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Quote (abe @ June 19 2013,11:20) Archangel. Arch
archó: to rule, to begin
Original Word: ἄρχω
Part of Speech: Verb
Transliteration: archó
Phonetic Spelling: (ar'-kho)
Short Definition: I reign, rule
Definition: I reign, rule.Word Origin
a prim. verb
Definition
to rule, to begin
NASB Translation
began (62), begin (7), beginning (8), begins (2), begun (1), proceed (1), rule (1), rulers (1), starting (2).began (62), begin (7), beginning (8), begins (2), begun (1),
Do you think Beginning is the proper word to use? Your thoughts on this?
Peace brother….
Abe…..You gave a Good example so it obviousely depends on some other things, one, is it in context with the sentences it is being used in and, two, does it contradict other scriptures in the bible.Remember what Paul told the Bereans , They needed to search the scriptures to see if these thing they were hearing were true or not, also remember the only scriptures they had was the Old Testament. so if a statement in the New Testament goes against the old it is highly suspect in my opinion.
This is kind of like the Trinitarians and Preexistences saying there are other Gods , but our God Said he looked for other Gods and found none. So I believe what God himself said, but others torque scripture meanings to include other (TRUE) God's. They do this to meet their Dogmas they teach IMO.
The Greek wording is very tricky and many words they use can be taken many different ways so we must try to tie them in with other scriptures to get a balance. The Words (through) and (by) are good examples of that, also what you posted. When in doubt I also take what God himself said over what anyone else says. I try not to force the text to say anything against God own words, Which are written in the Old Testament. But try to make them conform with It.
I once showed where a Word had over 80 different meanings translated in Greek scriptures, The Hebrew Language Like our English seems to be more accurate IMO. But also remember those translators are and were by far Trinitarians and Preexistences, so they obversely torqued and tweaked scriptures to meet their Theologies, and this has happened over many, many years. So it appears we have a kind of Balancing act to perform to keep our thinking straight.
The basic rule is “one God”, “one Mediator” , between God and Man, “the Man”, Jesus who is the Christ. If we keep that always clear in our mind the rest falls in place. And remember a “man” is not a God, and “God” is not a Man.
Remember also it says for God is not a man that he should lie, or a son of man that he should repent,
peace and lvoe to you and yours………………….gene
Quote (Gene Balthrop @ June 19 2013,07:28) Quote (abe @ June 19 2013,11:20) Archangel. Arch
archó: to rule, to begin
Original Word: ἄρχω
Part of Speech: Verb
Transliteration: archó
Phonetic Spelling: (ar'-kho)
Short Definition: I reign, rule
Definition: I reign, rule.Word Origin
a prim. verb
Definition
to rule, to begin
NASB Translation
began (62), begin (7), beginning (8), begins (2), begun (1), proceed (1), rule (1), rulers (1), starting (2).began (62), begin (7), beginning (8), begins (2), begun (1),
Do you think Beginning is the proper word to use? Your thoughts on this?
Peace brother….
Abe…..You gave a Good example so it obviousely depends on some other things, one, is it in context with the sentences it is being used in and, two, does it contradict other scriptures in the bible.Remember what Paul told the Bereans , They needed to search the scriptures to see if these thing they were hearing were true or not, also remember the only scriptures they had was the Old Testament. so if a statement in the New Testament goes against the old it is highly suspect in my opinion.
This is kind of like the Trinitarians and Preexistences saying there are other Gods , but our God Said he looked for other Gods and found none. So I believe what God himself said, but others torque scripture meanings to include other (TRUE) God's. They do this to meet their Dogmas they teach IMO.
The Greek wording is very tricky and many words they use can be taken many different ways so we must try to tie them in with other scriptures to get a balance. The Words (through) and (by) are good examples of that, also what you posted. When in doubt I also take what God himself said over what anyone else says. I try not to force the text to say anything against God own words, Which are written in the Old Testament. But try to make them conform with It.
I once showed where a Word had over 80 different meanings translated in Greek scriptures, The Hebrew Language Like our English seems to be more accurate IMO. But also remember those translators are and were by far Trinitarians and Preexistences, so they obversely torqued and tweaked scriptures to meet their Theologies, and this has happened over many, many years. So it appears we have a kind of Balancing act to perform to keep our thinking straight.
The basic rule is “one God”, “one Mediator” , between God and Man, “the Man”, Jesus who is the Christ. If we keep that always clear in our mind the rest falls in place. And remember a “man” is not a God, and “God” is not a Man.
Remember also it says for God is not a man that he should lie, or a son of man that he should repent,
peace and lvoe to you and yours………………….gene
Hi Gene,(Quote)
remember the only scriptures they had was the Old Testament. so if a statement in the New Testament goes against the old it is highly suspect in my opinion.Dan.10:13 “But the prince of the kingdom of Persia was withstanding me for twenty-one days; then behold, Michael, One OF THE *chief* princes, came to help me, for I had been left there with the kings of Persia
Strong's Hebrew 7223
182 Occurrencesishon: former, first, chief
Original Word: רִאשׁוֹן
Part of Speech: Adjective
Transliteration: rishon
Phonetic Spelling: (ree-shone')
Short Definition: firstWord Origin
from rosh
Definition
former, first, chief
NASB Translation
ancestors (3), before (4), beginning (2), chief (1), chiefs (1), earlier (4), earlier things (1), first (113), first one (2), first time (1), forefathers (1), foremost (1), former (25), former ones (4), former things (6), formerly (6), front (1), old (1), older (1), one in front (1), past (1), previous (1), previously (1).Ec.7:29 See, this only have I found, that God has made man upright; but they have sought out many inventions.
I have to go to the Book of Enoch, I know its not canonized but I have a great Curiosity on the subject?
Who is the *image* of the invisible God.
Peace brother……
Quote (2besee @ June 18 2013,03:58) Hi kerwin,
The only problem that I have with Paul is the “law” part, mainly. I have debated people in the past who stated that the law (the ten commandments) were finished, and when I show them that Jesus never said that, they quoted Paul. But then again, Peter did say that the ignorant and the unstable will twist Paul's words, as they do the other scriptures, and I think that is what it is.
I'll leave it there. No need to further discuss it
2besee,The Ten Commandments are part of the Law.
Paul was addressing those who foolishly used human effort to overcome the world instead of wisely using godly effort.
In the covenant of Mt Sinai Israel the Law was given to be upheld by human effort but through Christ all men were given the covenant that results in the Law being upheld by godly effort..
2besee……….Where it say (the) Law it is referencing the Ten commandments, but if you do a investigation into the original Greek you will fine it should be rendered Just (Law) not (the) law, Paul was talking about , but Law in a general sense, That is why it says By (works) of Law, not (the) Law. Because if you use the definite article (the) you are being specific and addressing as Kerwin said the Ten Commandments, So Paul left out the definite article (the) there and used Just Law, he was addressing HOW LAW WORKS, the way it functions.
That is why he said in another place, “brethren have not come unto that mountain to (FEAR) as they (the Israelites did)” . It is never about Keeping the Ten commandments Paul was talking about, it is Just about the the “way” we keep them is it though the force applied through fear brought about through the working of LAW or by the Spirit of God.
One produces a form or outward Show of righteousness, the other Produces and Inward Change of Heart , brought by the Spirit of GOD. Remember God said I will take out of them the heart of Stone (hard hearted) and Give them a Heart of Flesh (soft heart) and I will write my Law in there inward Parts> So Paul was Just telling us “How” we are made right and justified before God and that is something a Law can never do no matter what kind of Law it is, it cannot change our hearts. IMO
peace and love to you and yours………………………………………gene
Abe…….The IMAGE of anything to me is never the original thing it is IMAGING. God made us to reflect Him or IMAGE Him, but we are never Him. We might image God by being like him having some of his attributes given us, but we can never be him.
That is what Paul was talking about, in 2 ths 2, this, Image of Jesus being a REAL GOD, he is being “desplayed” as, by trinitarians and Preexistences, but this the “LIE” Paul was talking about there, and God will send a “DELUDING SPIRIT” in order for them to believe a “LIE”, unto all who do not love the truth, and the truth is there is ONLY ONE GOD.
Notice it say the person who sits in the “temple” of God being who is being desplayed as a GOD, the only one who is sited in the temple of God is the Man Jesus, and he is not a God, but he is being “displayed” as one, this creates a “FALSE “IMAGE” of the man Jesus, this false image caused Jesus to become the “Man of Sin”.
The man of sin is not a real person it is a false “image” of the man, Jesus, Which he himself will destroy, when he returns , that is why it says, by the breath of his Mouth, another word, by his own words he will do away with that false teaching, that produced a (LIE) about him. God reavealed this to me many years ago, and it all fit if you think about it brothers .
peace and love to you and yours …………………………..gene
Quote (Gene Balthrop @ June 20 2013,07:04) Abe…….The IMAGE of anything to me is never the original thing it is IMAGING. God made us to reflect Him or IMAGE Him, but we are never Him. We might image God by being like him having his atributs given us, but we can never be him. Tha tis what Paul was talking about in 2 ths 2,this Image of Jesus being a REAL GOD, he is being “desplayed” as a God by trinitarians and Preexistences, but this it the “LIE” Paulwas talking about, and God will send a “DELUDING SPIRIT” unto all who do not love the truth, and the truth is there is ONLY ONE GOD, Notice it say the person sits in the temple of God being desplayed as a GOD, the only one who is sited in the temple of God is the Man Jesus and he is not GOd but he is being desplayed as one,this creates a “FALSE “IMAGE” of the MAN Jesus, this false image caused Jesus to become the “Man of Sin”. The man of sin is not a real person it is a false “image of the man Jesus. Which he himself will destory when he returns , that is why iot say by the breath of his Mouth anothers by his own words he will do away with that false teaching. IMO peace and love to you and yours …………………………..gene
Hi Gene,1In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth. 2And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness [was] upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.
3And God said, Let there be light: and there was light. 4And God saw the light, that [it was] good: and God divided the light from the darkness. 5And God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. And the evening and the morning were the first day.I believe The Son of God was created in the first Day.
Beginning
Heaven
Earth
Spirit of God
Waters
Darkness
Face
LightThe Son of God is the image of the invisible God. I believe God when He said; He Created.
Is.43:7 Even every one that is Called by my Name: for I have created him for my glory, I have formed him; yea, I have made him.
The 7 Spirits of God are Part of the Creation.
YHWH
Did God have a Name before he created anything?
Peace brother……
Abe…….. I don't think he did have a name, that may be why, when Moses as him who should I say sent me. he responded by saying , tell them that , THAT I AM, THAT I AM, sent HIM. I have seen other translation that say I EXIST, BECAUSE I EXIST , sent him. But from that we can only get a self description of him, and I believe that is pretty accurate . No one has seen God, because he is spirit and like the wind we can only see his effect. God said later his name was Yahweh, but what does that mean? We don't even know if that is pronounced right or not, some say Jehovah, some YHWH , I say YAHWEH . But to me the best name “discription” of him is, “I Exist, because I Exist” , seems most accurate. We don't even know if God is a she, he, or an IT. Because God is “personified”, does not nessarely convey the right understanding of him, remember what Jesus said , “I have spoken of the Father in a proverb ( fictious illustration ) , but a time would come when he would show us plainly about the Father. So we may all be surprised when that day comes. IMO
Peace and love to you ans yours…………………………..gene
Abe….. As far as the son of GOD goes, it's, much like a man , when his seed is discharged into a women and unites with her, he has extended himself to another life form, so it seems with the Spirit of God, IMO, If his seed (holy spirit abides in you, you are a son of God ) according to John. God the father has extended himself to us, by his Spirit, and being God is a spirt, we then are sharing our same body, just as Jesus was also. God's spirit begins to express itself in us and a changes in our nature begins to take place as we grow in the full measure of Christ. IMO
Hope that helped brother.
Peace and love to you and yours………………………..gene
Quote (kerwin @ June 21 2013,04:11) Gene, I was made in the image of man and found in the likeness of humanity.
Kerwin……..I would disagree with you brother, you were not made in the “image” of a man, you were made (A MAN) not an (IMAGE OF HIM) an image of a man is what you see when you look into a mirror it is a copy of you, but not you. Very much like a coin it can have all kind of “IMAGES” on it , Jesus said , whose “image” was on it and they said Caesars, so he said render unto Caesars the things of Caesar, and render unto God the things of God, but that image on that coin was not was not the real person only an image of him, do you see what I am saying, Kerwin check out the word “image” and you should find it means to copy or mirror or a reflection of something, unless I am misunderstanding it's meaning.Peace and love to you and yours………………………..gene
Quote (Gene Balthrop @ June 21 2013,04:48) Quote (kerwin @ June 21 2013,04:11) Gene, I was made in the image of man and found in the likeness of humanity.
Kerwin……..I would disagree with you brother, you were not made in the “image” of a man, you were made (A MAN) not an (IMAGE OF HIM) an image of a man is what you see when you look into a mirror it is a copy of you, but not you. Very much like a coin it can have all kind of “IMAGES” on it , Jesus said , whose “image” was on it and they said Caesars, so he said render unto Caesars the things of Caesar, and render unto God the things of God, but that image on that coin was not was not the real person only an image of him, do you see what I am saying, Kerwin check out the word “image” and you should find it means to copy or mirror or a reflection of something, unless I am misunderstanding it's meaning.Peace and love to you and yours………………………..gene
Gene,If I had written that correctly it would have been I was made in the image of man(humanity) and found in the likeness as a man.
I was using Philippians 2:7-8 as a pattern and unintentionally introduced several errors.
Hi Abe,
This has been on my mind for a while:Jesus said:
But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send (Greek) in the name of me, he will teach you all things and bring to your remembrance all that I have said to you.Do you think that the Holy Spirit now could be named Jesus?
I am trying to figure something out, I have more questions after that.
Thanks Abe.Quote (2besee @ June 22 2013,17:40) Hi Abe,
This has been on my mind for a while:Jesus said:
But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send (Greek) in the name of me, he will teach you all things and bring to your remembrance all that I have said to you.Do you think that the Holy Spirit now could be named Jesus?
I am trying to figure something out, I have more questions after that.
Thanks Abe.
2besee,In the name of the Law.
Quote (2besee @ June 22 2013,03:40) Hi Abe,
This has been on my mind for a while:Jesus said:
But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send (Greek) in the name of me, he will teach you all things and bring to your remembrance all that I have said to you.Do you think that the Holy Spirit now could be named Jesus?
I am trying to figure something out, I have more questions after that.
Thanks Abe.
Hi 2b,Gal.4:6 Because you are sons, God has sent forth the Spirit of His Son into our hearts, crying, “Abba! Father!”
Rom.8:9 But ye are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you. But if any man hath not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.
Acts2:33 “Therefore having been exalted to the right hand of God, and having received from the Father the promise of the Holy Spirit, He has poured forth this which you both see and hear.
The Promise of the Spirit of the Holy.
5037 [e]teτεandPrtcl
1860 [e]epangelianἐπαγγελίαν[the] promiseN-AFS
3588 [e]touτοῦof theArt-GNS
4151 [e]pneumatosπνεύματοςSpiritN-GNS
3588 [e]touτοῦ–Art-GMS
40 [e]hagiouἁγίουHoly,Adj-GNS
2983 [e]labōnλαβὼνhaving receivedV-APA-NMS
3844 [e]paraπαρὰfromPrep
3588 [e]touτοῦtheArt-GMS
3962 [e]patrosπατρὸςFather,Peace brother….
Quote (2besee @ June 23 2013,06:20) Hi Kerwin, what do you mean?
2besee,In the phrase “in the name of the Law” the word “name” means authority.
“name” can mean other things as Christians literally bear the name Christ but even if they are not called Christians they are still the people of Jesus Christ.
The spirit is sometimes called the spirit of Jesus Christ, spirit of Jesus, or the spirit of Christ.
Thank you kerwin that was what I was looking for. Getting back on track now!!
Abe,
” You are not in the flesh but in the Spirit — if it is so, that THE SPIRIT OF GOD dwells in you. But if any man doesn't have the SPIRIT OF CHRIST, he is not his.”
There you see the Spirit of God and the Spirit of Christ, and we know from scripture that there is only one spirit.
1 Corinthians 3:16 “Don't you know that you yourselves are God's temple and that God's Spirit lives in you?”
1 Corinthians 6:17 'But he who unites himself with the Lord is one with him in spirit.'
1 Corinthians 6:19 'Do you not know that your body is a temple of the Holy Spirit, who is in you, whom you have received from God? You are not your own.'
Here is the spirit of Christ in the prophets of old:
1 Peter 1:10-12.
'The prophets who prophesied of the grace that was to be yours searched and inquired about this salvation; they inquired what person or time was INDICATED BY THE SPIRIT OF CHRIST WITHIN when predicting the sufferings of Christ and the subsequent glory. It was revealed to them that they were serving not themselves but you, in the things which have now been announced to you by those who preached the good news to you through the Holy Spirit sent from heaven, things into which angels long to look.'
Quote (2besee @ June 22 2013,22:40) Hi Abe,
This has been on my mind for a while:Jesus said:
But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send (Greek) in the name of me, he will teach you all things and bring to your remembrance all that I have said to you.Do you think that the Holy Spirit now could be named Jesus?
I am trying to figure something out, I have more questions after that.
Thanks Abe.
Hi 2Besee,This is easy to understand once it's explained…
Jesus' name means: “YA is Salvation,” the
HolySpirit brings “The Salvation of YA.”God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org
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