Quote (shimmer @ Nov. 12 2010,18:41)JA, I thought you believed Jesus pre-existed in spirit too,Whats the actual debate here, Between you both ? And Who believes what exactly?I believe what you believe Shimmer.  We both believe that God brought Jesus forth as the “first of His works”. (Proverbs 8:22)Then God created everything else – including all…[Read more]

Quote (shimmer @ Nov. 12 2010,17:21)Thanks Terrarica I see that. But Mike, what i'm saying here is what I believed before coming on this forum. I got put off and confused by some things here. But it's less confusing to believe truth as was known.You must be strong in your faith and your beliefs Shimmer. No one “taught” me about scriptures. I…[Read more]

For Shimmer and JA, who both seem a little lost:JA:Quote Mike, since when do Angels need 'boundaries' for their Spirit.1 Cor 1538 But God gives it a body as he has determined, and to each kind of seed he gives its own body. 39 Not all flesh is the same: People have one kind of flesh, animals have another, birds another and fish another. 40 There…[Read more]

Quote (942767 @ Nov. 12 2010,13:04)Hi Mike:I believe that the scripture states that “his name” shall be called “mighty God” and not, he shall be called “mighty God”.  There is a difference.The scriptures are clear that there is “Only One God”.Love in Christ,MartyHi Marty,And how does that make a difference to what was said?  He will be called m…[Read more]

Quote (mikeangel @ Nov. 12 2010,13:43)Jesus is Lord. The Lord is God. I will tell him that to his face and he will hug me and introduce me to his father, because he said that those who honor him honor his Father too. I can't wait.Hi Mark,You'll probably hear this from him instead:21 “Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingd…[Read more]

You are exactly correct Pierre. I had overlooked the actual wording in my excitement that Shimmer understands!Thank you my scripturally proficient brother.mike

Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Nov. 11 2010,14:43)Example say you say i will go get the ball (you uttered those word ) but your Power went and got the Ball , can't you see they were connected.What if I said I would go get the ball, but didn't? What if I stayed my fat butt on the couch instead of doing what my words said?Am I STILL the same as my words in…[Read more]

Quote (942767 @ Nov. 12 2010,12:07)Hi Shimmer:The author of the gospel of John could of said: these things are witten that you might believe that Jesus is God, but he did not, he said: “that your might be believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God”.Love in Christ,MartyHi Shimmer and Marty,We all know “god” was a common word used to denote a…[Read more]

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Nov. 12 2010,05:47)What I have found is during this time the Romans were Polytheist and worshipped many gods, and in fact they worshipped Caesar as a god. So it is not uncommon that they would be worshipping Jesus as a “King” in a mocking way for they worshipped their King.Hi Keith,You kind of skimmed over the fact tha…[Read more]

Quote (terraricca @ Nov. 12 2010,11:27)Mike and JAi be looking and fallow your debate and not interfere in any way, until any of you ask;PierreThank you Pierre. I guess I should have asked if you were willing instead of just assuming you would be! peace and love,mike

Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Nov. 12 2010,11:22)I see what you are driving at now and will try not to even bother posting to this (PRESUPPOSES POSITION) THREAD.Thank you.

Quote (shimmer @ Nov. 12 2010,10:58)Quote (mikeboll64 @ Nov. 12 2010,12:32)Quote (shimmer @ Nov. 12 2010,10:12)That could mean, that through the whole Jesus being born here, and Jesus overcoming, and Jesus being risen from the dead, giving a way to all who follow Him, then yes, of course, through Jesus through whom are all things, and through whom…[Read more]

Quote (shimmer @ Nov. 12 2010,10:38)Quote (mikeboll64 @ Nov. 12 2010,12:35)No Shimmer.JA believes Jesus was awarded the title of “only begotten Son of God” as some sort of status symbol he earned.  He does not believe Jesus already WAS the only begotten Son of God who was sent down from heaven, dwelled as flesh for awhile, and then died and was…[Read more]

Gene,This is NOT a pre-existence thread.  I've asked you to refrain from turning it into one.Gene:Quote Mike………Why do you desire Jesus be so different then us what is you reasoning for that. Could you not identify better with him as a pure fellow human being who overcame his very own human nature and conquered sin by the hand of God just as…[Read more]

Quote (shimmer @ Nov. 12 2010,10:36)There is no scripture that says that. But it has to be something which cant happen. You need a body to pro-create something similar. God doesnt have a body. God is spirit, thats scriptural. Without a body, a spirit cant do things like pro-create, a spirit has no need to eat, to go toilet, etc, only a flesh body…[Read more]

Quote (shimmer @ Nov. 12 2010,10:17)Quote (mikeboll64 @ Nov. 12 2010,12:06)Quote (shimmer @ Nov. 12 2010,10:03)Terrarica, correct, begotten in spirit when created before the earth, begotten again in the womb, and begotten again when risen up from the dead, each one being different,Shimmer!  Why did you leave the “begotten in spirit when created…[Read more]

Quote (shimmer @ Nov. 12 2010,10:12)That could mean, that through the whole Jesus being born here, and Jesus overcoming, and Jesus being risen from the dead, giving a way to all who follow Him, then yes, of course, through Jesus through whom are all things, and through whom we exist, and continue to exist.But then you would have to have that same…[Read more]

Quote (kerwin @ Nov. 10 2010,15:12)It is through Jesus’ death and resurrection we can become rich and so Jesus was rich in being a living human being who owed death nothing as he did not sin.Okay Kerwin,If that's how you understand Christ being rich, the how did he become poor for us?  Did he cease to be one without sin?  Does he now owe death som…[Read more]

Quote (shimmer @ Nov. 12 2010,10:03)Terrarica, correct, begotten in spirit when created before the earth, begotten again in the womb, and begotten again when risen up from the dead, each one being different,Shimmer! Why did you leave the “begotten in spirit when created before the earth” out in your posts to me?You have just stated EXACTLY what I…[Read more]

Quote (shimmer @ Nov. 12 2010,09:53)Simply because God creates. God couldnt procreate because god is spirit.Jesus was begotten when concieved of in the womb of Mary, this I believe, Gods firstbegotten..firstborn. Jesus was also again begotten from the dead. So firstborn from the dead.Shimmer:Quote Simply because God creates. God couldnt procreate…[Read more]