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Hmm… I didn’t think I would have to say this, but a model of something is not evidence of that thing… unless of course you would like to consider the model of the flat Earth with the dome that I showed you as actual evidence of its existence. Now, do you have verifiable evidence that the heliocentric MODEL of eclipses is how it truly happens? Because I have verifiable evidence that the model doesn’t work, and can therefore NOT be considered viable.
Here’s the thing, T8… Team Globe is only allowed to use VERIFIABLE evidence- that any regular person can confirm or deny.
Well here’s the thing then Mike, Team Flat Earth will never produce verifiable evidence of the Flat Disc in space with a sun and moon below. So if it is not verifiable, then you are not allowed to argue for it according to your own reasoning.
Try to reason for a minute. If the Earth was a globe and part of the Solar System and we live in the Space Age, then you would see what you are seeing now. You would see the Earth disappear below the horizon, you would read about men go to Antarctica, and you would see solar and lunar eclipses, Auroras, etc.
But if the Earth was flat, you should see a body of evidence too that would be there outside of anything you have ever done for yourself for verifiable proof. But you do not see that at all. There are no videos or photos of a flat earth, there are no videos of a police force stopping people from landing on the Antarctic to get photos of the edge. and there is no working model of the Flat Earth and close sun and moon creating eclipses that follow the math, etc. There is really nothing as far as a large body of evidence.
So on circumstantial evidence outside of our own verifiable experience, Team Globe Earth wins. This is a big win Mike.
And on personal experimentation of a Flat Earth, so far all I have seen from the opposition is a scooter on a hot day driving down a road showing distortion, and some photos showing things that are supposedly beyond the horizon, even though that poses a huge problem to the Flat Earth more than a Globe Earth. Why because why if the Earth was flat can you only see these things on rare occasions and the answer is because something extraordinary is happening and that answer is the same for globe or flat earth. It favours neither that something extraordinary is taking place and in both cases it likely has to do with light and the nature of light through moisture.
Of course, I have given you verifiable info but you just ignore it. I have travelled between Wellington and Perth and it is not the huge distance that the Flat Earth requires. That is verifiable and don’t just take my word for it. Look at the times of flights and add them up yourself. Wellington to Sydney + Sydney to Perth = ??? Now compare that time with the Flat Earth distances required. It doesn’t work.
But Mike, there is an even better thing you can do to get verifiable proof. Take a Qantas flight over the Antarctic. Seriously dude, for a few thousand dollars you can spare yourself the charge of deception on that great day. Yes you need to add in a ticket from Arizona to Melbourne return and some spending money, but if you can solve this puzzle for $8,000 and spare yourself being deceived and deceiving, then that is money well spent in my view. Further, you could post videos on your Youtube channel saying you have converted tio the Globe Earth and I am sure you will get some decent traffic and may be able to monetize the channel to help bring the price of the trip down further. Finally, if you are paying taxes on your revenue from Youtube, then the whole trip is tax deductible meaning about one third cheaper too, (not sure of the Ameriucan tax rate). And imagine the time you will save others debating with you. Come on Mike, think it over. And if you had a bit of spare cash, come over to New Zealand for a beer. I will shout the beer.
Here is the link to book your ticket.
T8: Well here’s the thing then Mike, Team Flat Earth will never produce verifiable evidence of the Flat Disc in space with a sun and moon below. So if it is not verifiable, then you are not allowed to argue for it according to your own reasoning.
But I have tons of verifiable photographic evidence that the earth is flat – as opposed to your team which cannot produce a single photo of earth curvature that regular people like us can verify for ourselves. I have the evidence of the Michelson-Morley experiment that proved the earth does not move – as opposed to your team which cannot produce one iota of evidence that it does move. I have the evidence of the so-called Airy’s Failure, which proved that the stars move around us rather than the earth moving in relation to them. (It’s called Airy’s FAILURE because it failed to produce the expected results of a moving earth.) I have the evidence of Sagnac’s experiment, which again hoped to prove earth movement, but failed. In fact, the failure of Michelson-Morley is what prompted Einstein to do away with the long held belief in the aether, develop his theory of relativity, and posit that the mechanical arm of the measuring device actually shortened itself during the experiment, thereby giving the null result. All of this simply because the scientific evidence showed a fixed earth, and the heliocentrists couldn’t have that. 🙂
Then there’s the Bedford Level experiment, and the countless testimonies of seasoned sea captains seeing lighthouses etc. from much farther than would be allowed on a globe. And their logs reporting how they constantly found their positions many miles out of reckoning each day compared to where the ball earth theory said they should have been. And there’s the British ship Challenger’s attempt to sail around the continent of Antarctica to map it, which ended up taking 60,000 miles and 3 years! And the list goes on and on.
So the facts of the matter are that Team Flat has loads of testable, repeatable, and verifiable experiments going for it, while Team Globe has UNVERIFIABLE images purportedly taken from outer space… and nothing else. And 90% of the mathematical theories foisted upon us by Team Globe are demonstrably erroneous – as verified by actual observation. Their story of how eclipses happen is one of the most blatantly erroneous, and so I’m eager to talk to you about it.
T8: Try to reason for a minute. If the Earth was a globe and part of the Solar System and we live in the Space Age, then you would see what you are seeing now.
Your claim is the complete opposite of factual, T8. Every single observation regular people have made their entire lives is what anyone would expect to see on a flat earth with sun, moon, and stars moving over us in the sky. You said as much yourself at the beginning of this thread. Oh, and our lifelong personal observation also aligns perfectly with what the written word of God clearly and undeniably teaches… so there’s that too.
Mike, I was going to make the same point that we don’t have to go into “space” and look down to know the shape of the earth. We can simply measure the curvature, or lack there of, from the ground.
I guess some are impressed by pretty pictures.
But if you do go into space and it is a globe, then it is a globe. And there is nothing in scripture that negates this. If you think scripture does, what is your no 1 proof verse that the Bible teaches a flat earth?
I posted this last night, but it apparently didn’t transfer. It is my latest video, which shows another globe rebuttal that any regular person can verify for themselves…
It appears that the new server has the same problem with long threads. It takes you back to page one after you post.
Hey Admin, maybe you could lock this thread and start a part 2. There’s not that much traffic here anymore anyway, as it seems the HN crew prefer to remain asleep. Starting a duplicate would eliminate the hassle of being sent to page one every time you post. What say you?
Hi Mike.
My thinking is most forums have the latest post as no 1, and if such was the case here, then it would always jump to the first post because it wouldn’t need to keep counting the latest page number. But this forum has always posted in chronological order of first post to last post and a vote earlier on when I changed to this system was to leave it that way. This forum software supports reversing this and I believe the problem would be solved, but I don’t think it is worth sacrificing the order of posts to achieve it.
That said, I have set 15 posts per page and I am going to ramp it up to 20 posts meaning less pages. I think the forum was not programmed to go beyond 50 pages, well that is my guess at least. I’ve been waiting for a fix, but it is obviously not important enough at the moment. It will likely be addressed one day though.
Mike, I watched your video and I do not really understand what you are saying, but one thing did look wrong to me, so perhaps it answers your questions or at least provides a decent rebuttal.
Imagine Polaris which I assume is a star much bigger than Earth and very distant. Now from the perspective of Polaris imagine you could see the Earth like a small dot. Now imagine drawing a line from each edge of the earth dot toward Polaris and boom, both lines hit Polaris right? So now that you are on Earth, it explains why both people on each side of the globe at a certain latitude see that star, especially considering light travels in straight lines unless hindered. Polaris is simply way more distant and bigger than you have it in the diagram. Now I know you probably need to do this in a diagram because it will not be big enough to convey the true size of Polaris compared to the Earth and the distance between each, but we need to remind ourselves of the scale if we use the diagram to prove something false, based on the false distance and size of the objects in the diagram.
Hi All, this is a continuation of the discussion that began in this thread…
https://heavennet.net/forums/topic/flat-earth/#post-822307
Please post any replies to things said in the first thread here. These are the last two posts from the original thread…
Mike: This is my latest video, which shows another globe rebuttal that any regular person can verify for themselves…
T8: Mike, I watched your video and I do not really understand what you are saying, but one thing did look wrong to me, so perhaps it answers your questions or at least provides a decent rebuttal.
Imagine Polaris which I assume is a star much bigger than Earth and very distant. Now from the perspective of Polaris imagine you could see the Earth like a small dot. Now imagine drawing a line from each edge of the earth dot toward Polaris and boom, both lines hit Polaris right? So now that you are on Earth, it explains why both people on each side of the globe at a certain latitude see that star, especially considering light travels in straight lines unless hindered. Polaris is simply way more distant and bigger than you have it in the diagram. Now I know you probably need to do this in a diagram because it will not be big enough to convey the true size of Polaris compared to the Earth and the distance between each, but we need to remind ourselves of the scale if we use the diagram to prove something false, based on the false distance and size of the objects in the diagram.
Hi All, I’ve continued this discussion in the “Flat Earth 2” thread. I was tired of getting sent back to the first page every time I posted. Here’s the link…
https://heavennet.net/forums/topic/flat-earth-2
I will link the original thread there for anyone wanting to go through it from the start, but please add your replies to the new thread. Thanks.
T8: Imagine Polaris which I assume is a star much bigger than Earth and very distant.
“Imagine” and “assume” are two very fitting words to use in this case. 🙂 Although I see your point, keep in mind that I’m seeing the ENTIRE Polaris as a tiny dot from Phoenix while the person at 33 degrees north in India is also seeing the ENTIRE Polaris as a tiny dot at the same exact time. In your scenario, that couldn’t happen. Besides, there is no scientific reason to “imagine” and “assume” the things you do. We see Polaris as a tiny dot of light in the sky – whether it is huge and far away or small and close – and therefore its apparent size and angular resolution is all we have to consider. And it is impossible to see an object of that apparent size and angular resolution from opposite sides of a ball earth at the same time – no matter how big and far away it may actually be.
Hey Mike. I’m having a couple of ciders with a friend at the moment. We are both looking this thread. My friend’s dad is a known scientist here in NZ and he has been to the South Pole in the Antarctica. He told my friend that he walked around the pole and said that he walked around the whole world. Scientists of note in NZ often get to visit Antarctica in an area where NZ has a base which happens to be close to an American base. The Antarctica is not really what you proclaim it to be at least compared to what visiting scientists proclaim. There is substantial evidence of a southern continent called Antarctica and you can even pay a few thousand bucks and fly over it too. I cannot agree with your required views of the Antarctica and challenge you to at least fly over the continent so you can stop believing in this false narrative and spreading that narrative.
Mike I noticed that many of your videos do not appear here anymore because you removed them from your channel. Is that because you realised from debating here that they were wrong? Why for example did you delete the Mt Ruapehu video? Is that because it dawned on you that the mountain’s base was around 900 m above sea level?
Show me flat earth model of eclipses that matches the math used for predictions. Lord knows I’m keen to see it.
The Globe Earth is the only model that demonstrates the math.
This is another Team Globe Earth win right?
Hi Mike
This is Anthony I was wondering if you could read my post on
Soul, spirit, life and death, biblical definitions
Pages two and lete know what you think on this subject.
God bless
T8, I have removed a few videos from my YouTube channel. I had a few that just said “Yellow Star”, “Blue Star”, etc. I thought it was cheesy to not at least find out what star it was. Plus, the P1000 does better videos of them, so I’ll be uploading new ones with the stars’ names as I can.
No, I have not removed the Mt. Ruapehu video. As of today, it has had 78 views. And I have addressed your “plateau” concern twice on the Flat Earth 1 thread, and once on the comments of the YouTube video itself. All of those responses are still there for you to read. If you’d like me to do it once again, I will. But I’ll need a promise from you that you will READ it this time, so I don’t have to keep answering the same stuff multiple times.
I won’t respond on the Flat Earth 1 thread any more. So please put your future flat earth posts on this Flat Earth 2 thread. Thanks.
My friend mentioned a few things that easily prove the Earth is not flat. High on his list was the Great Southern Ocean Race which is a point I have made with you a number of times. The noted times in this race coupled with sophisticated computerised yachts that are precise would show huge discrepancies in the Globe Earth if the world was flat. How do these yachts claim to do about one third or a quarter of the distance that a Flat Earth requires. How do they go from Auckland to Sydney, then to Cape Town and not notice that the distances are way longer than the globe? I will tell you why Mike. They don’t notice because the world is not flat. Solved.
Also, this Kiwi friend of mine lives in Western Australia at the moment. He frequently travels between Wellington and Perth, The distances that the Flat Earth requires for Wellington to Perth is not just wrong, but is a huge error. In this one point alone, your Flat Earth is debunked experientially for us. NASA, SpaceX, or JAXA not even needed Mike. You can film mobility scooters all you like and buy sophisticated camera equipment and say this and that, but I am thinking you are making mistakes and you are better off travelling round the Southern Hemisphere with that money. Further, while I have slowly pointed out your mistakes one by one, I know I haven’t answered everything, but that has more to do with the lack of time or possibly missing a post altogether. So I am satisfied that your hypothesis is debunked.
Again, instead of investing in expensive equipment, just go on holiday to Australia and travel around for a bit. Make calculations as to how long the Flat Earth says the distance between Sydney and Perth is and then hire a vehicle and clock it yourself, The roads are very straight there too. Even better, fly between Australia and New Zealand. The flight takes about 3 hours even though it seems a bigger distance on the Flat Earth than east to west in the States. Now look at the unreal distance between Perth and Joburg. Does that really look to you like an 11 hour flight? Consider that NY to LA is about 5 hours, so on a the Flat Earth, Perth to Joburg should be around 20 hours or 4 times the distance between LA and NY.
See that. Another proof that Team Flat Earth is flat out wrong.
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