Bizzaro World Doctrines

Blocked

Quote (t8 @ June 23 2011,15:33)

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ June 23 2011,08:58)

Quote (t8 @ June 22 2011,16:56)

First question.

Is Jesus the Heavenly Father according to this verse?

It doesn't say “heavenly father” does it?

Thank you for taking the bait.

I now reel you in with, “It doesn't say the Almighty (God) Elohim” does it.

I saw that coming yesterday and had to really hold myself back from ruining the punch line!

June 23, 2011 at 11:47 pm#249650

Blocked

Quote (t8 @ June 23 2011,17:30)

1) Is Jesus from Heaven?
2) Is he the Everlasting Father

You answer would be yes to both.
Then I would reply, see he is the Heavenly Father.

Even though we both know this is wrong, this is exactly what it is like listening to your rants and reasons as to why Jesus is God.

Bam! You hit the nail right smack on the head with that one, t8.

I honestly wonder if they realize they do this and do it anyway…………or if they've just never had someone point it out to them as simply and brilliantly as you just did.

Keith's next post should give me the answer.

June 24, 2011 at 12:10 am#249651

Blocked

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ June 23 2011,16:20)

So what are you saying that YHVH is not “Almighty” and Jesus is not “Almighty”?

For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, “The mighty God, (el gibbowr)” The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace. Isa 9:6

The remnant shall return, even the remnant of Jacob, unto the “mighty God (el gibbowr)”. Isa 10:21

Thou shewest lovingkindness unto thousands, and recompensest the iniquity of the fathers into the bosom of their children after them: the Great, the ”Mighty God, ((el gibbowr)” the LORD of hosts, is his name, Jer 32:18

Keith,

This is the Bizzaro World Same Name Game claim. Just because two are called “mighty god” does not mean those TWO are ONE.

Satan is called a god. Jesus is also called a god. Jehovah is also called a god. Are all three of them “God Almighty” just because all three of them are called “god”?

Satan is called “god”, but never “mighty god” or “Almighty God”, so we know he is LESSOR TO both Jesus AND Jehovah.

Jesus is called both “god” AND “mighty god”, but NEVER “Almighty God” or “God Most High” or “the God OF gods”, so we likewise know he is LESSOR TO Jehovah.

Put them all in a hierarchy, Keith:
1. Idols – really not a god at all.
2. Human rulers – Powerful rulers, but not powerful supernatural beings who have sway over the affairs of mankind and nature.
3. Angels and Demons – Powerful supernatural beings who DO have sway over humans and nature, and are often considered and called gods, but are under the rule of Jesus.
4. Jesus Christ – An even MORE powerful supernatural being who is called god, but is under the rule of the One he calls “my God”. (The One who GAVE him the power and authority that he does have.)
5. Jehovah – The God of all other gods, the God Most High, THE Almighty God (because there is ONLY ONE Almighty – hence the name “Almighty”). It is to Him that ALL other gods report. It is HE who PRESIDES OVER the assembly of gods and passes down judgment upon those other gods. And it is ONLY Him who is under the rule of NO ONE ELSE.

See Keith? All other gods have a God of their own, including Jesus. Jehovah is the ONLY exception, which is why HE ALONE is the “only true God” and our “one God”.

June 24, 2011 at 12:34 am#249654

Blocked

Quote (Kangaroo Jack @ June 23 2011,13:27)

Istari:

Quote

There is only One True God – God Most High – YHVH.

Jesus Christ is also called the true God (1 John 5:20).

Poppycock, but one that should be added to the Bizzaro Doctrine thread: Deliberately misinterpreting a clear scripture to pretend that it supports your doctrine.

20 We know also that the Son of God has come and has given us understanding, so that we may know him who is true. And we are in him who is true—even in his Son Jesus Christ. He is the true God and eternal life.

This “him who is true” has a Son named Jesus Christ and is also “the true God” in this scripture. Hmmm…………….where have we heard “true God” before? Oh yeah, Jesus himself taught us that HIS FATHER was the “only true God”. And who is it that has a SON named Jesus Christ? Surely not Jesus Christ himself?

Have you guys no shame? Do you not even realize how hard it is for us to keep a straight face when you guys PRETEND the scriptures say something totally illogical and outside the realms of any known rules of grammar or common sense?

June 24, 2011 at 12:40 am#249655

Participant

Mike is right KJ.

And you owe me an explanation as to the truth I pointed out regarding this in the debate we are having.

Reinforcing your view which is currently been exposed as wrong in our debate is not wise.

June 24, 2011 at 12:40 am#249656

Participant

Quote (mikeboll64 @ June 24 2011,10:43)

Quote (t8 @ June 23 2011,15:33)

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ June 23 2011,08:58)

Quote (t8 @ June 22 2011,16:56)

First question.

Is Jesus the Heavenly Father according to this verse?

It doesn't say “heavenly father” does it?

Thank you for taking the bait.

I now reel you in with, “It doesn't say the Almighty (God) Elohim” does it.

I saw that coming yesterday and had to really hold myself back from ruining the punch line!

June 24, 2011 at 12:44 am#249657

Participant

Quote (mikeboll64 @ June 24 2011,11:10)

See Keith? All other gods have a God of their own, including Jesus. Jehovah is the ONLY exception, which is why HE ALONE is the “only true God” and our “one God”.

Nice one Mike.

OK, Keith, twist this back into confusion for us will you?

June 24, 2011 at 2:08 am#249665

Blocked

Quote (Kangaroo Jack @ June 23 2011,15:21)

There is NO scripture that says that Jesus is “other” than God in the sense Mike suggests. Jesus is “monogenes”, that is, God the only Son

I don't know what to call this one. Perhaps “the perverting of basic common sense to further a doctrine”? At any rate, it IS gibberish, and belongs in this thread.

Jack, “Son OF God” does not in any stretch of the imagination EVER mean “God the Son”. Also, “monogenes” means “only begotten”, just like Strong says it does. Is God Almighty “begotten” in ANY sense of the word?

June 26, 2011 at 8:30 pm#249987

Blocked

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ June 23 2011,11:50)

And Jesus nor the Apostles ever said “he was not God” did they?

:laugh: I have to place this one right up there with Paul's “God is invisible except for when He isn't” statement!

Jesus IS God Almighty simply because no one told us he ISN'T! That's just too much, man!

Uh, hello……………the fact that Jesus is the Son OF God tells us he isn't the God he is the Son OF!

June 27, 2011 at 1:05 am#250037

Blocked

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ June 23 2011 @ 10:33)

If all we need is “good logic” to understand the scriptures then why did Jesus have to send the “Spirit of truth”?

Many think they know by the scriptures who Jesus is, but the scriptures clearly teach without the Holy Spirit of truth to reveal him then they do not know who or what he is!

Quote (Lightenup @ June 26 2011,18:47)

…….you talk about Jehovah as if the name is always referring to the Father. Context……can help distinguish between which one would be referred to……as well as the Spirit who guides and brings understanding.

Quote (Lightenup @ June 26 2011,19:04)

Quote (Rena @ June 26 2011,17:15)

Quote (mikeboll64 @ June 26 2011,17:09)

Quote (Lightenup @ June 26 2011,15:46)

There is but one Almighty God on one side of the equation which encompasses two mighty Gods and their Spirit on the other side of the equation, as I understand it.

Your understanding makes us have TWO Gods, which is a heresy. Not even the Trinitarians go that far.

So what is it? There are two Gods or one? Is the bible correct….or others?

Rena,
Walk by the Spirit and let the Spirit guide you in understanding why Jesus is called the mighty God.

Is this a new trend? When we've finally acknowledged that God's written words don't actually support our doctrine, is it then okay to support that doctrine by saying, “The 'Spirit of Truth' showed me this – even though it isn't in the scriptures”?

Does that make good sense to anyone? Aren't we suppose to test all things, including spirits? What are we to test them against if not the written words of the scriptures?

What does it mean if the “Spirit of Truth” is telling us we have TWO Gods when the scriptures are telling us there is but ONE? What if the “Spirit of Truth” is telling us Jesus is God Himself when the scriptures tell us he is the SON of God?

June 27, 2011 at 1:45 am#250046

Participant

Quote (mikeboll64 @ June 24 2011,11:34)

Poppycock

That would have been a good alternative name for this topic.

June 27, 2011 at 4:34 pm#250095

Participant

Quote (mikeboll64 @ June 26 2011,20:05)

What does it mean if the “Spirit of Truth” is telling us we have TWO Gods when the scriptures are telling us there is but ONE?

Mike,

There you go again like t8 by playing that word game again.

Remember you said with your own words Mike…

Quote (mikeboll64 @ Jan. 06 2011,17:00)

And I don't know of a scripture that calls Jesus “the true god” (changed to [a] true god), but I agree that he is.

And…

Quote (mikeboll64 @ Jan. 05 2011,18:35)

Jesus is the god (changed to a god), or “powerful ruler” of all in heaven right now, and of the believer's on earth.

And…

Quote (mikeboll64 @ Jan. 08 2011,14:05)

Jesus is one who has been called by the title “god”, so he is also “A god”. He has not specifically been called “THE god” of anything in particular, but knowing that “god” only means “ruler”, I can honestly say that he is “my god”.

So why do you keep saying there is only “1 theos/god” when by your own words you believe in and serve “2 theos/gods”?

The Greek and Hebrew doesn't have caps!

June 27, 2011 at 6:01 pm#250097

Participant

Hi WJ,

Only in bazzaro world is this issue (WJ presents) never settled.
There's no need to argue your views “vs” their views,
all that's needed is for you to look at “The FACTS”!

(26=)יהוה = GOD(=26)

“YHVH”(=63) (יהוה) is the God of “The Bible”(=63); PLAIN AND SIMPLE!

LORD & Lord

The Bible uses LORD for this very reason, of ending stupid bickering; like WJ keeps presenting here.

First: [יהוה] YÄ-hä-vā translates directly into English as YHVH. (AKJV Bible: JEHOVAH)
Secondly: [יהשוע] YÄ-shü-ă translates directly into English as Joshua. (AKJV Bible: Jesus)

[אדני] Âdônây in Hebrew means: “Lord” or “Owner” and is akin to
[Κύριος] kü-rē-ŏs in Greek meaning “The Same”: “Lord” or “Owner”

“YOU” CANNOT argue with this “Bible Truth”! (LORD: means Owner)
I will orchestrate my explanation around the term “Owner”.
The AKJV Bible uses: Lord for [יהשוע] and LORD for [יהוה].

A Closer Examination

Technically Jesus is: “owner” but NOT “THE OWNER”!
This can be clearly seen and understood using the word “Owner” (instead of “God”)!

Jehovah is “The Owner” and Jesus is The Son of “The Owner”.
Jehovah CANNOT DIE, so Jehovah will ALWAYS remain “The Owner”!
A Son can 'only' become become fully “The Owner” if the Parent dies,
which in JEHOVAH's case cannot happen; because GOD CANNOT DIE!

Witnessing to the world in behalf of…
יהוה האלהים(JEHOVAH GOD) YÄ-hä-vā hä ĔL-ō-Hêêm! (Psalm 45:17)
Ed J (AKJV Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

June 27, 2011 at 6:10 pm#250099

Participant

Quote (Ed J @ June 27 2011,13:01)

Technically Jesus is: “owner” but NOT “THE OWNER”!

More word games.

My Father gave me everything that belonged to him, but “technically I do not own it” my Father does!

Tell me Ed, does everything come to you from Jesus own hands or not?

If so then Jesus is “The Owner” and the source!

June 27, 2011 at 6:29 pm#250105

Participant

Hi WJ,

119:89-91 For ever, O LORD (JEHOVAH), thy word is settled in heaven.
Thy faithfulness is unto all generations: thou hast established the earth, and it
abideth. They continue this day according to thine ordinances: for all are thy servants.

Witnessing to the world in behalf of YHVH! (Psalm 45:17)
117=יהוה האלהים (JEHOVAH GOD) YÄ-hä-vā hä ĔL-ō-Hêêm!
Ed J (AKJV Isaiah 49:16 / Isaiah 60:14 / Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org …(Eccl.9:12-16)

June 27, 2011 at 6:33 pm#250106

Participant

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ June 28 2011,05:10)

Tell me Ed, does everything come to you from Jesus own hands or not?

Hi WJ,

No; for example when I go out to eat at restaurant,
my food comes to me by the hands of the waitress.

God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

June 27, 2011 at 7:29 pm#250121

terraricca

Participant

Quote (mikeboll64 @ June 27 2011,19:05)

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ June 23 2011 @ 10:33)

If all we need is “good logic” to understand the scriptures then why did Jesus have to send the “Spirit of truth”?

Many think they know by the scriptures who Jesus is, but the scriptures clearly teach without the Holy Spirit of truth to reveal him then they do not know who or what he is!

Quote (Lightenup @ June 26 2011,18:47)

Quote (Lightenup @ June 26 2011,19:04)

Quote (Rena @ June 26 2011,17:15)

Quote (mikeboll64 @ June 26 2011,17:09)

Quote (Lightenup @ June 26 2011,15:46)

There is but one Almighty God on one side of the equation which encompasses two mighty Gods and their Spirit on the other side of the equation, as I understand it.

Your understanding makes us have TWO Gods, which is a heresy. Not even the Trinitarians go that far.

So what is it? There are two Gods or one? Is the bible correct….or others?

Rena,
Walk by the Spirit and let the Spirit guide you in understanding why Jesus is called the mighty God.

Does that make good sense to anyone? Aren't we suppose to test all things, including spirits? What are we to test them against if not the written words of the scriptures?

Mike

Kathi does not even know what the spirit is,and she recommend RENA to walk in the spirit ,

is that not being a blind guiding a blind(no offence RENA)

Pierre

June 27, 2011 at 8:15 pm#250127

Participant

Quote (Ed J @ June 27 2011,13:33)

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ June 28 2011,05:10)

Tell me Ed, does everything come to you from Jesus own hands or not?

Hi WJ,

No; for example when I go out to eat at restaurant,
my food comes to me by the hands of the waitress.

God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

HA HA! Is the waitress the “source” of the food? Does the waitress “Own” the food?

So then you are denying that Jesus is your Savior and the “source” of you faith and eternal life and that all things belong to him!

Jesus knowing that the “Father had given all things into HIS HANDS“, and that he was come from God, and went to God;” John 13:3

Jesus is the source of everything to the true believer.

Did you read my post here…?

Why do you make Jesus “a savior” by proxy and deny over 150 scriptures that says he is the source of all things to the creation?

BTW if you can't disuss scriptures without the numerical mumbo jumbo then you will have to have a discussion with yourself.

June 27, 2011 at 9:25 pm#250131

Participant

Hi WJ,

Pointing out that my food comes to me by the hand of a waitress,
hardly constitutes as me denying Jesus as savior of the world.

Your brother
in Christ, Jesus.
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

June 27, 2011 at 9:34 pm#250133