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[Spock]

What a sick belief system wherein a Satan God conspires to trick and fool at every turn.

[Spock]

Hearsay is a false legalistic construct created by the institutional church who also concocted the theory of scriptural inerrancy. Under such a stunting regime, any additional revelation will always be viewed as a threat to the old petrified worldview.

Jesus, who came down from heaven, was a miraculous person who lived a God revealing life, voluntarily laid down his human form and resurrected it again. He then returned to his rightful place in heaven only now with all power and authority in heaven and on earth as Lord and God of this world. These facts of Jesus’ life are only dimmed by the stubbornness of the old ways of thinking that developed among the Jews concerning an inelastic monotheism.

 

The Trinity ideas that developed within Christian theology did so in response to the facts of the life of Christ in addition to his teaching.

• This reply was modified 6 years, 6 months ago by Admin.

[Spock]

So silly, such an insult the work of Jesus!

[Spock]

The 3 Magi came from where? They knew what? They were looking for whom?

[Spock]

You can believe what you want about the Bible, but the prophecies have and will happen and we will all be judged by God at the end of our lives whether we like it or not.

 

I agree with that, God knows what’s in my heart right now, I do not fear being judged by God in the way that you desire him to judge me. Many of the Bible books don’t cite authors and make no claims of inerrancy, that teaching came form the church, it is the foundation of their brutal authority over the ages and is the foundation of believers today who attempt to control others.

This forum has 5 or 6 regular posters and yet they sincerely disagree on what the bible actually says in fundamental ways. Therefore I will be “judged” no differently than you. I am completely ready to stand before my creator in defense of why I do NOT believe the exaggerated history of the people of killed Jesus nor the portrayal of God therein as an inconsistent, sadistic monster God who led the Hebrew people into barbaric atrocities! That God concept bears no resemblance to the God revealed in the life of Jesus.

[Spock]

Christianity itself drains many an ancient Pagan swamp in its formation, the atonement doctrine, blood drinking, flesh eating, rituals, saints, relics, incantations etc.

[Spock]

I believe that the “mark of the beast” that John saw in his vision was the process of salvaged souls progressing through the mansion worlds wherein the emotional mark of mans evolutionary, animal inheritance is being removed. In short, we continue to mature in spirit.

[Spock]

When an emerging monotheism (the oneness of unified deity among diverse divine personalities) it is difficult for the plural elements of a triune deity to compete as a concept among so many legitimately false God concepts of the surrounding tribes. Hence the Lord God (I AM) becomes one even though he is plural in manifestation.

It was frankly after Jesus returned to heaven that disciples began to contemplate the consequences to the conceptualization of deity in light of the revelation of his Son to mankind on earth.

Opponents of the eternal personage and office of the Son of God, encounter inconsistency when the result of their disbelief installs a temporary man-God in the place of the creator Son (an existential personification of the Father) who is the way, who has always been the way.

[Spock]

* The Dead Sea scrolls were produced after the OT books were written or rewritten and redacted in Babylon. They just verify what was already written and became the scripture when the Israelites returned to Babylon.

 

* The Hebrew alphabet dates to about 900 BC, long after Moses would have lived. Moses could well have had writers writing in another form,  in fact I’m sure he did, it’s just that he wasn’t writing in Hebrew.

 

* I loosely believe elements of the OT story, myths are often grounded in truth.

[Spock]

Kerwin,

 

It is where you choose to put your faith that determines what you choose to believe.

I’m putting my faith in God, I take the writings of the people who killed Jesus with a grain of salt! Those who wrote about Jesus I hold in just a little higher regard. Those words purported to be the words of Jesus himself, I hold in the highest regard to the extent that I think hey were accurately restated.

Today I could write a spectacular, exaggerated history of my Scottish heritage and culture. I could simply include the writings of the prophets of old  (even though my ancestors treated them badly at the time they lived when they railed against the religious establishment, would-be  authors such as myself). 500 years from now someone might discover my dubious biography and because of the associated truths of the prophets therein, claim the entire work must be “the Word of God.”

[Spock]

Spock, I am taking ‘live long and prosper’ is not your tag line.

To deny the great flood didn’t happen is foolish, it is well documented through ancient cultures & archeology that a great flood of some kind did occur. The earth is organic of course there will be change.

 

Princess,

 

Science only speeds up the mortality of false Gods and the association of superstitious beliefs. The true God will actually emerge as religious thought continues to evolve.

Of coarse many ancient cultures have flood stories, there have been (and continue to be) many great floods. If we were living in 5,000 BC and the recent tsunami of Japan occurred, the Japanese people might understandably think their Gods were unhappy with them, they would incorporate that into their historic/religious world view. The ancients thought EVERYTHING was caused by God.

The YEC’s, who have made the writings of holy men into a “graven image”, would have us all believe that every species of plant, animal and near human that we have discovered in the archeological record, ALL lived together at the same time.

Reasonable people can see in the layers of earths history that this 4+ billion year old planet has been host to many epochs of evolutionary life, or if you like, different groups of life lived at different times and those things don’t live now.

[Spock]

To be sure the Bible has been changed many times, Babylon is where and when the OT books converted ordinary secular history into a miraculous fiction. And there were also many claims of Messiahs before and after Jesus. Some of the more central events in the life of Jesus are completely foreign  to Judaism and the OT scriptures.

But still, Jesus resurrected himself from the dead Just as he said he would, his apostles were just as surprised as anyone. He then claimed to have all power and authority in heaven and on earth. One may not believe he is God, but the facts are what they are.

 

[Spock]

Spock,

There is evidence for rapid evolution.

Article about rapid evolution in a particular species.

In recent years, biologists have increasingly recognized that evolutionary change can occur rapidly when natural selection is strong

You should not scoff at those things you do not understand.

If you wish to discuss evolution rationally then I can go on.

 

How can someone have a rational conversation about evolution with a man who believes that all life as we know it came from a boat piloted by a 500 year old man???? On an earth with hundreds of millions of years of life layered in the archeological record????

A rational person would not believe in such an obviously laughable story if it was recently discovered outside of the Bible. But because religion has manipulated your sensibilities by convincing you that God wrote the Bible, then if it said the moon was made of cheese you would go find me and article written by fellow crack pots that explain how God got all that cheese into the moon.

The OT is an exaggerated fiction written by the priestly Hebrew government in Babylon  intended to buttress the flagging faith  of the scattered Israelites. It bolsters the tradition of a fictional miraculous past of the Jews which was effective in holding them together. [Today those same people are still held together waiting for an ill-conceived, material Messiah who will never come. They used their supposedly inspired scripture to reject the true Son of the promise when he did come]

People of common sense have become liberated from the fear of your inconsistent, genocidal fire breathing God behind the curtain of OZ.

[Spock]

Did you say anything that is relevant to this thread?

 

Yes, they were discussing the 2 different, overlapping flood stories about Noah. My contribution was how believers in Noah’s absurd flood story must by default believe in a form of rapid re-evolution mutation or some such ridiculousness after all the animals and humans left the ark and repopulated the earth.

[Spock]

We put our trust in scripture. Not all do that of course.

 

You put your trust in the writings of the Hebrew government who rejected and killed Jesus.

[Spock]

Which evolution? The rapid regeneration of life after it got off of Noahs boat, an event that NO other people on earth trace their ancestry to except the Jews? Or ancient life found in the archeological record on this 4.8 billion year old planet that completely contradicts the God of the OT created in mans own image?

[Spock]

Then not only would we have a God with no foresight to begin with, he repeated the same mistake because man didn’t change at all! After God drown everyone on the earth who was not righteous (including infants and pregnant mothers) with the exception of 480 year old ancestor of the Jews, this only righteous man in the world ended up drunk and passed out naked in his tent!

Anyone outside of the authoritarian indoctrination can clearly see that the flood story is not only impossible, it’s a creation of man written for the child like mind of the audience during ancient times, before science or common sense was invented.

[Spock]

Noah’s flood story was an exaggerated adaptation of a smaller flood story on the part of the priestly Hebrew redactors in Babylon when they produced the OT books, using older books that they redacted and edited.  In attempting to trace their blood lines back to a much older Adam and Eve, the Hebrew priest gave up and decided to “drown the whole world in it’s own wickedness” in order to fill in the gap of the story. One can see that the flood story is an interruption inside a genealogical account.

* The Hebrew government that produced the OT books made no claim of writing by divine inspiration, that idea was a creation of later priestly ruling class to establish authority and a religious system of Justice. Geneses does NOT claim to be produced by a God!

* There is no secular history of the Jews unlike other cultures because after converting their relatively ordinary secular history into a miraculous fiction, they destroyed their history books. Or if it is to harsh to conceive that the same people who rejected and killed Christ may have fudged their history while in captivity based on their self proclaimed “chosen people arrogance” then by chance their scripture survived but the history books mentioned within them did not survive.

* Judaism is itself an evolved religion, but there is no scripture that would presumably predate Moses the reformer, only fragments of previous religious practice and beliefs.

* It only requires just a little common sense to realize that the flood story is a fiction. It is truly maddening that grown adults buy into that crap as if it’ really happened doing great damage to people who might otherwise give the gospel of Jesus the Christ a fair hearing!

* God never has nor will he ever regret anything that he has done, is doing or will ever do. That whole concept is a human likeness, not a God likeness.

[Spock]

We probably still disagree on when the Son became a personality reality, his function and office.   Some say he became the Word at birth, some say it was at his baptism and anointing, Christian Trinitarians would say he is an eternal part of the Trinity (the second person of deity).  I believe that he is a Son of the Trinity, Father and creator of our local universe.

 

 

[Spock]

Makes sense to me, the Father delegates creative powers and authority in his  Son who is the embodiment of the Father as the Word.  To see the Son is to see the Father.

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