Hello, Gene,

OK, I her what you re saying.  However, it do not think this  is an at all an curate  account of Trinitarianism.   Ttrinitarianism   is arguing the three are actually one God.  Granted, some of  the formulations may not bring  this off well at all.  However, affirming one God is the basic intent of Trinitarian thinking. That…[Read more]

I hear you, Gene.  However, it was never the intention of Trinitarian belief to affirm anything but strict monotheism. Indeed, that is the express purpose of all Trinitarian formulations. As I have pointed out several times in other posts here, the Bible is in fact ambiguous on the Trinity. I think I just addressed why, in  another post here I ju…[Read more]

Hello, Andrew,

I am inclined to agree with you.  Many people mistakenly think that Christianity is a monolithic religion, just one way.  Truth is, Christianity has always been a rick plurality of divergent POV’s which often conflict. Many people, however, find such diversity to be quite unnerving.  Today, psychiatry recognized “spiritual co…[Read more]

Hello, Andrew,

No, I never ate hoghead cheese.  Actually, truth is, I chose the nym “Hoghead” because   I’m one of the very few lucky train buffs who gets to run a real, historic steam locomotive. That’s where I was all day today, firing our engine on its special Father’s Day run. “Hoghead” is old-fashioned railway slang for engineer. Ac…[Read more]

Actually, the real problem here is how to use commas.  Going on strict usage, the KJV puts a comma between Lord and king.  That is because the translators do not want them considered equivalent, i.e., that the Lord is also the king. Today, the use of commas has somewhat changed.  For example, it’s now OK to write  a sentence  such as, ” I cond…[Read more]

No, I most certainly do not think so.  What he was blasting them for was being a bunch of legalists where law mattered more than love, where principles mattered more than persons.

Hello, Marty,

I agree with traditional Trinitarian thinking which does argue Jn. 1 is affirming the  Deity of Christ.  “And the Word was God…”   I think that makes it pretty clear the passage is saying Christ is in fact God.    It doesn’t say “in the form of God” or anything like that.  Also, as I have said before, I don’t understand how some…[Read more]

Look, Kerwin.  I enjoy discussions and debates, but they have to be respectful. I don’t put up with any flaming. When you sounded off above, saying that I embraced foolishness and told untruths, you are unduly attacking my character, which I do not appreciate.  If you want to disagree with me, fine, but it’s your responsibility to be respectful. I…[Read more]

Where do you see Scripture affirming that the worshipped David as God?  I Chron. 29:20 onwards?  if say, when it says they “prostrated themselves before the Lord and the king,” it simply means they bowed down before King David  and also God.  “The Lord and the king” here is referring to God and David; it is not saying they are one and the same…[Read more]

Hello, t8.

The truth of the matter is that there are around 100 major contradictions in Scripture.  These cannot be easily explained away simply looking at clearer passages.  For example, 2 Sam. 21:19, in Hebrew, says that Elhanan killed Goliath of Gath.  If you Bible  says he killed the “brother of” Goliath, that is not an accurate tra…[Read more]

Hi, Nick,

I don’t think it is wrong to focus on the flesh.  The Bible affirms the innate goodness of teh temporal-material world. Unfortunately, Christianity too strongly identified with Hellenic metaphysical systems were the temporal-material order is seen as a inherently, a big illusion. Sin isn’t flesh, sin is insensitivity.

I like to think of the universe as the body of God.  God is omnipresent throughout creation, just as I am omnipresent throughout my whole body. I view Gpod as eternally creative, so I don’t think there was some sort of timeless, spaceless before this universe  into being.  I think there was another, different one, and so on, ad infinitum into th…[Read more]

Sorry, Kirwin, but still puzzled here.  I defiantly did not say Scripture portrayed David as a god. As to my intent, I have rejected the classical model of God, in favor of a neo-classical one. I believe that dropping Hellenic substance metaphysics, specifically substance metaphysics, and affirming God is relational helps make better sense of teh Trinity.

Sorry, Kerwin, but I don’t think that is going to fly. Jhn Definitely affirms the Deity of Christ and also strongly implies that of the Spirit as well.

Hello, Gene,

OK, I see now what you are asking about. What you are addressing is a major ambiguity in Scripture about teh Trinity.  On one hand, certain passages, such as the prologue to Jn., do identify Christ with God.  On the other, there are passages such as you just cited, which make it appear somehow only the Father is God and that Jesus i…[Read more]

Yes, I would agree with that about Philo. I’m just stressing that he definitely has gnostic tendencies.  Yes, definitely gnostic teachings were and  are present in the church.  Those are to be found in the static, world-negating God of classical theism.

Sorry, Kerwin, but your above post gets the big “Huh?” from me.  I’m not sure what your point is here.  I thought I made it plain the OT did not claim they worshipped David as a second God.

Hello, Kirwin,

It is true that the Council of Nicaea did not go smoothly.  Lots of door slamming, yelling, and   bitter arguments.  Constantine called it an “unprofitable question,” to begin with. He was largely interested in keeping order.  Many scholars have good reason to wonder if he was really all that It is also true that there really was…[Read more]

Again, I wondering what “older tradition” you have in mind here.  As I said, there as a strong Christian gnostic movmenet, which had a kind of totem-pole of greater and lesser gods.  An inferior God had created the world.  Christ and the Spirit were lesser divine beings or gods.  The gnostics also had a completely different set of gospels from the…[Read more]

Well, Kirwin, I am not just appealing to tradition to support the  Trinity.  As I already said, there is biblical support for it. As I said, I am not sure what “older tradition” you are appealing to. The certainly was  a strong Christian gnostic movement.  Is that what you mean?