Home Scripture & Verse Support Verses for the Trinity Doctrine? Page 21

Support Verses for the Trinity Doctrine?

Viewing 20 posts - 401 through 420 (of 699 total)
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  • March 22, 2015 at 7:46 am#791331
    DavidL
    Participant

    NickHassan

    slow down and think first…you’re babbling

     

    first you misquote me saying

    You asked if we could be one with God too.

    No – this is the question I asked…’What other prophet, apostle or saint could ever say a thing like that..!? (I and the Father are one)   …Could you say that..!?

    March 22, 2015 at 8:29 am#791334
    NickHassan
    Participant

    Hi davidl,

    That is the plan of God.

    All the saints will be able to say that when the plan is complete.

    March 22, 2015 at 8:39 am#791347
    NickHassan
    Participant

    Hi davidl,

    God is not a three headed icon to be worshipped from afar.

    He wants men to be reborn into the unity He has with His Son by the Spirit.

     

    March 22, 2015 at 9:05 am#791349
    DavidL
    Participant

    NickHassan

     

    ..so you’re speaking of the future – Jesus spoke of the present…‘I and the Father are one,’ something no other person (no matter how righteous) has ever been able to truthfully say…because no one else (apart from the Holy Spirit) is one with God…

    How did the greatest apostles refer to themselves –  as ‘bondservants’ of Jesus Christ…so how can you just brush these verses aside…John declares He was God, Christ declares He is one with God, Paul states that the Godhead or Deity dwells within Him in bodily form, Thomas calls Him God to His face…yet somehow you claim this is wrong and unscriptural, even idolatry…!?!

    How is the three headed icon you speak of connected to anything I’m saying – surely your understanding is darkened because of teaching you’ve been exposed to in the past (truth mixed with tradition)…so now you throw the baby out with the bathwater..

    March 22, 2015 at 9:44 am#791354
    NickHassan
    Participant

    Hi davidl,

    From Pentecost God has fulfilled this promise joining men to himself and His Father in the One Spirit.

    John made no such declaration.

    Thomas was taught by Jesus in Jn 14

    “”If you had known Me you would have known the Father also;from now on you know Him and have seen Him”

    So when Thomas said in Jn 20

    ” My Lord AND my God” it showed he had understood.

     

    March 22, 2015 at 10:18 am#791370
    DavidL
    Participant

    If you had known Me you would have known the Father

    Yes, I and the Father ARE one…

     

    We are not God – we are not Jesus…we are branches grafted into the Vine – if we TRULY abide in His Word..

    March 22, 2015 at 10:35 am#791375
    NickHassan
    Participant

    Hi davidl,

    Do you not aspire to unity with God and Jesus?

    “..that they may be one as you and I are one..”

    March 22, 2015 at 10:37 am#791376
    NickHassan
    Participant

    Hi davidl,

    Indeed we should become branches of the vine but that is not our natural state-thorn bushes and weeds due for the fire.

    Seek ye FIRST the kingdom of God.

    Then we must abide in the Words of eternal life-no trinity found taught there.

     

    March 22, 2015 at 2:04 pm#791397
    kerwin
    Participant

    Nick,

    Hi davidl,

    From Pentecost God has fulfilled this promise joining men to himself and His Father in the One Spirit.

    John made no such declaration.

    Thomas was taught by Jesus in Jn 14

    “”If you had known Me you would have known the Father also;from now on you know Him and have seen Him”

    So when Thomas said in Jn 20

    ” My Lord AND my God” it showed he had understood.

    That sounds right to my ears.

    March 22, 2015 at 2:46 pm#791400
    kerwin
    Participant

    bodhitarta,

    Ecclesiastes 7:29Authorized (King James) Version (AKJV)

    29 Lo, this only have I found, that God hath made man upright; but they have sought out many inventions.

    This why I said that mankind was created in the image of God and then became corrupted by sin so they no longer bare it. The purpose of the new covenant is to return mankind to that image.

    The teaching that God first created the physical, then those with souls, and last of those that are spiritual is based on the fact that there are three uses of the word translated created in Genesis 1 and these types of the events are first time those type of creations are written in the that chapter. So you are correct that it has a basis in Scripture.

    I claim God has not outer image because he created space and any outer image requires space to exist as that is where it is located. Scripture declares God is invisible and yet even the angels that are often hidden from our sights are not said to be invisible.

    I know that the ones that Scripture explicitly calls angels often have the outer form of human beings. There are some inanimate things also called messengers. There are also living creatures that do not look like humans except perhaps in part and they are never called angels. If God is speaking about making humanity is physical form of the unity then the angels form is the only one spoken of in Scripture that humans look like.

    All my reasoning is based on Scripture though sometimes it has been pointed out to me even though after I look at it looks like it is obvious. I am a human and therefore limited and God reveals what he chooses to whomever he chose to reveal it.

    March 22, 2015 at 3:01 pm#791401
    bodhitharta
    Participant

    @DavidL

    each time you make a claim I give you an example and you turn blind to it: You say things like who would make such a claim as “I and my father are one” God has made a similar claim in the Bible telling Samuel:
    And the LORD told him:

    1 Samuel 8:7 “Listen to all that the people are saying to you;

      it is not you they have rejected, but they have rejected me

    as their king.

    This is God actually and literally saying it. It is the same construction God and Samuel are one, rejecting Samuel is rejecting God according to God and it is the same with Jesus, rejecting Jesus is rejecting God, rejecting Moses is rejecting God. When Moses went to the children of Israel and they asked who sent you MOSES said : I AM that I AM, he didn’t explain that God told him to say it, he didn’t tell them the whole story about how he saw a burning bush, he said it with authority and power from on high and God was with Him.

    I was certainly guided buy the Spirit of God to find that Samuel verse for you because God just put it in my head and I was able to find it easily God wants you to know the facts because even if you do not believe what I am telling you at least I have shown you the scripture itself.

    Luke 10:6 “Whoever listens to you listens to me; whoever rejects you rejects me; but whoever rejects me rejects him who sent me.”

    Jesus and Samuel are speaking from the same Context is this true or false?

    March 22, 2015 at 3:05 pm#791402
    NickHassan
    Participant

    Hi kw

    “This why I said that mankind was created in the image of God and then became corrupted by sin so they no longer bare it.”

    Assumption upon assumption

    March 22, 2015 at 3:06 pm#791403
    NickHassan
    Participant

    Hi KW

     

    “inanimate things also called messengers.”

    dead messengers??

    March 22, 2015 at 3:07 pm#791404
    NickHassan
    Participant

    Hi KW

     

    “Scripture declares God is invisible and yet even the angels that are often hidden from our sights are not said to be invisible.”

    Were the angelic armies initially VISIBLE to Elisha??

    March 22, 2015 at 3:21 pm#791406
    kerwin
    Participant

    Nick,

    The only cases of things called messengers that do not look like men is inanimate objects like a “pillar of fire”, “pillar of cloud’, and perhaps others. Those can be non-living things God chose to use as his messengers and so not party of the unity.

    There are also living creature but they are not called angels though they are part of the unity but they are clearly not a part that God declared he would make man in the outward likeness of. Creation is a team effort though all Scriptures tells us the host of heaven did was to sing and to shout for joy.

    Sometimes I am curious about what bible you read and this is one of those times because you should already be aware that Scripture declares that before Adam was fell from God’s grace he did not sin. I already quoted a Scripture to bodhitarta from Ecclesiastes that tells us humanity was created upright.

    March 22, 2015 at 3:32 pm#791408
    kerwin
    Participant

    Nick,

    2 Kings 6:17 does not explicitly say if Elisha ever had his eyes open to see the angels or just knew they were there because of his faith. It is likely his eyes were open to there existence and so he knew they were there before he asked God to reveal to his servant. This would parallel what happened with Baalam and his as.

    This passage does not say they were invisible but its wording reveals that Elisha’s servant just could not see them though they were hidden within his sight. It calls the sight of them a vision.

    March 22, 2015 at 3:37 pm#791409
    kerwin
    Participant

    Nick,

    Inanimate does not mean dead.

    A cloud and a fire are both inanimate things.

    March 22, 2015 at 3:42 pm#791410
    NickHassan
    Participant

    Hi KW,

    It means lifeless.

    A stone is inanimate

    March 22, 2015 at 3:44 pm#791411
    NickHassan
    Participant

    Hi KW,

    Where does God call inanimate objects His messengers?

    You make it up as you go along it seems.

    March 22, 2015 at 3:46 pm#791412
    NickHassan
    Participant

    Hi KW,

    So Elisha could not see the angels and then he could.

    Rationalisation is a form of deceit I am sure you know

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