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Quote (terraricca @ Jan. 23 2010,17:06) Goll
here is one in TO
Dt 18:15 The LORD your God will raise up for you a prophet like me. He will be one of your own people. You must listen to him.is this clear enough???
Did it say to achieve personal salvation you have to believe in Messiah?No Jew required to believe or pray to any prophet for salvation purpose except to pray to one and only God and trust Him alone and obey His commandments.
Quote (gollamudi @ Jan. 23 2010,12:10) Quote (terraricca @ Jan. 23 2010,17:06) Goll
here is one in TO
Dt 18:15 The LORD your God will raise up for you a prophet like me. He will be one of your own people. You must listen to him.is this clear enough???
Did it say to achieve personal salvation you have to believe in Messiah?
You do realize that certain definitions of trust and faith are synonyms.You also obey the one trust when they tell you “do this or perish.”
Quote (gollamudi @ Jan. 23 2010,12:17) No Jew required to believe or pray to any prophet for salvation purpose except to pray to one and only God and trust Him alone and obey His commandments.
Part of your statement is a red herring fallacy. Jesus stated to ask God for something in his name which is not the same as praying to him.I assure you Jews are required to believe prophets as prophets speak the word of God.
There was a price to pay when one chose to disobey a prophet of God.
Hi brother Kerwin,
I find you always avoid my question. Please see the central subject of my question “salvation”Quote (gollamudi @ Jan. 23 2010,13:04) Hi brother Kerwin,
I find you always avoid my question. Please see the central subject of my question “salvation”
The problem is that you do not seem to understand that in order to have eternal life you must first be saved from your sins. The prophet Ezekiel tells us.Ezekiel 18:21-23(NIV) reads:
Quote “But if a wicked man turns away from all the sins he has committed and keeps all my decrees and does what is just and right, he will surely live; he will not die. None of the offenses he has committed will be remembered against him. Because of the righteous things he has done, he will live. Do I take any pleasure in the death of the wicked? declares the Sovereign LORD. Rather, am I not pleased when they turn from their ways and live?
The only way to do this is to believe the promise of righteousness which you will receive by obeying everything Jesus teaches. You will do that only if you have faith that Jesus is the Anointed One. This is where the scripture Terraricca comes in.
There was no such promise under the Law of Mosses.
In this way obeying Jesus carries out the righteous requirements of the Law of Mosses.
kerwin,Jan. wrote:Ezekiel 18:21-23(NIV) reads:
Quote “But if a wicked man turns away from all the sins he has committed and keeps all my decrees and does what is just and right, he will surely live; he will not die. None of the offenses he has committed will be remembered against him. Because of the righteous things he has done, he will live. Do I take any pleasure in the death of the wicked? declares the Sovereign LORD. Rather, am I not pleased when they turn from their ways and live? .
This is what I believe for my salvation or eternal life but not faith in Messiah for the remission of my sins since no Jewish scriptures says so but only the alleged doctrines of st Paul and others.Quote (gollamudi @ Jan. 23 2010,02:52) kerwin,Jan. wrote:Ezekiel 18:21-23(NIV) reads:
Quote “But if a wicked man turns away from all the sins he has committed and keeps all my decrees and does what is just and right, he will surely live; he will not die. None of the offenses he has committed will be remembered against him. Because of the righteous things he has done, he will live. Do I take any pleasure in the death of the wicked? declares the Sovereign LORD. Rather, am I not pleased when they turn from their ways and live? .
This is what I believe for my salvation or eternal life but not faith in Messiah for the remission of my sins since no Jewish scriptures says so but only the alleged doctrines of st Paul and others.
But I thought you just told me that you didn't say Jesus was not the Messiah?Now it seems you are saying he is not?
WJ
Quote (gollamudi @ Jan. 23 2010,18:52) kerwin,Jan. wrote:Ezekiel 18:21-23(NIV) reads:
Quote “But if a wicked man turns away from all the sins he has committed and keeps all my decrees and does what is just and right, he will surely live; he will not die. None of the offenses he has committed will be remembered against him. Because of the righteous things he has done, he will live. Do I take any pleasure in the death of the wicked? declares the Sovereign LORD. Rather, am I not pleased when they turn from their ways and live? .
This is what I believe for my salvation or eternal life but not faith in Messiah for the remission of my sins since no Jewish scriptures says so but only the alleged doctrines of st Paul and others.
Hi Adam:The problem is that you cannot keep the commandments of God without, if only inadvertently, violating them.
We will be saved only through what God has done for us in the person of Jesus His Son and His Christ. His sacrifice is the propitation for our sins. There is no other way to be saved.
Therefore, it we are saved not because of our goodness but because of the goodness of God.
Salvation is by faith(believing the Word of God) that it might be by grace (unmerited favor).
Love in Christ,
MartyHi brothers WJ and Marty,
I know you both will be disturbed seeing my recent posts. But I am in great dilemma what to believe. Before Jesus all Jews were saved by confessing their sins directly to God without any mediator. No Hebrew scriptures states so as you told above. Even Jews were forgiven by God without Temple and regular sacrifice when they were on exile. Where is the proof in Hebrew scriptures which state that we will be forgiven by Messiah of our sins?Quote (gollamudi @ Jan. 23 2010,13:52) kerwin,Jan. wrote:Ezekiel 18:21-23(NIV) reads:
Quote “But if a wicked man turns away from all the sins he has committed and keeps all my decrees and does what is just and right, he will surely live; he will not die. None of the offenses he has committed will be remembered against him. Because of the righteous things he has done, he will live. Do I take any pleasure in the death of the wicked? declares the Sovereign LORD. Rather, am I not pleased when they turn from their ways and live? .
This is what I believe for my salvation or eternal life but not faith in Messiah for the remission of my sins since no Jewish scriptures says so but only the alleged doctrines of st Paul and others.
Did you read what the Passage from Ezekiel states? That passage addresses the remission of sins. The same is true of the gospel of Jesus the Anointed One as God does not change.When God states “None of the offenses he has committed will be remembered against him.” he is speaking of forgiveness.
Quote (gollamudi @ Jan. 23 2010,15:16) So where is the requirement of Jesus here my friend?
The promise of the Spirit of Holiness. I have already shown you where it is prophesied of the link between the Anointed One and the Spirit. If one walks according to the ways of the Spirit then they do not sin. If they do not sin the God will forgive all the sins that go before and they will have eternal life.The contract is sealed by blood. Jesus shed that blood.
One enters the contract by obeying all of Jesus' teachings.
One receives and lives by the Spirit through belief in Jesus and so in all of what he states.
Jesus blood is the only acceptable sacrifice because he did not sin even though he was tempted even as we are.
Quote (gollamudi @ Jan. 23 2010,15:32) That is what the Christianity says which is negated by a true jew.
So Pharisees are true Jews?Since when?
So which prophet do you believe are false, Jeremiah, Isaiah, Ezekiel, or another? I already pointed to their testimony of the comming Anointed One.
Even the Pharisees, or at least their descendants, that you prefer listening to tell you that the Anointed One will bring righteousness. Why do you reject it when he brings it? Do you love the darkness?
Adam……….Make a study of the Seventy week Prophesy given by Danial that Should clarify how and when the “MESSIAH” Should come, all the Jews Knew the time of His coming including their leaders as well a the High Priests and Pharisees. They were the one who cast out the Son of the Owner of the vineyard and Killed Him. Be careful not to by into their Dogmas and rejection of Jesus as Our savior and High Priest lest you let the words he spoke to us slip. Adam no one said this was going to be easy, but why come this far and then slip, do not get caught up in the Jewish Dogmas. They reject Christ and GOD rejected them and sent a sword after them.
My prayer is that GOD will Shield you from their denial of Jesus and keep you in the true faith.
Peace and love to you and yours Adam………………………gene
Hi brother Gene,
I appreciate your concern for me. But no single Christian doctrine could really satisfy my desires for God so far. I have read more than 100 books in one year. I have read most famous theologians including the books sent by you. But no single doctrine of Christianity could really answer all my questions on Jesus. I now turn to Jews if they got answers for my queries. My recent posts are based on their interpretations on Jesus.Even now I am free from any biased tendency towards any single doctrine. I am still praying to God to reveal truth from His scriptures. Soon I will come up with my findings on my studies.
Peace and love
AdamAdam……Include in your inquires the (SEVENTY WEEK) PROPHESY OF DANIEL, It shows the exact time of the Messiah berth. IMO
peace and love to you and yours…………..gene
I have already many times on this propecy brother Gene. But I find the Jewish interpretation more appropriate if you read the original translations like NEB/RSV/Jewish Bible etc. Here is one of such interpretations on Dan 9:24-27
Daniel 9:25 Translation
QUESTION: I have noticed that there are many differences between Jewish Bible translations of Daniel 9:25-26 and several different Christian Bible translations. What should be the correct readings of the disputed words and phrases?ANSWER:
In our study of the different translations we will compare the Hebrew text with |that of the King James Version of the Bible. It contains the grossest errors, which are, in |whole or in part, duplicated by other Christian versions of the Bible.
First, the King James Version puts a definite article before “Messiah the Prince” (9:25). |The original Hebrew text does not read “the Messiah the Prince,” but, having no article, |it is to be rendered “a mashiach [“anointed one,” “messiah”], a prince,” i.e., Cyrus |(Isaiah 45:1, 13; Ezra 1:1-2).
The word mashiach is nowhere used in the Jewish Scriptures as a proper name, but as a |title of authority of a king or a high priest. Therefore, a correct rendering of the original |Hebrew should be: “an anointed one, a prince.”
Second, the King James Version disregards the Hebrew punctuation. The punctuation |mark 'atnach functions as the main pause within a sentence. The 'atnach is the appropriate |equivalent of the semicolon in the modern system of punctuation. It thus has the effect of |separating the seven weeks from the sixty-two weeks: “. . . until an anointed one, a |prince, shall be seven weeks; then for sixty-two weeks it shall be built again . . .” (9:25).
By creating a sixty-nine week period, which is not divided into two separate periods of |seven weeks and sixty-two weeks respectively, Christians reach an incorrect conclusion, |i.e., that the Messiah will come 483 years after the destruction of the First Temple.
Some Christians claim that there is something called a “prophetic year” of 360 days, thus |shortening the interval between the beginning of the 483 years which they claim began in |444 B.C.E., and the date of the crucifixion of Jesus. They do this in order to make the |dates coincide, but the claim of a “prophetic year” is without any scriptural foundation.
Third, the King James Version omits the definite article in Daniel 9:26, which should |read: “And after the threescore and two weeks. . . .” By treating the sixty-two weeks as a |distinct period, this verse, in the original Hebrew, shows that the sixty-two weeks |mentioned in verse 25 are correctly separated from the seven weeks by the 'atnach. |Hence, two anointed ones are spoken of in this chapter, one of whom comes after seven |weeks (Cyrus), and the other after a further period of sixty-two weeks (Alexander |Yannai).Fourth, the words v'ayn lo (9:26) are incorrectly translated by the King James Version as |”but not for himself.” They should be translated as “he has nothing” or “he shall have |nothing.” There are Christian commentators who maintain this phrase has both meanings, |but that claim cannot be supported grammatically.
Source: http://www.jewsforjudaism.org/faq-pri….slation
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