ISM Scale

[mikeboll64]

So we can all see that I've successfully nipped Ed's point in the bud, as promised. And we can all see that Ed is now in denial, saying “elohim” means “GOD” in Isaiah 44, but means “leader” when Jehovah is called the “elohim of elohim”.

And he will continue to switch the definitions of the word, scripture by scripture, until those scriptures teach exactly what he wants them to teach – despite what they really teach.

I know from experience that Ed's game will go on and on forever, with him continually changing the meaning of “elohim”, saying, “It means angel here” and “It means leader here”, etc. He will have no proof to support his claims – only his undying insistence that there is LITERALLY only ONE god in existence.

But Ed has some kryptonite that most people don't have. Ed is convinced (for some odd reason) that the AKJV is the unaltered word of God Himself, and cannot be faulty. So instead of playing Ed's game of ever changing definitions of “elohim”, I will use his kryptonite against him:

Genesis 3:5 AKJV
For God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil.

Ed, who are the “gods” that your AKJV is talking about?

[Ed J]

Quote (mikeboll64 @ June 30 2013,14:49)

Quote (Ed J @ June 29 2013,21:18) Quote (mikeboll64 @ June 30 2013,14:05) Quote (Ed J @ June 29 2013,20:51) You can't change Scripture – there are no other gods Mike, period.  You are in complete denial, Ed. What do you say we get extremely REAL about this? The fact of the matter is that there are no “gods” PERIOD in ANY scripture.  There are “el”, “elohim”, and “theos”. Fact:  Jehovah is the elohim OF elohim. Fact:  Jehovah is the MOST HIGH elohim. Question:  Is Jehovah literally the ONLY elohim?  YES or NO? Hi Mike, “EL-o-heem” defines as any of the following(depending on the context): 1. GOD 2. Angels 3. Leaders 4. Magistrates The context of Isa 44:8 dictates that the definition of “EL-o-heem” is definition #1. “EL-o-heem” as the definition of “GOD” yes – JEHOVAH is the only “GOD”(EL-o-heem). No Ed. You can't just swap the definitions of “elohim” as it suits your purpose.  The word means the same thing all the time. The question is:  Is Jehovah LITERALLY the ONLY elohim in existence?  YES or NO? Answer it with a “YES” or a “NO”, Ed.

Hi Mike,

You can't change the definition after I answer.
“EL-o-heem” under the definition of “GOD” –
yes JEHOVAH is the only “EL-o-heem”.

God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

[Ed J]

Quote (mikeboll64 @ June 30 2013,15:02)

So we can all see that I've successfully nipped Ed's point in the bud, as promised.  And we can all see that Ed is now in denial, saying “elohim” means “GOD” in Isaiah 44, but means “leader” when Jehovah is called the “elohim of elohim”. And he will continue to switch the definitions of the word, scripture by scripture, until those scriptures teach exactly what he wants them to teach – despite what they really teach. I know from experience that Ed's game will go on and on forever, with him continually changing the meaning of “elohim”, saying, “It means angel here” and “It means leader here”, etc.  He will have no proof to support his claims – only his undying insistence that there is LITERALLY only ONE god in existence. But Ed has some kryptonite that most people don't have.  Ed is convinced (for some odd reason) that the AKJV is the unaltered word of God Himself, and cannot be faulty.  So instead of playing Ed's game of ever changing definitions of “elohim”, I will use his kryptonite against him: Genesis 3:5 AKJV For God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil. Ed, who are the “gods” that your AKJV is talking about?

Hi Mike,

“EL-o-heem” in that verse should have been translated to “Angels”.
And by the way I never said that the AKJV translators were
perfect – only that the “AKJV Bible” is anointed.

God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

[2besee]

Mike and all,
Regarding the last two posts on the last page,
As I have said before:

The Greek word for “through” is di'-δι' which means either through or because of,  for, or on account of.

http://biblesuite.com/greek/1223.htm

(the same word is used in John 1).

Here are a few examples if the same word di'-δι being used in scripture.. And it does not say “through”,

Matthew 6:25
Prep BIB: Διὰ τοῦτο λέγω
NAS: For this reason I say
KJV: Therefore I say unto you,
INT: Because of this I say

Matthew 9:11
Prep BIB: μαθηταῖς αὐτοῦ Διὰ τί μετὰ
NAS: to His disciples, Why is your Teacher
INT: disciples of him because of why

Matthew 9:14
Prep BIB: Ἰωάννου λέγοντες Διὰ τί ἡμεῖς
NAS: to Him, asking, Why do we and the Pharisees
INT: of John saying because of why we

Matthew 10:22
Prep BIB: ὑπὸ πάντων διὰ τὸ ὄνομά
NAS: by all because of My name,
KJV: of all [men] for my name's sake:
INT: by all on account of the name

Matthew 12:27
Prep BIB:τίνι ἐκβάλλουσιν διὰ τοῦτο αὐτοὶ
NAS: cast [them] out? For this reason
INT: whom do they cast out on account of this

Matthew 13:21
Prep BIB: ἢ διωγμοῦ διὰ τὸν λόγον
NAS: arises because of the word,
KJV: ariseth because of the word,
INT: or persecution on account of the word

Matthew 13:52
Prep BIB: εἶπεν αὐτοῖς Διὰ τοῦτο πᾶς
NAS: And Jesus said to them, Therefore every
KJV: he unto them, Therefore every
INT: he said to them because of this every

Matthew 13:58
Prep BIB: δυνάμεις πολλὰς διὰ τὴν ἀπιστίαν
NAS: there because of their unbelief.
KJV: there because of their
INT: works of power many because the unbelief

Matthew 14:2
Prep BIB: νεκρῶν καὶ διὰ τοῦτο αἱ
NAS: from the dead, and that is why miraculous powers
KJV: and therefore mighty works
INT: dead and because of this the

Matthew 14:3
Prep BIB: φυλακῇ ἀπέθετο διὰ Ἡρῳδιάδα τὴν
NAS: him in prison because of Herodias,
KJV: for Herodias' sake, his brother
INT: prison put [him] on account of Herodias the

Matthew 14:9
Prep BIB: ὁ βασιλεὺς διὰ τοὺς ὅρκους
NAS: [it] to be given because of his oaths,
INT: the king but on account of the oaths

Matthew 15:2
Prep BIB: Διὰ τί οἱ
NAS: Why do Your disciples
  INT: because of why the

Matthew 15:3
Prep BIB: εἶπεν αὐτοῖς Διὰ τί καὶ
NAS: and said to them, Why do you yourselves
KJV: of God by your
INT: he said to them because of why also

Matthew 15:3
Prep BIB: τοῦ θεοῦ διὰ τὴν παράδοσιν
NAS: of God for the sake of your tradition?
INT: of God on account of the tradition

Matthew 15:6
Prep BIB: τοῦ θεοῦ διὰ τὴν παράδοσιν
NAS: of God for the sake of your tradition.
KJV: of none effect by your INT: of God on account of the

Matthew 17:20
Prep BIB: λέγει αὐτοῖς Διὰ τὴν ὀλιγοπιστίαν
NAS: And He said to them, because of the littleness of your faith;
KJV: unto them, because of your
INT: he said to them because of the little faith

Matthew 19:12
Prep BIB: εὐνούχισαν ἑαυτοὺς διὰ τὴν βασιλείαν
NAS: eunuchs for the sake of the kingdom
KJV: eunuchs for the kingdom
INT: made eunuchs of themselves for the sake of the kingdom

Romans 4:16
Prep BIB: Διὰ τοῦτο ἐκ
NAS: For this reason [it is] by faith,
KJV: Therefore [it is] of faith,
INT: because of this of

Romans 4:23
Prep BIB: ἐγράφη δὲ δι' αὐτὸν μόνον
NAS: Now not for his sake only
KJV: not written for his sake alone, that
INT: It was written but on account of him only

Romans 4:24
Prep BIB: ἀλλὰ καὶ δι' ἡμᾶς οἷς NAS: but for our sake also, to who
KJV: But for us also,
INT: but also on account of us to whom

Romans 4:25
Prep BIB: ὃς παρεδόθη διὰ τὰ παραπτώματα
NAS: was delivered over because of our transgressions,
KJV: Who was delivered for our offences,
INT: who was delievered for the trespasses

Romans 4:25
Prep BIB: καὶ ἠγέρθη διὰ τὴν δικαίωσιν
NAS: and was raised because of our justification.
KJV: was raised again for our
INT: and was raised for the justification

You can find all of the occurrences of the word here:

http://biblesuite.com/greek….tm]http

It can be used either way.
We should know that God alone created the heavens and the earth, because that is what scriptures say.

BTW: Colossions is in the list of disputed epistles. Many scholars do not believe that Paul wrote Colossions (refer wikipedia), but that somebody else wrote it later on, to support later views.

Just for your information. Not wanting to debate it.

[Ed J]

Hi 2Besee,

Yes it was “because of” Jesus crucifixion that GOD created everything.

God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

[terraricca]

Quote (2besee @ June 30 2013,10:35)

Mike and all, Regarding the last two posts on the last page, As I have said before: The Greek word for “through” is di'-δι' which means either through or because of,  for, or on account of. http://biblesuite.com/greek/1223.htm (the same word is used in John 1). Here are a few examples if the same word di'-δι being used in scripture.. And it does not say “through”, Matthew 6:25 Prep BIB: Διὰ τοῦτο λέγω NAS: For this reason I say KJV: Therefore I say unto you, INT: Because of this I say Matthew 9:11 Prep BIB: μαθηταῖς αὐτοῦ Διὰ τί μετὰ NAS: to His disciples, Why is your Teacher INT: disciples of him because of why Matthew 9:14 Prep BIB: Ἰωάννου λέγοντες Διὰ τί ἡμεῖς NAS: to Him, asking, Why do we and the Pharisees INT: of John saying because of why we Matthew 10:22 Prep BIB: ὑπὸ πάντων διὰ τὸ ὄνομά NAS: by all because of My name, KJV: of all [men] for my name's sake: INT: by all on account of the name Matthew 12:27 Prep BIB:τίνι ἐκβάλλουσιν διὰ τοῦτο αὐτοὶ NAS: cast [them] out? For this reason INT: whom do they cast out on account of this Matthew 13:21 Prep BIB: ἢ διωγμοῦ διὰ τὸν λόγον NAS: arises because of the word, KJV: ariseth because of the word, INT: or persecution on account of the word Matthew 13:52 Prep BIB: εἶπεν αὐτοῖς Διὰ τοῦτο πᾶς NAS: And Jesus said to them, Therefore every KJV: he unto them, Therefore every INT: he said to them because of this every Matthew 13:58 Prep BIB: δυνάμεις πολλὰς διὰ τὴν ἀπιστίαν NAS: there because of their unbelief. KJV: there because of their INT: works of power many because the unbelief Matthew 14:2 Prep BIB: νεκρῶν καὶ διὰ τοῦτο αἱ NAS: from the dead, and that is why miraculous powers KJV: and therefore mighty works INT: dead and because of this the Matthew 14:3 Prep BIB: φυλακῇ ἀπέθετο διὰ Ἡρῳδιάδα τὴν NAS: him in prison because of Herodias, KJV: for Herodias' sake, his brother INT: prison put [him] on account of Herodias the Matthew 14:9 Prep BIB: ὁ βασιλεὺς διὰ τοὺς ὅρκους NAS: [it] to be given because of his oaths, INT: the king but on account of the oaths Matthew 15:2 Prep BIB: Διὰ τί οἱ NAS: Why do Your disciples   INT: because of why the Matthew 15:3 Prep BIB: εἶπεν αὐτοῖς Διὰ τί καὶ NAS: and said to them, Why do you yourselves KJV: of God by your INT: he said to them because of why also Matthew 15:3 Prep BIB: τοῦ θεοῦ διὰ τὴν παράδοσιν NAS: of God for the sake of your tradition? INT: of God on account of the tradition Matthew 15:6 Prep BIB: τοῦ θεοῦ διὰ τὴν παράδοσιν NAS: of God for the sake of your tradition. KJV: of none effect by your INT: of God on account of the Matthew 17:20 Prep BIB: λέγει αὐτοῖς Διὰ τὴν ὀλιγοπιστίαν NAS: And He said to them, because of the littleness of your faith; KJV: unto them, because of your INT: he said to them because of the little faith Matthew 19:12 Prep BIB: εὐνούχισαν ἑαυτοὺς διὰ τὴν βασιλείαν NAS: eunuchs for the sake of the kingdom KJV: eunuchs for the kingdom INT: made eunuchs of themselves for the sake of the kingdom Romans 4:16 Prep BIB: Διὰ τοῦτο ἐκ NAS: For this reason [it is] by faith, KJV: Therefore [it is] of faith, INT: because of this of Romans 4:23 Prep BIB: ἐγράφη δὲ δι' αὐτὸν μόνον NAS: Now not for his sake only KJV: not written for his sake alone, that INT: It was written but on account of him only Romans 4:24 Prep BIB: ἀλλὰ καὶ δι' ἡμᾶς οἷς NAS: but for our sake also, to who KJV: But for us also, INT: but also on account of us to whom Romans 4:25 Prep BIB: ὃς παρεδόθη διὰ τὰ παραπτώματα NAS: was delivered over because of our transgressions, KJV: Who was delivered for our offences, INT: who was delievered for the trespasses Romans 4:25 Prep BIB: καὶ ἠγέρθη διὰ τὴν δικαίωσιν NAS: and was raised because of our justification. KJV: was raised again for our INT: and was raised for the justification You can find all of the occurrences of the word here: http://biblesuite.com/greek….tm]http It can be used either way. We should know that God alone created the heavens and the earth, because that is what scriptures say. BTW: Colossions is in the list of disputed epistles. Many scholars do not believe that Paul wrote Colossions (refer wikipedia), but that somebody else wrote it later on, to support later views. Just for your information. Not wanting to debate it.

2bee

Useless info
,you have not investigate it enough ,you are following men not God ,this may be rude and raw but true ,

[kerwin]

Quote (Ed J @ June 30 2013,08:16)

Quote (Ed J @ June 30 2013,13:13) JEHOVAH is the most high “leader” – there are no gods. “there is no God else beside me” (Isaiah 45:21)

Ed J,

Jehovah is the only  “perfect, omnipotent, omniscient originator and ruler of the universe” but the God Mike and T believe in is not omnipresent.  They believe instead that God is a “being of supernatural powers or attributes, believed in and worshiped by a people” and those are believers.  They believe each angel is “A being of supernatural powers or attributes” but not to be worshiped by people.  They have many God's but only one primary God just like Jesus is the one Lord even though there are many lords. They basically believe God is an uncreated super angel.

Jehovah Elohim is Elohim of Elohim is to me better expressed in English as Jehovah God is the Pantheon of the pantheon. Even pantheon is a poor fit unless you include those beings associated with the gods but not worshiped. Jehovah is not just God he is the God of the Gods, he is their pantheon.

Note: quotes from thefreedictionary.com

[mikeboll64]

Not exactly, Kerwin.

I won't speak for Pierre (although I believe he sees it pretty much the same way I do), but here is what I believe:

The word “elohim” simply means “mighty (one)” – PERIOD!

Jehovah is but ONE of the MANY elohim.

Jehovah is the ONLY elohim who has existed from eternity.

Jehovah CREATED all of the other elohim.

Jehovah is the MOST HIGH of all the elohim.

Jehovah is the elohim OF all the other elohim.

Jehovah is the ONLY elohim that we Christians are to worship and serve as OUR elohim.

An angel is a spirit messenger – one who is SENT to deliver the messages of another who is greater than him.  And therefore, Jehovah could never be an angel, because no one SENDS Jehovah to deliver a message for them – as if Jehovah is their errand boy or something.

[mikeboll64]

Quote (Ed J @ June 29 2013,22:25)

Quote (mikeboll64 @ June 30 2013,15:02) Genesis 3:5 AKJV For God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil. Ed, who are the “gods” that your AKJV is talking about? Hi Mike, “EL-o-heem” in that verse should have been translated to “Angels”. And by the way I never said that the AKJV translators were perfect – only that the “AKJV Bible” is anointed.

The AKJV is “anointed” by God Himself, yet still has many mistakes in it?  Hmmm…………….

You must now budge on one of your errors, Ed.  Either you must admit that the AKJV is faulty, or admit that angels are gods.  I'm glad to see you have done the former, because now we don't ever have to listen to you tell us how the AKJV is the ONLY Bible “authorized by God”, etc.

Please don't ever claim that on this site again, because your own words have just proven you don't actually believe it.

Now, on to the latter point:  “EL-o-heem” in that verse should have been translated to “Angels”.

Genesis 3
5 …..and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil.

22 And the LORD God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil……..

If “gods” in verse 3 should be translated as “angels”, like you say, then in verse 22, Jehovah includes HIMSELF among those angels.

Ed, do you believe Jehovah is an angel? YES or NO?

(Who wants to bet that Ed will now swap his definition of elohim in verse 5, and claim instead that it means “leaders” in that verse?)

[kerwin]

Quote (mikeboll64 @ June 30 2013,22:49)

Not exactly, Kerwin. I won't speak for Pierre (although I believe he sees it pretty much the same way I do), but here is what I believe: The word “elohim” simply means “mighty (one)” – PERIOD! Jehovah is but ONE of the MANY elohim. Jehovah is the ONLY elohim who has existed from eternity. Jehovah CREATED all of the other elohim. Jehovah is the MOST HIGH of all the elohim. Jehovah is the elohim OF all the other elohim. Jehovah is the ONLY elohim that we Christians are to worship and serve as OUR elohim. An angel is a spirit messenger – one who is SENT to deliver the messages of another who is greater than him.  And therefore, Jehovah could never be an angel, because no one SENDS Jehovah to deliver a message for them – as if Jehovah is their errand boy or something.

Mike,

God is mighty as Spirit is wind.  

I will have to look back as that is where I seemed to misunderstood you.

[mikeboll64]

Kerwin,

Since “god” actually MEANS “mighty one”, then it is a given that Jehovah is mighty. In fact, He is the MOST mighty out of all the mighty ones.

[terraricca]

Quote (kerwin @ June 30 2013,20:20)

Quote (Ed J @ June 30 2013,08:16) Quote (Ed J @ June 30 2013,13:13) JEHOVAH is the most high “leader” – there are no gods. “there is no God else beside me” (Isaiah 45:21) Ed J, Jehovah is the only  “perfect, omnipotent, omniscient originator and ruler of the universe” but the God Mike and T believe in is not omnipresent.  They believe instead that God is a “being of supernatural powers or attributes, believed in and worshiped by a people” and those are believers.  They believe each angel is “A being of supernatural powers or attributes” but not to be worshiped by people.  They have many God's but only one primary God just like Jesus is the one Lord even though there are many lords. They basically believe God is an uncreated super angel. Jehovah Elohim is Elohim of Elohim is to me better expressed in English as Jehovah God is the Pantheon of the pantheon. Even pantheon is a poor fit unless you include those beings associated with the gods but not worshiped. Jehovah is not just God he is the God of the Gods, he is their pantheon. Note: quotes from thefreedictionary.com

K

Quote

” but the God Mike and T believe in is not omnipresent.

why are you always quoting things i have told you of what I believe ,

the God I believe in is omnipresent though his creation ,a thing that Paul is teaching ,and David as well ,

you need more reading in the scriptures to allow you to understand what it teaches,

Mike as told you what he believe (what is close to my believes)

[Ed J]

Quote (mikeboll64 @ July 01 2013,03:58)

Quote (Ed J @ June 29 2013,22:25) Quote (mikeboll64 @ June 30 2013,15:02) Genesis 3:5 AKJV For God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil. Ed, who are the “gods” that your AKJV is talking about? Hi Mike, “EL-o-heem” in that verse should have been translated to “Angels”. And by the way I never said that the AKJV translators were perfect – only that the “AKJV Bible” is anointed. The AKJV is “anointed” by God Himself, yet still has many mistakes in it?  Hmmm……………. You must now budge on one of your errors, Ed.  Either you must admit that the AKJV is faulty, or admit that angels are gods.  I'm glad to see you have done the former, because now we don't ever have to listen to you tell us how the AKJV is the ONLY Bible “authorized by God”, etc. Please don't ever claim that on this site again, because your own words have just proven you don't actually believe it. Now, on to the latter point:  “EL-o-heem” in that verse should have been translated to “Angels”. Genesis 3 5 …..and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil. 22 And the LORD God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil…….. If “gods” in verse 3 should be translated as “angels”, like you say, then in verse 22, Jehovah includes HIMSELF among those angels. Ed, do you believe Jehovah is an angel?  YES or NO? (Who wants to bet that Ed will now swap his definition of elohim in verse 5, and claim instead that it means “leaders” in that verse?)

Hi Mike,

1) Saul was anointed and he made mistakes, and David was anointed and he made mistakes too.
1John 5:7 doesn't belong in the bible – when man's involved, mistakes will naturally happen.

2) The “AKJV Bible” was Authorized by the crown (James I) – acting in behalf of  YHVH.

3) “Us” is GOD and the Angels, and no GOD is NOT an Angel and Jesus is neither.

Nothing has changed, nothing except your understanding that is.  

God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

[Ed J]

Quote (Ed J @ July 01 2013,07:39)

Quote (mikeboll64 @ July 01 2013,03:58) Quote (Ed J @ June 29 2013,22:25) Quote (mikeboll64 @ June 30 2013,15:02) Genesis 3:5 AKJV For God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil. Ed, who are the “gods” that your AKJV is talking about? Hi Mike, “EL-o-heem” in that verse should have been translated to “Angels”. And by the way I never said that the AKJV translators were perfect – only that the “AKJV Bible” is anointed. The AKJV is “anointed” by God Himself, yet still has many mistakes in it?  Hmmm……………. You must now budge on one of your errors, Ed.  Either you must admit that the AKJV is faulty, or admit that angels are gods.  I'm glad to see you have done the former, because now we don't ever have to listen to you tell us how the AKJV is the ONLY Bible “authorized by God”, etc. Please don't ever claim that on this site again, because your own words have just proven you don't actually believe it. Now, on to the latter point:  “EL-o-heem” in that verse should have been translated to “Angels”. Genesis 3 5 …..and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil. 22 And the LORD God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil…….. If “gods” in verse 3 should be translated as “angels”, like you say, then in verse 22, Jehovah includes HIMSELF among those angels. Ed, do you believe Jehovah is an angel?  YES or NO? (Who wants to bet that Ed will now swap his definition of elohim in verse 5, and claim instead that it means “leaders” in that verse?) Hi Mike, 1) Saul was anointed and he made mistakes, and David was anointed and he made mistakes too. 1John 5:7 doesn't belong in the bible – when man's involved, mistakes will naturally happen. 2) The “AKJV Bible” was Authorized by the crown (James I) – acting in behalf of  YHVH. 3) “Us” is GOD and the Angels, and no GOD is NOT an Angel and Jesus is neither. Nothing has changed, nothing except your understanding that is.   God bless Ed J (Joshua 22:34) http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

Mans alterations of biblical text is not needed; some believe it is though, and that is quite unfortunate.

[kerwin]

Quote (mikeboll64 @ June 30 2013,23:03)

Kerwin, Since “god” actually MEANS “mighty one”, then it is a given that Jehovah is mighty.   In fact, He is the MOST mighty out of all the mighty ones.

Mike,

God does not mean mighty, mighty is just a descriptive word associated with God.

[942767]

Quote (mikeboll64 @ June 30 2013,14:53)

Quote (942767 @ June 29 2013,21:30) Quote (mikeboll64 @ June 30 2013,14:15) All from scripture, Marty. Hi Mike: Please quote the scripture. Love in Christ, Marty Phil 2 Who, existing in the form of God,    did not consider equality with God something to be grasped; 7 rather, he made himself nothing    by taking the form of a servant,    being made in human likeness. Colossians 1:16 For through him all things were created: things in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or powers or rulers or authorities; all things have been created through him and for him. There are more that say the same thing, but this should suffice for now.

Yes, Mike, that is the scripture, but notice it does not say before the universe was created

Love in Christ,
Marty

[terraricca]

Quote (942767 @ July 01 2013,03:23)

Quote (mikeboll64 @ June 30 2013,14:53) Quote (942767 @ June 29 2013,21:30) Quote (mikeboll64 @ June 30 2013,14:15) All from scripture, Marty. Hi Mike: Please quote the scripture. Love in Christ, Marty Phil 2 Who, existing in the form of God,    did not consider equality with God something to be grasped; 7 rather, he made himself nothing    by taking the form of a servant,    being made in human likeness. Colossians 1:16 For through him all things were created: things in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or powers or rulers or authorities; all things have been created through him and for him. There are more that say the same thing, but this should suffice for now. Yes, Mike, that is the scripture, but notice it does not say before the universe was created Love in Christ, Marty

Marty

Col;1…all things were created by him and for him.
Col 1:17 He is before all things,

is the “universe excluded from “ALL THINGS ”

CHRIST IS before all things this includes the Universe ,just not his father and God

[terraricca]

Quote (kerwin @ July 01 2013,03:03)

Quote (mikeboll64 @ June 30 2013,23:03) Kerwin, Since “god” actually MEANS “mighty one”, then it is a given that Jehovah is mighty.   In fact, He is the MOST mighty out of all the mighty ones. Mike, God does not mean mighty, mighty is just a descriptive word associated with God.

K

show your source

[mikeboll64]

Quote (kerwin @ June 30 2013,15:03)

Quote (mikeboll64 @ June 30 2013,23:03) Kerwin, Since “god” actually MEANS “mighty one”, then it is a given that Jehovah is mighty.   In fact, He is the MOST mighty out of all the mighty ones. Mike, God does not mean mighty, mighty is just a descriptive word associated with God.

Kerwin, the earliest known meaning of the Hebrew word “el” is “mighty (one)”.

And that is all it ever means each and every time it is used in scripture.

[Proclaimer]

Quote (Ed J @ July 01 2013,10:39)

2) The “AKJV Bible” was Authorized by the crown (James I) – acting in behalf of  YHVH.

Thanks for keeping this humerous Ed J, as the topic states.

So all that was authorised by the crown (James 1) is on behalf of YHVH?

By that faulty logic, his witch hunts were also on behalf of YHVH. Here is what you must also be promoting by reason of your faulty logic:

James's visit to Denmark, a country familiar with witch hunts, may have encouraged an interest in the study of witchcraft, which he considered a branch of theology. After his return to Scotland, he attended the North Berwick witch trials, the first major persecution of witches in Scotland under the Witchcraft Act 1563. Several people, most notably Agnes Sampson, were convicted of using witchcraft to send storms against James's ship. James became obsessed with the threat posed by witches and, inspired by his personal involvement, in 1597 wrote the Daemonologie, a tract which opposed the practice of witchcraft and which provided background material for Shakespeare's Tragedy of Macbeth. James personally supervised the torture of women accused of being witches
Source: Wikipedia

And you turn a blind eye to the faults in the AKJV because that would infringe on your faulty number system.

[Author]

Posts