Free Will?

[gollamudi]

Quote (Not3in1 @ Nov. 04 2008,13:09)

It's true that we can't control our destiny – all must die according to the bible – according to the original sin – according to a supposed loving Father who holds death over his children.  Sure, there's a saviour, but not until we die.  The fear of death cripples some.  And why shouldn't it?  We live and toil and love —- only to never know when our time is up?  When it's over.  All is lost and forgotten.  It's a terrible thing to do to a person. I think the Christian plan is flawed.  Period.

You are absolutely right Mandy,
We don't have F..R..E..E W..I..L..L to chose our destiny it is only the cause and effects whether it may God or Satan or our own flesh any one you name but you don't have uninfluenced 'free will' in this universe. I too find Christianity is so much complicated and controdicting itself some times.

Thanks and love to you
Adam

[942767]

Quote (gollamudi @ Nov. 04 2008,15:51)

Quote (Not3in1 @ Nov. 04 2008,13:09) It's true that we can't control our destiny – all must die according to the bible – according to the original sin – according to a supposed loving Father who holds death over his children.  Sure, there's a saviour, but not until we die.  The fear of death cripples some.  And why shouldn't it?  We live and toil and love —- only to never know when our time is up?  When it's over.  All is lost and forgotten.  It's a terrible thing to do to a person. I think the Christian plan is flawed.  Period. You are absolutely right Mandy, We don't have F..R..E..E  W..I..L..L to chose our destiny it is only the cause and effects whether it may God or Satan or our own flesh any one you name but you don't have uninfluenced 'free will' in this universe. I too find Christianity is so much complicated and controdicting itself some times. Thanks and love to you Adam

Hi Adam:

We have freedom to choose in response to the gospel message when it is preached. No one has said that this in uninfluenced.

Tell me if you believe the following scriptures or not.

Quote

Jhn 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. Jhn 3:17 For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved. Jhn 3:18 He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God. Jhn 3:19 And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil. Jhn 3:20 For every one that doeth evil hateth the light, neither cometh to the light, lest his deeds should be reproved. Jhn 3:21 But he that doeth truth cometh to the light, that his deeds may be made manifest, that they are wrought in God.

Quote

Mar 16:15 And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature. Mar 16:16 He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.

[Not3in1]

Quote (942767 @ Nov. 04 2008,14:22)

Hi Mandy: That may be your opinion, but this is what the scriptures state and I know that this is the truth.  I can't find any flaw in this at all. Quote Jhn 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. Jhn 3:17 For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved. Jhn 3:18 He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God. Jhn 3:19 And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil. Jhn 3:20 For every one that doeth evil hateth the light, neither cometh to the light, lest his deeds should be reproved. Jhn 3:21 But he that doeth truth cometh to the light, that his deeds may be made manifest, that they are wrought in God.

That's the promise, sure.
But there's no proof that it is true.
Faith alone helps you to buy this.
Meanwhile, you will die. You don't know when. This is something that is held over us through a grand design. It's cruel in so many ways.

[Kupchuk]

Hi 942767.
May I respond to this quote?
Quote
Mar 16:15 And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature.

I believe that Matt.15:24 …24 Now He, answering, said, “I was not commissioned except for the lost sheep of the house of Israel.”

Plainly saying that Jesus teachings was for the Jews, and only them. And the verses you quote, Mar16:15 was for His deciples.

The same message is in Matt.28:19 …Going, then, disciple all the nations, baptizing them into the name of the Father and of the Son and of the holy spirit,

Does this not conflict with Matt.10:5-6 …5 These twelve Jesus commissions, charging them, saying, “Into a road of the nations you may not pass forth, and into a city of the Samaritans you may not be entering.
6 Yet be going rather to the lost sheep of the house of Israel.

These two scriptures appear to be in conflict, one saying 'go into the nations', while the other says not to! Also note that His (Jesus)deciples never did go to the “nations”.
The reason is that they (Jews) did not accept Jesus as their “Messiah”, had they accepted Him, this command of His (Jesus) would have been realised, and they (His deciples) would have completed this request.

Much confusion would be eliminated by “correctly cutting the word of truth”. (2Tim.2:15.)
Ro.15:8 …For I am saying that Christ has become the Servant of the Circumcision, for the sake of the truth of God, to confirm the patriarchal promises.
Ro.15:16 …because of the grace being given to me from God,
16 for me (Paul) to be the minister of Christ Jesus for the nations,

Blessings.

[gollamudi]

Hi  brother 942767,
Thanks for your response I agree with you that we have only the influenced will. But I asked you here many times whether we really have a 'free will' ? I think we are wasting our time by arguing this topic for so many days and months without coming to a conclusion. Brother Gene, Tim, Mandy and my self we believe that we don't have real free will but only the influenced will where as you and others believe we certainly have free will. What is the final outcome of this debate…only ZERO. Finally I conclude that God is the potter and I'm the clay let my maker mould me as per His wish and will. His sovereign will may be fulfilled in our lives not our own so called free will.

Thanks and blessings
Adam

[GeneBalthrop]

Adam……….Amen Brother…..we are caused to chose God by His GRACE (Gods influencing on our hearts) our so-called “FREE WILL”S”. have nothing to do with it . Because there is no such thing as “Free Wills” only influenced Wills exist and that elimates (FREE) , because a n influenced Will is not a FREE WILL.

Love and peace to you and yours………………gene

[Tiffany]

Gen Lets take a scenario where you have a, an apple
b an orange
c a grape
d a plum
so what is that called when I take one, am I not choosing one, or would I not say:” Please chose one or two?” It is my free will, I am not being influenced to take anything.
So are we able to chose good over evil. nobody is influencing us. We are choosing one or the other. Or we can even do nothing, our choice our free will to do so. If however my friend would say:” Irene that grape really tastes good ,” and I would take the grape, He has influenced me to chose it. There is a difference.

Peace and Love Irene

[Samuel]

As I've stated in other posts and theads:

Our sense is that it is “Free Will”…and in fact it is “Free Will”

Now…if I might be able to clear this up for you some:

Where this gets really confusing to us (Mainly because we just don't understand it).
Is that GOD already knows what your “Free Will” choices are.  He already knows what choices your going to make tomorrow at 5:00pm  He knows when you go to Burger King what your going to order.  You don't know but he does.   You still have the power to chose what you want to do.  But your still going to do the same things…reguardless.

Just as with Peter…Jesus told him what he was going to do.  He told him that he would deny him three times before the crow.  Now…Peter was aware of what he was told that he was going to do.

Could he have changed it?  …the better question is …and one that we all know the answer to…is did he change it?   The answer is no…he was not able to change it.  In fact straightfoward after he did what he was told that he would do…he remembered the words that Jesus told him.

Its really confusing …you have “Free Will”  You do.  However, GOD being all knowing already knows where your “Free Will” choices are going to take you.

The fact of the matter is we just can not understand this concept.  That know matter what GOD still knows.

Suppose that Peter changed what was going to happen…that would effectively make a GOD a liar.  Which can not happen.  GOD can not lie.  He is perfect in every way.  He can not tell a lie…thus it was not possible for Peter to change the course of his Free Will Actions.

Jesus merely told him what he was going to do.  He did not “Set His Course for him” However him having the knowledge from the Almighty Father…simply enlightened him as to a future desicsion that he would make.

For who hath known the mind of the Lord, that he may instruct him?

[Tiffany]

Since a Christian, in most cases will chose what is right. We know ahead of time what He will chose. That is an easy one. Since God is all knowing it is easy for Him, IMO
We will never however completely understand what and how God thinks. That is the mystery of our God. And that we just have to except.

Peace and Love to all, Irene

[Kupchuk]

Quote (gollamudi @ Nov. 04 2008,19:10)

Hi  brother 942767, Thanks for your response I agree with you that we have only the influenced will. But I asked you here many times whether we really have a 'free will' ? I think we are wasting our time by arguing this topic for so many days and months without coming to a conclusion. Brother Gene, Tim, Mandy and my self we believe we don't have real free will but only the influenced will where as you and others believe we certainly have free will. What is the final outcome of this debate…only ZERO. Finally I conclude that God is the potter and I'm the clay let my maker mould me as per His wish and will. His sovereign will may be fulfilled in our lives not our own so called free will. Thanks and blessings Adam

Hi Adam.
Add me to your list that believe we do not have “free will”.
Scripture says, in Eph.1:9-11 …9 making known to us the secret of His will (in accord with His delight, which He purposed in Him)
10 to have an administration of the complement of the eras, to head up all in the Christ — both that in the heavens and that on the earth —
11 in Him in Whom our lot was cast also, being designated beforehand according to the purpose of the One Who is operating all in accord with the counsel of His will,

If God is operating ALL in accord with the counsel of HIS WILL, how can our so-called “free will” not follow His?

Blessings.

[GeneBalthrop]

Kupchuk……..> You are right, God causes our choices by His influencing us through His Spirit. Grace is God's influencing on the heart. There is no such thing as (FREE CHOICE), all choices are the result of influence. If we take Irene's scenario of the choice of the fruit she would chose the one that is influenced in her mind at the time , and that is the result of cause and the effect would be the choice. As i said before Socrates proved that in 425 B.C. and it never has been proved wrong, Scientist and Psychologist all Know that nothing does not exist with a cause. Irene just isn't realizing that her thinking is the thing that is causing her choices and therefore her choice was caused and the effect was what she chose.

peace to you and yours……………….gene

[gollamudi]

Quote (Kupchuk @ Nov. 05 2008,12:07)

Quote (gollamudi @ Nov. 04 2008,19:10) Hi  brother 942767, Thanks for your response I agree with you that we have only the influenced will. But I asked you here many times whether we really have a 'free will' ? I think we are wasting our time by arguing this topic for so many days and months without coming to a conclusion. Brother Gene, Tim, Mandy and my self we believe we don't have real free will but only the influenced will where as you and others believe we certainly have free will. What is the final outcome of this debate…only ZERO. Finally I conclude that God is the potter and I'm the clay let my maker mould me as per His wish and will. His sovereign will may be fulfilled in our lives not our own so called free will. Thanks and blessings Adam Hi Adam.     Add me to your list that believe we do not have “free will”. Scripture says, in Eph.1:9-11   …9 making known to us the secret of His will (in accord with His delight, which He purposed in Him) 10 to have an administration of the complement of the eras, to head up all in the Christ — both that in the heavens and that on the earth — 11 in Him in Whom our lot was cast also, being designated beforehand according to the purpose of the One Who is operating all in accord with the counsel of His will, If God is operating ALL in accord with the counsel of HIS WILL,  how can our so-called “free will” not follow His? Blessings.

Amen to that post brother Kupchuk,
Certainly God will alter our so called free wills.

Thanks and blessings
Adam

[gollamudi]

Quote (Samuel @ Nov. 05 2008,08:11)

As I've stated in other posts and theads: Our sense is that it is “Free Will”…and in fact it is “Free Will” Now…if I might be able to clear this up for you some: Where this gets really confusing to us (Mainly because we just don't understand it). Is that GOD already knows what your “Free Will” choices are.  He already knows what choices your going to make tomorrow at 5:00pm  He knows when you go to Burger King what your going to order.  You don't know but he does.   You still have the power to chose what you want to do.  But your still going to do the same things…reguardless. Just as with Peter…Jesus told him what he was going to do.  He told him that he would deny him three times before the crow.  Now…Peter was aware of what he was told that he was going to do. Could he have changed it?  …the better question is …and one that we all know the answer to…is did he change it?   The answer is no…he was not able to change it.  In fact straightfoward after he did what he was told that he would do…he remembered the words that Jesus told him. Its really confusing …you have “Free Will”  You do.  However, GOD being all knowing already knows where your “Free Will” choices are going to take you. The fact of the matter is we just can not understand this concept.  That know matter what GOD still knows. Suppose that Peter changed what was going to happen…that would effectively make a GOD a liar.  Which can not happen.  GOD can not lie.  He is perfect in every way.  He can not tell a lie…thus it was not possible for Peter to change the course of his Free Will Actions. Jesus merely told him what he was going to do.  He did not “Set His Course for him” However him having the knowledge from the Almighty Father…simply enlightened him as to a future desicsion that he would make. For who hath known the mind of the Lord, that he may instruct him?

Hi brother Samuel,
That is a wonderful explanation on free will.

May God bring more revelations from you.
Adam

[GeneBalthrop]

Samuel……….if Peter could not change His will , then He did not have (FREE) Will, but controlled Will. The problem is see with your understanding of (Free)Will, is the word (FREE) if we are going to say our Will's are truly (FREE) the there can be (NO) influencing going on by (Any) source whatsoever in order to be truly free. God caused those event to take place with Peter in order to teach Peter something He needed to learn. Every Choice we make is a caused choice by some kind of influence taking place in our minds. And these influences were learned influences before the decisions were ever made, therefore our choices are caused and therefore not Free at all. Jesus said I have come to set the captives free, people are held captive by there thinking and act out what is in them, and if the wrong thing is in them then they will do that because thats what is influencing there thinking, Nothing Free about that at all. No (FREE WILL CHOICES) only CAUSED CHOICES< it is GRACE (God's influencing on the heart) the (CAUSES) Godly choices. It's a work of GOD not the self through so-called (Free wills) that changes us and perfects us.

peace to you and yours………………….gene

[epistemaniac]

Quote (david @ June 10 2008,17:13)

Quote David …..the point is do you believe in the absolute sovereignty of God? As far as I can tell, JW's are the only ones that speak of God's sovereignty on a regular basis.  I guess my answer is yes. But no Bible will tell you that this means he's in control of everything that happens.  In fact, the Bible says quite the opposite.  Because of the very issue of sovereignty, because his very right to rule was challenged, He's allowed Satan to rule.  Yes, the earth, the universe, everything is still his, but for the time being, he has allowed Satan to be “ruler of this world.”  That doesn't mean God isn't wise enough to know how this is going to end.

Then I guess you can't tell very much at all It seems you haven't been around many in the Reformed camp have you….? I encourage you, do a google search for the phrase “sovereignty of God”, and there you will see that the top 5 hits are not JW's literature that comes up, but rather it is Reformed resources, and of the top 10, only 1 was non-Reformed, and of the first 70 or so hits, probably 90% were a defense of God's sovereignty from Reformed writers or were others referring to their writings. To answer the question “What, then, is distinctive about reformed theology?” The answer was

“2. The Sovereignty of God.

For most reformed people the chief and most distinctive article of the creed is God's sovereignty. Sovereignty means rule, and the sovereignty of God means that God rules over His creation with absolute power and authority. He determines what is going to happen, and it does happen. God is not alarmed, frustrated, or defeated by circumstances, by sin, or by the rebellion of His creatures.” (Reformed Theology by James Montegomery Boice, http://www.reformedreader.org/t.u.l.i.p.htm)

So while many times, while we usually disagree, it seems your posts are well thought out (or at least well thought out copy and paste from JW sites, which is important since it shows you are reading and applying the proper material to the issue at hand) in this case, you are far from the mark in thinking that the JW's are the only ones who preach the sovereignty of God.

blessings,
Ken

[942767]

Quote (gollamudi @ Nov. 05 2008,15:44)

Quote (Samuel @ Nov. 05 2008,08:11) As I've stated in other posts and theads: Our sense is that it is “Free Will”…and in fact it is “Free Will” Now…if I might be able to clear this up for you some: Where this gets really confusing to us (Mainly because we just don't understand it). Is that GOD already knows what your “Free Will” choices are.  He already knows what choices your going to make tomorrow at 5:00pm  He knows when you go to Burger King what your going to order.  You don't know but he does.   You still have the power to chose what you want to do.  But your still going to do the same things…reguardless. Just as with Peter…Jesus told him what he was going to do.  He told him that he would deny him three times before the crow.  Now…Peter was aware of what he was told that he was going to do. Could he have changed it?  …the better question is …and one that we all know the answer to…is did he change it?   The answer is no…he was not able to change it.  In fact straightfoward after he did what he was told that he would do…he remembered the words that Jesus told him. Its really confusing …you have “Free Will”  You do.  However, GOD being all knowing already knows where your “Free Will” choices are going to take you. The fact of the matter is we just can not understand this concept.  That know matter what GOD still knows. Suppose that Peter changed what was going to happen…that would effectively make a GOD a liar.  Which can not happen.  GOD can not lie.  He is perfect in every way.  He can not tell a lie…thus it was not possible for Peter to change the course of his Free Will Actions. Jesus merely told him what he was going to do.  He did not “Set His Course for him” However him having the knowledge from the Almighty Father…simply enlightened him as to a future desicsion that he would make. For who hath known the mind of the Lord, that he may instruct him? Hi brother Samuel, That is a wonderful explanation on free will. May God bring more revelations from you. Adam

Yes, Brother:

This is a good explanation. This is exactly what I have been saying.

God Bless

[epistemaniac]

early on… page 4 or so in this topic, it was brought up by Timothy that God hardened Pharaoh's heart… other counters were made that Pharaoh hardened his own heart, but before any miracle was presented to Pharaoh, before Moses had ever left to confront Pharaoh, God said Exodus 4:21-23 (ESV) Ex 21 And the Lord said to Moses, “When you go back to Egypt, see that you do before Pharaoh all the miracles that I have put in your power. But I will harden his heart, so that he will not let the people go. 22 Then you shall say to Pharaoh, ‘Thus says the Lord, Israel is my firstborn son, 23 and I say to you, “Let my son go that he may serve me.” If you refuse to let him go, behold, I will kill your firstborn son.’ ” So whatever one thinks on this topic, chronologically at least, God had decided to harden Pharaoh's heart prior to Moses ever going to confront him in the first place.

blessings,
Ken

[942767]

Quote (epistemaniac @ Nov. 08 2008,09:30)

early on… page 4 or so in this topic, it was brought up by Timothy that God hardened Pharaoh's heart… other counters were made that Pharaoh hardened his own heart, but before any miracle was presented to Pharaoh, before Moses had ever left to confront Pharaoh, God said Exodus 4:21-23 (ESV) Ex 21 And the Lord said to Moses, “When you go back to Egypt, see that you do before Pharaoh all the miracles that I have put in your power. But I will harden his heart, so that he will not let the people go. 22 Then you shall say to Pharaoh, ‘Thus says the Lord, Israel is my firstborn son, 23 and I say to you, “Let my son go that he may serve me.” If you refuse to let him go, behold, I will kill your firstborn son.’ ”   So whatever one thinks on this topic, chronologically at least, God had decided to harden Pharaoh's heart prior to Moses ever going to confront him in the first place. blessings, Ken

Hi Ken:

Is what you are saying consitent with the following scripture?

Quote

2Pe 3:9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.

God Bless

[epistemaniac]

Quote (Tiffany @ Nov. 05 2008,03:02)

Gen Lets take a scenario where you have a, an apple                                                       b  an orange                                                       c  a grape                                                       d  a plum so what is that called when I take one, am I not choosing one, or would I not say:” Please chose one or two?” It is my free will, I am not being influenced to take anything. So are we able to chose good over evil. nobody is influencing us. We are choosing one or the other. Or we can even do nothing, our choice our free will to do so. If however my friend would say:” Irene that grape really tastes good ,” and I would take the grape, He has influenced me to chose it. There is a difference. Peace and Love Irene

Irene… read Jonathan Edwards Dissertation on the Will, in particular the chapter “SECTION 1. SHEWING THE MANIFEST INCONSISTENCY OF THE ARMINIAN NOTION OF LIBERTY OF WILL, CONSISTING IN THE WILL'S SELF-DETERMINING POWER”… this one writing has done more to help me in this area than any other… it will be well worth your time…. its tough reading, but will pay dividends to be sure….

There are always influences on us, causing us to choose one thing over another, for imagine the absurdity of the contrary, namely to choose something for no reason at all!!! That would be the very height of irrationality and would end in chaos.

One might think that to say that my choosing an orange over a plum is simply because I prefer oranges over plums, but that is not itself reason enough for choosing. There is the question of why I prefer oranges over plums…. perhaps I have fond memories of eating oranges in Florida with my grandfather and every time I eat one I have a pleasant sensation of that memory… whatever… the point is, there is a reason, a cause behind my choice of one thing over another. And there will be a string of causes going back in time until we are faced with the ultimate first cause that is behind everything, God. We make the choices we make because of where we have been in our lives, but we have been where we are in our lives because God has deemed that it be so. In fact, He has established the very time and place of where we would exist; Acts 17:26 (ESV) And he made from one man every nation of mankind to live on all the face of the earth, having determined allotted periods and the boundaries of their dwelling place”. God has not only determined the times and places where we live, but there isn't anything outside His sovereign control of God's will and counsel. Ephesians 1:11 (ESV) In him we have obtained an inheritance, having been predestined according to the purpose of him who works all things according to the counsel of his will,”

blessings,
Ken

[942767]

Quote (epistemaniac @ Nov. 08 2008,14:51)

Quote (Tiffany @ Nov. 05 2008,03:02) Gen Lets take a scenario where you have a, an apple                                                       b  an orange                                                       c  a grape                                                       d  a plum so what is that called when I take one, am I not choosing one, or would I not say:” Please chose one or two?” It is my free will, I am not being influenced to take anything. So are we able to chose good over evil. nobody is influencing us. We are choosing one or the other. Or we can even do nothing, our choice our free will to do so. If however my friend would say:” Irene that grape really tastes good ,” and I would take the grape, He has influenced me to chose it. There is a difference. Peace and Love Irene Irene… read Jonathan Edwards Dissertation on the Will, in particular the chapter “SECTION 1. SHEWING THE MANIFEST INCONSISTENCY OF THE ARMINIAN NOTION OF LIBERTY OF WILL, CONSISTING IN THE WILL'S SELF-DETERMINING POWER”… this one writing has done more to help me in this area than any other… it will be well worth your time…. its tough reading, but will pay dividends to be sure…. There are always influences on us, causing us to choose one thing over another, for imagine the absurdity of the contrary,  namely to choose something for no reason at all!!! That would be the very height of irrationality and would end in chaos. One might think that to say that my choosing an orange over a plum is simply because I prefer oranges over plums, but that is not itself reason enough for choosing. There is the question of why I prefer oranges over plums…. perhaps I have fond memories of eating oranges in Florida with my grandfather and every time I eat one I have a pleasant sensation of that memory… whatever… the point is, there is a reason, a cause behind my choice of one thing over another. And there will be a string of causes going back in time until we are faced with the ultimate first cause that is behind everything, God. We make the choices we make because of where we have been in our lives, but we have been where we are in our lives because God has deemed that it be so. In fact, He has established the very time and place of where we would exist; Acts 17:26 (ESV) And he made from one man every nation of mankind to live on all the face of the earth, having determined allotted periods and the boundaries of their dwelling place”.  God has not only determined the times and places where we live, but there isn't anything outside His sovereign control of God's will and counsel.  Ephesians 1:11 (ESV) In him we have obtained an inheritance, having been predestined according to the purpose of him who works all things according to the counsel of his will,” blessings, Ken

Hi Ken:

I thought I would post the verses to which you refer in Acts 17 in context:

Quote

Act 17:24 “The God who made the world and everything in it, being Lord of heaven and earth, does not live in temples made by man, [fn] Act 17:25 “nor is he served by human hands, as though he needed anything, since he himself gives to all mankind life and breath and everything. Act 17:26 “And he made from one man every nation of mankind to live on all the face of the earth, having determined allotted periods and the boundaries of their dwelling place, Act 17:27 “that they should seek God, in the hope that they might feel their way toward him and find him. Yet he is actually not far from each one of us, Act 17:28 “for 'In him we live and move and have our being'; [fn] as even some of your own poets have said, 'For we are indeed his offspring.' [fn] Act 17:29 “Being then God's offspring, we ought not to think that the divine being is like gold or silver or stone, an image formed by the art and imagination of man. Act 17:30 “The times of ignorance God overlooked, but now he commands all people everywhere to repent, Act 17:31 “because he has fixed a day on which he will judge the world in righteousness by a man whom he has appointed; and of this he has given assurance to all by raising him from the dead.”

God Bless

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