Is Jesus the Logos?

The Word of God

We know that God created all things through his Word.

John 1:1-3
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.  He was with God in the beginning.  Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made.

1 John 1:1-3
That which was from the beginning, which we have heard, which we have seen with our eyes, which we have looked at and our hands have touched—this we proclaim concerning the Word of life. The life appeared; we have seen it and testify to it, and we proclaim to you the eternal life, which was with the Father and has appeared to us. We proclaim to you what we have seen and heard, so that you also may have fellowship with us. And our fellowship is with the Father and with his Son, Jesus Christ.

However, it is also written that God made all things through his son.

Hebrews 1:2
but in these last days he has spoken to us by his Son, whom he appointed heir of all things, and through whom also he made the universe.

Colossians 1:15-17
He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of all creation. For by Him all things were created, both in the heavens and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities– all things have been created through Him and for Him. He is before all things, and in Him all things hold together.

1 Corinthians 8:6
yet there is for us only one God, the Father, who is the Creator of all things and for whom we live; and there is only one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom all things were created and through whom we live.

There seems to be a direct link with the Word and the Son in the above verses as both are said to be the agent by which God created all things. Or did God make all things through his Word as well as the Son? If there was a time when there was only God and his Word as we read in John 1:1-3, then know that Jesus is not only described in similar terms as that Word but that he is actually called the Word of God too.

Revelation 19:13
He is dressed in a robe dipped in blood, and his name is the Word of God.

It seems that with God making all things through his Word, through his Son, and even through Wisdom, this either means that these are all different agents, thus God invoked a number of things to create the Universe, or they are one and the same, i.e., the Word is Jesus Christ before he was called Jesus. Christ.

We are told that the Word became flesh and that is an obvious reference in a book devoted to Jesus Christ in a passage of scripture about the origins of Jesus Christ. So this either means that Jesus was newly created from the Word as some teach or that he is the Word but took on another form, that of flesh when he came to earth. The latter seems the more likely explanation given that God created all things through the Son and the Word and that Jesus Christ is even called the ‘Word of God’.

Even if there were no direct references for Jesus being the Word of God, there would still be a whole raft of other verses to contend with. These verses speak of Jesus existence before he came as a man (outside of mentioning the Word).

  • “Before Abraham, I am”, – John 8:58
  • “to the only God our Savior be glory, majesty, power and authority, through Jesus Christ our Lord, before all ages, now and forevermore! Amen.” – Jude 1:25,
  • He is before all things, and in him all things hold together –  Colossians 1:17.
  • etc.

Finally, we are told to not trust in the flesh, so if Jesus is only flesh, then should we trust him? After all we are explicitly taught that we are cursed if we trust in man. When we trust Jesus, are we trusting in man or the Word of God?

Jeremiah 17:5
This is what the LORD says: “Cursed is the one who trusts in man, who draws strength from mere flesh and whose heart turns away from the LORD.

For more on this subject try this writing:
Did Jesus pre-exist before his birth on earth

Viewing 20 posts - 24,721 through 24,740 (of 25,958 total)
  • Author
    Posts
  • #944771
    Nick
    Participant

    Hi Berean,

    The promise was made to Mary before the conception of Yeshua.

    The fulfilment of that promise was when the Word was made flesh at the Jordan when the Father said

    ”This is My Son in whom I am well pleased”

    And for us

    “Because you are sons God has sent forth THE SPIRIT OF THE SON into our hearts crying Abba, Father!…”

    Gal 4.6

    look beyond flesh and see the Spirit.

    #944773
    carmel
    Participant

    Hi Nick,

    You: Hi Berean,

    It is the Spirit of anointing that made the man Jesus different to us.

    Me: Nick, When did the Spirit anoint the man Jesus,

    Before His birth?

    On His birth?

    Or at the River Jordan?

    SCRIPTURES:

    Isaiah 42:11BEHOLD my servant, I will uphold him: my elect,

    my soul delights in him:

    Notice in the above, the simple present tense is used: “My soul delights in HIM”

    We use the simple present tense when an action is happening right now, or when it happens regularly (or unceasingly, which is why it’s sometimes called present indefinite).

    Now; WHO IS GOD’S SOUL?

    THE HOLY GHOST!  NO? 

    Now read hereunder:

    I HAVE GIVEN my spirit upon him,

    Notice again the tense,

    The present perfect tense is an English verb tense used for past actions that are related to or continue into the present. 

    AS CLEAR AS CRYSTAL:

    JESUS PREEXISTED, AND BEFORE THE WORD WAS HE WAS GIVEN THE HOLY GHOST. 

    JESUS WAS ANOINTED BEFORE HE COMMENCED  HIS TASK OF THE CREATION OF THIS WORLD:

    A KING IS ANOINTED BEFORE HE COMMENCES HIS TASK AS KING EMPOWERED BY GOD’S SPIRIT IF HE REMAINS LOYAL TO GOD!

    LIKEWISE, JESUS, EMPTIED HIMSELF OF HIS DIVINE ATTRIBUTES AND THOUGH IN ORDER TO BE IN ALL THINGS LIKE US, HE BECAME AS WEAK AS HUMANS ARE,  AS A SPIRIT, HE WAS ALSO ANOINTED AND EMPOWERED BY THE SPIRIT OF GOD BEFORE HE COMMENCED HIS TASK IN THE CREATION OF THIS WORLD:

    John 17:4I have glorified thee on the earth;

    I have finished the work which thou gavest me to do. 

    EVEN SLAIN LIKE A LAMB FROM THE BEGINNING OF THE WORLD. Rev 13:8

    5And now glorify thou me, O Father, with thyself, with the glory which I had, before the world was, with thee.

    MORE SCRIPTURE:

    Isaiah 48:16 Come ye near unto me, and hear this:

    I have not spoken in secret from THE BGINNING:

    AGAIN THE PRESENT PERFECT TENSE! 

    A CLEAR REFERENCE TO JESUS PREEXISTENCE AS A SPIRIT “THE WORD” SPOKEN OF GOD; John1:1

    from the time before it was done,

    BEFORE CREATION WAS DONE:

    I was there,

    and now the Lord God hath sent me, and his spirit.

    AS CLEAR AS CRYSTAL AGAIN;

    JESUS WAS SENT BY THE FATHER CARRYING THE FATHER’S SPIRIT, THE HOLY GHOST, GOD’S SOUL  BEFORE THE CREATION OF THIS WORLD.

    MORE SCRIPTURE:

    John4:35 Do you not say, There are yet four months, and then the harvest cometh? Behold, I say to you, lift up your eyes, and see the countries; for they are white already to harvest. 

    36And HE that reapeth receiveth wages, and gathereth fruit unto life everlasting:

    that both HE THAT SOWETH,

    and HE THAT REAPETH,

    may rejoice together.

    MAY REJOICE TOGETHER ON JESUS’ DEATH ON THE CROSS,  BOTH GLORIFIED IN ONE SUBSTANCE BOTH SPIRIT AND FLESH AS

    GODMAN! John 13:31,32, John17:1!

     37For in this is the saying true:

    That it is ONE MAN that soweth,

    JESUS THE SON OF MAN, JESUS’ HUMAN NATURE, THE ABODE OF THE HOLY GHOST, GOD’S SOUL!

    and it is ANOTHER that reapeth. 

    THE HOLY GHOST, IN JESUS’SOUL, GOD’S SOUL, JESUS’DIVINE NATURE! 

    38I have sent you to reap that in which you did not labour:

    others have laboured,

    JESUS, THE SON OF GOD, THE HOLY GHOST AND 

    JESUS, THE SON OF MAN, “THE WORD” MADE FLESH

    and you have entered into their labours.

     

    Peace and love in Jesus Christ

    #944774
    Nick
    Participant

    Hi Carmel,

    The future is as the present to our God.

    prophetic scripture.

    #944776
    GeneBalthrop
    Participant

    Jodi…….excellent post,  hope Desire Truth,  Will think about it.

    peace and love to you and yours Jodi……..gene

    #944777
    GeneBalthrop
    Participant

    DT…….Seeming your new found religion rejects Jesus as a ‘mediator’, between God and men,  tell me this,  Did God reject the mediators,  in the days of the old testaments.  Was Moses a “mediator ” between God and men,  were the high priests “mediators”  between God and men? Did Moses not say that God would raise up to the people,  a mediator like him , and that we should heed his words?

    Did not Jesus say, the words I am telling you are “not” my words , but the words of him who sent him?

    Do you honestly think “rejecting”  the person God the Father sent to us,  is going to work well for you?   It won’t, no more than when korah rejected Moses,  as the Mediator between Israel and God.  How did that work out  for him DT?  “IF YOU REJECT THE ONE GOD SENDS, YOU ALSO ARE “REJECTING’’  GOD, “WHO SENT HIM” . Think about that DT.

    peace and love to you and yours DT………..gene

    #944778
    Nick
    Participant

    Yes Gene,,

    a good post of Jodi’s.

    #944779
    Nick
    Participant

    Hi Gene,

    A good post to DT from you.

    #944782
    carmel
    Participant

     

    Hi Desiretruth,

    You: Unfortunately, it’s not what I don’t see; it’s what I do see. If Jesus was an “example” for us and how we are to go to God; why does Jesus say the only way to God is through him?

    Me: Adam rejected God’s will, he lost his spiritual state in the image of God, the way to eternal life of the kingdom of God, and unaware of acquired the physical state in the image of god of this world, and the way to the kingdom of Satan’s eternal death.

    God rejected Adam and his will and threw him out of the garden of God.

    ONCE ADAM AND THE HUMAN RACE ENDED IN THIS SATANIC CURSED AND MORTAL EARTH, only ONE WAY remained for humanity in order to re-establish again an entirely NEW RELATIONSHIP WITH GOD.

    You: If Jesus was an “example” for us and how we are to go to God;

    why does Jesus say the only way to God is through him?

    Now DT. Read this scripture:

    For God so loved the world, as to give his only begotten Son;

    that whosoever believeth in him,

    DT. believe in Jesus or else you’ve had it!! Keep on reading please:

    may not perish,

    but may have life everlasting.

     17For God sent not his Son into the world, to judge the world,

    but that the world may be saved by him.

    18He that believeth in him is not judged.

     But he that doth not believe, is already judged:

    Ok DT. In your case,

    You are already judged! Why? Read please:

    because he believeth not in the name of the only begotten Son of God.

    19And this is the judgment:

    because the light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than the light: for their works were evil.

    More emphatically clear in

    John3:36 He that believeth in the Son, hath life everlasting;

     but he that believeth not the Son,

    shall not see life;

     but the wrath of God ABIDETH on him.

    Now ask yourself a question!

    WHAT AND WHO IS

    THE WRATH OF GOD?

     

    Peace and love in Jesus Christ

    #944783
    carmel
    Participant

    Hi Nick,

    You: Hi Carmel,

    The future is as the present to our God.

    prophetic scripture.

    Me: First and foremost

    PRODUCE THE SCRIPTURE PLEASE!

    Also explain in your own terms,

    both the scripture that you are referring to and what you said above in relation to my post! 

     

    Peace and love in Jesus Christ

     

    #944784
    Nick
    Participant

    Hi C,

    The revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave him to show to His bondservants, the things which must soon take place; and He sent and communicated it by His Angel to His bondservant John , who testified to the Word of God and to the testimony of Jesus Christ, even to all that he saw. Blessed is he who reads and those who hear the words of the prophecy, and heed the things which are written in it; for the time is near.

    Rev1.1f

    #944786
    Nick
    Participant

    And now brethren, I know you acted in ignorance, just as your rulers did also. But the things God announced beforehand by the mouth of all the prophets, that His Christ would suffer, He has thus fulfilled. Therefore repent and return, so that your sins may be wiped away, in order that times of refreshing may come from the presence of the Lord, and that he may send you Jesus, the Christ appointed for you, whom heaven must receive until the period of restoration of all things which God spoke by the mouth of the Holy prophets from ancient time. Moses said,

    ”The Lord God will raise up a prophet like me from your brethren; to him you shall give heed” to everything he says to you. And it shall be that every soul that does not heed that prophet shall be utterly destroyed from among the people.

    Acts 3.17f

    #944787
    carmel
    Participant

    Hi Nick,

    You: Hi Carmel,

    The future is as the present to our God.

    prophetic scripture.

    Me: First and foremost

    PRODUCE THE SCRIPTURE PLEASE!

    Also explain in your own terms,

    both the scripture that you are referring to and what you said above in relation to my post! 

    Me: AS YOU CAN READ I POSTED AGAIN MY POST!

    WOULD YOU BE KIND ENOUGH AS I SUGGESTED TO

    EXPLAIN IN YOUR OWN TERMS BOTH THE SCRIPTURE THAT YOU POSTED AND WHAT YOU SAID IN RELATION TO MY POST PLEASE?

     

     

    Peace and love in Jesus Christ

     

    #944788
    Nick
    Participant

    Hi C,

    let scripture speak.

    #944789
    Nick
    Participant

    Find it written and find witnesses to what is written.

    EVERY FACT IS TO BE CONFIRMED BY THE TESTIMONY OF TWO OR THREE WITNESSSES

    2 Cor 13.1

    #944790
    GeneBalthrop
    Participant

    Desire Truth……..There are three here witnessing to you,  Nick, Jodi, and myself , you need to return to the sheep fold. And you will find rest for your soul brother.  You were well grounded understanding the words of Jesus, and scriptures concerning him,  and we understand your disagreements with the Apostate Churches of this age, we have that also, but none of that disagrees with the words of Jesus, he even said , “many would come in his name, and deceive “many”  and,  that “many” would come to him and say “lord in “your name”, we have done these good works, and he would say to them, depart from me you workers of iniquity, I know you not. He didn’t say that they did not do great works did he, but their error was they did it in “his” name, instead of doing it in God the Fathers name, as Jesus did.  They had left their “first love” God the Father, and replaced him with Jesus.  Example the church at Ephesus,  Rev 2: 1-5 .
    So preaching Jesus they shall be rejected, why, because Jesus  was not sent from God? “NO” but  because they are preaching a “false” Jesus Christ as their first love and as their God, look,  there are a lot of reasons to reject the Jesus of “modern Christianity ” , but no reason to reject,  the real Jesus Christ of scriptures.   IMO, brother.
    Return to the sheep fold , where you belong brother.

    peace and love to you and yours Desire Truth………..gene

    #944791
    Berean
    Participant

     

    The next day John seeth Jesus coming unto him, and saith, ☀️Behold the Lamb of God, which taketh away the sin of the world.☀️  

    Can a man take away the sins of the world?

    #944792
    Nick
    Participant

     

    Hi Gene,

    Yes,

    ”If your brother sins go and show him his fault in private; if he listens to you, you have won your brother. But if he does not listen to you, take one or two more with you so that BY THE MOUTH OF TWO OR THREE WITNESSES EVERY FACT MAY BE CONFIRMED.” Mt18.15

    Scriptural witnesses are true too.

    Deut 17.6,

    Num35.30

    Deut 19.15

    #944793
    Nick
    Participant

    Hi Berean,

    yes

    one at a time.

    Repent and be baptised in the name of Jess Christ for the forgiveness of your sins….

    #944794
    Nick
    Participant

    In the name of Jesus Christ.

    #944795
    carmel
    Participant

    Hi Nick,

    You: The promise was made to Mary before the conception of Yeshua.

    The fulfilment of that promise was when the Word was made flesh at the Jordan when the Father said

    ”This is My Son in whom I am well pleased”

    Me: Read hereunder please:

    Luke 2:49 And he said to them: How is it that you sought me?

    did you not know,

    that I must be about MY FATHER’S business? 

    50And they understood not the word that he spoke unto them.

     

    What did Jesus a child of 12 declare in full clarity?

    You: The fulfilment of that promise was when

    the Word was made flesh at the Jordan when the Father said

    ”This is My Son in whom I am well pleased”

    Is it the fulfillment or the confirmation of what Jesus a child of twelve revealed?

    John 5:36 But I have a greater testimony than that of John: for the works which the Father hath given me to perfect; the works themselves, which I do, give testimony of me, that the Father hath sent me.

    37And the Father himself who hath sent me,

    hath given testimony of me:

    neither have you heard his voice at any time, nor seen his shape.

     

    And the Father himself who hath sent me,

    hath given testimony of me:

    How?

    at the river Jordan:

    ”This is My Son in whom I am well pleased”

    Reflect please:

    WAS IT A FULFILLMENT AT THE RIVER JORDAN?

    WAS IT A TESTIMONY OF WHAT JESUS A CHILD OF TWELVE DECLARED?

     

    Peace and love in Jesus Christ

Viewing 20 posts - 24,721 through 24,740 (of 25,958 total)
  • You must be logged in to reply to this topic.

© 1999 - 2024 Heaven Net

Navigation

© 1999 - 2023 - Heaven Net
or

Log in with your credentials

or    

Forgot your details?

or

Create Account