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[mikeboll64]

Quote (kerwin @ July 11 2013,18:38)

Quote (mikeboll64 @ July 12 2013,06:08) Quote (terraricca @ July 11 2013,13:16) I start to wander if you are paying attention to what Mike and I tell you for the past 3 years………. It's like he can't hear us sometimes.   Pierre, do YOU know of any scripture that says any Canaanite ever worshipped Jehovah as their God?  I don't know of any, and Kerwin surely hasn't been able to produce one after all this time.  How about you? Mike, You have no evidence for your opinion and much against it.

Kerwin, YOU are the one who made a claim you can't scripturally prove. Since when does the responsibility fall on ME to DISPROVE something that you haven't even proved in the first place?

[mikeboll64]

Quote (Ed J @ July 11 2013,18:53)

Hi Mike, He said “EL-o-heem” not 'gods',vand yes Angels are called “EL-o-heem” too. I said there are no 'gods' besides “GOD”.

It doesn't matter what YOU said, Ed. It only matters that Jehovah said there were no ELOHIM, and you and I both know there were.

Was Jehovah LYING? Or was He making an emphatic statement? Which one?

[Ed J]

Quote (mikeboll64 @ July 11 2013,10:44)

1.  And how did man-made idols of wood, metal, and stone turn a wooden staff into a living snake? 2.  How did they turn water into blood? 3.  How did these idols produce frogs out of thin air? 4.  And finally, how in the world can Jehovah BRING JUDGMENT on an inanimate, man-made idol? Ed, please answer these 4 questions from 5 pages ago.

Hi Mike,

1) Idols of wood cannot do anything – except take up space.
2) Perhaps it was demonic powers at work?
3) Perhaps demonic powers?
4) Break it.

God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

[mikeboll64]

Quote (Ed J @ July 11 2013,18:59)

Quote (mikeboll64 @ July 11 2013,10:44) How did they turn water into blood? Hi Mike, Perhaps it was demonic powers at work?

Now that is a very SENSIBLE understanding, Ed. And these demonic powers were called “the gods of Egypt” by Moses and Jehovah, among others.

“they sacrificed to demons…….. to gods their fathers didn't know”

Are you beginning to see it yet?

[Ed J]

Quote (mikeboll64 @ July 12 2013,11:05)

Quote (Ed J @ July 11 2013,17:29) Quote (mikeboll64 @ July 10 2013,09:32) Ed, your AKJV calls Jehovah the “most high God” in many places.  Are they wrong in that translation also?  Should it really be “most high LEADER”? Hi Mike, I gave you Psalm 83:18 and asked if that meant that men were “high” because that is precisely what you are doing with the phrase “God of gods”. The term “God of gods” does not establish that there are other gods any more than JEHOVAH being most high over men on the earth PROVING that men are “high”. That statement doesn't make sense, Ed.  Calling someone a king of kings DOES establish that there are OTHER kings the first king is the king of. It is likewise true with “god of gods” and “lord of lords”. Quote (Ed J @ July 11 2013,17:29) Do you consider men – gods?       (<– please answer) In the OT, men were occasionally referred to as “elohim”.  By the time we reached the NT, the only “theos” mentioned are supernatural beings. So if I'm reading the OT, and a man is called a god, then YES, that man was a god – according to the way THEY used the word el back then. (I've made my question big this time, so you can easily see it an perhaps ANSWER IT.  I'm asking if the AKJV is once again WRONG in their translation of “most high God”.  Is it WRONG again, Ed?

Hi Mike,

The English term most high God is not the problem,
what I consider “wrong” (if we can call it that) is
your understanding that there are other gods.

So men were 'gods' but they aren't any longer – is that what you are saying?         (<– please answer)

God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

[Ed J]

Quote (mikeboll64 @ July 12 2013,11:57)

Quote (Ed J @ July 11 2013,18:53) Hi Mike, He said “EL-o-heem” not 'gods',vand yes Angels are called “EL-o-heem” too. I said there are no 'gods' besides “GOD”. It doesn't matter what YOU said, Ed.  It only matters that Jehovah said there were no ELOHIM, and you and I both know there were. Was Jehovah LYING?  Or was He making an emphatic statement?  Which one?

Hi Mike,

Not if he was saying: “there is no God beside me”

Also on a side note: please define YOUR USAGE OF the term
emphatic statement – because I don't know what you are meaning?

God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

[Ed J]

Quote (mikeboll64 @ July 12 2013,12:06)

Quote (Ed J @ July 11 2013,18:59) Quote (mikeboll64 @ July 11 2013,10:44) How did they turn water into blood? Hi Mike, Perhaps it was demonic powers at work? Now that is a very SENSIBLE understanding, Ed.  And these demonic powers were called “the gods of Egypt” by Moses and Jehovah, among others. “they sacrificed to demons…….. to gods their fathers didn't know” Are you beginning to see it yet?

Hi Mike,

Demons are not gods.

God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

[mikeboll64]

Ed,

I want REAL answers to my questions……. not DODGES like you're doing.  Re-do your last three posts, answering my questions in a DIRECT and HONEST manner please.

As for your questions:
1.  No, I didn't say men used to be gods, but aren't anymore.  Re-read my answer, and find out what I REALLY said, okay?

2.  Example of an emphatic statement:

John 21:17
He said, “Lord, you know all things…….”

Did Jesus LITERALLY know ALL THINGS – including the day and the hour?  Or was Peter speaking EMPHATICALLY – indicating that Jesus knew a WHOLE LOT OF things? WHICH ONE PLEASE?

[terraricca]

Quote (mikeboll64 @ July 12 2013,06:56)

Quote (kerwin @ July 11 2013,18:38) Quote (mikeboll64 @ July 12 2013,06:08) Quote (terraricca @ July 11 2013,13:16) I start to wander if you are paying attention to what Mike and I tell you for the past 3 years………. It's like he can't hear us sometimes.   Pierre, do YOU know of any scripture that says any Canaanite ever worshipped Jehovah as their God?  I don't know of any, and Kerwin surely hasn't been able to produce one after all this time.  How about you? Mike, You have no evidence for your opinion and much against it. Kerwin, YOU are the one who made a claim you can't scripturally prove.  Since when does the responsibility fall on ME to DISPROVE something that you haven't even proved in the first place?

Mike

the only pagan people I know of that ever obeyed God's judgement where the people and their king to the witnessing of Jonas and that was Ninive but that is more closer to Babylon,not Canaan ,

and yes Kerwin try to prove what he can not according to him EL is equal to god and so it is not a name but a distinction title ,and so can be applied to any god high or low god wood or gold ,

[Ed J]

Quote (mikeboll64 @ July 12 2013,12:32)

Ed, I want REAL answers to my questions……. not DODGES like you're doing.  Re-do your last three posts, answering my questions in a DIRECT and HONEST manner please. As for your questions: 1.  No, I didn't say men used to be gods, but aren't anymore.  Re-read my answer, and find out what I REALLY said, okay? 2.  Example of an emphatic statement: John 21:17 He said, “Lord, you know all things…….” Did Jesus LITERALLY know ALL THINGS – including the day and the hour?  Or was Peter speaking EMPHATICALLY – indicating that Jesus knew a WHOLE LOT OF things?  WHICH ONE PLEASE?

Hi Mike,

Apparently Peter says he does “know all things”.

An “emphatic statement” is what exactly? Please explain what it is?
Are you saying an “emphatic statement” is an 'untrue statement'?

And which question are you saying I have not answered?

God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

[terraricca]

Quote (Ed J @ July 12 2013,08:42)

Quote (mikeboll64 @ July 12 2013,12:32) Ed, I want REAL answers to my questions……. not DODGES like you're doing.  Re-do your last three posts, answering my questions in a DIRECT and HONEST manner please. As for your questions: 1.  No, I didn't say men used to be gods, but aren't anymore.  Re-read my answer, and find out what I REALLY said, okay? 2.  Example of an emphatic statement: John 21:17 He said, “Lord, you know all things…….” Did Jesus LITERALLY know ALL THINGS – including the day and the hour?  Or was Peter speaking EMPHATICALLY – indicating that Jesus knew a WHOLE LOT OF things?  WHICH ONE PLEASE? Hi Mike, Apparently Peter says he does “know all things”. An “emphatic statement” is what exactly? Please explain what it is? Are you saying an “emphatic statement” is an 'untrue statement'? And which question are you saying I have not answered? God bless Ed J (Joshua 22:34) http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

EDJ

no,it is a statement in the general sense ;just like when God says '

Ge 6:5 The LORD saw how great man’s wickedness on the earth had become, and that every inclination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil ALL the time.

AND YET HE SAID ;Ge 6:8 But Noah found favor in the eyes of the LORD.

got it

[Ed J]

Quote (terraricca @ July 13 2013,04:32)

Quote (Ed J @ July 12 2013,08:42) Quote (mikeboll64 @ July 12 2013,12:32) Ed, I want REAL answers to my questions……. not DODGES like you're doing.  Re-do your last three posts, answering my questions in a DIRECT and HONEST manner please. As for your questions: 1.  No, I didn't say men used to be gods, but aren't anymore.  Re-read my answer, and find out what I REALLY said, okay? 2.  Example of an emphatic statement: John 21:17 He said, “Lord, you know all things…….” Did Jesus LITERALLY know ALL THINGS – including the day and the hour?  Or was Peter speaking EMPHATICALLY – indicating that Jesus knew a WHOLE LOT OF things?  WHICH ONE PLEASE? Hi Mike, Apparently Peter says he does “know all things”. An “emphatic statement” is what exactly? Please explain what it is? Are you saying an “emphatic statement” is an 'untrue statement'? And which question are you saying I have not answered? God bless Ed J (Joshua 22:34) http://www.holycitybiblecode.org EDJ no,it is a statement in the general sense ;just like when God says ' Ge 6:5 The LORD saw how great man’s wickedness on the earth had become, and that every inclination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil ALL the time. AND YET HE SAID ;Ge 6:8 But Noah found favor in the eyes of the LORD. got it

Hi Pierre,

By you giving examples of what YOU believe it is, YOU are attempting to have me define what it means – which “I” have done already.

So then YOU are saying that an “emphatic statement” is an 'untrue statement' – right? If not an 'untrue statement' than what?

God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

[kerwin]

Mike,

So you have no evidence the relationship the El of the Canaanites to the El of Abraham was not like the relationship of the God of the Trinitarians to the God of the Jehovah witnesses and yet you choose to deny that relationship anyways.

[terraricca]

Quote (Ed J @ July 13 2013,01:43)

Quote (terraricca @ July 13 2013,04:32) Quote (Ed J @ July 12 2013,08:42) Quote (mikeboll64 @ July 12 2013,12:32) Ed, I want REAL answers to my questions……. not DODGES like you're doing.  Re-do your last three posts, answering my questions in a DIRECT and HONEST manner please. As for your questions: 1.  No, I didn't say men used to be gods, but aren't anymore.  Re-read my answer, and find out what I REALLY said, okay? 2.  Example of an emphatic statement: John 21:17 He said, “Lord, you know all things…….” Did Jesus LITERALLY know ALL THINGS – including the day and the hour?  Or was Peter speaking EMPHATICALLY – indicating that Jesus knew a WHOLE LOT OF things?  WHICH ONE PLEASE? Hi Mike, Apparently Peter says he does “know all things”. An “emphatic statement” is what exactly? Please explain what it is? Are you saying an “emphatic statement” is an 'untrue statement'? And which question are you saying I have not answered? God bless Ed J (Joshua 22:34) http://www.holycitybiblecode.org EDJ no,it is a statement in the general sense ;just like when God says ' Ge 6:5 The LORD saw how great man’s wickedness on the earth had become, and that every inclination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil ALL the time. AND YET HE SAID ;Ge 6:8 But Noah found favor in the eyes of the LORD. got it Hi Pierre, By you giving examples of what YOU believe it is, YOU are attempting to have me define what it means – which “I” have done already. So then YOU are saying that an “emphatic statement” is an 'untrue statement' – right? If not an 'untrue statement' than what? God bless Ed J (Joshua 22:34) http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

edj

grow up ,you are playing stupid

[terraricca]

Quote (kerwin @ July 13 2013,02:57)

Mike, So you have no evidence the relationship the El of the Canaanites to the El of Abraham was not like the relationship of the God of the Trinitarians to the God of the Jehovah witnesses and yet you choose to deny that relationship anyways.

K

prove your point by showing scriptures ;and you will see that you have no claim

[kerwin]

Quote (terraricca @ July 13 2013,04:39)

Quote (kerwin @ July 13 2013,02:57) Mike, So you have no evidence the relationship the El of the Canaanites to the El of Abraham was not like the relationship of the God of the Trinitarians to the God of the Jehovah witnesses and yet you choose to deny that relationship anyways. K prove your point by showing scriptures ;and you will see that you have no claim

T,

I already have and the only opposition I see is disbelief based on tradition and not Scripture.

[terraricca]

Quote (kerwin @ July 13 2013,05:36)

Quote (terraricca @ July 13 2013,04:39) Quote (kerwin @ July 13 2013,02:57) Mike, So you have no evidence the relationship the El of the Canaanites to the El of Abraham was not like the relationship of the God of the Trinitarians to the God of the Jehovah witnesses and yet you choose to deny that relationship anyways. K prove your point by showing scriptures ;and you will see that you have no claim T, I already have and the only opposition I see is disbelief based on tradition and not Scripture.

k

YOU DID NOT SHOW ANY SCRIPTURES ,i did not see them ;and as for Jewish tradition this is what Paul as been fighting against most of his ministry ,all tradition are man made not of God and so cannot be trusted

even Jesus rejected there traditions,

and your EL = god or mighty or might it does not make any difference because it does not differentiate the good from the bad

[mikeboll64]

Quote (terraricca @ July 11 2013,20:06)

and yes Kerwin try to prove what he can not according to him EL  is equal to god and so it is not a name but a distinction title ,and so can be applied to any god high or low god wood or gold ,

Jehovah insisted that the Israelites not follow in the practices of the Canaanites, whose land they were being given.

The practices of the Canaanites included worshipping a god they called “El”, and also setting up Asherah poles on high places to worship El's wife Asherah.

Somehow, Kerwin has concluded that the El the Canaanites worshiped (the El with a wife named Asherah) is the same El that the Hebrews worshiped (the El WIHOUTH a wife named Asherah).

I haven't yet seen any scriptures from him that verify this conclusion.

1 Kings 14:15 NET
The LORD will attack Israel, making it like a reed that sways in the water. He will remove Israel from this good land he gave to their ancestors and scatter them beyond the Euphrates River, because they angered the LORD by making Asherah poles. 23

Footnote 23 says:
Asherah was a leading deity of the Canaanite pantheon, wife/sister of El and goddess of fertility. She was commonly worshiped at shrines in or near groves of evergreen trees, or, failing that, at places marked by wooden poles. These were to be burned or cut down (Deut 12:3; 16:21; Judg 6:25, 28, 30; 2 Kgs 18:4).

It seems quite apparent to me that the El the Canaanites worshiped was NOT Jehovah, for He has no wife/sister named Asherah.

I think Kerwin is confusing the fact that every living thing HAS the same God with the assumption that everybody WORSHIPS the same God.  He assumes that Trinitarians WORSHIP the same God that he worships, but that is a flawed conclusion.  While Trinitarians HAVE the same God that we have, they in fact WORSHIP a completely different God – one who has a multiple personality disorder.

I believe this assumption of his is why we're not fully understanding each other.

[kerwin]

Quote (terraricca @ July 13 2013,07:50)

Quote (kerwin @ July 13 2013,05:36) Quote (terraricca @ July 13 2013,04:39) Quote (kerwin @ July 13 2013,02:57) Mike, So you have no evidence the relationship the El of the Canaanites to the El of Abraham was not like the relationship of the God of the Trinitarians to the God of the Jehovah witnesses and yet you choose to deny that relationship anyways. K prove your point by showing scriptures ;and you will see that you have no claim T, I already have and the only opposition I see is disbelief based on tradition and not Scripture. k YOU DID NOT SHOW ANY SCRIPTURES ,i did not see them ;and as for Jewish tradition this is what Paul as been fighting against most of his ministry ,all tradition are man made not of God and so cannot be trusted even Jesus rejected there traditions, and your EL = god or mighty or might it does not make any difference because it does not differentiate the good from the bad

T,

You see what you want to see but you have no evidence that El Abraham to to the King of Sodom is not the same El that the Canaanites believed in though many of them were heretics.

Paul, nor Jesus, did not fight against the true Jewish tradition but against false teachings that even the Jews of this day do not agree with.

[mikeboll64]

Quote (kerwin @ July 12 2013,14:57)

Mike, So you have no evidence the relationship the El of the Canaanites to the El of Abraham was not like the relationship of the God of the Trinitarians to the God of the Jehovah witnesses and yet you choose to deny that relationship anyways.

Therein lies the confusion, Kerwin.

You believe that the JWs and the Trinitarians worship the SAME God. But is that really true?

The Trinitarians worship their God Jesus Christ, who created them all.

Did YOUR God Jesus Christ create YOU, Kerwin? YES or NO?

Or do YOU worship a DIFFERENT God who is NOT Jesus Christ?

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