The Holy Spirit is the spirit of the Father

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April 3, 2015 at 10:01 am#792521
Proclaimer
Participant
@DavidL, while you may or may not have some valid points about the Word being with God, I want to point you to something of utmost importance that far outweighs what we believe about the Word of God.
You agree with the Catholic Faith as defined by their creed more than you believe the following words:
“For us, there is one God the Father, and one Lord, the Lord Jesus Christ.”
“This is eternal life, to know the only true God, and Jesus Christ whom he has sent.”
“Now to the King eternal, immortal, invisible, the only God, be honor and glory for ever and ever.”
“Now I want you to realize that the head of every man is Christ, and the head of the woman is man, and the head of Christ is God.”
“one Lord, one faith, one baptism; one God and Father of all, who is over all and through all and in all.”
“Do not hold on to me, for I have not yet returned to the Father. Go instead to my brothers and tell them,
`I am returning to my Father and your Father, to my God and your God.”
“so that with one heart and mouth you may glorify the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ.”
“Praise be to the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of compassion and the God of all comfort,”
“The revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave him to show his servants what must soon take place.”
Who are you kidding DavidL? You are not kidding us and obviously you are not kidding God.
You are kidding yourself. You have clearly traded in the Roman Catholic faith for the words of eternal life and the most important truth, that there is one God the Father and that he sent his son to save sinners.
You have rejected all the above scriptures and it is plain for all to see that you have done this. You are deluded if you think you have not. Read them again and again and say to yourself “Do I honestly believe these scriptures”. You will find the answer is NO, (if you are honest).
April 3, 2015 at 10:06 am#792524
kerwin
Participant
DavidL,
The Koine Greeks did not use pronouns as we do. That nouns had gender as did their pronouns. Translating them to English and disagreements between experts are common. For example:
John 1:1-2American Standard Version (ASV)
1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
2 The same was in the beginning with God.
The word logos is a masculine and so the correct Koine Greek pronoun is a masculine one.
April 3, 2015 at 10:33 am#792528
bodhitharta
Participant
Secrets of a Magician:
Exposure is claimed to “kill” magic as an art form, but time has proven this to be untrue.
April 3, 2015 at 10:48 am#792529
bodhitharta
Participant
DavidL
You are one of the great Magicians of all time. You call Jesus the Lamb of God but say Jesus is God then boom God appears as a Lamb…. tension mounts t8 comes out and says you have gotten this sorcery from Catholicism but every magician knows you are forbidden to tell the source of your magic…so you dismiss the expose but implant the idea that if the catholic church was where he got the trick from it makes more sense than the expose because what t8 did not know was:
there are often many ways to achieve a single illusion, so the ‘secret’ is merely an example of how it “could” work.
April 3, 2015 at 11:00 am#792532
bodhitharta
Participant
How can someone argue the trinity when by default they support it…if you read the posts of Nick they are not that far from DavidL. Nick worships Jesus as if he were God Almighty…he will tell you that Jesus is just a man…but all his writings show he thinks like DavidL. Nick is like if you do not serve 2 masters you are failing God…Nick is just a better magician he goes for 3 masters. true believers can’t do magic they only have one Master…oh well, I guess paradise is better than self praise
April 3, 2015 at 11:18 am#792533
bodhitharta
Participant
Matthew 16:23
23 But he turned and said to Peter, “Get behind me, Satan! You are a hindrance to me. For you are not setting your mind on the things of God, but on the things of man.”
If Jesus is a Man nick you should heed the advice and set your mind on the things of God and Hid Sovereign Nature.
April 3, 2015 at 12:15 pm#792541
NickHassan
Participant
Hi BD,
Indeed Jesus continued his battle with the servants of darkness even in his chosen brothers.
You deny the Son and call his teaching lies while telling us he is a mighty messenger of God.
A kingdom against itself cannot survive.
April 3, 2015 at 12:25 pm#792548
bodhitharta
Participant
Best you belong to the Kingdom of God and love his messengers without Worshiping them as partners with God
April 4, 2015 at 11:15 pm#792724
Proclaimer
Participant
BD, ‘worship’ is the same word as ‘honour’.
In scripture we see that men rightly so worshipped/honoured the Father as the one true God.
In scripture we see that men rightly so worshipped/honoured Jesus Christ as the son of God and the Lamb of God.
Mohammed denied in his teachings and in the Koran that Jesus is the son of God and the Lamb of God. Islam attacks the identity of Jesus by denying he is the son of God and we know what spirit denies this precious truth.
Further, Islam denies that Jesus died for man’s sins and rose from the grave. Instead they say that it was made to look like he died.
Quran in S. 4:157-158:
“And because of their (the Jews) saying: We slew the Messiah, Jesus son of Mary, Allah’s messenger- they slew him not nor crucified him, but it appeared so unto them; and lo! those who disagree concerning it are in doubt thereof; they have no knowledge thereof save pursuit of a conjecture; they slew him not for certain. But Allah took him up unto Himself. Allah was ever Mighty, Wise.” M. M. Pickthall
While you may have something to contribute as far as exposing the lie of the Trinity, if you do so to provide another lie, then what good is that?
Can you not see that the one who inspired scripture and the one who inspired the Koran are in opposition?
They are not the same God.

April 5, 2015 at 7:19 am#792740
DavidL
Participant
Kerwin
The Koine Greeks did not use pronouns as we do.
so…what you’re saying is if I don’t study Greek – I will be deceived by reading the NT..??

v3…”All things came into being through Him, and apart from Him nothing came into being that has come into being.”

v4 “In Him was life, and the life was the Light of men.”

v10 “He was in the world, and the world was made through Him, and the world did not know Him.”

v11 “He came to His own, and those who were His own did not receive Him.”

v12 “But as many as received Him, to them He gave the right to become children of God, even to those who believe in His name.”

John shows clearly that Jesus was in the beginning with God – as God.

Paul confirms this – Philippians 2:6,7
“who, although He existed in the form of God, did not regard equality with God a thing to be grasped, but emptied Himself, taking the form of a bond-servant, and being made in the likeness of men.”

Jesus Himself confirms this – John 17:5
“Now, Father, glorify Me together with Yourself, with the glory which I had with You before the world was.”

April 5, 2015 at 8:25 am#792745
NickHassan
Participant
Hi davidl,
Jesus was the word in the beginning?
Yet conceived of Mary??
April 5, 2015 at 8:32 am#792748
bodhitharta
Participant
BD, ‘worship’ is the same word as ‘honour’.
In scripture we see that men rightly so worshipped/honoured the Father as the one true God.
In scripture we see that men rightly so worshipped/honoured Jesus Christ as the son of God and the Lamb of God.
They also worshiped kings so you are correct but that is not the same thing as Worshiping someone AS God, is it?
Mohammed denied in his teachings and in the Koran that Jesus is the son of God and the Lamb of God. Islam attacks the identity of Jesus by denying he is the son of God and we know what spirit denies this precious truth.
Further, Islam denies that Jesus died for man’s sins and rose from the grave. Instead they say that it was made to look like he died.
Muhammad doesn’t have any teaching in the Quran, Gabriel recited to him what to write/remember but the Quran doesn’t simply say that Jesus is not the Son of God it says GOD has NO son, meaning all claims including angels being sons are misunderstood and I can clearly and plainly prove this:
Hebrews 1:5
For unto which of the angels said he at any time, Thou art my Son, this day have I begotten thee? And again, I will be to him a Father, and he shall be to me a Son?
Paul is saying that God never said he would be a Father to an angel and yet you have this:
Job 1:6
Now there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before the Lord, and Satan came also among them.
If God never called them son, who is calling them sons of God? Paul said he never said this at ANY TIME to these angels and yet it is said repeatedly in the Bible, why is that. So you are saying that the Quran is saying something false when it says GOD has no son and Paul at least agrees that God has no angel sons even though it is written in the bible that these angels are called sons of God. So I beg you to explain that, did God ever call an angel his son?
Quran in S. 4:157-158:
“And because of their (the Jews) saying: We slew the Messiah, Jesus son of Mary, Allah’s messenger- they slew him not nor crucified him, but it appeared so unto them; and lo! those who disagree concerning it are in doubt thereof; they have no knowledge thereof save pursuit of a conjecture; they slew him not for certain. But Allah took him up unto Himself. Allah was ever Mighty, Wise.” M. M. Pickthall
While you may have something to contribute as far as exposing the lie of the Trinity, if you do so to provide another lie, then what good is that?
Yes what good would that be? but is that true? No, There is no trinity and God does not have any SONS except in a metaphorical way as in their obedience and closeness makes them LIKE sons and Jesus is very near and dear to God
Behold! the angels said: “O Mary! allah giveth thee glad tidings of a Word from Him: his name will be Christ Jesus, the son of Mary, held in honour in this world and the Hereafter and of (the company of) those nearest to allah;
( سورة آل عمران , Aal-e-Imran, Chapter #3, Verse #45)
Can you not see that the one who inspired scripture and the one who inspired the Koran are in opposition?
They are not the same God.
They are not in opposition however certain liberties are taken in the older scriptures that the Quran simply clarifies because you have to understand it is these very misunderstandings that make further misunderstandings Possible. DavidL wouldn’t even have the trinity in his head if he understood that the term “son of God” is a figure of speech and not literal because quite frankly if Jesus is the Literal son of God the trinity is correct
April 5, 2015 at 8:36 am#792751
NickHassan
Participant
Hi BD,
The sons of God are led by the Spirit of God.
There are heavenly sons. Jb 38.7
April 5, 2015 at 8:37 am#792752
DavidL
Participant
t8
You agree with the Catholic Faith as defined by their creed more than you believe the following words:
No – I agree with anyone so far as their confession agrees with the testimony of Scripture – which is why I would accept the statement highlighted from the Catholic creed, but reject your teaching as completely erroneous…

“Now I want you to realize that the head of every man is Christ, and the head of the woman is man, and the head of Christ is God.”
..in this verse you have quoted (as proof that the Father is somehow separate in His Deity from His own Son) lies the answer to your confusion over the trinity, and oneness of the Father with His Son..

Can you understand how husband and wife, still being two, are considered by God as being one..?
Mark 10:7-9 says, “FOR THIS REASON A MAN SHALL LEAVE HIS FATHER AND MOTHER, AND THE TWO SHALL BECOME ONE FLESH; so they are no longer two, but one flesh. What therefore God has joined together, let no man separate.”
Here in marriage, two completely separate individuals who continue to operate in their own unique individual roles, of which one is head over the other – are in God’s sight, considered as ONE… this should at least help you in some degree to understand that the nature of the tri-unity is actually not so strange or unscriptural as you try and make out…

..it should make us realize that when Christ declared, “I and the Father are one,” – He was stating something far more literal and real than what you are here willing to admit… something of which earthly marriage (as a binding and irrevocable covenant declaring our complete and unbroken commitment to unity in love, no matter what)…is somehow just a poor reflection of that perfect oneness that exists within the eternal Godhead… remembering, of course, that we are created in the image of God….”Let Us make man in OUR image…” – in short, the unity of man and woman as one flesh, is a reflection of the unity of God as One.
April 5, 2015 at 8:39 am#792753
NickHassan
Participant
Hi BD,
You apply your own understanding to the sacred words.
It satisfies your mind but is far from a spiritual view.

Trust not in your own understanding
April 5, 2015 at 8:40 am#792754
NickHassan
Participant
psst davidl,
There is no trinity.
Yet you make it your foundation
April 5, 2015 at 8:46 am#792759
bodhitharta
Participant
DavidL
If Jesus and the Father are 1 how is the Holy spirit also one with them unless you are meaning like Adam and Eve the two became one and when they had children they were all still one….is that what you mean? So if Jesus and God are one in the sense that you have said like Husband and wife, the wife wouldn’t be the husband or the Husband the wife, right? So God wouldn’t be Jesus or Jesus wouldn’t be God…do you see it that way. Becoming 1 in unity doesn’t alter the identity or number of individual beings
April 5, 2015 at 8:49 am#792761
bodhitharta
Participant
DavidL
Genesis 11
6 And the Lord said, Behold, the people is one, and they have all one language; and this they begin to do: and now nothing will be restrained from them, which they have imagined to do.
what does this mean to you?
April 5, 2015 at 8:57 am#792762
DavidL
Participant
NickHassan
Jesus was the word in the beginning?
Yet conceived of Mary??
You got it – the Word made flesh…!!
God manifest in human form..!!
This is the testimony of Scripture…that remains incomprehensible without the Spirit..
April 5, 2015 at 9:05 am#792764
NickHassan
Participant
Hi Davidl,
True in part.
God has visited His people.
As with the prophets, in a human vessel.

No trinity theology needs to be added.
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