Many besides WJ would agree with his words:“. . . Matthew 28:19 is unambiguous evidence that the early Apostles and Church Fathers believed in a Trinity.”I don't think it is. It is proof that they believed in “the Father” and the “Son” and the “holy spirit.” The fact that 3 are listed together does no equal “unambiguous evidence” for a trinity.1…[Read more]

There are many threads on the holy spirit. I really wanted this thread to be about Matthew 28:19 and to discuss whether this is “proof” of a trinity.

Quote hey david!what do you think about the Holy Spirit point i mentoined?about God being all in all.SF, I can't seem to find exactly what you are talking about. Could you quote it or point me to the page?

If there is no free will, then do you believe God will punish some for things that they had no choice?If I had a son and his mom ordered him to do something, would it make sense for me to punish him for obeying?If one does not have free will, then they are just obeying what is destined to be. How can a loving Father punish a child for something…[Read more]

Quote (t8 @ May 22 2010,16:17)Quote (david @ May 22 2010,13:27)Quote arnt they both moderators?T8 (aka, "heaven") runs this joint.He has allowed Nick (who generally believes the same things as T8) to moderate.  Nick is on here a lot more, but T8 is on here a lot more regularly, steady.)They are both moderators.T8 and Nick differ on certain…[Read more]

Quote (mikeboll64 @ May 22 2010,13:30)Quote (david @ May 22 2010,13:11)Remember your 50+ scholars that wrote the CEV?  Their footnote at Judges 13:22, where they put the word “angel”,  says,angel:The Hebrew text has “god”, which can be used of God or of other supernatural beings.–Mike.WJ, DO NOT RESPOND TO THIS POST.  (Reverse psychology.)WJ, I…[Read more]

Quote but it is (INSIDE) of you”.Gene, pretty much all Bibles say “in your midst” or “among you” and the 2 that don't, have those phrases in the footnotes/margin as alternate translations.Gene, how can you base anything on something that is basically a wrong translation? Every other translation, and even the footnotes/marginal references agree…[Read more]

Quote (david @ May 22 2010,12:39)But on being asked by the Pharisees when the kingdom of God was coming, he answered them . . .A question was asked by the Pharisees.  Jesus “answered THEM” saying:“The kingdom of God is in your midst.” (New World Translation)“For behold, the kingdom of God is in your midst.”  (NASB)“Because God's kingdom is alread…[Read more]

Gene, we are not talking about God influencing (“ruling” as you say) a person's life. We are talking about God's kingdom, the kingdom that we are told at Daniel 2:44 is going to crush and destroy all other governments. I know that deep down you can see the difference between the two, but you continue to not even acknowledge such scriptures. I…[Read more]

Quote your last poitn about blasphemy.answer is neither. Because the jews wanted to kill him because he put himself equal to God. so… idk. Im not going to sepeculate any other point. im going to stick to scripture.Sticking to scripture, let's look at one other scripture first, where we find the idea of Jesus being equal to God. It is a…[Read more]

Hi SimplyForgivenYour first question:Quote Question to all of those who are anti-trine… idk how to spell it…I would really like to understand two things?Of two scriptures, and i hope that ya dont take it as myself being agressive, or antagonizing ya.I really would like to know your interpretation of two scriptures. and compare with others if…[Read more]

But when all things will have been subjected to him, then the Son himself will also subject himself to the One who subjected all things to him, that God may be all things to everyone.in turn YOU belong to Christ; Christ, in turn, belongs to God.–1 CorNext, the end, when he hands over the kingdom to his God and Father, when he has brought to…[Read more]

Quote arnt they both moderators?T8 (aka, "heaven") runs this joint.He has allowed Nick (who generally believes the same things as T8) to moderate. Nick is on here a lot more, but T8 is on here a lot more regularly, steady.)They are both moderators.T8 and Nick differ on certain subjects:T8 believes that Jesus is a malakh (angel/messenger) Nick…[Read more]

I have never logged out. If some day I do not come back, I would like you all to consider it a conspiracy and for you to believe that I have somehow been locked out.

WHY DO PEOPLE KEEP MENTIONing JOHN 10:30? Later in John, Jesus says that he hopes his disciples will be “one” “just as” he and the Father are one.JOHN 17:20 “I make request, not concerning these only, but also concerning those putting faith in me through their word; 21 in order that they may all be one, just as you, Father, are in union with me…[Read more]

Remember your 50+ scholars that wrote the CEV? Their footnote at Judges 13:22, where they put the word “angel”, says,angel:The Hebrew text has “god”, which can be used of God or of other supernatural beings.–Mike.WJ, DO NOT RESPOND TO THIS POST. (Reverse psychology.)

No, I can't do it.

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ May 21 2010,07:41)Quote (david @ May 20 2010,00:42)“How does a non person “testify” of someone?”–thinkerAre “The Blood” and “The Water” persons?  Yet, they are said to testify or to bear witness.  And they are in agreement.  Are they persons Thinker?  What do you think?  Is your logic sound?  Do you use perso…[Read more]

Simply Forgiven, to be clear, I do not think the blood or water are literal people. I was pointing out that personification exists in the Bible. And you can even find it existing with other trinity's: Blood, water, holy spirit. And you can even find that it says these things are “testifying” or bearing witness. It's called personification.I…[Read more]

Quote There is indeed coming a “Physical” Kingdom of GOD on this earth but it will be the “SPIRITUAL” Childern of GOD ruling it, the rest are just living in it for a time.Gene, you have ignored these scriptures countless times.  REVELATION 1:6“and he made us to be a kingdom, priests to his God and Father—yes, to him be the glory and the might fore…[Read more]