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Hi MK:
Do you have any family and friends who are saved and who if they disagree, are willing to come together and worship, and pursue unity in their understanding of the scriptures by discussing their differences and praying to God for revelation knowledge in His Word even if it means that their understanding is wrong and they have to be corrected.
If so, start a fellowship with these. Jesus said: “Where two or three are gathered in my name, there I am in the midst”.
Quote (Not3in1 @ Dec. 16 2008,04:26) God knows we are trying to find Him through it all.
Speak for yourself!Stuart
Quote (Tiffany @ Dec. 16 2008,06:09) Quote (Not3in1 @ Dec. 16 2008,04:26) Sorry, Meerkat, I was under the impression that you were already a churchgoer! Speaking from experience, you will never find a body of believers who believe just as you do (you can't even find that here). Every church will have it's rules and regs to follow (obey). But you can choose which bits are for you, and which bits you throw away. I think there is a wonderful trade-off in fellowship if you are able to do this. I am speaking from a place of regret, you must realize. I wish I would have been able to do that before disfellowshiping myself. It's not too late for me, and I am seeking fellowship for myself, and my children.
We are born into a Christian culture. Some are born into Islam and other religions. Embrace what you are given; love the one you're with!
God knows we are trying to find Him through it all.
Love,
Mandy
Mandy! I do wonder if you take all those who do not believe in the trinity for instance, you would get quit a few together. Also I know a few that do not go to Church like we do. Then if you take what Jesus said that only few will find it. The road is steep and it is. Knowing who started the Catholic Church and all Sister Churches that came out of Her, I have a problem joining one. IMO So it is up to the individual I guess what to do. I will not judge.
Peace and Love Irene
Lots of times lately I feel like all are ignoring me, usally my intuition is right, but I do feel still God's Love for me and that of course is more important then anything else. For that I do not have to come on here. Good-bye. My Song Post is good enough for me.Quote (942767 @ Dec. 16 2008,13:23) Hi MK: Do you have any family and friends who are saved and who if they disagree, are willing to come together and worship, and pursue unity in their understanding of the scriptures by discussing their differences and praying to God for revelation knowledge in His Word even if it means that their understanding is wrong and they have to be corrected.
If so, start a fellowship with these. Jesus said: “Where two or three are gathered in my name, there I am in the midst”.
No, I don't ………..I think I will visit some different churches, and take one step at a time, see where it leads ….. maybe I have been too tentative to take the second step because of what the first step revealed and worrying about what the final outcome [/b]could[/b] be.
I guess I need to trust that God will lead me where he wants me to be ……. he is giving me the desire for physical fellowship so I need to follow that.
Quote (Tiffany @ Dec. 17 2008,07:12) Quote (Tiffany @ Dec. 16 2008,06:09) Quote (Not3in1 @ Dec. 16 2008,04:26) Sorry, Meerkat, I was under the impression that you were already a churchgoer! Speaking from experience, you will never find a body of believers who believe just as you do (you can't even find that here). Every church will have it's rules and regs to follow (obey). But you can choose which bits are for you, and which bits you throw away. I think there is a wonderful trade-off in fellowship if you are able to do this. I am speaking from a place of regret, you must realize. I wish I would have been able to do that before disfellowshiping myself. It's not too late for me, and I am seeking fellowship for myself, and my children.
We are born into a Christian culture. Some are born into Islam and other religions. Embrace what you are given; love the one you're with!
God knows we are trying to find Him through it all.
Love,
Mandy
Mandy! I do wonder if you take all those who do not believe in the trinity for instance, you would get quit a few together. Also I know a few that do not go to Church like we do. Then if you take what Jesus said that only few will find it. The road is steep and it is. Knowing who started the Catholic Church and all Sister Churches that came out of Her, I have a problem joining one. IMO So it is up to the individual I guess what to do. I will not judge.
Peace and Love Irene
Lots of times lately I feel like all are ignoring me, usally my intuition is right, but I do feel still God's Love for me and that of course is more important then anything else. For that I do not have to come on here. Good-bye. My Song Post is good enough for me.
Hi Irene,I just wonder if a disbelief in the trinity is enough to form productive fellowship, while I believe that the trinity is a false doctrine, it is not the only false doctrine ……… While it was nice going to church and singing hymns of praise I sort of felt that there was not a striving and yearning for truth ….. there seemed to be a complacency …. it seemed they were happy that pastor knows and says this is “the truth” so we will believe that, and come together to sing and listen to pastor, then talk about the kids and how good it is that we are saved and shame about the heathens who don't believe…….
Quote (meerkat @ Dec. 15 2008,13:52)
Irene,Thank you for your reply …….. It is not only my wanting fellowship with like minded believers it is also a concern for those in the churches, and also knowing that the pastors/ministers are looking out for people who will lead the flock astray. So I feel like I should warn but also not feeling strong enough to be thought of as a heretic. When I did try “churchgoing” and mentioned some of what I was thinking I got the implied warning of church discipline, also not being sure that I can explain it and also knowing that a lot do not want to hear.
Hi MKQuote (meerkat @ Dec. 15 2008,13:52) When I did try “churchgoing” and mentioned some of what I was thinking I got the implied warning of church discipline, also not being sure that I can explain it and also knowing that a lot do not want to hear. They do not want to hear what? Your version of the truth?
Does doctrine become the prerequisite to fellowshipping in the Spirit? Ehp 4:1-3
An elitist attitude is one that thinks he has all truth and separates himself from others and taking the high minded attitude that they are in the truth and everyone else who doesn’t agree with them is still a part of the harlot church, and yet they themselves may still believe religous things that are part of the harlot.
Could it be that you are deceived and they are right?
They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would no doubt have continued with us: but [they went out], that they might be made manifest that they were not all of us. 1 John 2:19
This same John claimed Jesus to be the Word that was with God and was God.
WJ
WJ,
Yes, I do think of and acknowledge that possibility, probability, I am human and bound by my perceptions, you are bound by yours – what church/denomination has the truth? – if I go to a baptist church I get baptist doctrine, if RCC – I get RCC doctrine etc,etc ………….
The feeling I have gotten when going to a “church” is that any questions I have are not actually considered but run past an established doctrine eg baptist and then I am given the “standard answer” for questioners, then if I don't accept “the truth” I must be heretic.
WJ
John is saying that 2000 years ago, right at the very start, before the apostles were even dead, there was false doctrine being delivered as truth ………….. and its had 2000 years.
I am not saying I have all truth ….. I am here to discuss, learn, putting forth views, observations. I am suspicious about all the different denomination all saying varying things and believing each is “the truth”
Quote (meerkat @ Dec. 17 2008,08:11) Quote (Tiffany @ Dec. 17 2008,07:12) Quote (Tiffany @ Dec. 16 2008,06:09) Quote (Not3in1 @ Dec. 16 2008,04:26) Sorry, Meerkat, I was under the impression that you were already a churchgoer! Speaking from experience, you will never find a body of believers who believe just as you do (you can't even find that here). Every church will have it's rules and regs to follow (obey). But you can choose which bits are for you, and which bits you throw away. I think there is a wonderful trade-off in fellowship if you are able to do this. I am speaking from a place of regret, you must realize. I wish I would have been able to do that before disfellowshiping myself. It's not too late for me, and I am seeking fellowship for myself, and my children.
We are born into a Christian culture. Some are born into Islam and other religions. Embrace what you are given; love the one you're with!
God knows we are trying to find Him through it all.
Love,
Mandy
Mandy! I do wonder if you take all those who do not believe in the trinity for instance, you would get quit a few together. Also I know a few that do not go to Church like we do. Then if you take what Jesus said that only few will find it. The road is steep and it is. Knowing who started the Catholic Church and all Sister Churches that came out of Her, I have a problem joining one. IMO So it is up to the individual I guess what to do. I will not judge.
Peace and Love Irene
Lots of times lately I feel like all are ignoring me, usally my intuition is right, but I do feel still God's Love for me and that of course is more important then anything else. For that I do not have to come on here. Good-bye. My Song Post is good enough for me.
Hi Irene,I just wonder if a disbelief in the trinity is enough to form productive fellowship, while I believe that the trinity is a false doctrine, it is not the only false doctrine ……… While it was nice going to church and singing hymns of praise I sort of felt that there was not a striving and yearning for truth ….. there seemed to be a complacency …. it seemed they were happy that pastor knows and says this is “the truth” so we will believe that, and come together to sing and listen to pastor, then talk about the kids and how good it is that we are saved and shame about the heathens who don't believe…….
Mandy! I sense some dissatisfaction lately and that I don't like. Maybe there are to many that question to many things. Even tho I belief questening what one belief system is,is good it gets rough at times. Maybe I should take a rest. I already said Good-bye
Peace and Love IreneQuote (meerkat @ Dec. 17 2008,08:59) WJ John is saying that 2000 years ago, right at the very start, before the apostles were even dead, there was false doctrine being delivered as truth ………….. and its had 2000 years.
I am not saying I have all truth ….. I am here to discuss, learn, putting forth views, observations. I am suspicious about all the different denomination all saying varying things and believing each is “the truth”
Hi MKFair enough.
But remember in the NT church 2000 years ago they had doctrinal differences and divisions also which Paul preached against.
You see I believe that “Arians” (those who do not believe in the deity of Jesus Christ) are heretics, but I do not not judge the hearts and minds of those who are anti-trinitarian by claiming they do not know God, because it may be they are just decieved.
So Pot meets kettle!
WJ
Quote (Tiffany @ Dec. 17 2008,10:07) Quote (meerkat @ Dec. 17 2008,08:11) Quote (Tiffany @ Dec. 17 2008,07:12) Quote (Tiffany @ Dec. 16 2008,06:09) Quote (Not3in1 @ Dec. 16 2008,04:26) Sorry, Meerkat, I was under the impression that you were already a churchgoer! Speaking from experience, you will never find a body of believers who believe just as you do (you can't even find that here). Every church will have it's rules and regs to follow (obey). But you can choose which bits are for you, and which bits you throw away. I think there is a wonderful trade-off in fellowship if you are able to do this. I am speaking from a place of regret, you must realize. I wish I would have been able to do that before disfellowshiping myself. It's not too late for me, and I am seeking fellowship for myself, and my children.
We are born into a Christian culture. Some are born into Islam and other religions. Embrace what you are given; love the one you're with!
God knows we are trying to find Him through it all.
Love,
Mandy
Mandy! I do wonder if you take all those who do not believe in the trinity for instance, you would get quit a few together. Also I know a few that do not go to Church like we do. Then if you take what Jesus said that only few will find it. The road is steep and it is. Knowing who started the Catholic Church and all Sister Churches that came out of Her, I have a problem joining one. IMO So it is up to the individual I guess what to do. I will not judge.
Peace and Love Irene
Lots of times lately I feel like all are ignoring me, usally my intuition is right, but I do feel still God's Love for me and that of course is more important then anything else. For that I do not have to come on here. Good-bye. My Song Post is good enough for me.
Hi Irene,I just wonder if a disbelief in the trinity is enough to form productive fellowship, while I believe that the trinity is a false doctrine, it is not the only false doctrine ……… While it was nice going to church and singing hymns of praise I sort of felt that there was not a striving and yearning for truth ….. there seemed to be a complacency …. it seemed they were happy that pastor knows and says this is “the truth” so we will believe that, and come together to sing and listen to pastor, then talk about the kids and how good it is that we are saved and shame about the heathens who don't believe…….
Mandy! I sense some dissatisfaction lately and that I don't like. Maybe there are to many that question to many things. Even tho I belief questening what one belief system is,is good it gets rough at times. Maybe I should take a rest. I already said Good-bye
Peace and Love Irene
Sorry Irene,That was me (meerkat) bringing this back up – I think it went me addressing you were addressing Mandy was addressing me
, 
I was not trying to offend or upset you ……..
meerkat You did not offend me, I was saying in general I have the feeling that some including self have been dissatisfied with what is being said here lately. No in fact my Husband really enjoys debating with you. It is me, that is why I said I need a rest.
Peace and Love IreneQuote (Tiffany @ Dec. 17 2008,07:12) Quote (Tiffany @ Dec. 16 2008,06:09) Quote (Not3in1 @ Dec. 16 2008,04:26) Sorry, Meerkat, I was under the impression that you were already a churchgoer! Speaking from experience, you will never find a body of believers who believe just as you do (you can't even find that here). Every church will have it's rules and regs to follow (obey). But you can choose which bits are for you, and which bits you throw away. I think there is a wonderful trade-off in fellowship if you are able to do this. I am speaking from a place of regret, you must realize. I wish I would have been able to do that before disfellowshiping myself. It's not too late for me, and I am seeking fellowship for myself, and my children.
We are born into a Christian culture. Some are born into Islam and other religions. Embrace what you are given; love the one you're with!
God knows we are trying to find Him through it all.
Love,
Mandy
Mandy! I do wonder if you take all those who do not believe in the trinity for instance, you would get quit a few together. Also I know a few that do not go to Church like we do. Then if you take what Jesus said that only few will find it. The road is steep and it is. Knowing who started the Catholic Church and all Sister Churches that came out of Her, I have a problem joining one. IMO So it is up to the individual I guess what to do. I will not judge.
Peace and Love Irene
Lots of times lately I feel like all are ignoring me, usally my intuition is right, but I do feel still God's Love for me and that of course is more important then anything else. For that I do not have to come on here. Good-bye. My Song Post is good enough for me.
Hi Irene,I'm sorry if I missed your post here to me – I didn't see it. I've been trying to keep up with posts here while doing ten million other things at home. I've been hosting parties, trying to keep my marriage together, volunteering a lot at my kids' school, Christimas shopping….
I think if you're tired and you no longer feel joy by being here, you should definitely take a break. It really helped me to take a break! I plan to take another one coming up soon.
You are an important person here. Both you and Georg are valid members here and what you contribute is always appreciated. Just look at how you both are helping one of our newest members – Meerkat!
Also, I like to chat with you about stuff that has nothing to do with Heavennet. Sometimes we chat about kids, marriage, life in general. I like that. But do take a break if you're tired. Heavennet will still be here….Nick will still be here arguing with Gene….ha.
Rest up and stay warm (we're supposed to get snow again tonight). Love you,
Mandymeercat
There are over 34,000 versions of christianity if you include all the small independent churches. You have the problem that we are all strict agnostics: no one can actually demonstrate for anyone else that there are or are not any gods, or give any evidence at all that it is the Judeo-christian god specifically doing all the things claimed for 'him'. Then you have the problem that scripture is demonstrated to be literally wrong in some places and there is endless chatter about what is allegory and what isn't.
I think the first question to answer is 'Why do I need a god?”. If the answer itself is fellowship for the sake of supportive social interaction then it should not really matter what church you attended, or indeed whether the chosen social activity had anything to do with religious faith at all.
If the answer is 'because I need to be saved', well I wonder if you have thought about what on earth that actually means, and whether it might just have been invented by humans. If you need Jesus to have died in order to live a good life then I wonder what kind of attitude to that life you would have. Not you personally, you understand, but the general 'you'. Have you stepped outside your beliefs recently and considered them looking in from the outside?
Stuart
Quote (meerkat @ Dec. 18 2008,05:47) Thanks Stu, Yes, I have
Cool. And can I ask what you decided?Stuart
I have decided that God exists independant of christianity, judaism, hinduism, etc
Religions are mans search for what they preceive as God, there is more beyond our physical senses, laws of gravity, light, etc and ever further beyond that is a spiritual dimension. That is what spiritual “eyes” perceive.
I have found I am not exactly looking for “christianity” I am looking for what is behind the facade, which has been written about in the bible, and looking for people who are looking for that same thing.
Careful meerkat,
they will banish you to the non believers section and you will no longer be able to talk
to people who are looking for the same thing.Tim
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