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Hi T8,
Those given a share of the Spirit are yet alive,
Abraham, Isaac and Jacob the Lord Jesus offered as examples
Nick….I do believe Jesus, and he said he was “dead”, does dead mean we are still alive? I alway though a man is either dead or alive, and i don’t think being dead means you are still alive, or maybe Jesus lied when he said he was dead but i don’t think so. Scripture says when a man dies his thoughts parish, so if his thoughts parish how does he think being dead.
I know about the witch of Endor Nick, but i am not sure what part God had in all that, same with Moses and Elisha on the mount of transfiguration. All thing are possible with God, but other scriptures say when a person is dead he really is dead. I know when our bodies decompose in those graves we are no longer a “living soul” , but i also believe the spirit goes back to him who gave it. And i do believe that spirit is an “it” not a living soul, when it goes back to the Father.
I also know As you said Jesus said God is not the God of the dead but the living, but that can be taken in several ways, like perhaps it means that God has preserved us somehow for a regeneration of spirit and flesh to be a resurected soul again. Perhaps our death is better looked as a sleep, because of God the Fathers promise of a resurection, so that all of our hope for any future life again, is in him.
I don’t think we are transfered from one state of life to another state of life at death, as you might Nick, because if that were true why even have a resurection, that will witness the redemption of our BODIES.
Anyway i put “all” my hopes and trust in the hands of God the Father Nick.
Peace and love to you and yours. ………gene
Nick….Yes Jonah, was carried by the great fish God had prepared to a pit but was he dead? Who knows. He did remain there for three days and three nights, no scripture says he was dead though. So it would only be an assumption to say he was actually dead, right Nick?
Jesus was just using the analogy of his time in the grave “dead” before he would be resurected back to life, Nick ì just believe what Jesus said,he said he was “dead” and that to me really means he was “dead” not still alive as you seem to assume brother.
Nick sceipture say every hair of our head is numbered right?, so why number them if we would not need them again, i believe our complete DNA is recorded for future use. There would be no need to record it if it was not going to be used again would there?
Anyway we will all know someday right brother?
Peace and love to you and yours. ……….gene
Hi Gene,
Jonah was thrown overboard and swallowed by the large fish.
Three days later he was vomited up onto land by the fish.
So his body never left the fish for three days
He was without oxygen for 3 days
Meanwhile he says that he cried of from the depth of Sheol.
Water encompassed him to the point of death.
Then his life was brought up from the pit.
So it seems his soul departed from his body in the fish and was rejoined to it before he was vomited up. Jesus used this as a simile to his own death and resurrection so he must want us to understand it.
Nick… No scripture says Jesus’ “soul” left his body, that is a speculation brother on your part, not scripturally written. There is not a scripture that says a soul ever leaves a body, because a soul is a body with the breath of life “in” it, according to scriptures. Is it not prophesied in scripture, that God would not leave Jesus’ soul in the grave to see coruption? The spirit does not corrupt in the grave, it goes back to him who gave it, Jesus said unto the Father, “i commend my “spirit” into they hands”, but the flesh body does corrupt the grave Nick and God the Father did not let Jesus’ body see corruption, he resurected it before it did. Why?, because Jesus did no sin, therefore his body was not subject to coruption even though he did die, but not for his sins but ours, so God did not allow his body to see corruption in the grave. He was resurected after the three days and nights time in the grave past, as a complete living “soul”. Just like he was before he died.
Nick no living soul is with out a body of some kind, that is why after we die, and our bodies do corupt in the grave, then we must be resurected with a new “body” before we can become a living “soul” again. Read the valley of dried bones, those who have seen coruption of there bodies must recieve new “bodies” again in order to become living souls again. The new bodies will be spiritually generated, from God the Father, as Adam and Jesus’ was, with that same DNA. All of our DNA is recorded, so we can be regenerated Nick. IMO
Peace and love to you and yours. ……gene
Hi Gene,
It sounds like your dogmas talking. No mention of DNA in scripture but your idea has become fact to you?
Did Jesus, alive in the Spirit, visit the spirits in prison while his body was in the grave?
Peter said so.
Hi Gene,
Acts 2.27
“Because you will not abandon my soul to Hades
NOR allow your holy one to undergo decay.
…he looked ahead and spoke of the resurrection of the Christ
that he was neither abandoned to Hades,
NOR did his flesh undergo decay.”
2 separate issues – the fate of the body and of the soul.
The salvation of the soul is our hope
1 Peter 1.8
..obtaining as the outcome of your faith the salvation of your souls.
Hi Gene,
Speaking of the old and the new bodies
2 Cor 5.1
For we know that if the earthly tent, which is our house, is torn down, we have a building from God, a house not made with hands, eternal in the heavens. For indeed in this house we groan, longing to be clothed with our dwelling from heaven, inasmuch as we, having put it on, will not be found naked. For indeed while we are in this tent, we groan, being burdened, because we do not want to be unclothed but to be clothed, so that what is mortal will be swallowed up by life. Now He Who has prepared us for this very purpose is God, who gave us the Spirit as a pledge.
Nick….They are not to separate things being mentioned there, it is speaking about the same thing, Jesus soul, his complete being, a body and breath of life in it. When a man dies his thoughts “parish”, i hardly think that means still living Nick. That is what those scriptures are saying to me. Why even have a resurection if it is not needed?
Peace and love to you and. ……gene
Hi Gene,
You missed the question.
Did Jesus visit the spirits in prison after his death?
1 Peter 3.18
For Christ who died for sins, once for all, the just for the unjust, so that he might bring us to God, having been put to death in the flesh, but made alive in the Spirit; in which also he went and made proclamation to the spirits now in prison, who once were disobedient, when the patience of God kept waiting in the days of Noah, during the construction of the ark, in which a few, that is 8 persons, were brought safely through the water.
Hi Gene,
2 Cor 5 speaks of the tearing down of the old earthly tent so that we can be clothed with our dwelling from heaven.
But you say that the new dwelling is just the old earthly one? No new body?
Flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom.
Nick…You need to read more, “though he die” (yet) shall he live. As i recall Jesus said that also, so Jesus was speaking from what you quote from the point of eternal death, or “parishing” not a temporal death. That he often compared to a sleep state, Nick when a man dies he ceases to funtion in any capacity other scriptures support that also, IMO,
John 11:25 says this, “Jesus said unto her, I am the “resurection”, and the life: he that believes in me, “though he were dead” yet shall he live: 26…and whosoever liveth and believes in me shall never die. Belivest thou this?
Notice the words “though he were dead” yet (shall) -future tense-, live. So there are those who believed in Jesus who (are) dead. Another point notice Pryor to Jesus saying that, he said..”ĺ am the resurection”, resurection from what if not the dead?
Now if we consider that Jesus was speaking the words of God as he said else where, ” the words he spoke were “not his” words but the words of him that sent him”, then those words were God the Fathers words, comming out of his mouth, so THE SPIRITS of those who die on this earth, who believe, go to the LORD GOD, and are preserved for a resurection of their bodies in the future. Just as Jesus’ was, So in that sense, those who believe are not dead, even though they die, YET SHALL THEY LIVE, they do not parish by the death of the body, only their bodies do, for a period of time and then they are resurected and given a new body with the spirit added back into it. The new body is spiritually generated by God the Father, like Adam and Eve’s were, a body that could have lived forever scripture says.
I can’t understand why you can’t believe in a actual resurected “Body” Nick? Scripture is full of places mentioning it.
Peace and love to you and yours. ……gene
Hi Gene,
I think it means that the believers who are alive when he returns will never die.
They have already passed over from death to life.
They will not be naked but the new body will be put over the old.
The rest are raised in their old bodies to face the judgement.
Nick….To me the best scriptures that clearly explains it, is John 5:24-29
Notice what Jesus say about hearing his words (and) believes on him that sent him, (God the Father) has (present tense) everlasting life and shall not come to condemnation; but is passed (present tense) death unto life.
Verse 25, deals with those who are spiritualy dead now, that is why he says (and “now” is) those were people of that time who were spritually dead, even as we were at one time, and will hear the voice of the son of God: and they that hear shall (future tense) live.
Verse 28, marvel not at this: for the hour is comming, in which all that are (in the graves) shall hear his voice, 29, and shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation or judgement.
Fact is we have all done good and evil in our lives, the only difference is we have already have accepted the sacrifice of Jesus for our sins and it takes away our evil, so we have a resurection of life, while those who have not excepted, a resurection of judgement, because their sins remain on them.
Peace and love to you and yours. ……gene
It is true that only the righteous inherit eternal life. The wicked are cast into hell and hell is cast into the Lake of Fire, the second death. This is written.
If we are born again, we will be God’s children. We know we belong to God because we will love. Those who love not do not belong to God because God is love. The Pharisees were religious in their doctrines, but they lacked the more weighty things. We need to learn from their error. Such religious men tend to accuse those who belong to God, even more than those who are not religious. These religious men engage in criticism day and night. Beware their leaven.
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