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Hi Nick,
Being anointed with the holy spirit does not mean that Christ did not have the holy spirit in him from conception. The Word became one with flesh at conception, not at Jordon. Christ was empowered with the holy spirit at Jordon to do his ministry. The holy spirit rested on him. It was already in him. He was the son of God at conception.
Hi TC,
John was conceived in Elizabeth and the same word is used for the conception of the man , Jesus, in Mary.
But you say the conception of Jesus was different?
Hi TC,
The Spirit is of power and manifests in miraculous works.
But you say Jesus was anointed but that anointing did not manifest till the Jordan?
TC….You said being anointed withthe holy spirit did not mean Jesus did not already have the spirit “in” him. You have it completely backwards, GOD SPIRIT WAS “ON” HIM, WATCHING OVER HIM FROM THE START, BUT CAME TO BE “IN” HIM AT THE ANOINTING BY JOHN THE BAPTIST. Thats when the word came to be “in” the flesh, the flesh man Jesus.
THE SAME APPLIES TO US, GOD uses his spirit to draw us to JESUS, but after we are baptized, he comes to live “in” us.
Jesus told us that after he went to the Father he would send the comforter (the spirit of truth) to be “in” us “forever,” the spirit can be with you, but not nessarely “in” you. The spirit of God was on many before JESUS DAY, GUIDING AND INFLUENCING THEM , But we have the spirit “IN” US AS DOES JESUS, our ‘BODIES ARE THE TEMPLE OF GOD, HE LIVE IN AND THROUGH US, JUST AS HE DOES JESUS.
Trying so desperately to make Jesus appear different then us, is the very work of the servants of satan. Satan wants us to believe we are different and that we can not “come to the measure and full stature of Christ Jesus”. Is that not also what you preach?
Also the site you ask us to view is a trinitarian site, hardy a site to go for the truth . God is spirit he can live in anyone he chooses to, why do you think it say “that God may be in all and through all”. Bottom line is you are trying desperately to make Jesus appear different then his brother and sisters. Thats exactly what Satan wants you to do. 2 Ths 2 explains to clearly, “to those who have ears to hear and eyes to see”.
Jodi has answered your questions clearly and accurately, she present scripture truthfully and honestly, she does not act as a prema donna. you on the other hand seem favor trinitarian teachers and concepts .
Peace and love to you and yours . ……gene
Hi TC,
YOU:
Hi Jodi,
I may address your nonsense again on the weekend again. It is heart wrenching to discuss with you on the things pertaining to our Lord because:…
ME: I could say the same about you TC it is heart wrenching to see that you don’t give glory to God for His work. You want to re-write his word, His work that He accomplished in a man. It is heart wrenching to see you destroy the TRUE GOSPEL, the Good News of how the One True God saves mankind and all of creation through a servant who He anointed with His Spirit. You dishonor our Creator, our Heavenly Father by changing who Christ is, he is the anointed man.
TC, let’s clarify something RIGHT now, I SAY I believe the Son of God is a perfect man. This is heart wrenching to you that I say I believe EXACTLY what scripture says? Come again?
You: (1) You denigrate him by saying he is just a flesh and bone man in his glorified state.
ME: I give glory to God by believing in what God says in scripture, and I give glory to Christ for believing in what Christ says directly in scripture also.
Ephesians 4:13 Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:
Romans 1:1 Paul, a servant of Jesus Christ, called to be an apostle, separated unto the gospel of God, 2 (Which he had promised afore by his prophets in the holy scriptures,) 3 Concerning his Son Jesus Christ our Lord, which was made of the seed of David according to the flesh; 4 And declared to be the Son of God with power, according to the spirit of holiness, by the resurrection from the dead:
I can’t help it TC if the scripture in 1 Corinthians 15 tells us directly that Jesus was raised IN GLORY, IN POWER, INCORRUPTIBLE, that he is the heavenly HUMAN, or that he is the SECOND HUMAN as opposed to the FIRST HUMAN Adam. I can’t help it if Jesus after he rose receiving power, glory and an incorruptible body says that he was flesh and bones. I can’t help it TC if scripture tells us that the one that sits at God’s right hand is of the fruit of David’s loins, and that this Son of Man is returning among the clouds in his FATHER’S GLORY.
TC I can’t help it to believe that the prophecies God gave came true in the man Jesus, and that Jesus quotes those prophecies he says were concerning him, and that those prophecies were about a human from among the people who God would anoint with His Spirit.
I can’t help it to believe God’s word to Abraham that of his seed would come the Christ, or that Jesus was a man who learned obedience being perfected by what he suffered.
I give God GLORY because He brought a man into perfection through the work of His Spirit and that perfection was sacrificed to save us from sin and bring us to eternal life. I give GLORY to God because He fulfilled THROUGH the MAN Jesus, the promise He made BEFORE He created the world, ETERNAL LIFE.
I give glory to Jesus because he is my king and my righteous judge BECAUSE he suffered like I suffer.
I give glory to Jesus because he was the one human God foreordained before the foundation of the world to be the lamb without spot or blemish.
I give glory to both God and Jesus for precisely the reasons why I am told to, ACCORDING to scripture.
YOU:(2) You denigrate him by saying Christ did not have the holy spirit of God until Jordan whereas John the Baptist had received it at conception.
ME: TC what I have said directly is completely against your accusation. I have COMPARED the difference between Jesus BEFORE his baptism and upon his baptism. I have also shared why it is we are told that Jesus would be born from a virgin. So let’s review what I have said on more than one occasion, as I realize our many posts can get lost and often times not read at all.
Isaiah 7:5 Because Syria, Ephraim, and the son of Remaliah, have taken evil counsel against thee, saying, 6 Let us go up against Judah, and vex it, and let us make a breach therein for us, and set a king in the midst of it, even the son of Tabeal 7 Thus saith the Lord GOD, It shall not stand, neither shall it come to pass… 13 And he said, Hear ye now, O house of David; Is it a small thing for you to weary men, but will ye weary my God also? 14 Therefore the Lord himself shall give you a sign; Behold, a virgin shall conceive, and bear a son, and shall call his name Immanuel. 15 Butter and honey shall he eat, that he may know to refuse the evil, and choose the good. 16 For before the child shall know to refuse the evil, and choose the good, the land that thou abhorrest shall be forsaken of both her kings.
1 Corinthians 7:34 There is difference also between a wife and a virgin. The unmarried woman careth for the things of the Lord, that she may be holy both in body and in spirit: but she that is married careth for the things of the world, how she may please her husband.
Luke 1:46 And Mary said, My soul doth magnify the Lord, 47 And my spirit hath rejoiced in God my Saviour. 48 For he hath regarded the low estate of his handmaiden: for, behold, from henceforth all generations shall call me blessed. 49 For he that is mighty hath done to me great things; and holy is his name. 50 And his mercy is on them that fear him from generation to generation. 51 He hath shewed strength with his arm; he hath scattered the proud in the imagination of their hearts. 52 He hath put down the mighty from their seats, and exalted them of low degree. 53 He hath filled the hungry with good things; and the rich he hath sent empty away. 54 He hath holpen his servant Israel, in remembrance of his mercy; 55 As he spake to our fathers, to Abraham, and to his seed for ever.
Galatians 3:16 Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ.
Luke 2:39 And when they had performed all things according to the law of the Lord, they returned into Galilee, to their own city Nazareth. 40 And the child grew, and waxed strong in spirit, filled with wisdom: and the GRACE of God was upon him.
Paul had grace upon him as did other apostles,
1 Corinthians 15:9 For I am the least of the apostles, that am not meet to be called an apostle, because I persecuted the church of God. 10 But by the grace of God I am what I am: and his grace which was bestowed upon me was not in vain; but I laboured more abundantly than they all: yet not I, but the grace of God which was with me.
Acts 4:33 And with great power gave the apostles witness of the resurrection of the Lord Jesus: and great grace was upon them all.
COMPARE a child growing with the grace of God upon him verses the baptism and the anointing (CHRISTOS) of which was necessary in order for Jesus to fulfill ALL righteousness.
Matthew 3:13 Then cometh Jesus from Galilee to Jordan unto John, to be baptized of him. 14 But John forbad him, saying, I have need to be baptized of thee, and comest thou to me? 15 And Jesus answering said unto him, Suffer it to be so now: for thus it becometh us to fulfil all righteousness. Then he suffered him. 16 And Jesus, when he was baptized, went up straightway out of the water: and, lo, the heavens were opened unto him, and he saw the Spirit of God descending like a dove, and lighting upon him: 17 And lo a voice from heaven, saying, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased.
Isaiah 42:1 Behold my SERVANT, whom I uphold; mine elect, in whom my soul delighteth; I have put my spirit upon him: he shall bring forth judgment to the Gentiles. …4 He shall not fail nor be discouraged, till he have set judgment in the earth: and the isles shall wait for his law. 5 Thus saith God the LORD, he that created the heavens, and stretched them out; he that spread forth the earth, and that which cometh out of it; he that giveth breath unto the people upon it, and spirit to them that walk therein: 6 I the LORD have called thee in righteousness, and will hold thine hand, and will keep thee, and give thee for a covenant of the people, for a light of the Gentiles; ….8 I am the LORD: that is my name: and MY GLORY will I not give to another, neither my praise to graven images. 9 Behold, the former things are come to pass, and new things do I declare: before they spring forth I tell you of them.
Luke 4:17 And there was delivered unto him the book of the prophet Esaias. And when he had opened the book, he found the place where it was written, 18 The Spirit of the Lord is upon me, because he hath anointed (Chrio) me to preach the gospel to the poor; he hath sent me to heal the brokenhearted, to preach deliverance to the captives, and recovering of sight to the blind, to set at liberty them that are bruised, 19 To preach the acceptable year of the Lord.
Acts 10:38 How God anointed (Chrio) Jesus of Nazareth with the Holy Ghost and with power: who went about doing good, and healing all that were oppressed of the devil; for God was with him.
Romans 1:4 And DECLARED to be the Son of God with power, ACCORDING TO the spirit of holiness, by the resurrection from the dead:
CHRISTOS WORD ORIGIN CHRIO BOTH MEAN anointed.
TC the scriptures say,
Jesus is the seed of David and declared the Son of God according to the Spirit
Jesus had to be baptized to fulfill all righteousness
Those who are righteous are born of God born of the Spirit
Our unity of faith is to believe that the Son of God is a perfect man, the fullness of Christ–an anointing.
By Jesus’s own words he was ANOINTED (made the Christ) and was SENT into the world
God SENT THIS SON, the one of the seed of David, DECLARED a SON ACCORDING to the Spirit into the world where he would be persecuted for the words he would speak and for the signs and miracles he would perform, they would hang him on the cross where he learned obedience by what he suffered being MADE perfect, and bring eternal life.
Could passages connected together BE more CLEAR as to the identity of CHRIST, as to the identity of WHO the ONLY BEGOTTEN SON is that we are to believe in to have eternal life? Our unity of faith is to BELIEVE that the Son of God IS A PERFECT MAN, the fullness of CHRIST.
TC are you not telling me that I need to believe otherwise, that the FULLNESS of CHRIST represents something else, and NOT the perfected man????
You disgrace GOD and His Son if you do not believe that the only begotten Son that God sent into the world to bring everlasting life is not the seed of David that was declared a Son ACCORDING to the Spirit, the one who had to be baptized in order to fulfill ALL RIGHTEOUSNESS, the man that was made perfect learning obedience through suffering on the cross, the Son of God who is the perfect man by the full measure of an anointing of God’s Spirit.
Matthew 22:42 Saying, What think ye of Christ? whose son is he? They say unto him, The Son of David. 43 He saith unto them,How then doth David in spirit call him Lord, saying, 44 The LORD said unto my Lord, Sit thou on my right hand, till I make thine enemies thy footstool? 45 If David then call him Lord, how is he his son? 46 And no man was able to answer him a word, neither durst any man from that day forth ask him any more questions.
Acts 2:29 Men and brethren, let me freely speak unto you of the patriarch David, that he is both dead and buried, and his sepulchre is with us unto this day. 30 Therefore being a prophet, and knowing that God had sworn with an oath to him, that of the fruit of his loins, according to the flesh, he would raise up Christ to sit on his throne; 31 He seeing this before spake of the resurrection of Christ, that his soul was not left in hell, neither his flesh did see corruption. 32 This Jesus hath God raised up, whereof we all are witnesses.
Acts 26:23 That Christ should suffer, and that he should be the first that should rise from the dead, and should shew light unto the people, and to the Gentiles.
Isaiah 42:1 Behold my SERVANT, whom I uphold; mine elect, in whom my soul delighteth; I have put my spirit upon him: he shall bring forth judgment to the Gentiles.
Luke 24:26 Ought not Christ to have suffered these things, and to enter into his glory? …39 Behold my hands and my feet, that it is I myself: handle me, and see; for a spirit hath not flesh and bones, as ye see me have. 40 And when he had thus spoken, he shewed them his hands and his feet. 41 And while they yet believed not for joy, and wondered, he said unto them,Have ye here any meat? 42 And they gave him a piece of a broiled fish, and of an honeycomb. 43 And he took it, and did eat before them. 44 And he said unto them, These are the words which I spake unto you, while I was yet with you, that all things must be fulfilled, which were written in the law of Moses, and in the prophets, and in the psalms, concerning me. 45 Then opened he their understanding, that they might understand the scriptures, 46 And said unto them,Thus it is written, and thus it behoved Christ to suffer, and to RISE from the dead the third day: 47 And that repentance and remission of sins should be preached in his name among all nations, beginning at Jerusalem.
42 So also is the resurrection of the dead. It is sown in corruption; it is raised in incorruption: 43 It is sown in dishonour; it is raised in glory: it is sown in weakness; it is raised in power: 44 It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body.
YOU: (3) You denigrate him by saying he was just like one of the boys with flesh like ours and was resurrected from the dead with no blood in him.
ME: First of all he WAS not just a man, HE IS A MAN TO THIS DAY, one who knew no sin, and it is clearly proven in scripture that Jesus suffered and entered into his glory upon RISING from the dead with an incorruptible body, RAISED a spiritual body, raised with power and he was a witness to people showing them his flesh and bones body. TC I just believe exactly what the scriptures tell me. You say I need to believe otherwise, that he received his glory and power later.
Romans 1:4 And DECLARED to be the Son of God with power, ACCORDING TO the spirit of holiness, by the resurrection from the dead:
WHAT part of the above passage do you not comprehend? What part of RAISED IN power, RAISED in GLORY, RAISED INCORRUPTIBLE do you not understand TC?
<b>Sounds like you will deny the Christ when he returns, you will call him the antichrist, as you define Christ not according to God’s word and the words of Jesus. </b>
26 For whosoever shall be ashamed of me and of my words, of him shall the Son of man be ashamed, when he shall come in his own glory, and in his Father’s, and of the holy angels.
Matthew 16:27 For the Son of man shall come in the glory of his Father with his angels; and then he shall reward every man according to his works.
7 Saying,The Son of man must be delivered into the hands of sinful men, and be crucified, and the third day rise again.
Acts 3:22 For Moses truly said unto the fathers, A prophet shall the Lord your God raise up unto you of your brethren, like unto me; him shall ye hear in all things whatsoever he shall say unto you.
The ONE TC I listen to his MY BROTHER, and he is also my king and master.
Romans 9:1 I say the truth in Christ, I lie not, my conscience also bearing me witness in the Holy Ghost, 2 That I have great heaviness and continual sorrow in my heart. 3 For I could wish that myself were accursed from Christ for my brethren, my kinsmen according to the flesh: 4 Who are Israelites; to whom pertaineth the adoption, and the glory, and the covenants, and the giving of the law, and the service of God, and the promises; 5 Whose are the fathers, and of whom as concerning the flesh Christ came, who is over all, God blessed for ever. Amen.
1 John 4:1 Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world. 2 Hereby know ye the Spirit of God: Every spirit that confesseth that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is of God: 3 And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world.
2 John 2:7 For many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist.
Jesus CAME in the FLESH of the SEED of David, and he EXISTS to this day the fruit of David’s loins, his offspring.
Revelation 22:16 I Jesus have sent mine angel to testify unto you these things in the churches. I am the root and the offspring of David, and the bright and morning star.
TC, this is what I believe, the TRUE GOSPEL, “of the fruit of his loins, according to the flesh, he would raise up Christ to sit on his throne; 31 He seeing this before spake of the resurrection of Christ,”…1 Paul, a servant of Jesus Christ, called to be an apostle, separated unto the gospel of God, 2 (Which he had promised afore by his prophets in the holy scriptures,) 3 Concerning his Son Jesus Christ our Lord, which was made of the seed of David according to the flesh; 4 And declared to be the Son of God with power, according to the spirit of holiness, by the resurrection from the dead:
Hi Jodi,
Eccl 5:3 For a dream cometh through the multitude of business; and a fool’s voice is known by multitude of words.
Me: You didn’t have to write a book. A lot of what you were saying doesn’t relate to what we are trying to establish here: who is Christ and his relationship to God.
Also, you keeping saying the same things over and over as if at some point I will believe them, or more likely to save face. For Example, you would say the King David is dead and quote one version of it as if it was the only one. But I had shown you the others. Still, you make it seem like there is no other, when in fact I had shown you there are that relate to what we are addressing.Hi Jodi,
Continued:
Acts 2:29 (KJV) Men and brethren, let me freely speak unto you of the patriarch David, that he is both dead and buried, and his sepulchre is with us unto this dayBible Hub: Men brothers it is permitted to speak with freedom with you concerning the Patriarch David that both he died and was buried and the tomb of him is amoung us unto the day this.
New International Version
“Fellow Israelites, I can tell you confidently that the patriarch David died and was buried, and his tomb is here to this day.New Living Translation
“Dear brothers, think about this! You can be sure that the patriarch David wasn’t referring to himself, for he died and was buried, and his tomb is still here among us.English Standard Version
“Brothers, I may say to you with confidence about the patriarch David that he both died and was buried, and his tomb is with us to this day.Berean Study Bible
Brothers, I can tell you with confidence that the patriarch David died and was buried, and his tomb is with us to this day.Berean Literal Bible
Men, brothers, it is permitted me to speak with freedom to you concerning the patriarch David, that both he died and was buried, and his tomb is among us unto this day,New American Standard Bible
“Brethren, I may confidently say to you regarding the patriarch David that he both died and was buried, and his tomb is with us to this day.Contemporary English Version
My friends, it is right for me to speak to you about our ancestor David. He died and was buried, and his tomb is still here.Good News Translation
“My friends, I must speak to you plainly about our famous ancestor King David. He died and was buried, and his grave is here with us to this very day.International Standard Version
“Brothers, I can tell you confidently that the patriarch David died and was buried, and that his tomb is among us to this day.NET Bible
“Brothers, I can speak confidently to you about our forefather David, that he both died and was buried, and his tomb is with us to this day.
And on and on.
These versions and many others do say David is dead, but had died. A few version have “is dead”.
Acts 2:24 Whom (the Messiah) God hath raised up, having loosed the pains of death: because it was not possible that he should be holden of it…27 Because thou wilt not leave my (David) soul (5590. psuché, not body) in hell, neither wilt thou suffer thine Holy One to see corruption.
Me: David was relying on the resurrection of Christ from the dead in body and mind to resurrect him now in mind and spirit from the dead. Notice that soul is contrasted with body.
New Living Translation
Acts 2:27 “Dear brothers, think about this! You can be sure that the patriarch David wasn’t referring to himself, for he died and was buried, and his tomb is still here among.Me: I believe this is the best translation of Acts 2:27. David did not resurrect in spirit from the dead to save himself, but it was the resurrection of Christ that saves him. David’s soul (inner self) was resurrected from the dead not his body at the time of Pentecost.
Hi Jodi,
We went over all the others already. You have not made your case–far from it. The Messiah is the Word of God bonded as one with the flesh of the seed of David. The Word was God and is God. The Word bonded with the seed of David as the heart and mind of God bonded as one with the human heart and mind of the messiah through the holy spirit. This was a growth process for the human Messiah, both man and God–both the son of man and the son of God.
The son of God is God (John 1:1). The Messiah was conceived of the spirit of God and did not have to wait until Jordon to receive it.The Messiah had a glorified spirit body after his ascension into heaven, the same one the Word had before the Word became on with flesh.
John 1:14 And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.
The spirit of God now has the heart and mind of Christ in it.That sums it up for me. You and your toady Gene do not know who the son of God is. He is not a glorified flesh and bone creature from the lagoon.
Hi Jodi and Gene,
Please reconcile 1 Corinthians 15:52 and 1 Thes 4:16-17 with 2 Cor 12:2-3, Phil 1:22 and 2 Cor 5:1,8 and show no contradictions. then I would like to discuss this with you. Taking all the scripture that pertains to the subject we are addressing is how we understand the bible. You have not really even given cursory attention to 2 Cor 12:2-3, Phil 1:22 and 2 Cor 5:8.
I have constantly tried to get you to address this, but you have avoided 2 Cor 12:2-3, Phil 1:22 and 2 Cor 5:1,88 like the plague. I do not want to talk about the other things which we have exhausted. You have not address this with good reason. It is because you cannot reconcile scripture within the confines of your false beliefs. If you can address the above , then we will continue our discussion. If not, I am finished here and will consider both of you as frauds and phonies.TC,
29 “Fellow Israelites, I may say to you confidently of our ancestor David that he both died and was buried, and his tomb is with us to this day.
REALLY nailing it hear that David is DEAD, HE DIED, HE was BURIED, and his tomb is with us to this day.
Delusional to use this as saying that because it says he DIED he is no longer dead??? come again?? The very point that is being made here is that David is still dead, his tomb is with us to this day, we can look at that tomb and know that is where his bones lie.
30 Since he was a prophet, he knew that God had sworn with an oath to him that he would put one of his descendants on his throne. 31 Foreseeing this, David spoke of the resurrection of the Messiah, saying, “He was not abandoned to Hades, nor did his flesh experience corruption.’ 32 This Jesus God raised up, and of that all of us are witnesses. 33 Being therefore exalted at the right hand of God, and having received from the Father the promise of the Holy Spirit, he has poured out this that you both see and hear. 34 For David did not ascend into the heavens, but he himself says, “The Lord said to my Lord, “Sit at my right hand, 35 until I make your enemies your footstool.” ‘ 36 Therefore let the entire house of Israel know with certainty that God has made him both Lord and Messiah, this Jesus whom you crucified.”
TC this was written AFTER Pentecost and it says that DAVID has not ascended to heaven. Then we are told about another TIME which is ALSO spoken of in 1 Corinthians 15,
25 For he must reign until he has put all his enemies under his feet.
When Jesus returns he is going to reign on earth putting all enemies under his feet, what are we told just prior,
20 But in fact Christ has been raised from the dead, the first fruits of those who have died. 21 For since death came through a human being, the resurrection of the dead has also come through a human being; 22 for as all die in Adam, so all will be made alive in Christ. 23 But each in his own order: Christ the first fruits, then at his coming those who belong to Christ.
A few things here this is speaking of the resurrection of the dead when one rises to receive an incorruptible body, when one rises to receive glory. ALL shall be made alive given an incorruptible body. AT HIS COMING those who belong to Christ are MADE ALIVE. David BELONG’s to Christ, he is MADE ALIVE at Christ’s coming, which is exactly why we are told in Acts that David died, he was buried and his tomb is with us this day.
DAVID is included in the chapter below, he has not received the promise as made clear in Acts 2, he would not receive it until Christ’s second coming when he comes to put all enemies under his feet.
Hebrews 11:39 Yet all these, though they were commended for their faith, did not receive what was promised, 40 since God had provided something better so that they would not, apart from us, be made perfect.
YOU:I believe this is the best translation of Acts 2:27. David did not resurrect in spirit from the dead to save himself, but it was the resurrection of Christ that saves him. David’s soul (inner self) was resurrected from the dead not his body at the time of Pentecost.
ME:What on earth are you talking about this makes no sense, “David did not resurrect in spirit from the dead to save himself” yah, who would EVER think such a thing, why even mention such and absurd idea??
God made David a prophet, God gave David promises, his son would die, but his flesh would not see decay and he would be resurrected to LIFE. I know of no scripture that speaks of the resurrection representing a different resurrection than one to LIFE receiving an immortal body. You have seriously created one weird doctrine. Show me one scripture where the word resurrection is not used to represent being raised to LIFE again as Jesus was raised to life again? Once again, we are given the account of Pentecost and in it there is not a single world about dead people being resurrected with a spirit, the Spirit came to men who were alive at the time, and we are DIRECTLY TOLD the PURPOSE of receiving the Spirit, it was so some could be made prophets, some healers, some to speak in tongues, some apostles..etc. Paul was an apostle and he died in hope that his mortal body would be swallowed up to LIFE, and as an apostle he tells us directly that David has not received the promise and he won’t apart from him, they will receive it together. Paul is even so specific about it he tells us that the dead will receive the promise first and those in Christ alive at his return will receive it just after (which Paul tells us is the mystery that there will be those still alive when Christ returns and they will have their bodies swallowed up to life) We are told that the DEAD and those that are still ALIVE receive it. No mention of your very strange non biblical doctrine TC, where there are spirit beings receiving a body then also.
Acts 2:25 King David said this about him: ‘I see that the LORD is always with me. I will not be shaken, for he is right beside me. 26 No wonder my heart is glad, and my tongue shouts his praises! My body rests in hope.
TC, David’s HOPE is the SAME hope that we see that Paul had, which concerns the BODY, the body where mortality is swallowed up to LIFE.
27 For you will not leave my soul among the dead or allow your Holy One to rot in the grave.
David knew his soul would not remain dead, his body rests in hope for LIFE.
28 You have shown me the way of life, and you will fill me with the joy of your presence. 29 “Dear brothers, think about this! You can be sure that the patriarch David wasn’t referring to himself, for he died and was buried, and his tomb is still here among us. 30 But he was a prophet, and he knew God had promised with an oath that one of David’s own descendants would sit on his throne.
When David said, “allow your Holy One to rot in the grave.” he was not referring to himself, FOR HE DIED, he DID ROT in the grave.
Thanks TC, you just made the scripture even more clear to prove my point.
27 For you will not leave my soul among the dead or allow your Holy One to rot in the grave…You can be sure that the patriarch David wasn’t referring to himself, for he died and was buried, and his tomb is still here among us.
Hebrews 9:27 And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment:28 So Christ was once offered to bear the sins of many; and unto them that look for him shall he appear the second time without sin unto salvation.
This passage is completely against your doctrine TC, men die and AFTER this the judgement, and those that look for him shall he APPEAR the second time unto SALVATION.
There exists NO scripture that says, it is appointed for men once to die, after that those in Christ have a body that decays but their spirit goes to be with Christ in heaven, and then they return with Christ and receive immortal bodies.
Paul speaks AGAINST YOU TC on so many counts.
Hi Jodi,
Abraham, Isaac and Jacob died, as did David.
All are yet alive to God because the faithful Spirit of eternal life abides in them and will raise them.
Hi TC,
I hope you can reconcile your belief with that of Paul’s words in Hebrews 9.
Also reconcile your belief with what is said below,
31 Because he hath appointed a day, in the which he will judge the world in righteousness by that MAN whom he hath ORDAINED; whereof he hath given assurance unto all men, in that he hath raised him from the dead.
Also reconcile,
13 Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:
This is where MY FAITH LIVES TC, but you want to say I speak not the truth.
think on this,
Christ had to be baptized receiving the Spirit in order to fulfill ALL righteousness, I would think that his perfecting going to the cross was fulfilling that righteousness, wouldn’t you agree?
We are to believe that the Son of God is a perfect man, the measure and stature of the fulness of Christ (Christos anointing). The INFANT was to fulfill prophecy, he HAD to be anointed with God’s Spirit and be sent out into the world to be persecuted by his words and actions in order to fulfill prophecy.
Hi TC,
YOU:Please reconcile 1 Corinthians 15:52 and 1 Thes 4:16-17 with 2 Cor 12:2-3, Phil 1:22 and 2 Cor 5:8 and show no contradictions.
ME: I have already gone through that twice with you, and I have told you that according to my understanding of these scriptures there is no contradiction, there is NOTHING that needs to be reconciled. My understanding comes from applying what Paul is saying in these passages through what he says in other passages. For instance I do not read 2 Corinthians 5 without applying what he said in Romans 7. Just like I do not apply Colossians 1 without applying Isaiah 42, Ephesians 3, Acts 17, and a whole host of many other passages.
Hi Jodi,
You quoted Me:
Please reconcile 1 Corinthians 15:52 and 1 Thes 4:16-17 with 2 Cor 12:2-3, Phil 1:22 and 2 Cor 5:8 and show no contradictions.
You: I have already gone through that twice with you, and I have told you that according to my understanding of these scriptures there is no contradiction, there is NOTHING that needs to be reconciled. My understanding comes from applying what Paul is saying in these passages through what he says in other passages. For instance I do not read 2 Corinthians 5 without applying what he said in Romans 7. Just like I do not apply Colossians 1 without applying Isaiah 42, Ephesians 3, Acts 17, and a whole host of many other passages.
Me: You are a liar. I have mentioned this reconciliation many times in the past which you have ignored because you couldn’t and still can’t. I have not seen one commentary by you that quoted the above scriptures in your last numerous posts in which I had asked for it and which you have completely ignored.
Hi Jodi,
All emphasis in the quotation marks are mine.
You quoted Me: 29 “Fellow Israelites, I may say to you confidently of our ancestor David that he both died and was buried, and his tomb is with us to this day.
You: REALLY nailing it hear that David is DEAD, HE DIED, HE was BURIED, and his tomb is with us to this day.
Delusional to use this as saying that because it says he DIED he is no longer dead??? come again?? The very point that is being made here is that David is still dead, his tomb is with us to this day, we can look at that tomb and know that is where his bones lie.
30 Since he was a prophet, he knew that God had sworn with an oath to him that he would put one of his descendants on his throne. 31 Foreseeing this, David spoke of the resurrection of the Messiah, saying, “He was not abandoned to Hades, nor did his flesh experience corruption.’ 32 This Jesus God raised up, and of that all of us are witnesses. 33 Being therefore exalted at the right hand of God, and having received from the Father the promise of the Holy Spirit, he has poured out this that you both see and hear. 34 For David did not ascend into the heavens, but he himself says, “The Lord said to my Lord, “Sit at my right hand, 35 until I make your enemies your footstool.” ‘ 36 Therefore let the entire house of Israel know with certainty that God has made him both Lord and Messiah, this Jesus whom you crucified.”
TC this was written AFTER Pentecost and it says that DAVID has not ascended to heaven. Then we are told about another TIME which is ALSO spoken of in 1 Corinthians 15,
30 Since he was a prophet, he knew that God had sworn with an oath to him that he would put one of his descendants on his throne. 31 Foreseeing this, David spoke of the resurrection of the Messiah, saying, “He was not abandoned to Hades, nor did his flesh experience corruption.’ 32 This Jesus God raised up, and of that all of us are witnesses. 33 Being therefore exalted at the right hand of God, and having received from the Father the promise of the Holy Spirit, he has poured out this that you both see and hear. 34 For David did not ascend into the heavens, but he himself says, “The Lord said to my Lord, “Sit at my right hand, 35 until I make your enemies your footstool.” ‘ 36 Therefore let the entire house of Israel know with certainty that God has made him both Lord and Messiah, this Jesus whom you crucified.”
TC this was written AFTER Pentecost and it says that DAVID has not ascended to heaven. Then we are told about another TIME which is ALSO spoken of in 1 Corinthians 15,Me:
New Living Translation
Acts 2:27 “Dear brothers, think about this! You can be sure that the patriarch David wasn’t referring to himself, for he died and was buried, and his tomb is still here among.Me: This verse wasn’t referring to David means that this verse was referring to Christ, not David, for Christ was resurrected wholly (body and spirit) from the dead. For David’s body is still in the grave, even now. But this doesn’t mean that his mind, spirit and heart had not resurrected after Christ had ascended into heaven.
Reconciliation:
2 Cor 5:8 We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord.Ezk 36:26 A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit (holy spirit) will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh (of the Messiah).
Me: although Ezk 36:26 is addressing carnal Israel, the principle is true for all flesh.
Reference verse:
Psalm 16:9 Therefore my heart is glad, and my glory rejoiceth: my flesh (new flesh made like Christ) also shall rest in hope. 10 For thou wilt not leave my soul (doesn’t say body) in hell; neither wilt thou suffer thine Holy One to see corruption.Me: The messiah’s heart is David’s new heart and Christ shares his glory with the church, including David (Rom 8:17). This happens at Pentecost.
So, let’s put things in order in these parallel verses:
First:
“Therefore my heart is glad, and my glory rejoiceth”
“For thou wilt not leave my soul (inner self, not body) in hell;”Second:
“neither wilt thou suffer thine Holy One to see corruption “
“my flesh shall also rest in hope”The order is a spiritual resurrection first, and then a new body second. The flesh that shall rest in hope is the new flesh.
Reconciliation:
2 Cor 5:1 For we know that if our earthly house of this tabernacle (temporary dwelling or tent) were dissolved, we have a building of God, an house not made with hands, eternal in the heavens.
Matthew 27: Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye are like unto whited sepulchres, which indeed appear beautiful outward, but are within full of (3498 mortal) bones, and of all uncleanness.
https://biblehub.com/greek/3498.htmHi TC,
I will get those posts for you and you can retract calling me a LIAR, as that is something I don’t do.
You want to call me a prima donna, you want to address Ecc 10 at me, that is hurtful but to call me a liar I simply cannot stand for.
SO JUST WAIT and you CAN EAT YOUR WORDS!!!!!!!!!!
and then I will not speak to you again.
You::
25 For he must reign until he has put all his enemies under his feet.
When Jesus returns he is going to reign on earth putting all enemies under his feet, what are we told just prior,
20 But in fact Christ has been raised from the dead, the first fruits of those who have died. 21 For since death came through a human being, the resurrection of the dead has also come through a human being; 22 for as all die in Adam, so all will be made alive in Christ. 23 But each in his own order: Christ the first fruits, then at his coming those who belong to Christ.
A few things here this is speaking of the resurrection of the dead when one rises to receive an incorruptible body, when one rises to receive glory. ALL shall be made alive given an incorruptible body. AT HIS COMING those who belong to Christ are MADE ALIVE. David BELONG’s to Christ, he is MADE ALIVE at Christ’s coming, which is exactly why we are told in Acts that David died, he was buried and his tomb is with us this day.
DAVID is included in the chapter below, he has not received the promise as made clear in Acts 2, he would not receive it until Christ’s second coming when he comes to put all enemies under his feet.
Hebrews 11:39 Yet all these, though they were commended for their faith, did not receive what was promised, 40 since God had provided something better so that they would not, apart from us, be made perfect.Me: If you look from verse 1 to the end of the chapter you will only find OT patriarchs and saints, not NT saints. These died in faith and did not receive the promise until the resurrection and ascension of Christ into heaven. Then they could be baptized in the spirit. See below.
You quoted me: I believe this is the best translation of Acts 2:27. David did not resurrect in spirit from the dead to save himself, but it was the resurrection of Christ that saves him. David’s soul (inner self) was resurrected from the dead not his body at the time of Pentecost.
You: What on earth are you talking about this makes no sense, “David did not resurrect in spirit from the dead to save himself” yah, who would EVER think such a thing, why even mention such and absurd idea??
Me: I am talking about heavenly not “what on earth things” like you are. Learn how to read and think: I said it was because of Christ’s resurrection from the dead that Psalm 16:9 is referring to when reading Acts 2:27 not David. Don’t be a dingbat.
Lol TC, I didn’t “completely” ignore them, as I responded to you before you stated that I have completely ignored them, and in my response I said that I would not repeat myself. You also told me in one of your recent posts to stop repeating myself, lol!
I had to share what you said to me to my husband, now I will gather those posts for you.
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