Carmel:  JESUS IS THE FIRSTBORN OF LUCIFER!

IN THE BEGINNING (LUCIFER) WAS “THE WORD”

First you post “Satan’s Dream”, and now this crap?  I am now convinced that the one you say talks to you is Satan, and not Jesus.

Father in heaven, please free Carmel from the hold of the evil one.  Satan has apparently masqueraded as your holy servant Jesus,…

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Carmel: Now read again:

Rev 1:1… The revelation from Jesus Christ, which God gave him…..

In the above PHRASE:

WHICH GOD GAVE HIM means

THE TITLE OF
THE GOD AND FATHER OF OUR LORD JESUS CHRIST,

THE ONLY BEING EMPOWERED BOTH WITH 

ALL GOD’S THINGS AND ALL HUMAN THINGS,

GODMAN! 
GAVE HIM, JESUS CHRIST, ALL AUTHORITIES AND POWERS….. …

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Berean: Mike

I know from the letter to the Colossians that the Son of God IS BEFORE ALL THINGS …. THIS MEANS ETERNITY ….. AND THIS IS ENOUGH FOR ME.

The phrase “before all things” doesn’t mean “eternity”.  Not in Colossians, and not ever.

Berean:  2 Timothy 2:16
And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: GOD (the divine Son of God) WAS MANIFESTED IN THE FLESH, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory.

Let’s let those same 25 TRINITARIAN scholars enlighten us on your verse too…

NET ©  An…[Read more]

Carmel:  Proverbs 8:22 The Lord possessed me in the beginning of his ways,
before he made anything from the beginning.

Your version confirms that Jesus is a possession of his God – as are we all.  So I can live with it.  But if you want to get right on this verse, here’s a little education for you – from 25 TRINITARIAN scholars…

NET © The …[Read more]

Carmel: Mike, Can you see from the above scriptures what Jesus meant?

The Father and the Son never glorify themselves, 

But each other.

I don’t see the Father or the Son posting on this site on your behalf, do you?  And since they aren’t glorifying you, then you glorifying yourself as some “spirit-enlightened” person who has a better un…[Read more]

Gene:  Mike……you mistranslated the text,  it says this…..” whosoever is “born’” of God sins not,  but whosoever is “begotten” of God “keeps” himself,  and the evil one touches him not.

I didn’t translate anything.  I copied and pasted the English Standard Version.  But the point is that all of the words are the same exact Greek word, Gene.  We…[Read more]

Berean: Mike

Michah 5:2 Say

But thou, Bethlehem Ephratah, though thou be little among the thousands of Judah, yet out of thee shall he come forth unto me that is to be ruler in Israel; whose goings forth have been from of old, from everlasting.

Now go look up what the word you show as “everlasting” really means.  I’ll do it for you.  From the 2…[Read more]

Danny: Mike,

You said that Jesus was created.

You are wrong.
Jesus was not created but begotten.

A synonym of “beget” is “procreate”, Danny.  Understand?   By bringing a living being into existence (procreating, begetting, birthing, etc) you are creating a new life that didn’t previously exist.

So if Jesus is begotten, then Jesus is a new cr…[Read more]

Proclaimer:  Yes. In the sense that he has rule over me.

Agreed.

LU:  Danny and Berean,

The three of us are agreeing on both the Father and Son being deity and identified as YHVH, correct?

Berean:  Hi LU

YES!

Uh oh… two in one day?  Yikes.

Berean:  MY FAVORIT TEXTE FOR THE SON AS YHVH IS FROM PSALM 24

Psalm 24:1…Jehovah owns the earth and all it contains, the world and all who live in it.

I can see in…[Read more]

Danny:  Hi LU,

You asked:

Danny and Berean,
The three of us are agreeing on both the Father and Son being deity and identified as YHVH, correct?

I agree.

Wait… did the Kathi Cult finally get a bonafide follower here – after over a decade of changing her doctrine when she was showed the scriptural errors in it?  Wow.

Hey Danny, Gods name is Y…[Read more]

Berean, watch how easily I use the scriptures themselves (or the LACK of scriptures) to address everything you say.

Berean: For you Mike, Christ is an angel, a god…

According to the scriptures themselves, what is an “angel”?  It is a spirit messenger of God.

Rev 1:1… The revelation from Jesus Christ, which God gave him to show his servants…[Read more]

Proclaimer: He was born not created.
If a living thing is born, isn’t it also a new creation that didn’t exist before it was born?  Can you think of an exception?  Now, let’s examine three scriptures…

Col 1:15… He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature.

Is it even remotely possible that this verse means exactly w…[Read more]

LU: I believe the following is correct:

The Son is theos

The Son is god

The Father and the Son are theos

The Father and the Son are god.

The Father is not the Son.

Two persons are theos.

Two persons are god.

There is one god.

Two persons act together as one god.

All scriptural except for the last utterly confusing bolded part.  Paul s…[Read more]

Danny: Jesus and His Father are both deity not just divine.

Agreed.  This is scriptural.  Both Jesus and his Father are gods.  One of them is the Most High God of gods, and the other is one of the gods that the first one is the God of.

Danny:  I believe this is what John 1:1 teaches.
“what God was, the Word was”

Agreed… to an extent.  The Most…[Read more]

Proclaimer:  The word ‘theos’ was applied to judges after all.

The rest of your post to Danny was spot on.  This part is erroneous.  The word “god” in scripture is used of actual gods (spirit sons of the Most High God) and of idols that sometimes represented one of those actual gods, and other times were made by men who for some reason believ…[Read more]

Gene:  we are begotten of God…  according to… 1 John 5:18

Well done, Gene.

1 John 5 American Standard Version
1 Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is begotten of God: and whosoever loveth him that begat loveth him also that is begotten of him.

4 For whosoever is begotten of God overcometh the world

18 We know that whosoever is bego…[Read more]

LU: That which is begotten of the eternal One is part of the family of YHVH and is every bit a YHVH as the eternal One that begat Him.

Would you agree to that?

That which was begotten of Elvis Presley is part of the Presley family and is every bit a Presley as Elvis.  Makes sense?

So now “YHVH” is God’s last name?  How about we try your an…[Read more]

Berean: We still have to agree on what “God in nature” means ….. because if in the end, we do not believe that Christ, the divine and unique SON OF GOD, BEGOTTEN IN ETERNITY, DOES NOT HAVE IN HIMSELF THE ATTRIBUTES OF HIS FATHER: OMNIPOTENCE, OMNIPRESENCE, OMNISCIENCE, HE IS NOT THEN THE OWN SON OF GOD DESCRIBED IN HEBREWS 1: 3
…. Who being TH…

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