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Quote (t8 @ Sep. 27 2009,10:57) Quote (thethinker @ Sep. 27 2009,08:20) t8,
You can't see it can you? You gave Ephesians 4:6 which says that there is ONE Lord. So by your logic Jesus can't be Lord. But He is Lord! Right? Christ's statement in John 17:3 is non applicable today. The Father has since installed His Son as God on the throne (Heb. 1:18-10). You can't use scripture to tie God's hands. If God wants to install a man as God on the throne He may do so. All men are accountable to Jesus Christ now.thinker
God made Jesus Lord not LORD.
Perhaps you should be humble and open enough to see that it is you who cannot see it.I find that Trinitarian's don't seem to be able to grasp this because it deflates much of the foundation they have laid their Trinitarian belief on. And so the reaction at this point is to either wake up to it, or to play the Pretend Game or the Ignore Game.
But believe it, it is true.
Do not confuse this with YHWH. It is the word “kurios”.Once you have grasped that, then Acts 2:36 will make sense to you.
“Therefore let all Israel be assured of this: God has made this Jesus, whom you crucified, both Lord and Christ.”It isn't saying God made Jesus YHWH, and no matter how much you may wish this to be the case, it is simply saying that God made Jesus kurios/lord and christ/messiah.
So what will be your reaction to this truth?
Will it be an embrace or to pray to God about it? Or will the following occur:
John 3:19
“This is the judgment, that the Light has come into the world, and men loved the darkness rather than the Light, for their deeds were evilHopefully it is not the latter.
thinker and you cannot see that the trinity is a manmade doctrine and God the Father is greater then His Son.
If you have the Britannica Encylopedia you will find a large Article on Tertullian. The trinity doctrine it says, is the greates achievement that Tertullian made to Christianity. We got a Book explaining who was Tertullian and what He did, from a Baptist Minister of all people.
So when t8 gives you good Scriptures about who is greater and above all, why in the world can you not ever take heed. He4 gives you so much of what is really truth.
You are so blinded in your theology and the trinity.
One day you will have to learn.
His full name is Quintus Septimus lorens Tertullian.
IreneQuote (t8 @ Sep. 27 2009,03:51) Quote (thethinker @ Sep. 26 2009,19:21) Quote (Nick Hassan @ Sep. 26 2009,18:27) Hi CA,
You you are the one able to establish truth?
Yet you have only yourself and your masters to guide you.“Thy Word is truth”
Nick,
As CA has correctly said, “Who told you that the books in your Bible are the Word of God?” The RCC told you. So trash your Bible.thinker
Sure they may have packaged it, but what did they do after that?They eventually denied people the bible until it got into their hands by other means. The RCC's agenda seems to be about controlling the people of God. They only play nice, when they have to, but in those instances, they are dragged there kicking and screaming.
The organisation showed it's true fruit in the dark ages. They extorted money from people through fear, denied them scriptures so they wouldn't know any better, and persecuted those who spoke the truth.
When they had some competition they had to compete and hence a nicer front.
Like any monopoly, they treat customers badly as monopolies tend to abuse their position. Where there is competition, you usually get better treatment. In that scenario if they don't shape up, they lose.
You can bet your bottom dollar that if they had the chance they would rule as they had in the past.
The reformation kind of stuffed things up for them a bit.
I'm going to assume from now on that you have never read ANY of the writings or primary historical source material from the Middle (what you call “dark”) Ages.You would make St. Thomas Aquinas a Neanderthal….wouldn't you?
If those were the “dark ages”, then what we have produced in society in regard to universal belief in God and Christ….could it be called “the blackest of dark ages”?
I guess ignorance is bliss when you don't want to be confused with the facts.
Quote (Gene @ Sep. 27 2009,04:47) T8……..Right on , Napoleon dealt the CATHOLIC CHURCH A DEADLY BLOW, breaking there power over Kingdoms of the world, but don't think for a second they would not like it back and continue to work for that end. GOD help us if that ever occurs. Then we will see there true colors as Ireland Has even in our generation. There is no organization on the face of the earth that has caused more torture and violence and corruption to the word of GOD and murders to the people of GOD them that Church has, nothing even close to It. AS History has Shown over and over again. Yet there are decieved people who still listen to Her and Her Blind Daughters the PROTESTANTS as well. May GOD help us and protect Us from this EVIL influence. IMO gene
Deadly blow, eh?1. The Church is over a billion strong. Not quite as deadly as you were hoping apparently.
2. Please admit to everyone that it is all you can do to refrain from calling Napoleon “saint” napoleon.
3. Please admit to everyone here that the moral Relativism and Secularism of the French Revolution is PREFERABLE to a Christian society.
4. Please explain to us all why American children can list their ten favorite beers, but could not list the Ten Commandments…much less in order.
5. Please admit to everyone that you would rather have the society you have now….one that spits on morality, than have one who is heavily influenced by a voice that always calls it to works of charity and purity of heart.
I could go on….but you are sufficiently exposed.
Hi CA,
Are Thomas Aquinas and the catholic 'saints' as honored by God as by your humanistic religion?
What men consider wonderful often jars with God.But how will you know while you accept their words above those of the Lord of all?
Quote (CatholicApologist @ Sep. 27 2009,18:16) Sure they may have packaged it, but what did they do after that? They eventually denied people the bible until it got into their hands by other means. The RCC's agenda seems to be about controlling the people of God. They only play nice, when they have to, but in those instances, they are dragged there kicking and screaming.
The organisation showed it's true fruit in the dark ages. They extorted money from people through fear, denied them scriptures so they wouldn't know any better, and persecuted those who spoke the truth.
When they had some competition they had to compete and hence a nicer front.
Like any monopoly, they treat customers badly as monopolies tend to abuse their position. Where there is competition, you usually get better treatment. In that scenario if they don't shape up, they lose.
You can bet your bottom dollar that if they had the chance they would rule as they had in the past.
The reformation kind of stuffed things up for them a bit.[/quote]
I'm going to assume from now on that you have never read ANY of the writings or primary historical source material from the Middle (what you call “dark”) Ages.You would make St. Thomas Aquinas a Neanderthal….wouldn't you?
If those were the “dark ages”, then what we have produced in society in regard to universal belief in God and Christ….could it be called “the blackest of dark ages”?
I guess ignorance is bliss when you don't want to be confused with the facts.
I never called it the Dark Ages, history records it that way. I am only referring to that time.Quote (CatholicApologist @ Sep. 27 2009,18:25) The Church is over a billion strong. Not quite as deadly as you were hoping apparently.
Oh, the biggest club wins does it?Quote (Nick Hassan @ Sep. 27 2009,18:25) Hi CA,
Are Thomas Aquinas and the catholic 'saints' as honored by God as by your humanistic religion?
What men consider wonderful often jars with God.But how will you know while you accept their words above those of the Lord of all?
You can't even substantiate that you HAVE the words “of the Lord of all”BTW, nice dodge. Everyone please notice that before it was…ooooh…the middle ages were really the dark ages…..ooooh
Then when they are refuted soundly they go “well…what about this….?”
It's called: YOU LOST
Admit it.
Hi CA,
It is not a carnal competition but the sword of the Spirit is two edged and sharp.
The Lord of All appointed by God does not need a vicar in Rome.
Fear of deception leads many to hide behind religionBe brave and read the bible as it can feed your soul.
Lk16.15Quote (t8 @ Sep. 27 2009,18:28) Quote (CatholicApologist @ Sep. 27 2009,18:25) The Church is over a billion strong. Not quite as deadly as you were hoping apparently.
Oh, the biggest club wins does it?
Awesome! Thanks for proving my point so soon, t8. Man, you guys work fast.OK, everyone. Notice:
The first argument was “ooooh…Napoleon dealt a death blow to the Church!”
I respond “The Church is over a billion strong. Not quite as deadly as you were hoping apparently.”
Their response:
“Oh, the biggest club wins does it?” (i.e. “um…you made my argument look silly….but I can't admit it…um….what about….this?)
YOU LOST?
Oh so you win and let's all become Roman Catholics.
Is that it? What is it you are trying to achieve?
Hi,
All who are not in Christ obey the god of this world.
The way of Christ is narrow and few choose it.Quote (t8 @ Sep. 26 2009,11:04) Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Sep. 26 2009,05:57) Quote (Gene @ Sep. 25 2009,13:05) Thinker……..Doesn't these things Jodi is quoting trouble you even a little, come out of those false teachings of the TRINITY thinker. gene
GeneNone of those scriptures contradict the Trinitarian view!
WJ
Oh yeah right, let's also pretend that the next 3 scriptures do not contradict the Trinity doctrine in any way.John 17:3
Now this is eternal life: that they may know you, the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom you have sent.Trint
Ephesians 4:4-6
5 one Lord, one faith, one baptism;
6 one God and Father of all, who is over all and through all and in all.1 Corinthians 8:6
6 yet for us there is but one God, the Father, from whom all things came and for whom we live; and there is but one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom all things came and through whom we live.Oh sure in reality they contradict, but when you play the Pretend Game, you can pretend they don't. Is that how the game is played? Am I understanding the rules WJ?
t8So lets test your theory and see whose faith the scriptures contradict!
Now this is eternal life: that they may know you, the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom you have sent.
The Trinitarians believe in “One True God”!
The Henotheist believe in “One Big God” who is True, and “One little god” who is true!
Ephesians 4:4-6
5 one Lord, one faith, one baptism;
6 one God and Father of all, who is over all and through all and in all.The Trinitarians believe their is “One God and Father of all” and “One Lord” who is over all and in all!
The Henotheist believe in “One God and Father of all” who is also LORD, and yet “another Lord” who is a smaller lord and a smaller god!
1 Corinthians 8:6
6 yet for us there is but one God, the Father, from whom all things came and for whom we live; and there is but one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom all things came and through whom we live.The Trinitarian believes in “One God the Father” and One Lord Jesus Christ!
The Henotheist believe in “One God the Father” who is also LORD, and “another lord” who is a smaller lord and god!
There is only “One True God” and not a big one and a little one.
And there is only one LORD who is LORD over all!
Hear, O Israel: The LORD our God is one LORD: Deut 6:4
So live with your contradictions.
WJ
Quote (t8 @ Sep. 27 2009,18:26) I never called it the Dark Ages, history records it that way. I am only referring to that time.
No…PROTESTANT history records it that way.It is referred to in academia as The Middle Ages.
“The Dark Ages” is not an objective term and is politically loaded….biased. And I would submit: revisionist.
Hi CA,
What men fear befalls them.
No better deception than the ritualism and magic formulas of catholicismQuote (CatholicApologist @ Sep. 27 2009,18:33) Quote (t8 @ Sep. 27 2009,18:28) Quote (CatholicApologist @ Sep. 27 2009,18:25) The Church is over a billion strong. Not quite as deadly as you were hoping apparently.
Oh, the biggest club wins does it?
Awesome! Thanks for proving my point so soon, t8. Man, you guys work fast.OK, everyone. Notice:
The first argument was “ooooh…Napoleon dealt a death blow to the Church!”
I respond “The Church is over a billion strong. Not quite as deadly as you were hoping apparently.”
Their response:
“Oh, the biggest club wins does it?” (i.e. “um…you made my argument look silly….but I can't admit it…um….what about….this?)
Um. I think the point is that if the Catholic Church tried to deny the people scriptures and burned people at the stake, they would be put in prison today, where they would deserve to go for such crimes. In the past, they got away with it because they were more powerful.Anyway, like many others you seem to hide behind numbers. That means that Evolution is true as probably most Scientist's seem to tell us.
Besides, isn't it written that the devil deceives the world? And that Mystery Babylon makes the whole world drunk on her wine. Numbers in a biblical context doesn't validate anything.
This logic is not of the Spirit.
In fact what we see written is “little flock” or “the straight and narrow path that few find”.
Quote (t8 @ Sep. 27 2009,18:33) YOU LOST? Oh so you win and let's all become Roman Catholics.
Is that it? What is it you are trying to achieve?
Well…Catholics anyway.Yes, that would be nice. Especially for you.
Aren't you ultimately a truth seeker?
Quote (CatholicApologist @ Sep. 27 2009,18:36) Quote (t8 @ Sep. 27 2009,18:26) I never called it the Dark Ages, history records it that way. I am only referring to that time.
No…PROTESTANT history records it that way.It is referred to in academia as The Middle Ages.
“The Dark Ages” is not an objective term and is politically loaded….biased. And I would submit: revisionist.
Oh, so the Catholics call it the Age of enlightenment or something similar?
When people were burned at the stake, and you paid money to be forgiven of your sins.OK, I am obviously unenlightened.
How can we bring back this glorious time?
Become Roman Catholics?
Quote (t8 @ Sep. 27 2009,18:37) Quote (CatholicApologist @ Sep. 27 2009,18:33) Quote (t8 @ Sep. 27 2009,18:28) Quote (CatholicApologist @ Sep. 27 2009,18:25) The Church is over a billion strong. Not quite as deadly as you were hoping apparently.
Oh, the biggest club wins does it?
Awesome! Thanks for proving my point so soon, t8. Man, you guys work fast.OK, everyone. Notice:
The first argument was “ooooh…Napoleon dealt a death blow to the Church!”
I respond “The Church is over a billion strong. Not quite as deadly as you were hoping apparently.”
Their response:
“Oh, the biggest club wins does it?” (i.e. “um…you made my argument look silly….but I can't admit it…um….what about….this?)
Um. I think the point is that if the Catholic Church tried to deny the people scriptures and burned people at the stake, they would be put in prison today, where they would deserve to go for such crimes. In the past, they got away with it because they were more powerful.Anyway, like many others you seem to hide behind numbers. That means that Evolution is true as probably most Scientist's seem to tell us.
Besides, isn't it written that the devil deceives the world? And that Mystery Babylon makes the whole world drunk on her wine. Numbers in a biblical context doesn't validate anything.
This logic is not of the Spirit.
In fact what we see written is “little flock” or the straight and narrow path that few find.
OK, don't admit you were wrong. But you're not fooling anyone.Quote Um. I think the point is that if the Catholic Church tried to deny the people scriptures and burned people at the stake, they would be put in prison today, where they would deserve to go for such crimes. In the past, they got away with it because they were more powerful. i.e. “or what about….THIS?”
So tell me why the first English Bibles were Catholic Bibles?
Tell me why the first vernacular Bibles of any language came from an Orthodox Catholic Church?
And if you REALLY want to make the Scriptures accessible, then go on a campaign to teach the world Greek, Hebrew, and Aramaic. Because otherwise your Bible teachers are doing much the same thing you accuse priests of doing…i.e. explaining what it says “in the Greek”
That's not replicatable! And it's 2009!
Admit it…you have a high brow religion.
Your religion is NOT for the common man!
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