Did Jesus Christ exist before his birth on Earth?

It seems that most who call themselves Christian belong to one of two camps. Jesus is either God or a mere created man. This debate has been raging since the days of Athanasius of Alexandria and Arius.

What the does the Bible say? Well it is quite clear on who Jesus is and his origin. Let’s take a look at what is written.

Scripture says the Word became flesh and dwelt among us and when Jesus returns, his name is called ‘The Word of God’. (John 1 & Revelation 19:13)

It says that God created all things through THE WORD and nothing was created without him. (John 1:3)

It says that the universe was created through THE SON and he is before all things. (Colossians 1:15-17)

It says that all things were created through JESUS CHRIST. (Hebrews 2:9)

This is what the Bible says about Jesus Christ, the son of the living God, the one named: ‘The Word of God’ who was with God in the beginning.

He emptied himself, took upon himself our nature, was obedient to his God and our God, died for our sins as it is written, and is now in the glory he had with the Father before the cosmos.

Jesus is not God in the flesh, rather the Word who became flesh and dwelt among us. He was with God in the beginning. He was the first to be with God.

This topic has 25,955 replies, 116 voices, and was last updated 6 days, 18 hours ago by Keith.

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April 25, 2016 at 7:42 pm#812645
Ed J
Participant
Hebrews 2:14-15Authorized (King James) Version (AKJV)
14 Forasmuch then as the children are partakers of flesh and blood, he also himself likewise took part of the same; that through death he might destroy him that had the power of death, that is, the devil; 15 and deliver them who through fear of death were all their lifetime subject to bondage.
Hi Kerwin,
This verse confirms that “the Spirit of Christ” came from eternity to Bethlehem. (ref. Micah 5:2)
_________________
God bless
Ed J
April 25, 2016 at 7:47 pm#812646
Ed J
Participant
It is the unity of the Spirit. “One” means united.
John 17:20-23Authorized (King James) Version (AKJV)
20 Neither pray I for these alone, but for them also which shall believe on me through their word; 21 that they all may be one; as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be one in us: that the world may believe that thou hast sent me. 22 And the glory which thou gavest me I have given them; that they may be one, even as we are one: 23 I in them, and thou in me, that they may be made perfect in one; and that the world may know that thou hast sent me, and hast loved them, as thou hast loved me.
The words ” And the glory which thou gavest me I have given them” is speaking of the Spirit of God.
There is only one Spirit in the unity of the Spirit that is enumerated.
Kerwin, adding your ‘spin’ to the text does not change the text into what you are saying.
April 25, 2016 at 8:01 pm#812649
kerwin
Participant
Ed,
Sorry Kerwin, But the word “Human” is not in the bible. Trying to read
your preconceived ideas into the text will not change what it says.
Are you still going by the letter of the Law?
Man is a synonym of human in the words Paul speaks to Timothy. I am sure you are aware of that so why did you post these words?
- This reply was modified 6 years, 6 months ago by Admin.
April 25, 2016 at 8:32 pm#812651
kerwin
Participant
Ed,
I believe in Scripture: “AKJV Bible”
Obviously not since you misinterpret its words.
Of course I choose to believe that is due to lack of learning rather than lack of stability. (2 Peter 3:16)
Then again you are stumbling on smooth ground so my choice may be in error.
Jesus is right to say “blessed are the meek …” (Matthew 5:5) We would be wise to seek to be meek.
April 25, 2016 at 8:34 pm#812652
Ed J
Participant
Kerwin why do you ignore Scripture?
In this verse Christ tells of his spirit’s origin from eternity past (pre-human):
“And he said unto them, How say they that Christ is David’s son? And David
himself saith in the book of Psalms, The LORD said unto my Lord,
Sit thou on my right hand, Till I make thine enemies thy footstool.
David therefore calleth him Lord, how is he then his son?” (Luke 20:41-44)
Why do you ignore verses such as this one which claims Christ is more than a mere human
April 25, 2016 at 8:40 pm#812653
Ed J
Participant
Ed,
I believe in Scripture: “AKJV Bible”
Obviously not since you misinterpret its words.
Wrong! It is you who misinterprets its words.
Why do you attempt to change this verse which claims Christ is more than a mere human
(Psalms 49:1) Hear this, all ye people; give ear, all ye inhabitants of the world:
“None of them can by any means redeem his brother, nor give to God a ransom for him” (Psalms 49:7)
April 25, 2016 at 8:46 pm#812654
kerwin
Participant
Ed,
Do you believe that all are one in the unity of the Spirit?
Because if you did then you would know my words are not spin.
The unity is God is Jesus through the one Spirit and both are in believers by the same Spirit. They are all one, which is united.
The reverse is also true. Believers are in both God and Jesus through the one Spirit and Jesus is in God by the same Spirit.
John 3:3Authorized (King James) Version (AKJV)
3 Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.
Who is you in this passage?
1. Nicodemus the flesh.
2. Nicodemus the spirit.
3. Another answer
April 25, 2016 at 8:51 pm#812655
kerwin
Participant
Ed,
Jesus asked a question and the Pharisees chose not to answer it but Paul answers it in the first chapter of Romans. Believe what Paul claims or not. That is your free choice.
April 25, 2016 at 8:58 pm#812656
Ed J
Participant
Ed,
Do you believe that all are one in the unity of the Spirit?
Hi Kerwin,
The Spirit of Christ is in unity with the Spirit of God;
when we are born of the Spirit, our spirit too
is in unity with the Spirit of God!
____________________
God bless
Ed J
April 25, 2016 at 9:01 pm#812657
Ed J
Participant
John 3:3Authorized (King James) Version (AKJV)
3 Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.
Who is you in this passage?
Nicodemus the flesh.
Nicodemus the spirit.
Another answer
Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee (Nicodemus),
Except a man (all ye inhabitants of the world) be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.
April 25, 2016 at 9:04 pm#812658
kerwin
Participant
Ed.
Ed,
The reason I cited blessed are the meek is that you are bearing the form of a certain Pharisee that prayed to God and not the form of the publican.
In a conversation there is part A that is doing the talking, party b that is being spoken too, and party c that is being spoken about.
Which party is them?
Here is an example
Revelation 2:2Authorized (King James) Version (AKJV)
2 I know thy works, and thy labour, and thy patience, and how thou canst not bear them which are evil: and thou hast tried them which say they are apostles, and are not, and hast found them liars:
So is them the ones that are told “I know thy works…”?
I believe you will answer no to my secound question and answer part c to my first but refuse to acknowledge them is not the group being spoken to in Psalms 49:1.
That reveals you do not believe the words of the AV of the KJV. It also reveals you are satisfied with your own righteousness.
April 25, 2016 at 9:10 pm#812659
kerwin
Participant
Ed,
The Spirit of Christ is in unity with the Spirit of God;
when we are born of the Spirit, our spirit too
is in unity with the Spirit of God!
I assume the answer is yes, you do believe in the unity of the Spirit.
April 25, 2016 at 9:10 pm#812660
Ed J
Participant
What I don’t believe is your ‘spin’
April 25, 2016 at 9:11 pm#812661
Ed J
Participant
My righteousness comes from God
April 25, 2016 at 9:14 pm#812662
kerwin
Participant
Ed,
Since Nicodemus is a man you are dodging my question instead of answering it.
You also tried to make a point that Jesus is not a man is spite of passages of the writing that call him a man.
Jesus also needed to be born of Spirit.
It is only sinners that need to be born again.
The question was not about Jesus or the inhabitants of the earth but only about Nicodemus. Will you please answer it?
April 25, 2016 at 9:19 pm#812663
Ed J
Participant
(1) It is only sinners that need to be born again.
(2) The question was not about Jesus or the inhabitants of the earth but only about Nicodemus. Will you please answer it?
1) Correct
2) I did Post #812657
April 25, 2016 at 9:22 pm#812664
Ed J
Participant
Nicodemus the spirit.
Nicodemus was not a spirit – so there is NO Nicodemus the spirit in that verse; PERIOD!
April 25, 2016 at 10:01 pm#812667
NickHassan
Participant
Hi Ed,
The verse from Hebrews says nothing about Bethlehem.
It simply repeats the concept of the Word becoming flesh at the Jordan.
April 25, 2016 at 11:36 pm#812668
kerwin
Participant
Ed,
Nicodemus was not a spirit – so there is NO Nicodemus the spirit in that verse; PERIOD!
By those words you deny that a man must be born of Spirit.
For Jesus told Nicodemus ” Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again” (John 3:7) and he was not speaking of the flesh.
Humans are both flesh and spirit for the flesh was made of the ground and the spirit came from God. (Genesis 2:7)
The outward Nicodemus is the flesh and the inward Nicodemus is the spirit. (2 Corinthians 4:16)
You want to be a teacher so you should know these things already.
April 25, 2016 at 11:38 pm#812669
kerwin
Participant
Ed.
Where are the post numbers located?
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