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There are two who are our creator and we are to fear them both. They act as one.
Person A and B are not the same person. Peter has already shown you that. Your argument is with Peter, not with me.
Psalm 2:12
Do homage to the Son, that He not become angry, and you perish in the way, For His wrath may soon be kindled. How blessed are all who take refuge in Him!Quote (Lightenup @ Nov. 20 2013,03:17) There are two who are our creator and we are to fear them both. They act as one. Person A and B are not the same person. Peter has already shown you that. Your argument is with Peter, not with me.
Psalm 2:12
Do homage to the Son, that He not become angry, and you perish in the way, For His wrath may soon be kindled. How blessed are all who take refuge in Him!
kathyPs 2:10 Therefore, you kings, be wise;
be warned, you rulers of the earth.
Ps 2:11 Serve the LORD with fear
and rejoice with trembling.
Ps 2:12 Kiss the Son, lest he be angry
and you be destroyed in your way,
for his wrath can flare up in a moment.
Blessed are all who take refuge in him.yes I agree with this ;
but here is 1Peter ;
1Pe 2:7 Now to you who believe, this stone is precious. But to those who do not believe,
“The stone the builders rejected
has become the capstone,’”
1Pe 2:8 and,
“A stone that causes men to stumble
and a rock that makes them fall.”They stumble because they disobey the message—which is also what they were destined for.
1Pe 2:9 But you are a chosen people, a royal priesthood, a holy nation, a people belonging to God, that you may declare the praises of him who called you out of darkness into his wonderful light.show me in those scriptures that there are two persons ? sins you tell me that my quarrel is with 1 Peter;
Pierre,
Your quarrel is with Peter as he identified Jesus as the Stone who Jehovah says is Jehovah of hosts from Isaiah 8. In Isaiah 8, Jehovah of hosts is the Stone that Jehovah is speaking about. You have to look at both passages (Isaiah 8 and 1 Peter 2) to see that there are two persons…one as the speaker (Jehovah) and one as the stone (Jesus/Jehovah of hosts). That's two persons.Quote (Lightenup @ Nov. 24 2013,08:08) Pierre,
Your quarrel is with Peter as he identified Jesus as the Stone who Jehovah says is Jehovah of hosts from Isaiah 8. In Isaiah 8, Jehovah of hosts is the Stone that Jehovah is speaking about. You have to look at both passages (Isaiah 8 and 1 Peter 2) to see that there are two persons…one as the speaker (Jehovah) and one as the stone (Jesus/Jehovah of hosts). That's two persons.
Kathyif you cannot see it ,it is because of me,
i have no quarrel with any scripture ,
and certainly not with Peter
Pierre,
Then you agree that Jesus is the one that Jehovah speaks about as 'Jehovah of hosts' mentioned in Isaiah 8?
11For Jehovah spake thus to me with a strong hand, and instructed me not to walk in the way of this people, saying,
12Say ye not, A conspiracy, concerning all whereof this people shall say, A conspiracy; neither fear ye their fear, nor be in dread thereof .
13Jehovah of hosts, him shall ye sanctify; and let him be your fear, and let him be your dread.
14And he shall be for a sanctuary; but for a stone of stumbling and for a rock of offence to both the houses of Israel, for a gin and for a snare to the inhabitants of Jerusalem.
15And many shall stumble thereon, and fall, and be broken, and be snared, and be taken.
Quote (Lightenup @ Oct. 21 2013,09:34) Quote (terraricca @ Oct. 20 2013,16:42) Kathi Quote I voted yes because we are to test all things according to the Word of God which God has had certain men write down as inspired by the Holy Spirit. but learning another language would not help you to be more righteous,more truthful,have more love for God and his son, or be more receptif toward his message or obey his will ,would it
i do not think so ,education does not make your heart a truthful one
I disagree Pierre. I definitely think learning the original language that God inspired the writers to write in would help me to know much more about the fullness of God and the love and will of the Father and Son, and cause me to be reproofed if need be or trained in righteousness and in many ways. Understanding the original written word has great value to add depth to our knowledge, understanding and appreciation of our Lord and God.Joshua 1
8Keep this Book of the Law always on your lips; meditate on it day and night, so that you may be careful to do everything written in it. Then you will be prosperous and successful.Pierre, I believe that learning the original language would certainly be helpful to understanding the fullness of scripture. Of course the Holy Spirit reveals things through the scriptures which will line up with what is written. We have to do our part in learning God's word. I know you don't trust the translations at times but without knowing the original language, your defense is not as credible as if you actually knew the original language.
If your wife's native and only language was different from yours, don't you think that you would better understand what she was saying if you studied her native language with all its grammar tendencies and nuances? If not, you would have to get everything translated and depend on the integrity of the translator.
Kathyyou are wrong ;you see my wife and I talk to each other about the meanings of certain expressions that I have in my language but in hers they have a similar expression but not with the same words ,so learning the language will not help me into translated correctly ,unless I am familiar with the common expression of the people using that language ,a thing that can not be done when those people and language are gone and no longer exist ,
culture is not fund in dictionary
Quote (Lightenup @ Nov. 24 2013,13:55) Pierre, Then you agree that Jesus is the one that Jehovah speaks about as 'Jehovah of hosts' mentioned in Isaiah 8?
11For Jehovah spake thus to me with a strong hand, and instructed me not to walk in the way of this people, saying,
12Say ye not, A conspiracy, concerning all whereof this people shall say, A conspiracy; neither fear ye their fear, nor be in dread thereof .
13Jehovah of hosts, him shall ye sanctify; and let him be your fear, and let him be your dread.
14And he shall be for a sanctuary; but for a stone of stumbling and for a rock of offence to both the houses of Israel, for a gin and for a snare to the inhabitants of Jerusalem.
15And many shall stumble thereon, and fall, and be broken, and be snared, and be taken.
Bump for Pierre. Please address this.Quote (Lightenup @ Nov. 25 2013,01:54) Quote (Lightenup @ Nov. 24 2013,13:55) Pierre, Then you agree that Jesus is the one that Jehovah speaks about as 'Jehovah of hosts' mentioned in Isaiah 8?
11For Jehovah spake thus to me with a strong hand, and instructed me not to walk in the way of this people, saying,
12Say ye not, A conspiracy, concerning all whereof this people shall say, A conspiracy; neither fear ye their fear, nor be in dread thereof .
13Jehovah of hosts, him shall ye sanctify; and let him be your fear, and let him be your dread.
14And he shall be for a sanctuary; but for a stone of stumbling and for a rock of offence to both the houses of Israel, for a gin and for a snare to the inhabitants of Jerusalem.
15And many shall stumble thereon, and fall, and be broken, and be snared, and be taken.
Bump for Pierre. Please address this.
KathyIsa 8:13 The LORD Almighty is the one you are to regard as holy,
he is the one you are to fear,
he is the one you are to dread,
Isa 8:14 and he will be a sanctuary;
but for both houses of Israel he will be
a stone that causes men to stumble
and a rock that makes them fall.
And for the people of Jerusalem he will be
a trap and a snare.
Isa 8:15 Many of them will stumble;
they will fall and be broken,
they will be snared and captured.”Isa 8:16 Bind up the testimony
and seal up the law among my disciples.
Isa 8:17 I will wait for the LORD,
who is hiding his face from the house of Jacob.
I will put my trust in him.
Isa 8:18 Here am I, and the children the LORD has given me. We are signs and symbols in Israel from the LORD Almighty, who dwells on Mount Zion.Isa 1:2 Hear, O heavens! Listen, O earth!
For the LORD has spoken:
“I reared children and brought them up,
but they have rebelled against me.
Isa 1:3 The ox knows his master,
the donkey his owner’s manger,
but Israel does not know,
my people do not understand.who are those that falls or broken
Isa 1:4 Ah, sinful nation,
a people loaded with guilt,
a brood of evildoers,
children given to corruption!
They have forsaken the LORDwho are those that did not fall or broken
Isa 1:16 wash and make yourselves clean.
Take your evil deeds
out of my sight!
Stop doing wrong,
Isa 1:17 learn to do right!
Seek justice,
encourage the oppressed.
Defend the cause of the fatherless,
plead the case of the widow.Isa 1:18 “Come now, let us reason together,”
says the LORD.
“Though your sins are like scarlet,
they shall be as white as snow;
though they are red as crimson,
they shall be like wool.
Isa 1:19 If you are willing and obedient,
you will eat the best from the land;those things were preached by Jesus in the name of his father ;
so their are not two but one God Jehovah that saves of make the wicked perish for the sake of the righteous ,so justice will be rendered,
Pierre,
Peter identifies Jesus as the Jehovah of hosts and the one to fear and sanctify in our hearts. He quotes Isaiah 8 in two places in 1 Peter. Chapter 2 and chapter 3. In both places Peter identifies Jesus as the one Jehovah is calling Jehovah of hosts in Isaiah 8.Those who stumble are those who deny Jehovah of hosts. Those who do not stumble are those who will not deny Jehovah of hosts but they will abide in Him as a sanctuary for their souls.
Do you abide in Christ, Pierre?
Quote (Lightenup @ Nov. 25 2013,06:36) Pierre,
Peter identifies Jesus as the Jehovah of hosts and the one to fear and sanctify in our hearts. He quotes Isaiah 8 in two places in 1 Peter. Chapter 2 and chapter 3. In both places Peter identifies Jesus as the one Jehovah is calling Jehovah of hosts in Isaiah 8.Those who stumble are those who deny Jehovah of hosts. Those who do not stumble are those who will not deny Jehovah of hosts but they will abide in Him as a sanctuary for their souls.
Do you abide in Christ, Pierre?
kATHYIF YOU WOULD HAVE READ MY QUOTE AND SCRIPTURES YOU SHOULD HAVE THE ANSWER ,AND YOUR QUESTION IS IRRELEVANT TO YOU ,
BUT IS IMPORTANT TO ME .
So how do you answer the question, Pierre? Do you abide in the one who is our sanctuary and who Jehovah speaks about as Jehovah of hosts in Isa 8 and Peter identifies as Jesus in 1 Peter 2 and 3?
I'm all signed up to learn Hebrew in 2014. My hope is that it helps bring some unity in the truth of the OT and some enlightenment to the mysteries of the NT for myself and the members and readers here. I'm here to serve and I know there is much for me to learn in order to serve better.
It is not too late for others to sign up to learn Hebrew or Greek with the Memra Institute.
http://www.memraonline.com/Quote (Lightenup @ Nov. 26 2013,00:14) So how do you answer the question, Pierre? Do you abide in the one who is our sanctuary and who Jehovah speaks about as Jehovah of hosts in Isa 8 and Peter identifies as Jesus in 1 Peter 2 and 3?
Kathywhen we obey to what Jesus said we in fact obey God his and our father ,because the words that Jesus spoke where the ones from his father ,
Jesus is the son ,
Jesus is the anointed one that God send us,
Jesus is the mediator between God and us ,for our benefit,
Jesus sacrifice is given by God and Christ so that we can benefit from the grace of our father ,I really have no difficulty to understand this from my bibles English or French ;what would Hebrew tell me more
Quote (Lightenup @ Dec. 02 2013,01:34) I'm all signed up to learn Hebrew in 2014. My hope is that it helps bring some unity in the truth of the OT and some enlightenment to the mysteries of the NT for myself and the members and readers here. I'm here to serve and I know there is much for me to learn in order to serve better. It is not too late for others to sign up to learn Hebrew or Greek with the Memra Institute.
http://www.memraonline.com/
Kathygood for you,
but think about it , the one that teaches you Hebrew is a men that did not lived 2000 years ago ,and so his own Hebrew language has been learned from another men and he from another me and so on ,
the scriptures have been written and translated in the same way ,SO WHERE IS YOUR ADVANTAGE LAYS
IF THE SCRIPTURES CONTENT DOES NOT TEACH YOU ,THAN WHAT WILL
Pierre,
My son shared this true story with me the other day. He was explaining to a fellow worker that he ate a half a grapefruit for breakfast. The fellow worker was from a foreign country and questioned why anyone would eat a half of a grape for breakfast. My son knew the word for grapefruit in that person's native language and said the word for grapefruit. Then the co-worker understood what my son meant and it all made sense. Do you get it? So, people who have studied the ancient foreign language and culture have included the study of writings during those ancient times. It would only be logical that they could shed some light on idioms in the Bible or the nuances of the meaning of the passage in regards to the apparent culture.If I took your approach to learning, I wouldn't have even gone to school. Science teachers can only teach what they or others have observed but they cannot teach as if they were the creator, for instance. A good teacher can bring much understanding. If the LORD did not use teachers to teach His principles then teaching would not be a spiritual gift.
Quote IF THE SCRIPTURES CONTENT DOES NOT TEACH YOU ,THAN WHAT WILL So you ask where my advantage will be, we shall both see after the classes have started, won't we.
BTW, in regards to our discussion on 1 Peter 2 and Isa 8, the scripture content doesn't appear to teach you anything. You have to surrender your own understanding to the Holy Spirit to gain from the teaching of those that the Holy Spirit is using to teach you.
Quote (terraricca @ Dec. 01 2013,14:44) Quote (Lightenup @ Nov. 26 2013,00:14) So how do you answer the question, Pierre? Do you abide in the one who is our sanctuary and who Jehovah speaks about as Jehovah of hosts in Isa 8 and Peter identifies as Jesus in 1 Peter 2 and 3?
Kathywhen we obey to what Jesus said we in fact obey God his and our father ,because the words that Jesus spoke where the ones from his father ,
Jesus is the son ,
Jesus is the anointed one that God send us,
Jesus is the mediator between God and us ,for our benefit,
Jesus sacrifice is given by God and Christ so that we can benefit from the grace of our father ,I really have no difficulty to understand this from my bibles English or French ;what would Hebrew tell me more
Hebrews idioms and culture are not English idioms or French idioms or English culture or French culture.If you don't want to take the classes, then just sit back and we shall see if what I learn is helpful to you or not.
The proof is in the pudding, as they say. Do you understand that idiom, Pierre? Can you explain that idiom to me so that I know that you understand it?
Quote (Lightenup @ Dec. 02 2013,05:40) Quote (terraricca @ Dec. 01 2013,14:44) Quote (Lightenup @ Nov. 26 2013,00:14) So how do you answer the question, Pierre? Do you abide in the one who is our sanctuary and who Jehovah speaks about as Jehovah of hosts in Isa 8 and Peter identifies as Jesus in 1 Peter 2 and 3?
Kathywhen we obey to what Jesus said we in fact obey God his and our father ,because the words that Jesus spoke where the ones from his father ,
Jesus is the son ,
Jesus is the anointed one that God send us,
Jesus is the mediator between God and us ,for our benefit,
Jesus sacrifice is given by God and Christ so that we can benefit from the grace of our father ,I really have no difficulty to understand this from my bibles English or French ;what would Hebrew tell me more
Hebrews idioms and culture are not English idioms or French idioms or English culture or French culture.If you don't want to take the classes, then just sit back and we shall see if what I learn is helpful to you or not.
The proof is in the pudding, as they say. Do you understand that idiom, Pierre? Can you explain that idiom to me so that I know that you understand it?
Kathydo you remember my quote a page back ? here it is again;
Quote Kathy you are wrong ;you see my wife and I talk to each other about the meanings of certain expressions that I have in my language but in hers they have a similar expression but not with the same words ,so learning the language will not help me into translated correctly ,unless I am familiar with the common expression of the people using that language ,a thing that can not be done when those people and language are gone and no longer exist ,
culture is not fund in dictionary
and yes that is what I was talking about ;all languages and cultures are different ,but WHEN YOU DEAL WITH SCRIPTURES ALL FALLS DOWN TO THE CONTENT OF THE WORD OF GOD ,AND YOUR SOUL AND HEART ,REMEMBER WHAT PAUL SAYS ;YOU CAN HAVE EVERYTHING AND IF YOU MISS LOVE YOU END UP WITH NOTHING ;THE LOVE PAUL TALKS ABOUT IS “THE LOVE FOR GOD AND HIS RIGHTEOUSNESS AND TRUTH ,YOUR OWN PERSONAL LANGUAGE IS GOOD ENOUGH FOR GOD AND HIS SON ,
Kathy
Quote So you ask where my advantage will be, we shall both see after the classes have started, won't we. what advantage is there to know
would you gain so much that you would be ahead in truth
and see things the way God want you to see it will you be more righteous,truthful ,honest,and practice the previous , after you learn the language than before Pierre,
Did you know that there is a word of two letters that is found in many verses of the OT that is non-translatable? The two letters are the first and the last letters of the Hebrew alphabet. Since they are non-translatable, you will not find them translated in the Bibles that you read. You can only find them in the Hebrew scriptures. Jesus says that He is the first and the last letter of the alphabet when He identifies Himself as the Alpha and Omega. It is doubtful that He used the Greek alphabet letters there and very likely that He spoke the Hebrew letters…the aleph and tav.That is another reason to learn more about the Hebrew language and culture.
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