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Quote (terraricca @ Feb. 11 2012,17:49) what you are running away,you tell others not to but you do ? you defend their teachings and interpretations ,now you refuse to look in to it because you do not like it ,if you would you would tear them down but not now why,answer me this did you know that the JW have preached that 1975 was the end ;yes or no
and if you say yes why did it not come through??
Running away from what, Pierre? Are we still discussing how 1914 can't possibly be the year Christ began to rule in heaven?Or would you like to talk about the false 1975 prediction that the JWs learned from?
Yes, they made the prediction. Yes, many people became disenchanted when it didn't come true, and as a result they lost many members that year. Yes, they have since humbled themselves, and admitted they were wrong to ever have done such a thing. Yes, they now take to heart the words of Jesus that no one knows the day or the hour.
What more would you like to say about it? Will it make you feel better to taunt them about a past mistake?
If so, then taunt away and get it out of your system. Then, when you're done taunting, perhaps you'll come up with one of their doctrines that is so against scripture that they must be a cult.
That is what I'm waiting for.
Quote (mikeboll64 @ Feb. 13 2012,08:09) Quote (terraricca @ Feb. 11 2012,17:49) what you are running away,you tell others not to but you do ? you defend their teachings and interpretations ,now you refuse to look in to it because you do not like it ,if you would you would tear them down but not now why,answer me this did you know that the JW have preached that 1975 was the end ;yes or no
and if you say yes why did it not come through??
Running away from what, Pierre? Are we still discussing how 1914 can't possibly be the year Christ began to rule in heaven?Or would you like to talk about the false 1975 prediction that the JWs learned from?
Yes, they made the prediction. Yes, many people became disenchanted when it didn't come true, and as a result they lost many members that year. Yes, they have since humbled themselves, and admitted they were wrong to ever have done such a thing. Yes, they now take to heart the words of Jesus that no one knows the day or the hour.
What more would you like to say about it? Will it make you feel better to taunt them about a past mistake?
If so, then taunt away and get it out of your system. Then, when you're done taunting, perhaps you'll come up with one of their doctrines that is so against scripture that they must be a cult.
That is what I'm waiting for.
Mikenow I see you telling the truth,but like I say this is only one date they made previous dates as well,so it seems they have not learned anything from the previous ones,and so can go on ,and on,and so they say that they are guided by the spirit through the faithful slave ,this disqualifies all others to be in the truth ,
this to me is like wen the Pope was declared ;Papal infallibility
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopediaThe Holy Spirit descending on Pope Gregory I, by Carlo Saraceni, circa 1610, Rome.
Catholicism portal
Papal infallibility is a dogma of the Catholic Church which states that, by action of the Holy Spirit, the pope is preserved from even the possibility of error[1] when in his official capacity he solemnly declares or promulgates to the universal Church a dogmatic teaching on faith or morals. It is also taught that the Holy Spirit works in the body of the Church, as sensus fidelium, to ensure that dogmatic teachings proclaimed to be infallible will be received by all Catholics. This dogma, however, does not state either that the pope cannot sin in his own personal life or that he is necessarily free of error, even when speaking in his official capacity, outside the specific contexts in which the dogma applies.
This doctrine was defined dogmatically in the First Vatican Council of 1870. According to Catholic theology, there are several concepts important to the understanding of infallible, divine revelation: Sacred Scripture, Sacred Tradition, and the Sacred Magisterium. The infallible teachings of the pope are part of the Sacred Magisterium, which also consists of ecumenical councils and the “ordinary and universal magisterium”. In Catholic theology, papal infallibility is one of the channels of the infallibility of the Church. The infallible teachings of the pope must be based on, or at least not contradict, Sacred Tradition or Sacred Scripture. Papal infallibility does not signify that the pope is impeccable, i.e.., that he is specially exempt from liability to sin.
The doctrine of infallibility relies on one of the cornerstones of Catholic dogma—that of petrine supremacy of the pope, and his authority to be the ruling agent in deciding what will be accepted as formal beliefs in the Church.[2] The clearest example (though not the only one)[3] of the use of this power, referred to as speaking ex cathedra[4] expressed since the solemn declaration of papal infallibility by Vatican I on July 18, 1870, took place in 1950 when Pope Pius XII defined the Assumption of Mary as being an article of faith for Roman Catholics.[5] This authority is considered by Catholics to be apostolic and of divine origin. Prior to the solemn definition of 1870, Pope Boniface VIII in the Bull Unam Sanctam of 1302,[6][7][8] Pope Eugene IV in the Bull Cantate Domino of 1441,[9][10][11] and Pope Pius IX in the Papal constitution Ineffabilis Deus of 1854[12][13] have all spoken “ex cathedra.”any way it is our personal duty before God to search and look,for the his truth and his kingdom ,not for mere men organization claims of truths.and we all then pay the price for our choice.
Quote (terraricca @ Feb. 12 2012,10:43) Mike now I see you telling the truth,but like I say this is only one date they made previous dates as well…….
Previous? But none after 1975, right?What's is been, Pierre? 42 years now?
I recall you preaching and teaching that Jesus was raised from the grave as a spirit being. Shall we chastise YOU for the next 42 years because of a MISTAKE you made? Shall we consider you a “false teacher” forever because you made a mistake in the past?
(Btw, that is another of the JW teachings that I don't agree with. They think like we used to think, that Jesus was raised as a spirit being right from the grave.)
Quote (mikeboll64 @ Feb. 13 2012,11:01) Quote (terraricca @ Feb. 12 2012,10:43) Mike now I see you telling the truth,but like I say this is only one date they made previous dates as well…….
Previous? But none after 1975, right?What's is been, Pierre? 42 years now?
I recall you preaching and teaching that Jesus was raised from the grave as a spirit being. Shall we chastise YOU for the next 42 years because of a MISTAKE you made? Shall we consider you a “false teacher” forever because you made a mistake in the past?
(Btw, that is another of the JW teachings that I don't agree with. They think like we used to think, that Jesus was raised as a spirit being right from the grave.)
Mikefirst I never claim that I have the spirit right
or did I the JW ORG. did .
Quote now I see you telling the truth,but like I say this is only one date they made previous dates as well…….
Previous? But none after 1975, right?[/QUOTE]I don't care what they do or not do ,the men called the faithful slave,are just liars according to scriptures or false prophets ,
a person (one) does not mistaken but he does not comprehend
or understand,or lack knowledge in truth,but still a student,wen you are a leader (s) you bear the responsibility of your words even greater wen you are an organization,and claim to be guide by Gods spirit ;do I have to remember what it says in the seven letters to the seven churches;
?a false teacher is the one that makes false claims not the one that not fully understand the word of God ,(because then it will include all past prophets)
as for Christ resurrection in the spirit ,this verse came to me lately ; Mk 16:12 Afterward Jesus appeared in a different form to two of them while they were walking in the country.
Lk 24:16 but they were kept from recognizing him.
what you think???
Quote (terraricca @ Feb. 12 2012,11:26) Mike first I never claim that I have the spirit right or did I
the JW ORG. did .
Show me where the JW Organization, as a whole, ever claimed to have the spirit, or to be the only ones with the spirit.Quote (terraricca @ Feb. 12 2012,11:26) as for Christ resurrection in the spirit ,this verse came to me lately ; Mk 16:12 Afterward Jesus appeared in a different form to two of them while they were walking in the country. Lk 24:16 but they were kept from recognizing him.
what you think???
I think the same thing I though before – that Jesus would have been LYING to his disciples in Luke 24 if he was already a spirit being.But hey, go ahead and switch back to your previous understanding if you want to……………you'll be right in line with the teaching of the JWs who you try so hard to call false teachers.
Quote (mikeboll64 @ Feb. 13 2012,11:30) Quote (terraricca @ Feb. 12 2012,11:26) as for Christ resurrection in the spirit ,this verse came to me lately ; Mk 16:12 Afterward Jesus appeared in a different form to two of them while they were walking in the country. Lk 24:16 but they were kept from recognizing him.
what you think???
I think the same thing I though before – that Jesus would have been LYING to his disciples in Luke 24 if he was already a spirit being.But hey, go ahead and switch back to your previous understanding if you want to……………you'll be right in line with the teaching of the JWs who you try so hard to call false teachers.
Mikedid you concluded that I have changed now were did I say this ?? you mean I should never talk about this any other way ??or even subjecting another view
are you not jumping to personal conclusion I merely call for a look at this verse ,I did not ask you to change your believe or did I
I looked at it and answered you. Where did I say you have swithed back to your old views? I said for you TO DO THAT if you wanted to.
Mike
here is more on dates ;Failed predictions
Watch Tower Society publications have claimed that God has used Jehovah's Witnesses (and formerly, the International Bible Students) to declare his will[318][319] and has provided advance knowledge about Armageddon and the establishment of God's kingdom.[320][321][322] Raymond Franz, who became a critic of the religion, has cited publications that claimed that God has used Jehovah's Witnesses and the International Bible Students as a modern-day prophet.[note 6] Jehovah's Witnesses' publications have made various predictions about world events they believe were prophesied in the Bible.[323][324] Failed predictions have led to the alteration or abandonment of some doctrines.[325][326] Critics highlight failed predictions that the Watch Tower Society had claimed were “beyond doubt” or “approved by God”.[327] The Watch Tower Society rejects accusations that it is a false prophet.[328] It says that unlike Old Testament prophets, its interpretations of the Bible are not inspired or infallible,[329][330][331] and that its predictions were not claimed as “the words of Jehovah.”[328] It states that some of its expectations have needed adjustment as a part of progressive revelation and of its eagerness for God's kingdom, adding that Witnesses are always ready to accept such adjustments and that it would be “foolish to take the view that expectations needing some adjustment should call into question the whole body of truth.”[332][333] George D. Chryssides has suggested that with the exception of statements about 1914, 1925 and 1975, the changing views and dates of the Jehovah's Witnesses are largely attributable to changed understandings of biblical chronology than to failed predictions.[334]like I say ,I don't care about it ,but I know you will never be able to vindicate that religion with scriptures,so do not ask me what you can not do ,
remember what I said about BETH SARIM
Pierre,
I'm waiting for something unscriptural that the JWs teach. You call them “false teachers” – prove it.
Quote (mikeboll64 @ Feb. 13 2012,11:53) Pierre, I'm waiting for something unscriptural that the JWs teach. You call them “false teachers” – prove it.
MIKEwhat is a false teacher
?Quote (mikeboll64 @ Feb. 13 2012,11:53) Pierre, I'm waiting for something unscriptural that the JWs teach. You call them “false teachers” – prove it.
MikeI have quoted you many false teachings from the JW Organization,and as far as it goes in scriptures you ,yourself are disagreeing with some of their teachings as you say ,why you asking me to prove what you are already know.
Have ever altered your understanding of scripture before? Were you a false teacher before you altered it, or just a man who was mistaken?
If you can get so upset by me asking you that last simple question, then understand how I hate it when people make threads slamming the JWs all the time around here. It infuriates me.
If they are teaching something that you don't agree with, then either you or they are interpreting certain scriptures incorrectly. And who is to say which one is right?
I'm asking that you lay off of them. They are God-fearing servants of the Almighty who are doing their best to understand scripture, and doing more than any organization in the world to get the good news to people on the street.
Mike
Quote If you can get so upset by me asking you that last simple question, then understand how I hate it when people make threads slamming the JWs all the time around here. It infuriates me. I am not upset ,I use capital letter to emphasize what I say so I apologies for this,Mike I explain this many times an individual and a corporation are two different things,
Quote I'm asking that you lay off of them. They are God-fearing servants of the Almighty who are doing their best to understand scripture, and doing more than any organization in the world to get the good news to people on the street. their are good people in all religion in the world ,and God will call them if this is what he wants,God people do not go to men organization but to their God in truth and in spirit,all men made religion makes proselytes for their group,or organization and their believe ,they all use their own or other scriptures it depend or the wealth and donation they have ,Mike I know I have been on the legal fact of some cases between the WJ and other WJ person,
this is the second time you ask me ,so I will apply but I can not let the truth about them be ignored ,
so case closed
Quote (terraricca @ Feb. 12 2012,16:18) this is the second time you ask me ,so I will apply
Thank you my friend. And for my part, I will disregard the JW threads from now on. It's just not worth the emotional toll. People can think what they want to think.peace,
mikePage 3
Hi Mike,
Quote So then Jesus lied when he told us to be his hands and feet? He lied when he told us to preach the good news of the Kingdom to the ends of the earth? In your understanding, God and Jesus will draw who they want from heaven, and therefore there is no need for us to speak to anyone about God at all.
Pierre, the JWs are doing EXACTLY what Jesus commissioned us all to do. Yet some people knock them for doing just that.
MATTHEW 24:14
» 14 † And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come.Jesus called us to preach the exact same gospel, yet man doesn't preach the same gospel, which includes JW's and all the other denominations, just like Pierre said.
So the point being they are not doing what Jesus said to do. Without the Holy Ghost in each of us, we will never do what we were called to do.
I COR 2:4 † And my speech and my preaching was not with enticing words of man's wisdom, but in demonstration of the Spirit and of power:
Marlin
Quote (Marlin1 @ Feb. 12 2012,19:16) Jesus called us to preach the exact same gospel, yet man doesn't preach the same gospel…………
You sure don't. Jesus preached that our God was his God. You preach that Jesus our God, which would make him his own God if we add your teaching to Jesus' teaching.
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