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Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Jan. 18 2011,01:03) Mike…………Here is my scripture support regarding Jesus ascending (FIRST) and then returning and was touched by his apostles. Joh 20:17……> Jesus saith unto her, TOUCH ME NOT ,FOR I AM NOT YET ASCENDED TO MY FATHER: but go to my BROTHERS, and say unto them, I (ASCEND) unto my Father and your Father, and My GOD and your GOD.
Hi Gene,Why do you think Mary couldn't touch him before he ascended “the first time”, but Thomas could touch him a couple of weeks later?
The word “touch” also mean “hold on to”, as the NIV translates it.
What are your thoughts on this?
mike
Mike…………As i have said before you can't corner a snake in a brier patch. Mike truth is (NOT) what you are after here , you want just you version of truth> SLICK must say> Your practice is very diabolical though as JA has said. IMO
peace and love……………………………gene
Quote (shimmer @ Jan. 18 2011,08:44) If Jesus is with us always in spirit form, in how many people and in how many places, then his spirit cannot have form because something with form has to be in only one place. Mike, the wind blows and moves the trees. However it cant avoid a few trees and hit a few can it ? So, if spirit had form it would have to be in everyone in its way? Therefore it can NOT have form can it ? But can be in different people who are among all the others.
Hi Shimmer,I agree with your “set-up”, but not your conclusion. Picture a bright pink beach ball with little black polka dots all over it. Within the pink is Jesus' spirit and all the blessed who it is moving through. The black polka dots are the evil people who Jesus' spirit avoids.
Now, not only does each and every black polka dot have a form, or “body” of its own, but because the pink is some places on the ball and not other places on the ball, it too has a form, or “body”. Its body looks sort of like a bright pink piece of Swiss cheese.
Shimmer, either a spirit is “everywhere all the time”, like JA thinks but can't defend against scripture, or it is not. Now if it IS, then the Holy Spirit is living and working in every single thing in existence, including Satan and his demons, the baby raper in the act of raping a child, the mass muderer in the act of murdering innocent people, and every single vile abhorition known to man and beyond.
Why is it the Holy Spirit only fell on certain people in Jerusalem at Pentecost……….and not every single being in existence? If it was really “everywhere all the time”, then everyone in Jerusalem, the whole world, and anywhere at all would have received the Spirit – not just at Pentecost, but continually from their very existence. Because it could not help being “everywhere all the time” from its very existence.
Now on the other hand, if it is more like the pink Swiss cheese ball, filling someone here, and avoiding someone else over there, then it has a form. It has places where it IS and places where it ISN'T. And if that's the case, then it has SOMETHING that dictates where it IS from where it ISN'T.
That something would be a body.
peace and love,
mikeQuote (Gene Balthrop @ Jan. 18 2011,10:41) Mike…………As i have said before you can't corner a snake in a brier patch. Mike truth is (NOT) what you are after here , you want just you version of truth> SLICK must say> Your practice is very diabolical though as JA has said. IMO peace and love……………………………gene
I'm sorry Istari Jr. I only asked you a question.
Mike………….Even if you use the word “cling”, then why did he allow Thomas to “cling” on him afterwards then. Or are you switching word to fit you dogmas again> That would be the real question here. IMO
peace and love……………………………….gene
Quote (terraricca @ Jan. 18 2011,09:03) as for Mike beleive of spirit being to have a body form, mike told you he only start his bible study's 2-3 years ago
on the other hand i have started 50 years ago so it is not him who is teaching me ,i always have believed that it is so.
Hi Pierre,Istari is just like his angry little brother, JA. They both just like to push people's buttons. Did you notice he didn't bother responding to the THIRD scripture I posted that refutes his “everywhere all the time” theory? Nor can he answer the “separation” question we've been asking from the jump on this thread:
What separates one angel from another?
And Istari wasn't privy to our pm's where you wanted to discuss Revelation but your diagrams and charts were too far over my head. Remember when I asked you to postpone it because I was still on milk, and you were trying to feed me solid food?
But you go ahead and keep “following me” anyway, okay?
I learn a lot from you and Irene. I'm glad you're here. Thank you.
mike
Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Jan. 18 2011,11:05) Mike………….Even if you use the word “cling”, then why did he allow Thomas to “cling” on him afterwards then. Or are you switching word to fit you dogmas again> That would be the real question here. IMO peace and love……………………………….gene
No Gene. I don't even care which word you use. I don't understand it and I thought maybe you did. I can't figure out why Mary couldn't touch him but Thomas could later. Can you? It was an honest question.mike
Mikeboll64,
It is a wise man who avoids answering Bollsit questions that are senseless!
It is. Foolish man who tries to answer senseless questions!
How dare you claim that I avoid answering your ignorant nonsense because I'm running away!
Answer me this question, and only this question as proof of your claim:
Is a bigger bit smaller than smaller bigger bit and by how much does it cost because it must cost smaller than the bigger small bit is bigger than the cost?Please answer me, then I will answer you, much that I have answered you ten times over already.
Gene,
Jesus went to present himself to God Almighty. He did not want to be sullied by any kind of sinfulness.Check the words to Mary, 'Do not cling to me, for I have not yet ascended to my Father but go to my brethren and say to them “I am ascending to my Father and to your Father, and to my God and your God”'
So, first he went to present himself to God in the Spirit, pure and unsullied, then he came back and appeared in the room with the Disciples.
Then he said something curious, for Trinitarians, for nonPreExistents and for PreSonists:
He said, 'As THE FATHER has sent me so I send you'!!Trinitarians: Jesus is SENT by the Father. One equal God does not Send another Equal God and where is the third God in all this?
NonPreExistents: Jesus is SENT by the Father. Being Born is not being SENT. One has to already be EXISTING to be SENT!
PreSonist: Jesus is sent by THE FATHER. Jesus didn't say that he was sent by 'My Father' but by 'THE Father'!
'The' father, is not implying a singular parent attachment but that MANY are those whom HE is Father to, not just Jesus, alone, WHEN HE WAS SENT!!Quote (Istari @ Jan. 18 2011,11:26) Mikeboll64, It is a wise man who avoids answering Bollsit questions that are senseless!
Can't figure it out? Here, I'll tell you.Daniel's angel had to wait 21 days for help from Michael because Michael was NOT “everywhere all the time”.
How's that? Can you SCRIPTURALLY refute it?
I pray for you to find peace within yourself, Istari. The anger you show on the outside only reflects the hurt and feelings of inadequacy you have on the inside.
peace and love,
mikeQuote (mikeboll64 @ Jan. 18 2011,10:20) Quote (Baker @ Jan. 17 2011,23:42) Quote (mikeboll64 @ Jan. 17 2011,12:37) He's calling the wrong person for help anyway. t8 seems to agree that 1 Cor 15 is talking about the bodies that those of heaven have. Hi Irene and Pierre,
I haven't talked with you folks much lately. I hope all is well with both of you and Georg.
peace and love,
mike
Mike! We had a fantastic Weekend. First ouoldest Son took us to Olive Garden for Dinner, and then the rest of out Chilren and Grandchilren surprised us with a 50th Wedding Anniversary, with gifts and all kinds of Decoration, so beautiful. We are leaving all up til our next 50th….Ha,ha..We both were on cloud nine….
How are you doing, hope all is well……
Peace and Love Irene
That's fantastic Irene! Congratulations on 50 years! How did they “surprise” you? Were they setting it up while you were at Olive Garden?peace and love,
mike
Thank you Mike. Yes, while we where at Olive Garden the rest of our Family set it all up. It is unbelievable that Georg and I are married 50 years. Time goes so fast. And thank you for your well wishes, its appreciated. They planned all of this since May of last year…..David our oldest Son was so nervous He told us afterward.
We have pictures on Face book, come join us…. Its a lot of fun….some of our Family belongs. Our only Daughter and only Granddaughter too…..OH, and Worshiping Jesus and Kathi too….
Peace and Love IreneQuote (Baker @ Jan. 18 2011,13:45)
Yes, while we where at Olive Garden the rest of our Family set it all up.
How cool! That shows a lot of love for them to go to such lengths and planning!Quote (Baker @ Jan. 18 2011,13:45)
We have pictures on Face book, come join us…. Its a lot of fun….some of our Family belongs. Our only Daughter and only Granddaughter too…..OH, and Worshiping Jesus and Kathi too….
Peace and Love Irene
I thought of setting up a Facebook account, but I stay so busy here and with work and life, I don't really know how I'd find the time. And I don't want be accidentally “blowing people off” because I don't have time to answer their “notes” or whatever.But I'll think about it.
peace and love to you and yours,
mikeIsn't it amazing, Mikeboll64,
The 'anger' you seem to 'detect' is well founded … as it is you that planted it.That is an extremely stupid example of nothing which shows how ignorant a desparate individual can become.
No matter how much you are shown the reality of dimensions you stand in your position of Abstanence from Truth and reality.
You talk bravely as though a master of refuting. Yet you are nothing, and as a nothing, you display your nothingness as pure guttural ignorance.
Even so, you are clever…in a stupid kinda way, like politician who changes the question he is asked and thinks no one has noticed, or he says,'first let me say this…' but never returns to the actual question asked, or waffles so much that no one understands what it was he actual just said but are to proud to say 'ummm…I didn't understand – can you explain in a simpler way, please'
Mikeboll64, the other part of your slippy fish behaviour is that you are learning in every post, soaking up the truth without letting on. Somehow, you feel embarrassed to admit it. Well, be that as it may. If the point of my post, even others, draws you to the Truth, then WHAT OF IT! If you draw nearer to truth, Mikeboll64, then this is good. Better though that you didn't stress your teacher.
I'm watching a program right now that is delving into the world of Parallel Worlds…the equivalent of the fifth dimension…and guess what, Mikeboll64, in the quantum world of Parallel Universes, nothing is Physical… Ha ha ha ….mikeboll64, who are you?
Ok, the carnal mind of Scientist also places Parallel Universes as physical other worlds where we are all existing in slightly different, infinite number of different selves simply because Scientist can't believe in Spirits. Yet, the gist of what even carnal minded Scientists say is that in the fifth dimension, everything exists in all places AT THE SAME.
What, your problem is, Mikeboll64, is that you need cannot believe anything you didn't think of. You feel you have such a teenywheeny thing that you need to talk loud and masterly(!) to gain a sense of self-esteem.
You don't reply to the whole post but pick one point above only? Why? Did you believe the rest but can't write 'ah, I see' (ric)
You keep saying that saying that Spirits are in all places at all times and therefore how can they not be in all places at the same time and why do they have to go from one place to another, why did Gabriel take five days to come to Daniel. You imply that I am ignorant is what appears to your simpleton mind as my inability to respond. Mikeboll64, it is the frustration of your stupidity that leads me to slow my response.
How many times have I said that…although…Spirits is everywhere at all times in the fifth dimension, in the interaction of the physical, they have to come down to the fourth dimension.
To talk and convey the message to Daniel, Gabriel had to come down to the physical dimension. It would be unfair and unrealistic to humankind to interact with absurdly powerful Spirit agents without protection. The fourth dimension 'cloaks' the power of the Spirit restraining it to that of what fleshly man is capable of (note that we are capable of far more than we know of. This is what Jesus meant when he said 'if you had faith as small as a mustard seed …')
In the fifth dimension, time is linear, so days are days still. If Gabriel came down to the fourth, the physical dimension to fight with Prince of the kingdom of Persia (note, this does not mean physical fighting…an Angel does not physically fight with humans, it is more likely verbal and spiritual dispute) then he could be, as he said, be detained for five human days! Michael came and upheld him in his dispute and allowed him to leave off and get to Daniel. How? Go back up to the fifth dimension then back down to the fourth where Daniel was.
Where was the Prince of Persia. If the angel had to travel in the fourth dimension …on the earth, how long would it have taken? Yet, as soon as Michael came, he was able to 'Instantly' appear to Daniel? How?
Well, you chose it… How did the legion of Demons INSTANTLY move out of the man and into the pigs who were 'Some way off'?
And also, how did Gabriel travel from where the Prince of Persia was to where Daniel was?
How did Jesus appear inside a locked room, twice?Mikeboll64, Jesus appeared to 400 disciples in a very short space of time and they weren't in the same place, how?
Mikeboll64, if you are serious about studying the Scriptures, you need to get serious about lying to the forum and being deceitful in your posts. Put away your ego and embrace truth and reality.
Not only will you learn quicker but you will become less dishonest and above all, gain credibility, self-esteem and put on the Spiritual Body!Mike Boll,
We both agree that the spiritual body is material in composition.
I do state that I believe Paul was only addressing mortal flesh and blood which is why he made the point the all flesh is not the same.
Have you not read what God stated about his creation of man on the sixth day? He said man was very good. He said that because he predestined man though Jesus to be a very good creation. Jesus is part of the very good creation that he is the means by which it is and was made very good.
Error in my post above. I said five days instead of what it should have been: 21 days. Sorry!
Numbers are significant in Scriptures.
Has anyone else noticed that Mikeboll64 (excellent middle portion to his name) does not answer questions posed by Istari but DEMANDS OTHERS ANSWERS HIS QUESTIONS!
Mikeboll64 cannot refute a single claim by Istari so instead of conceding, he simply ignores the questions and finds what he thinks is a credible put down. Is this a Spirit of a mediator? If a mediator is willing to lie and be deceitful, how can he be called to be a judge, a mediator? What is he mediating between? His own confusion and his own delusion!
And then the cheeky tyke says that it is Istari who is running away from answering his irresponsible unspiritual unscriptural waffling that are no more than futile attempts at wriggling serpentlike from admitting that Istari speaks truthfully!
Check Istari's posts and you will see that Istari has not changed one iota of his original ideas.
Now check Mikebull64's posts and see the massive changes he has made while almost completely denying that he has changed. And if he has changed, to whom and for what reason has he changed.
And, has his changes moved him closer to what Istari has said from the beginning?Will Mikeboll64 apologise in the same way he demanded that JustAskin should have apologised to him, just because he was embarrassed at having his naked untruths exposed and everyone could see how small he really is!
Quote (mikeboll64 @ Jan. 18 2011,11:08) Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Jan. 18 2011,11:05) Mike………….Even if you use the word “cling”, then why did he allow Thomas to “cling” on him afterwards then. Or are you switching word to fit you dogmas again> That would be the real question here. IMO peace and love……………………………….gene
No Gene. I don't even care which word you use. I don't understand it and I thought maybe you did. I can't figure out why Mary couldn't touch him but Thomas could later. Can you? It was an honest question.mike
Mike………..Jesus said why , he had not yet ascended to the FATHER, The original question as i recall was (did) he first ascend to the father after his resurrection, before he appeared to the disciples, and yes he did. As to why that is a guess, i suppose he felt he need to at the time.JA's point i can follow to a point, but i think i may disagree with the idea that all angels can go to the fifth dimension i do believe there may exist a fifth dimension but perhaps only GOD can operate in that dimension. So in that sense He would always be Above ALL things, or perhaps there are seven dimensions, I am no sure though just conjecture on my part. Have not really studied dimensions that much to be honest as JA has.
Peace and love………………………gene
Quote (mikeboll64 @ Jan. 18 2011,13:54) Quote (Baker @ Jan. 18 2011,13:45)
Yes, while we where at Olive Garden the rest of our Family set it all up.
How cool! That shows a lot of love for them to go to such lengths and planning!Quote (Baker @ Jan. 18 2011,13:45)
We have pictures on Face book, come join us…. Its a lot of fun….some of our Family belongs. Our only Daughter and only Granddaughter too…..OH, and Worshiping Jesus and Kathi too….
Peace and Love Irene
I thought of setting up a Facebook account, but I stay so busy here and with work and life, I don't really know how I'd find the time. And I don't want be accidentally “blowing people off” because I don't have time to answer their “notes” or whatever.But I'll think about it.
peace and love to you and yours,
mike
Hi Mike! Yes, I know how busy you must be here. But lately it seems no matter what Scripture you present, it is not enough. Some just want their own interpretation and not what is written in Scriptures. Going to Face Book gives me another place to go where friends never attack ones character. In fact it lifts me up. I enjoy designing my Farm, turning it upside down and creating what might be soon coming when Christ return's…..Of course I am retired and have more time then money…..Hang in there it hasn't been easy here lately and I am glad there are people like you….Sorry to go of subject….
Peace and love IreneGene,
The flesh restricts the Spirit.The Spirit is Free.
The fifth dimension allows the Spirit to be wherever it wants to be but only in linear time according to the fourth dimension.
The demon angels in the man could not make the man do more than his physical strength allowed him to do, albeit that they could make him hurt himself overdoing things because they were not responsible for maintaining that body. The man's own Spirit was responsible!
By moving from the physical fourth dimension, which restricts movement in area and volume to contiguous (point next to point, position next to position, step next to step) movement requiring millions of step changes to go from any one position to any other position, to the fifth dimension which is a non-contiguous environment (movement can be from any one position, location, to any other position, location, instantaneously… In the twinkling of an eye, no less! The new position or location can be anywhere as by the physical dimension) the Spirit is, effectively, everywhere at all times. one moment it is here, the next, there. Walls, doors, prison bars, nothing physical is a barrier to the Spirit.
Think, think of somewhere, and you are there! But how? Only in the Spirit!!
Flesh cannot do this without going through every single intermediatary contiguous position or location in linear time phase!
So the Spirit can move from one place to the next without restriction! Not entirely. God can limit where a Spirit can MANIFEST ITSELF. therefore Has restricted the demon angels from coming into the fourth dimension through the creation of a host body. But, a host Spirit may invite a demon Spirit into it's 'House' as the crazy man did, and then that demon brought a load of his friends for a party, so to speak, a legion of demon friends!How did those demons move INSTANTANEOUSLY from the man to the pigs who were a good way off?
And, controversially, why did the pigs go crazy? And what if Jesus had denied them access to the pigs? Gene, this where your 'Arid places' may claim an answer!
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