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They also did not believe that Jesus was the Christ. They denied that Jesus Christ came in the flesh. They denied he was the son of God. They would naturally deny that he was conceived by the Spirit and Mary. They denied his Father was God.
Nick, you are not suppose to judge people this way. It is wrong.
You were once a moderator here, and you of all people should know better. You realise that I cannot show favoritism but as a moderator I extend more grace to you and ask to please refrain from acting this way toward others here. The forums are for challenging teachings, not to cast stones at each other. Otherwise I have no option to impose a partial ban that has been imposed on a few for the same reason.
Hi t8,
Those who judge their own ideas and teachings to be sound need to have those things tested by the Word.
I agree, but Nick, please judge my or other’s teachings only. Do not pass judgement on the state of my or other people’s soul or salvation. I encourage you to look at the rules of the forums. These rules are in place to stop the forums degenerating into a war of accusations and fiery darts. The purpose of these forums is not the latter even though that drives more traffic to the site. It is to challenge doctrines and teachings only. Please abide by the rules. If you cannot, then there are other forums out there that will cater for that kind of behaviour. This one is not meant to be for hurling accusations at each other. It wasn’t setup for that purpose. Please be respectful.
Agreed it is about the Spirit. But a man can say he has the Spirit, but if the evidence is not there, then saying and having are two different things. Those who are born of God, love, and those who love are born of God. People can argue all day that they have the spirit, but there are many spirits that a person can receive. As people we are not entirely blind. We can see the fruit of the Spirit and we can see the evidence of love.
Love
- Love is patient,
- love is kind.
- It does not envy,
- it does not boast,
- it is not proud.
- It does not dishonor others,
- it is not self-seeking,
- it is not easily angered,
- it keeps no record of wrongs
Beloved, let us love one another, for love is from God; and everyone who loves is born of God and knows God. The one who does not love does not know God, for God is love.
Hi T8,
How come you feel personally involved when it is your teachings that are under discussion?
It was never about you.
Sorry Nick, you made it about me. You said I was not being led by the Spirit. Now you deny it? Shall I copy and paste your accusations against me here? But I am not even truly upset about it, God is my witness, I am secure in what I believe and have scripture to back it up. In fact it is simple, I just believe scripture. No, I have no problem when people accuse me of this or that if it is not true. I would only be upset if it were actually true because then I would need to change.
I only brought your accusations up because I am a moderator and you were breaking the rules which state to not get personal. That rule is there because before the rules, the forums were degenerating into a slinging match where fiery darts of accusation were flying every which way. While that was good for the traffic on the site as it seems that people feel compelled to view such an event, when I banned it by imposing rules, yes the traffic in the site went down. Such is humanity. But the good people on the forums noticed a difference afterward as there were less hostilities.
Regardless, I have posted a definition of love. And love is a requirement of the Spirit. So if you keep telling us that we need the Spirit or to be born again as you do, then yes we all need the Spirit. But if you say it because you imply that we have not the Spirit, then I will remind you about the evidence of that Spirit so that you have to judge yourself and not others.
Those who are born-again love others and are kind and will not dishonor others.
God is love and those that are born of God love others and do not dishonor them. Love is the greatest even greater than hope and faith because God is love and his children have his nature.
Hi t8,
Neither is it about me.
there is much we all have to learn.
let’s start with the ESSENCE-the work of the Spirit of God
Correct. It is not about you. We do not fight against flesh and blood.
If a person teaches that Jesus Christ wasn’t born in a manger (or came in the flesh), or that Jesus is just a man and not the Christ, then then it is the spirit behind that teaching that needs to be tested. Once the spirit is tested and found to be Antichrist, then any victims of the teaching have a chance to recognize the spirit and come out of that spirit’s influence.
If it is one thing that has been done in this site since the beginning, it is to test the teachings and to test the spirits. This site is a place defined by that. All is able to be tested, even so-called sacred doctrines. You know this from the days when many came here teaching the Trinity.
Hi t8,
And how will you test these things?
Against a natural view of spiritual things?
Since you have consecrated your own ideas as truth could it be fair?
Scripture will reproof and correct, even rebuke. I will continue doing that.
I do not subscribe to secret hidden meanings in verses, especially ones that draw opposite conclusions to what is written. I believe they mean what they say and will use them to expose false teachings when they appear here. So the following verse:
Today in the town of David a Savior has been born to you; he is the Messiah, the Lord
means that a baby called Jesus was born as the Savior , the Messiah, and the Lord.
Whereas the hidden secret you seem to have is the text is actually saying that he is not the Messiah and Lord, but that would only happen a few years before he died, around thirty or so years after his birth.
Hi t8,
It is your site and you can do what you will.
The Spirit of God has never been welcomed among men of the earth.
Just a heads up.
Apparently, the adoptionist view was common in the early church more so than today.
From Wikipedia:
The Shepherd of Hermas (Greek: Ποιμὴν τοῦ Ἑρμᾶ, Poimēn tou Herma; sometimes just called The Shepherd) is a Christian literary work of the late 1st or mid-2nd century, considered a valuable book by many Christians, and considered canonical scripture by some of the early Church fathers such as Irenaeus.[1][2] The Shepherd was very popular amongst Christians in the 2nd and 3rd centuries.[3] It was bound as part of the New Testament[1][4] in the Codex Sinaiticus, and it was listed between the Acts of the Apostles and the Acts of Paul in the stichometrical list of the Codex Claromontanus.
In parable 5, the author mentions a Son of God, as a virtuous man filled with a Holy “pre-existent spirit” and adopted as the Son.[7] In the 2nd century, adoptionism (the view that Jesus Christ was at least initially, only a mortal man) was one of two competing doctrines about Jesus’ true nature, the other being that he pre-existed as a divine spirit (Logos); Christ’s identity with the Logos (Jn 1:1) was affirmed in 325 at the First Council of Nicaea.[8] Bogdan G. Bucur, however, notes how widely accepted the Shepherd of Hermas was among “orthodox” Christians, yet was never criticized for apparently exhibiting an adoptionistic Christology.
Miia, I read that parable.
But couldn’t see where it references Jesus as a mortal man made immortal by the Spirit.
What I read was a story about a servant who upon not only obeying the commandments did extra good works to please the LORD. Upon inspection of the LORD at what he had done to turn a weed filled field into a vineyard, he was so pleased that he decided to make him a son and share the inheritance of his already existing son.
Perhaps I read the wrong parable or something. Maybe you can guide me to the exact place.
Try CTRL F and type in ‘Parable/Similitude V’ once you are there. That is what I read.
Hi t8,
It is your site and you can do what you will.
The Spirit of God has never been welcomed among men of the earth.
It helps to keep to the discussion at hand and not make random negative comments that help no one.
You should be able to prove your doctrine with scripture. If you cannot, then no amount of negative feedback will change the fact that you haven’t supported your view with scripture and that you have not been able to argue against the scriptures given you.
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