Do spirits have bodies?

[mikeboll64]

Quote (toby @ Jan. 27 2012,01:12)

Quote (mikeboll64 @ Jan. 27 2012,06:37) Toby, when do you think Jesus stopped being a human being and became a spirit being? If I haven't answered it (In a way which you understand), then please let me know.

If you had, would I still be asking for an answer?

Let me make this REAL easy for you. Did Jesus change from human being to spirit being:

A. When he was raised from the dead?
B. When he ascended to heaven?
C. Other?

Toby, please use one of the letters above in your answer, so I can be clear what you think. Also please don't go overboard with a bunch of rhetoric……………less is more.

[terraricca]

Quote (toby @ Jan. 28 2012,15:10)

Quote (Wakeup @ Jan. 27 2012,11:54) Toby. Daniel 10:13. But the prince of the kingdom of percia(phisical evil angel) withstood me 0ne and twenty days: but lo, michael(phisical holy angel) one of the chief princes,came to help me; and I remain there with the prince of percia. A phisical spirit body can be withstood(captured). Acts1:10. And when they looked steadfastly toward heaven as he went up(Jesus); BEHOLD TWO MENS TOOD BY THEM IN WHITE APPAREL. (Angels materialising into a human body) They are not shapeless creatures. VERSE11. which also said; ye men of galilee,why stand ye gazing up to heaven? This same Jesus,which is taken up from you,into heaven,shall so come in like manner,as ye have seen him go into heaven. There are four chief angels:1.Michael. 2.Raphael. 3.Gabriel.4. phanuel.They are individual angels with character,not just spirits,like the wind,with no form or shape. The four beasts around the throne of God,each have four faces,and four wings. The four living creatures Ezekiel saw,had a head with four faces,arms,wings,and feet(ez.1:4—28.) They are not shapeless spirits. Lucifer was a beautiful cherub,with character,with ideas,and dreams, and plans,and strategies,and talents,wisdom. HE is not just a floating spirit force with no body or shape. wakeup. Hi Wakeup. What did Jesus Christ say about the wind – and why? That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.  Do not marvel that I said to you, `You must be born anew.'  The wind blows where it wills, and you hear the sound of it, but you do not know whence it comes or whither it goes; so it is with every one who is born of the Spirit.”  Nicode'mus said to him, “How can this be?”  Jesus answered him, “Are you a teacher of Israel, and yet you do not understand this?  Truly, truly, I say to you, we speak of what we know, and bear witness to what we have seen; but you do not receive our testimony.  If I have told you earthly things and you do not believe, how can you believe if I tell you heavenly things? Wakeup, does the wind have a Body (Not 'Is the Wind a Body of moving air?') Does the wind 'metaphorically' blow where it will? From where and how does Wind come from – where does it go? Does the Spirit Being in Heaven have a body?  Have you seen it? Does the Spirit Being from Heaven go where it will ( is there somewhere that the Spirit Being cannot go?) Wakeup, From where and How does the Spirit Being from Heaven come? Wakeup, to where and how does the Spirit Being from Heaven go?

toby and wakeup

you both talking about two different thing ,the wind is a image that tells how a person act when he is driven by the spirit of God
but it does not mean he is a spirit ,

a spirit being is ;God,Christ ,angels,those are beings,not thoughts,not ideas, they are real beings that has a SOUL,feelings,character, independent from all other being in heaven,so if a being as a soul and a living spirit (they are alive)were is it reside in ???this would I call a body (whatever it is made of)

Pierre

[Ed J]

Quote (terraricca @ Jan. 28 2012,04:00)

Quote (Ed J @ Jan. 28 2012,10:53) Quote (toby @ Jan. 27 2012,22:18) Quote (Ed J @ Jan. 27 2012,16:22) Quote (mikeboll64 @ Jan. 27 2012,11:41) Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Jan. 26 2012,18:09) Can we at least agree on that MIKE? Gene, Until we both agree on the DEFINITION of “spirit”  in Luke 24:37, anything else you say is pointless.  Because I can't show you what I have to show you until you are able to see what only you can't see. Hi Mike, You are right, when discoursing with Gene, one must first establish what the “Word” in question actual means. Gene: defines  “Free Will”  differently than everyone else does. Kangaroo Jack: defines  “Being”  differently than everyone else does. So when discoursing with either one of them. All disagreements (with them) MUST first start with defining each and and every “Word” in question! God bless Ed J Hi EDJ and Mikeboll. Mikeboll, well said about 'Defining Words'. EDJ, Hi, what you said was hilarious but I get the meaning. Quote What is the agreed definition of Spirit – and what is the agreed definition of Body? Hi Toby, That would be a constrictive start. God bless Ed J (Joshua 22:34) http://www.holycitybiblecode.org edj (1)what is a being ? (2)a combination of both spirit and body ? Pierre

PIERRE,

1) Living; being alive.

2) No

God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

[Ed J]

Quote (terraricca @ Jan. 28 2012,04:25)

edj see how gene is jumping on your wagon ?all for nothing Pierre

PIERRE,

Your not interested in resolution?

God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

[Ed J]

Quote (toby @ Jan. 28 2012,08:13)

Quote (Ed J @ Jan. 28 2012,03:53) Hi Toby, That would be a constrictive start. God bless Ed J (Joshua 22:34) http://www.holycitybiblecode.org Hi EDJ. Did you mean that or did you mean 'Constructive'!

Hi Toby,

I actually meant the word you put down.
But the other does imply no 'wiggle' room.

God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

[terraricca]

Quote (Ed J @ Jan. 28 2012,16:53)

Quote (terraricca @ Jan. 28 2012,04:25) edj see how gene is jumping on your wagon ?all for nothing Pierre PIERRE, Your not interested in resolution? God bless Ed J (Joshua 22:34) http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

edj

after two years ? give me some credit

[terraricca]

Quote (Ed J @ Jan. 28 2012,16:50)

Quote (terraricca @ Jan. 28 2012,04:00) Quote (Ed J @ Jan. 28 2012,10:53) Quote (toby @ Jan. 27 2012,22:18) Quote (Ed J @ Jan. 27 2012,16:22) Quote (mikeboll64 @ Jan. 27 2012,11:41) Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Jan. 26 2012,18:09) Can we at least agree on that MIKE? Gene, Until we both agree on the DEFINITION of “spirit”  in Luke 24:37, anything else you say is pointless.  Because I can't show you what I have to show you until you are able to see what only you can't see. Hi Mike, You are right, when discoursing with Gene, one must first establish what the “Word” in question actual means. Gene: defines  “Free Will”  differently than everyone else does. Kangaroo Jack: defines  “Being”  differently than everyone else does. So when discoursing with either one of them. All disagreements (with them) MUST first start with defining each and and every “Word” in question! God bless Ed J Hi EDJ and Mikeboll. Mikeboll, well said about 'Defining Words'. EDJ, Hi, what you said was hilarious but I get the meaning. Quote What is the agreed definition of Spirit – and what is the agreed definition of Body? Hi Toby, That would be a constrictive start. God bless Ed J (Joshua 22:34) http://www.holycitybiblecode.org edj (1)what is a being ? (2)a combination of both spirit and body ? Pierre PIERRE, 1) Living; being alive. 2) No God bless Ed J (Joshua 22:34) http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

edj

Quote

PIERRE, 1) Living; being alive. 2) No God bless

I ask you few question;do angel and spirit beings ;have a soul ?

do they HAVE a living spirit (not are)?

do spirit beings are independent of each other ??

if you say yes to those questions then they also have a body
in witch all tree item are in.

Pierre

[toby]

To Everyone:
– When Jesus comes back – when he returns in like manner to that which he left – will he be Man or Spirit Being?
– Will he have Flesh and Bone?
– Does a Spirit Being drink wine – please show your evidence?

[Ed J]

Quote (terraricca @ Jan. 28 2012,10:08)

Quote (Ed J @ Jan. 28 2012,16:50) Quote (terraricca @ Jan. 28 2012,04:00) Quote (Ed J @ Jan. 28 2012,10:53) Quote (toby @ Jan. 27 2012,22:18) Quote (Ed J @ Jan. 27 2012,16:22) Quote (mikeboll64 @ Jan. 27 2012,11:41) Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Jan. 26 2012,18:09) Can we at least agree on that MIKE? Gene, Until we both agree on the DEFINITION of “spirit”  in Luke 24:37, anything else you say is pointless.  Because I can't show you what I have to show you until you are able to see what only you can't see. Hi Mike, You are right, when discoursing with Gene, one must first establish what the “Word” in question actual means. Gene: defines  “Free Will”  differently than everyone else does. Kangaroo Jack: defines  “Being”  differently than everyone else does. So when discoursing with either one of them. All disagreements (with them) MUST first start with defining each and and every “Word” in question! God bless Ed J Hi EDJ and Mikeboll. Mikeboll, well said about 'Defining Words'. EDJ, Hi, what you said was hilarious but I get the meaning. Quote What is the agreed definition of Spirit – and what is the agreed definition of Body? Hi Toby, That would be a constrictive start. God bless Ed J (Joshua 22:34) http://www.holycitybiblecode.org edj (1)what is a being ? (2)a combination of both spirit and body ? Pierre PIERRE, 1) Living; being alive. 2) No God bless Ed J (Joshua 22:34) http://www.holycitybiblecode.org edj Quote PIERRE, 1) Living; being alive. 2) No God bless I ask you few question;(1)do angel and spirit beings ;(2)have a soul ? (3)do they HAVE a living spirit (not are)? (4)do spirit beings are independent of each other ?? (5)if you say yes to those questions then they also have a body in witch all tree item are in. Pierre

PIERRE,

First:  the resolution question was “a question”, not ‘an accusation’.
Resolution is ONLY accomplished by or upon a mutual agreement.

1) Angels are “Spirit Beings”.
2) A soul is our Spirit in our Body.
3) NO, because they are living Spirits.
4) Sure, yea, I would think it is so.
5) Huh?   …what do you mean?

God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

[toby]

Quote (mikeboll64 @ Jan. 28 2012,09:30)

If you had, would I still be asking for an answer?   Let me make this REAL easy for you.  Did Jesus change from human being to spirit being: A.  When he was raised from the dead? B.  When he ascended to heaven? C.  Other? Toby, please use one of the letters above in your answer, so I can be clear what you think.  Also please don't go overboard with a bunch of rhetoric……………less is more.

Mikeboll, I have answered your question.  Please read the post where I answered you using your own words.

[mikeboll64]

Quote

I will use your exact word: Jesus became a Spirit in Heaven on his ascension into Heaven. Jesus became a Spirit…? Mikeboll, ask yourself exactly what you mean by this 'Became' a Spirit?

Toby, do you mean this quote above?    He became a spirit IN HEAVEN when he ASCENDED TO HEAVEN?   Is that a joke?  Isn't that like saying Toby became a human being IN SPAIN when he ENTERED SPAIN?  It doesn't tell me whether or not you think Jesus was rasied from the dead as a new, glorious spirit being BEFORE he ascended to heaven.

Was he?  Or was he raised a human being and then was transformed into a spirit being upon his ascension to heaven?

[toby]

Mikeboll, my answer is perfectly in order.  Jesus is a Spirit Being in Heaven.  He 'became' (your word) a Spirit Being as he entered the Heavenly realm, where his flesh and bone body cannot go.

According to your theory and what you are trying to get me to say, Jesus turned into a Spirit Being at a non-event before he entered Heaven.  That is what your wording implies.  Please outline the event where this occurred, and why such a glorious event is not recorded, even in the very verses that show Jesus rising in the air and disappearing into a cloud.

Let me ask you a question (For your consideration – not as you no doubt will say, a Distraction): How do Spirit Being 'go up to'  and 'come down from' Heaven?  No, wait, let me answer: Using Jacob's Ladder.

Isn't this documented in Scriptures.  How come you never used that yourself?  Yes, they climb up and down a Ladder! (Genesis 28:12).

Also, you say the Bodies of Angels are described in Scriptures. Did the Bodies of Angels seen by humankind look the same as those you say are described?  Did they have six wings?  Think of one example that was not a symbolism (Daniel, and Ezekiel, for instance).

[Ed J]

Quote (Ed J @ Jan. 27 2012,15:59)

Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Jan. 27 2012,10:13) MIke………..That is all you have to do is show us ONE PERSON IN SCRIPTURE THAT HAS EVER SEEN A SPIRIT. It is JUST THAT SIMPLE, Don't give us the garbage of what some “THOUGHT” they saw and use it as a Proof Text that there (ARE) such thing as “SPIRIT BODIES” You have NO PROOF there ARE not from any Scripture. If I say I “THOUGHT” I saw a flying Saucer does that mean there are flying Saucers, can I say I know for a fact I saw one, when no one else can prove they say one either even though they “THOUGHT” they did?  come on Mike this Luke thing is absolute no proof of anything and what Jesus said after that should even more convience you MIKE> peace and love………………………………………….gene Hi Gene, is this what you ask? “And it came to pass, when they were come into Samaria, that Elisha said, LORD, open the eyes of these men, that they may see. And the LORD(YHVH) opened their eyes, and they saw;” (2 Kings 6:20) God bless Ed J

Gene,

Did you ever address this post?

God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

[toby]

….verse 22 even explicitly has Jacob saying that God's house is a pillar of stone'. Mikeboll, all this 'Proof' and you missed out on it. Or was there a reason you didn't post these 'Convincing and proof' verses?

[mikeboll64]

Quote (toby @ Jan. 28 2012,06:55)

Mikeboll, my answer is perfectly in order.  Jesus is a Spirit Being in Heaven.  He 'became' (your word) a Spirit Being as he entered the Heavenly realm, where his flesh and bone body cannot go.

So then he wasn't yet a spirit being when he was raised from the dead, and therefore had no need of a new spiritual body at that time? In other words, do we agree that Jesus was raised from the dead as a human being, and at that time had a human body made of flesh and bone?

Quote (toby @ Jan. 28 2012,06:55)

……what you are trying to get me to say……

I am surprised at how many people dilly-dally around answering direct questions for fear of what “I'm trying to get them to say”.  Ed even started a thread about it – as if asking a question on a scriptural forum should be frowned upon.  

If your answers are always nothing but the truth, then no one can “trick” you into saying something untrue, IMO.

[GeneBalthrop]

Quote (Ed J @ Jan. 29 2012,00:03)

Quote (Ed J @ Jan. 27 2012,15:59) Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Jan. 27 2012,10:13) MIke………..That is all you have to do is show us ONE PERSON IN SCRIPTURE THAT HAS EVER SEEN A SPIRIT. It is JUST THAT SIMPLE, Don't give us the garbage of what some “THOUGHT” they saw and use it as a Proof Text that there (ARE) such thing as “SPIRIT BODIES” You have NO PROOF there ARE not from any Scripture. If I say I “THOUGHT” I saw a flying Saucer does that mean there are flying Saucers, can I say I know for a fact I saw one, when no one else can prove they say one either even though they “THOUGHT” they did?  come on Mike this Luke thing is absolute no proof of anything and what Jesus said after that should even more convience you MIKE> peace and love………………………………………….gene Hi Gene, is this what you ask? “And it came to pass, when they were come into Samaria, that Elisha said, LORD, open the eyes of these men, that they may see. And the LORD(YHVH) opened their eyes, and they saw;” (2 Kings 6:20) God bless Ed J Gene, Did you ever address this post? God bless Ed J (Joshua 22:34) http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

ED J………that does not mean they never had bodies it simply mean that the Lad could not see them, His eyes were closed to them. And where do you see the Word SPIRIT there it not there. So no point to force the text to say what it is not in fact saying and no need to add two it meaning. That is what to many here do all the time and come up with all kinds of false teachings. IMO

peace and love…………………………………………gene

[mikeboll64]

Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Jan. 28 2012,10:31)

ED J………that does not mean they never had bodies it simply mean that the Lad could not see them, His eyes were closed to them.

And then God opened his eyes so that he could see the spirit beings, Gene. That was Ed's point.

[shimmer]

Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Jan. 28 2012,05:08)

Shimmer……….Wing in scriptures are symbolic language, it means what lifts you up, for example the wings of the four Living creatures in Revelations had “EYES” in then , why? becasue these EYES represent Spirits (INTELLECTS) of GOD and these Spirits mentally give them a “higher level” of understanding (Hence the symbols of wings with eyes (IN) them). IMO peace and love to you and yours…………………………………………gene

Gene I agree and love too, so love and a level of understanding, plus protection.

How are you Gene?

[shimmer]

Quote (mikeboll64 @ Jan. 28 2012,11:26)

Quote (shimmer @ Jan. 27 2012,00:58) Mike, my point was that – in 1Cor 15:39-42, Paul was not speaking about the Bodies of God or Angels, Sure he was, Shimmer.  He was answering the question, “With what kind of bodies will the dead be raised”.  He was trying to answer that question from verse 36 all the way until verse 54. Every bit of it has to do with the bodies the elect will be raised up in.

Mike, don't be silly.  There is no mention of God or Angels in there, it's talking about the Ressurected Bodies (Raised up Bodies of the Elect).  

Mike, can you help me to understand what this is all about by defining what a Body is and what a Spirit is?  I see this as the main problem in the thread – that everyone is using their own interpretation.  Can you not present a dictionary definition of Body.  Thankyou Mike.

[GeneBalthrop]

Shimmer………I am fine sis, thanks: a body according to the dictionary is a PHYSICAL OBJECTS, it could be solid liquid, or gas, or combinations of these elements and is never represented as a SPIRIT in any dictionary definition to my Knowledge. I think me or someone else posted it a while back.I really don't believe Mike want to post the dictionary definition it would only prove him wrong. IMO

I still stand by my conviction that a Spirit is not any kind of “BODY” but what is (IN) BODIES.  This is how it can be said “GOD IN ALL AND THROUGH ALL”> becasue GOD is a SPIRIT and Spirits cohabit Bodies, they themselves have no Body but posses the Bodies they are (IN)> rather a clean Spirit (INTELLECT) or an unclean Spirit (INTELLECT) If any Spirit is (IN) a Person (IT) will influence that persons MIND and consequentially that Person action. IMO

peace and love to you and yours Shimmer………………………………………………………gene

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