Who is the Father

Participant

Quote (Cult Buster @ Mar. 27 2007,12:37)

942767

Quote

God the Holy Spirit certainly has those characteristics.

Hi CB:

My understanding is that God is doing all of these things you state through His Spirit. (1 Co. 2:9-13)

God Bless

March 27, 2007 at 10:29 pm#46398

Participant

Hi CB,
Is the Spirit of God
another person in God
AS WELL AS
the Spirit of God?

March 27, 2007 at 10:31 pm#46400

kenrch

Participant

Quote (Nick Hassan @ Mar. 27 2007,23:29)

Hi CB,
Is the Spirit of God
another person in God
AS WELL AS
the Spirit of God?

No the Spirit of God is Elias, right?

March 27, 2007 at 10:32 pm#46402

Participant

hmmm

March 27, 2007 at 11:42 pm#46425

Participant

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Mar. 26 2007,04:49)

You say…

Quote

God is a living person with a mind, a free will, and emotions just as you and I. His Spirit is the life that he lives.

So are you saying his Spirit is what gives him life?

He is life.

His Spirit is Life because he is the Spirit.

He dosnt live by the life of his Spirit like us.

God is Spirit. And His Spirit is Life.

How many Spirits does God have?

Please give me your interpretation of these verses…

1 Cor 12:13
For by *one Spirit* are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into *one Spirit*.

Ehp 4:4
There is one body, and *one Spirit*, even as ye are called in one hope of your calling;

Is there any other Spirit for us but God?

Rom 8:9
But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the *Spirit of God dwell in you.* Now if any man have not the *Spirit of Christ*, he is none of his.

94, God is Spirit which is called “Spirit of God” and “Spirit of Christ” and in John 14 The Comforter which is all the ONE selfsame Spirit, God.

Compare to…
2 Cor 6:16
And what agreement hath the temple of God with idols? for ye are the temple of the living God; as God hath said, I will dwell in them, and walk in them; and I will be their God, and they shall be my people.

Does God by this verse live in you? Or is it a force or power or agent of some kind?

2 Cor 13:5
Examine yourselves, whether ye be in the faith; prove your own selves. Know ye not your own selves, how that Jesus Christ is in you, except ye be reprobates?

Does Jesus live in us or is it another part of God?

You see none of this makes since to the natural carnal mind without seeing by God that there is “One Spirit”, three Persons, and ONE God.

Father Son and Holy Spirit!

Hi WJ:

I am saying that the Holy Spirit is the life that God lives. It is who he is revealed to us by what he does. Just as who you are is revealed by what you do. God is a Mystery. There are some things that he doesn't tell us. We are told that he is eternal and that he is immortal and that he has life in himself. But what is his origin? That he doesn't tell us.

“For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead;…” (Rom. 1:20)

“But we speak the wisdom of Godin a mystery, even the hidden wisdom which God ordained before the world unto our glory: which none of the princes of this world knew: for had they know it, they would not have crucified the Lord of Glory. But as it is written, eye hath not seen, nor ear heard, neither have entered into the heart of man, the things which God hath prepared for them that love him. But God hath revealed them unto us by his Spirit: for the Spirit searcheth all things, yea, the deep things of God. For what man knoweth the things of man, save the spirit which is in him? even so, the things of God knoweth no man, but the Spirit of God. Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the spirit which is of God; that we might know the things that are freely given to us of God. Which things we also speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual thing with spiritual”. (1 Co. 2:7-13)

You ask:

How many Spirits does God have? He has one Spirit, the Holy Spirit. How man Spirits do you have?

You say, Please give me your intepretation of these verses…

1 Co. 12:13: “For by one Spirit are we all baptized inot one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be be bond or free; and have all been made to drink of one Spirit.

My understanding is that when we come to God with a repentant heart we receive the Holy Spirit which is God's personal presence in us by His Spirit as our Helper and the Father of our spirit. He will then sanctify us through his Word as Jesus prayed asking him to do in John 17:17. As we learn to apply what He has taught us our spirit is formed so that we are one in the spirit of holiness with him and our Lord Jesus.

And so, God our Father in the Spirit of Holiness, Jesus our Lord in the spirit of holiness, we who are born again believers in the spirit of holiness. But our Father dwells in us by his Spirit as our helper. Jesus who is the Word of God dwells in us also. “Whosoever transgresseth, and abideth not in the doctrine of Christ, hath not God. He that abideth in the doctrine of Christ, he hath both the Father and the Son”. (2 John v9)

I believe that this should answer all the questions that you have asked, but if not, please let me know.

God Bless

March 28, 2007 at 12:25 am#46426

Participant

Hi 94,
You say
“My understanding is that when we come to God with a repentant heart we receive the Holy Spirit “
??
No need for prayer[lk11] or the laying on of hands then?

March 28, 2007 at 12:36 am#46427

Participant

Quote (942767 @ Mar. 27 2007,03:39)

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Mar. 26 2007,05:15)

Quote

God is a living person with a mind, a free will, and emotions just as you and I.

By the way, I dont think God is just as you and I.

We as humans havnt begun to understand the complexity of the human being who our God made from just dust.

How do you think we will be able in our finite minds to begin to comprehend the complexity of this infinite God who fills all things and upholds all things by the Word of his power, and sustains everything because by him all things consist.

How does he do this, fill all things? Sustain all things?

Because he is Spirit!

God has no limitations of “Free Will”.

If God has “Free will” then that would mean someone would have had to set him free and give him that will.

We will not fully understand him in this life.

If we did we wouldnt need faith. Its faith that pleases God.

Thomas wasnt rebuked by Jesus, because now “by faith” he believed Jesus was his “Lord an God” whether he understood it or not.

Jesus blessed him because he seen it and believed it.

Rom 11:33
O the depth of the riches both of the wisdom and knowledge of God! how unsearchable are his judgments, and his ways past finding out!

Is 55:
8 For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither [are] your ways my ways, saith the LORD.
*For as the heavens are higher than the earth,* so are my ways higher than your ways, and my thoughts than your thoughts.

How much higher is the heavens from the earth?

Can it be measured?

Hi WJ:

I believe that if you will search the scriptures you will find that God has a mind, a free will and emotions, and we also have a mind, a free will, and emotions. And that is what I have stated. Are you disputing this? Can God do whatsoever He chooses to do? Is this not what a free will indicates?

We come to him by Faith, but after we receive the Holy Ghost we should know that he is a reality, and his thoughts are becoming my thoughts as a renew my mind throught his Word.

And I know Him and have seen Him in the face of my Lord Jesus who has said, “He who hath seen me hath seen the Father”. (John 14:9)

God Bless

The words “Free will” is not found in the Bible.

Now it can be implied that man has a will “not my will but thine be done”.

But to what extent is our wills free.

The creator of all things can do as he pleases. But even God is bound by his Word. The reason he can do what ever he pleases is because it will always please him to always abide by his word.

Pss 138:2
I will worship toward thy holy temple, and praise thy name for thy lovingkindness and for thy truth: for thou hast magnified (promote) thy word above all thy name.

For instance he cannot lie.

You could say Jesus had a free will, but did he? Could Jesus have chose not to do the Fathers will? Maybe. Is it possible that it was impossible for Jesus not do the the will of God because of His Love for the Father and humanity? Therefore in a sense he was bound and not free at all.

How about instances in the scriptures where it is clear that man has not always had a free will.

Look at “Pharoah”, God hardened his heart to accomplish his will and to show his power.

How about king Nebuchadnezzer who became like the beast of the field and ate grass for seven years?

How about Paul who was blinded on the road to Demascus.

It could be argued that Paul could have said no to Jesus, But could he?

Would you or anybody that had a meeting with God like that say no?

So the words “Free will” is not necesarily true in my opinion.

For one day we will all stand before the Judgement seat of Christ and give account whether we want to or not.

“And One day every knee will bow and confess to God”

IMHO

March 28, 2007 at 1:17 am#46428

Participant

Hi W,
Joshua 24:15
And if it seem evil unto you to serve the LORD, choose you this day whom ye will serve; whether the gods which your fathers served that were on the other side of the flood, or the gods of the Amorites, in whose land ye dwell: but as for me and my house, we will serve the LORD.

March 28, 2007 at 1:41 am#46430

Participant

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Mar. 26 2007,04:49)

Does Jesus live in us or is it another part of God?

You see none of this makes since to the natural carnal mind without seeing by God that there is “One Spirit”, three Persons, and ONE God.

Father Son and Holy Spirit!

Hi WJ:

You say that there is “one spirit” and then you say, “three persons” and include the Holy Spirit as a person. Since we are indicating “one spirit”, this doesn't make sense to me. Is it the Holy Spirit that is the “one spirit”? Please explain.

Thanks & God Bless

March 28, 2007 at 2:55 am#46432

Participant

Quote (Nick Hassan @ Mar. 28 2007,01:25)

Hi 94,
You say
“My understanding is that when we come to God with a repentant heart we receive the Holy Spirit “
??
No need for prayer[lk11] or the laying on of hands then?

Hi Nick:

Not necessarily. Cornelius received the Holy Spirit without the laying on of hands for example. But I should have said when we come to God through Jesus with a repentant heart instead of just come to God with a repentant heart.

And so, I made another mistake. I try not to make mistakes, but somehow, I have the tendency to make them.

God Bless

March 28, 2007 at 3:30 am#46434

Participant

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Mar. 28 2007,01:36)

Quote (942767 @ Mar. 27 2007,03:39)

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Mar. 26 2007,05:15)

Quote

God is a living person with a mind, a free will, and emotions just as you and I.

By the way, I dont think God is just as you and I.

We as humans havnt begun to understand the complexity of the human being who our God made from just dust.

How does he do this, fill all things? Sustain all things?

Because he is Spirit!

God has no limitations of “Free Will”.

If God has “Free will” then that would mean someone would have had to set him free and give him that will.

We will not fully understand him in this life.

If we did we wouldnt need faith. Its faith that pleases God.

Thomas wasnt rebuked by Jesus, because now “by faith” he believed Jesus was his “Lord an God” whether he understood it or not.

Jesus blessed him because he seen it and believed it.

Rom 11:33
O the depth of the riches both of the wisdom and knowledge of God! how unsearchable are his judgments, and his ways past finding out!

How much higher is the heavens from the earth?

Can it be measured?

Hi WJ:

We come to him by Faith, but after we receive the Holy Ghost we should know that he is a reality, and his thoughts are becoming my thoughts as a renew my mind throught his Word.

And I know Him and have seen Him in the face of my Lord Jesus who has said, “He who hath seen me hath seen the Father”. (John 14:9)

God Bless

The words “Free will” is not found in the Bible.

Now it can be implied that man has a will “not my will but thine be done”.

But to what extent is our wills free.

The creator of all things can do as he pleases. But even God is bound by his Word. The reason he can do what ever he pleases is because it will always please him to always abide by his word.

Pss 138:2
I will worship toward thy holy temple, and praise thy name for thy lovingkindness and for thy truth: for thou hast magnified (promote) thy word above all thy name.

For instance he cannot lie.

How about instances in the scriptures where it is clear that man has not always had a free will.

Look at “Pharoah”, God hardened his heart to accomplish his will and to show his power.

How about king Nebuchadnezzer who became like the beast of the field and ate grass for seven years?

How about Paul who was blinded on the road to Demascus.

It could be argued that Paul could have said no to Jesus, But could he?

Would you or anybody that had a meeting with God like that say no?

So the words “Free will” is not necesarily true in my opinion.

For one day we will all stand before the Judgement seat of Christ and give account whether we want to or not.

“And One day every knee will bow and confess to God”

IMHO

Hi WJ:

God said to Adam: “And the Lord commanded the man saying, of every tree of the garden thou mayest freely eat: But of the tree of knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thou shalt surely die”. (Genesis 2:16)

I do believe that we have a “free will” and can do what we choose, but there are consequences to our choices.

Heb 9:27
And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment:

You say that God cannot lie, but I believe that He can if he chooses to lie, but he doesn't lie and won't lie. His Word is what he chooses to do. And Jesus, gave his life freely. He did so out of his love for God and for humanity.

God did not and will not force any one to obey him. He may make things difficult for some when they don't obey, such as Nebuchadnezzar's experience. He definetly knows how to humble some one.

God Bless

March 28, 2007 at 4:34 am#46438

Participant

Quote (942767 @ Mar. 28 2007,03:55)

Quote (Nick Hassan @ Mar. 28 2007,01:25)

Hi 94,
You say
“My understanding is that when we come to God with a repentant heart we receive the Holy Spirit “
??
No need for prayer[lk11] or the laying on of hands then?

Hi Nick:

And so, I made another mistake. I try not to make mistakes, but somehow, I have the tendency to make them.

God Bless

Hi 94,
Cornelius and his friends were the exceptions to the pattern of Acts.

March 28, 2007 at 5:57 am#46444

Participant

Quote (942767 @ Mar. 28 2007,02:41)

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Mar. 26 2007,04:49)

Does Jesus live in us or is it another part of God?

You see none of this makes since to the natural carnal mind without seeing by God that there is “One Spirit”, three Persons, and ONE God.

Father Son and Holy Spirit!

Hi WJ:

Thanks & God Bless

I will let the scriptures explain.

The Father

2 Cor 6:16
And what agreement hath the temple of God with idols? for ye are the temple of the living God; as God hath said, I will dwell in them, and walk in them; and I will be their God, and they shall be my people.

Jn 14:23
Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and **we** will come unto him, and make our abode with him.

This is the Father living in us.

In fact the above verse says both the Father and the Son will come and dwell within us!

The Son

Rom 8:9
But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.

Rom 8:15
For ye have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear; but ye have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby we cry, Abba, Father.

2 Cor 13:5
Examine yourselves, whether ye be in the faith; prove your own selves. Know ye not your own selves, how that Jesus Christ is in you, except ye be reprobates?

Gal 4:6
And because ye are sons, God hath sent forth the Spirit of his Son into your hearts, crying, Abba, Father.

2 Cor 3:17
Now the Lord is that Spirit: and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty.

And so we see that the Son, Yeshua Messiah, Jesus Christ,
lives in us!

The Holy Spirit

Jn 14:6
And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever;

Jn 16:6
Nevertheless I tell you the truth; It is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you.

Jn 16
13 Howbeit when “he”, the Spirit of truth, is come, “he” will guide you into all truth: for “he” shall not speak of “himself”; but whatsoever “he” shall hear, that shall “he” speak: and “he” will shew you things to come.
14 “He” shall glorify me: for “he” shall receive of mine, and shall shew it unto you.

Acts 2:4
And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance.

And of course here we see the Comforter living in us and filling us!

So we have the Father, Son, And Holy Spirit living in us by these scriptures.

Can anyone show me how these scriptures say anything else?

Now, since we know that there is One Spirit we read…

1 Cor 12:13
For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.

Eph 2:18
For through him we both have access by one Spirit unto the Father.

Ehp 4:4
There is one body, and one Spirit, even as ye are called in one hope of your calling;

Then to stay in harmony with the scriptures we conclude that there is…… ONE SPIRIT, THREE PERSONS, and ONE GOD!

The above is confirmed by the following scriptures…

2 Cor 13:14
The grace of the Lord Jesus Christ, and the love of God, and the communion of the Holy Ghost, be with you all. Amen.

Matt 28:
18 And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth.

19 Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:

94, If we examine these scriptures closely as well as many others in scripture, we will see that the Apostles and believers used the terms Spirit of God, and the Spirit of Christ, and Holy Spirit, Spirit of him, his Spirit interchangebly in referring to the One Spirit, the One God. but yet three persons.

This I believe is a good test.

Ask yourself according to the above scriptures..

Does the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit live in you?

If you dont see it this way then of course we agree to disagree and still be friends and brothers, because I believe that you are a true brother.

Blessings

March 28, 2007 at 6:22 am#46449

Participant

Hi W,
You say
“So we have the Father, Son, And Holy Spirit living in us by these scriptures.”
So to which of your three spirits do these apply?
Or do they apply to the ONE Spirit?

The Spirit
Spirit of Truth
Spirit of God
My Spirit
Spirit of Holiness
Spirit of Life
Spirit of your Father

March 28, 2007 at 6:32 am#46451

Participant

Quote (942767 @ Mar. 28 2007,04:30)

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Mar. 28 2007,01:36)

Quote (942767 @ Mar. 27 2007,03:39)

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Mar. 26 2007,05:15)

Quote

God is a living person with a mind, a free will, and emotions just as you and I.

By the way, I dont think God is just as you and I.

We as humans havnt begun to understand the complexity of the human being who our God made from just dust.

How does he do this, fill all things? Sustain all things?

Because he is Spirit!

God has no limitations of “Free Will”.

If God has “Free will” then that would mean someone would have had to set him free and give him that will.

We will not fully understand him in this life.

If we did we wouldnt need faith. Its faith that pleases God.

Thomas wasnt rebuked by Jesus, because now “by faith” he believed Jesus was his “Lord an God” whether he understood it or not.

Jesus blessed him because he seen it and believed it.

Rom 11:33
O the depth of the riches both of the wisdom and knowledge of God! how unsearchable are his judgments, and his ways past finding out!

How much higher is the heavens from the earth?

Can it be measured?

Hi WJ:

We come to him by Faith, but after we receive the Holy Ghost we should know that he is a reality, and his thoughts are becoming my thoughts as a renew my mind throught his Word.

And I know Him and have seen Him in the face of my Lord Jesus who has said, “He who hath seen me hath seen the Father”. (John 14:9)

God Bless

The words “Free will” is not found in the Bible.

Now it can be implied that man has a will “not my will but thine be done”.

But to what extent is our wills free.

The creator of all things can do as he pleases. But even God is bound by his Word. The reason he can do what ever he pleases is because it will always please him to always abide by his word.

Pss 138:2
I will worship toward thy holy temple, and praise thy name for thy lovingkindness and for thy truth: for thou hast magnified (promote) thy word above all thy name.

For instance he cannot lie.

How about instances in the scriptures where it is clear that man has not always had a free will.

Look at “Pharoah”, God hardened his heart to accomplish his will and to show his power.

How about king Nebuchadnezzer who became like the beast of the field and ate grass for seven years?

How about Paul who was blinded on the road to Demascus.

It could be argued that Paul could have said no to Jesus, But could he?

Would you or anybody that had a meeting with God like that say no?

So the words “Free will” is not necesarily true in my opinion.

For one day we will all stand before the Judgement seat of Christ and give account whether we want to or not.

“And One day every knee will bow and confess to God”

IMHO

Hi WJ:

I do believe that we have a “free will” and can do what we choose, but there are consequences to our choices.

Heb 9:27
And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment:

God did not and will not force any one to obey him. He may make things difficult for some when they don't obey, such as Nebuchadnezzar's experience. He definetly knows how to humble some one.

God Bless

I Agree that to some degree we have choice. But the question is did I choose or was it because of my nature or maybe the Spirit working in my heart.

For instance, say that there was someone I couldnt stand, almost hated, and one day they were angry and slapped me,(I know some here would probably like to do that, LOL.) But suddenly reality hits me and God opens my eyes to see something of that person and then I began to feel the Love of God filling my heart and my response was one of Love and not hate. It could be argued that I chose to Love him, but did I?

Paul talks about a war going on in his body, listen to his words…

Rom 7: NASB
12 So then, the Law is holy, and the commandment is holy and righteous and good.
13 Therefore did that which is good become {a cause} {of} death for me? May it never be! Rather it was sin, in order that it might be shown to be sin by effecting my death through that which is good, so that through the commandment sin would become utterly sinful.
14 For we know that the Law is spiritual, but I am of flesh, sold into bondage to sin.
15 For what I am doing, I do not understand; for I am not practicing what I {would} like to {do,} but I am doing the very thing I hate.
16 But if I do the very thing I do not want {to do,} I agree with the Law, {confessing} that the Law is good.
17 So now, no longer am I the one doing it, but sin which dwells in me.
18 For I know that nothing good dwells in me, that is, in my flesh; for the willing is present in me, but the doing of the good is not.
19 For the good that I want, I do not do, but I practice the very evil that I do not want.
20 But if I am doing the very thing I do n
ot want, I am no longer the one doing it, but sin which dwells in me.
21 I find then the principle that evil is present in me, the one who wants to do good.
22 For I joyfully concur with the law of God in the inner man,
23 but I see a different law in the members of my body, waging war against the law of my mind and making me a prisoner of the law of sin which is in my members.
24 Wretched man that I am! Who will set me free from the body of this death?
25 Thanks be to God through Jesus Christ our Lord! So then, on the one hand I myself with my mind am serving the law of God, but on the other, with my flesh the law of sin.

On the other hand…

Eph 2:
8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.
10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.

So I think there is a lot we dont understand about ourselves or God.

And I do disagree with you that God can lie if he wants to.

Tts 1:2
In hope of eternal life, which God, that cannot lie, promised before the world began;

Blessings!

March 28, 2007 at 6:35 am#46453

Participant

Hi W,
If you say this
“So I think there is a lot we dont understand about ourselves or God.”
why are you so dogmatic about trinity
when it is not even in the BIBLE?

March 28, 2007 at 6:36 am#46454

Participant

Quote (Nick Hassan @ Mar. 28 2007,07:22)

Hi W,
You say
“So we have the Father, Son, And Holy Spirit living in us by these scriptures.”
So to which of your three spirits do these apply?
Or do they apply to the ONE Spirit?

The Spirit
Spirit of Truth
Spirit of God
My Spirit
Spirit of Holiness
Spirit of Life
Spirit of your Father

Is there anywhere in my post that says there is “three Spirits”?

Obviously you didnt even read it!

BTW I didnt write the scriptures, which ones do you disagree with?

March 28, 2007 at 6:41 am#46455

Participant

None W,
But you speak with a forked tongue.
You tell us the Spirit is ONE and I agree, but then you say the Holy Spirit is a person in God and then divide that Spirit into three.
What gives?

Rom 8
“And if the Spirit of him who raised Jesus from the dead is living in you, he who raised Christ from the dead will also give life to your mortal bodies through his Spirit, who lives in you.”

You say Christ raised himself??

Rom 8
“Romans 8:9
You, however, are controlled not by the sinful nature but by the Spirit, if the Spirit of God lives in you. And if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he does not belong to Christ.”

and you tell us this verse speaks of two different spirits??

March 28, 2007 at 7:15 am#46463