Quote (Lightenup @ Mar. 20 2013,21:49)Mike,Origen is making an argument based on the absence of the article to show the second God mentioned is a lessor type. This is what is the failed argument. I agree that the greatness of one of the two gods in 1:1 over the other one cannot be ascertained merely from the definite article “THE”.But do you agree…[Read more]

Quote (Lightenup @ Mar. 20 2013,21:38)So, I learned something about 'the Adam' tonight in my Hebrew class. 'the Adam' refers to a specific person that bears the image of God…in other words 'a specific follower' of God. Without the 'the,' adam refers to the believers in general. The word 'adam' is not a word for unbelieving man in general or a…[Read more]

Quote (kerwin @ Mar. 20 2013,13:36)Mike,Quote What exactly would fall into the class “god”, in your opinion?  Is God's Holy Spirit a god?  Are the spoken words of God “gods”?Or does it seem much more likely that a BEING, who was also in the “god class”, was with “THE god” in the beginning?The last I head elohim can even refer to holy items.   I be…[Read more]

Quote (kerwin @ Mar. 20 2013,06:40)Mike,I got confused.Phew!  I was starting to worry about you for a minute.    I don't think there is any doubt in anyone's mind that the “god” in part b is the Father God.  I mean, who else could it be?Quote (kerwin @ Mar. 20 2013,06:40)I have not looked into the matter but the god in John 1:1 seems to be cle…[Read more]

Quote (abe @ Mar. 19 2013,22:42)Hi Mike,In the beginning was Cain.  And Cain was with THE adam, and Cain was adam.The only way Cain was Adam is past tense.Past? present? Future?Could it be that since mankind itself is called “adam” in Hebrew, the statement could mean that Cain was with THE Adam (the original man), and Cain was also AN adam (a…[Read more]

Quote (abe @ Mar. 19 2013,21:58)Before Adam bore Cain,  Cain was Adam.  Why is this so difficult?Hmmm……………  You may have to explain this to us, Abe.But no matter what it means, it doesn't address my question.  My question is based on Adam and Cain both being alive, and with each other. It does not have to do with BEFORE Cain was bor…[Read more]

Why bother? I don't ever read them anyway.

Quote (Lightenup @ Mar. 18 2013,22:52)I can show you scriptures that speak of YHVH and also scriptures where the exact things are said of Jesus.And I can show you where those things can be, and are, said of others besides Jesus and his God, Jehovah.  But this is not the thread for it.The point of my exercise is that ALL of the things said about…[Read more]

Quote (Lightenup @ Mar. 18 2013,22:46)…but when it is full grown, it is larger than the garden plants and becomes a tree……]/i]Strong's 1096ginomai: to come into being, to happen, to becomeKathi, the Greek word “ginomai” doesn't always refer to “coming into being”. Sometimes it simply refers to “becoming” – as the definition you posted…[Read more]

Quote (abe @ Mar. 19 2013,21:27)Quote (mikeboll64 @ Mar. 19 2013,16:30)In the beginning was Cain.  And Cain was with THE adam, and Cain was adam.I want to know if, in the bolded, supersized part of my post above, “adam” in part c is “THE Adam” from part b.In other words, was Cain THE very Adam he was with?  YES or NO?Hi Mike,Cain was Adam, b…[Read more]

Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Mar. 19 2013,07:50)Mike………You have not given me ONE SCRIPTURE, that SAYS, Jesus preexisted his berth on this earth……….Slow down Gene. You asked for a scripture that says Jesus is a god. I gave you one in my last post, right?I need you to either acknowledge or refute that scripture before I go down this other…[Read more]

Quote (4Thomas @ Mar. 19 2013,19:57)So the Father can't be referred to as the Lord saves or “YHWH saves”?That was a question to you not a statement.  Yeah, I was thinking it must be a question!  NETNotes says:Jesus = “Jehovah is salvation”Joshua or Jehoshua = “Jehovah is salvation”Those names are given to people other than “Jehovah” as a t…[Read more]

Quote (t8 @ Mar. 19 2013,00:44)What I still don't understand is why it slows pages down when you say click Back multiple times because you should be able to click Back say 4 times in a row without waiting for the pages to download each time.Because I don't always KNOW that the page I want to get back to is four clicks away!  Let's say my last…[Read more]

Quote (kerwin @ Mar. 19 2013,06:23)Neither root or foundation were stated to be synonyms of first.  If you desire to conclude they are then find a definition or synonym to make your case.From Dictionary.com:root Definition: base, core Synonyms: basis, cause, foundation, origin, seed, starting pointAre those close enough to stop the hoop jumping,…[Read more]

Jack,If I take the time to scripturally correct some of the misunderstandings in your last post, will you read it and respond?I ask because I refuted the information you recently posted on HN, and you never responded.If you will read and learn, I will spend my time on this.  If not, then why should I bother?

Quote (4Thomas @ Mar. 19 2013,18:19)The Father does not seek to be called his name which is the name above all other names “Jehovah Saves” (YHWH saves) instead he wants to be know as Father.The name “YHWH saves” is “Joshua” in Hebrew, “Iesous” in Greek, and “Jesus” in English.The Father isn't named “Joshua”, Daniel.  His name is YHWH.  In E…[Read more]

Kerwin,9th post on page 4, please.

Quote (2besee @ Mar. 19 2013,16:16)He is not a man any longer and could rightly be called GOD (though not THE God), and Lord, so yes I do understand…………See 2B?  This is why I call you out whenever you post Isaiah 44, and try to imply that there LITERALLY exists only ONE god.  You KNOW that isn't the scriptural fact of the matter because, l…[Read more]

Quote (t8 @ Mar. 19 2013,15:56)Did. Do. Will do in the future. (Thanks for the Irenaeus quote. I will break that one down like I did the Origen quote you posted……… when I get the time. )

Quote (kerwin @ Mar. 19 2013,07:20)Quote (mikeboll64 @ Mar. 19 2013,08:44)(2)  He uses the article, when the name of theos refers to the uncreated cause of all things, and omits it when the Word is named theos. 2)  This part tells me that Origen believes “THE theos” of part b is the “uncreated cause of all things”, while “the Word” is NOT. Do y…[Read more]