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Quote (942767 @ Oct. 23 2007,11:32) Hi Morning Star: What about the following verse relative to your thesis?
Quote Hebrews 2:5-9
5 For unto the angels hath he not put in subjection the world to come, whereof we speak. 6 But one in a certain place testified, saying, What is man, that thou art mindful of him? or the son of man, that thou visitest him? 7 Thou madest him a little lower F6 than the angels; thou crownedst him with glory and honour, and didst set him over the works of thy hands: 8 Thou hast put all things in subjection under his feet. For in that he put all in subjection under him, he left nothing that is not put under him. But now we see not yet all things put under him. 9 But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honour; that he by the grace of God should taste death for every man.God Bless
exactly angels will no longer be in charge of the nations. we will be as the new spirit filled sons of god. Thanks for reminding me of this proof text.hebrews 2
17For this reason he had to be made like his brothers in every way, in order that he might become a merciful and faithful high priest in service to God, and that he might make atonement for[f]the sins of the people
you also reminded me of this verse. Where Jesus had to take on our form rather than his previous angelic form in order to help us. because since he doesnt help the angels he cant remain in his angelic form.
Quote (Morningstar @ Oct. 19 2007,02:26) Satan as a Morning Star, not just a morning star “A Fallen Morning Star”
Isaiah 14:12
12 How you have fallen from heaven,
O morning star, son of the dawn!
You have been cast down to the earth,
you who once laid low the nations!
Not Satan but the king of Babylon (Is 14:4), aka, Nebuchadnezzar. Satan is not a singular being in the Tanach, nor is “he” even mentioned here.whoops forgot to include verse 16 there.
hebrews 2
16For surely it is not angels he helps, but Abraham's descendants. 17For this reason he had to be made like his brothers in every way, in order that he might become a merciful and faithful high priest in service to God, and that he might make atonement for[f]the sins of the people.
I knew it was bound to happen…when a religion makes God in man's image, then it won't be too long after that man thinks he can be a god. The natural progression of pagan mythologies…
Quote (kejonn @ Oct. 23 2007,12:02) Quote (Morningstar @ Oct. 19 2007,02:26) Satan as a Morning Star, not just a morning star “A Fallen Morning Star”
Isaiah 14:12
12 How you have fallen from heaven,
O morning star, son of the dawn!
You have been cast down to the earth,
you who once laid low the nations!
Not Satan but the king of Babylon (Is 14:4), aka, Nebuchadnezzar. Satan is not a singular being in the Tanach, nor is “he” even mentioned here.
your right it might not be satan.but it is deffinately a son of god, angel, elohim
you are thinking of the prince of tyre.
all human rulers had heavenly rulers over them, principalities.
king of tyre = principality and power
prince of tyre = human rulerQuote (Morningstar @ Oct. 22 2007,19:05) Quote (kejonn @ Oct. 23 2007,12:02) Quote (Morningstar @ Oct. 19 2007,02:26) Satan as a Morning Star, not just a morning star “A Fallen Morning Star”
Isaiah 14:12
12 How you have fallen from heaven,
O morning star, son of the dawn!
You have been cast down to the earth,
you who once laid low the nations!
Not Satan but the king of Babylon (Is 14:4), aka, Nebuchadnezzar. Satan is not a singular being in the Tanach, nor is “he” even mentioned here.
your right it might not be satan.but it is deffinately a son of god, angel, elohim
you are thinking of the prince of tyre.
all human rulers had heavenly rulers over them, principalities.
king of tyre = principality and power
prince of tyre = human ruler
No, it says “king of Babylon” in v4. Last I looked, Nebuchadnezzar was not a “principality and power”. Nice try though.Quote (kejonn @ Oct. 23 2007,12:03) I knew it was bound to happen…when a religion makes God in man's image, then it won't be too long after that man thinks he can be a god. The natural progression of pagan mythologies…
please look through my verses i have posted and explain them to my weak mind then.explain to me how we dont become like God as an elohim who reigns with christ.
explain as these things i see written before me.
please dont just insult me.
Quote (kejonn @ Oct. 23 2007,12:12) Quote (Morningstar @ Oct. 22 2007,19:05) Quote (kejonn @ Oct. 23 2007,12:02) Quote (Morningstar @ Oct. 19 2007,02:26) Satan as a Morning Star, not just a morning star “A Fallen Morning Star”
Isaiah 14:12
12 How you have fallen from heaven,
O morning star, son of the dawn!
You have been cast down to the earth,
you who once laid low the nations!
Not Satan but the king of Babylon (Is 14:4), aka, Nebuchadnezzar. Satan is not a singular being in the Tanach, nor is “he” even mentioned here.
your right it might not be satan.but it is deffinately a son of god, angel, elohim
you are thinking of the prince of tyre.
all human rulers had heavenly rulers over them, principalities.
king of tyre = principality and power
prince of tyre = human ruler
No, it says “king of Babylon” in v4. Last I looked, Nebuchadnezzar was not a “principality and power”. Nice try though.
you seem a learned individual. may i ask what method you use for research?because i know the majority of non-religious scholars agree with me.
it makes me suspect that you are learning from a religious organization, because their really is a lot of information you can learn from higher criticism scholars.
why because they dont have a faith to defend in their studies.
how many verses must i show you. do i need to start listing of scholars here?
the nations were divided up amongst the sons of God.
these are the prinicpalities and powers paul spoke of.
Quote (Morningstar @ Oct. 22 2007,19:13) Quote (kejonn @ Oct. 23 2007,12:03) I knew it was bound to happen…when a religion makes God in man's image, then it won't be too long after that man thinks he can be a god. The natural progression of pagan mythologies…
please look through my verses i have posted and explain them to my weak mind then.explain to me how we dont become like God as an elohim who reigns with christ.
explain as these things i see written before me.
please dont just insult me.
I've already looked. The last statement summed up what I thought of them.Study Irenaeus. He agrees with you.
Quote (kejonn @ Oct. 23 2007,12:17) Quote (Morningstar @ Oct. 22 2007,19:13) Quote (kejonn @ Oct. 23 2007,12:03) I knew it was bound to happen…when a religion makes God in man's image, then it won't be too long after that man thinks he can be a god. The natural progression of pagan mythologies…
please look through my verses i have posted and explain them to my weak mind then.explain to me how we dont become like God as an elohim who reigns with christ.
explain as these things i see written before me.
please dont just insult me.
I've already looked. The last statement summed up what I thought of them.Study Irenaeus. He agrees with you.
i have thanks.but i also study modern scholarship.
you should study the ebionites. you seem pretty close to them.
Quote (Morningstar @ Oct. 22 2007,19:17) Quote (kejonn @ Oct. 23 2007,12:12) Quote (Morningstar @ Oct. 22 2007,19:05) Quote (kejonn @ Oct. 23 2007,12:02) Quote (Morningstar @ Oct. 19 2007,02:26) Satan as a Morning Star, not just a morning star “A Fallen Morning Star”
Isaiah 14:12
12 How you have fallen from heaven,
O morning star, son of the dawn!
You have been cast down to the earth,
you who once laid low the nations!
Not Satan but the king of Babylon (Is 14:4), aka, Nebuchadnezzar. Satan is not a singular being in the Tanach, nor is “he” even mentioned here.
your right it might not be satan.but it is deffinately a son of god, angel, elohim
you are thinking of the prince of tyre.
all human rulers had heavenly rulers over them, principalities.
king of tyre = principality and power
prince of tyre = human ruler
No, it says “king of Babylon” in v4. Last I looked, Nebuchadnezzar was not a “principality and power”. Nice try though.
you seem a learned individual. may i ask what method you use for research?because i know the majority of non-religious scholars agree with me.
it makes me suspect that you are learning from a religious organization, because their really is a lot of information you can learn from higher criticism scholars.
why because they dont have a faith to defend in their studies.
how many verses must i show you. do i need to start listing of scholars here?
the nations were divided up amongst the sons of God.
these are the prinicpalities and powers paul spoke of.
My method of research is contextual study (that is, don't just rip verses out of their surrounding passages to support a theology) and prayer. And every once in awhile, a commentary
.Don't be so quick to jump on the “non-religious scholars” bandwagon. They often have their own agenda: to make religious people look like fools.
Quote (kejonn @ Oct. 23 2007,12:20) Quote (Morningstar @ Oct. 22 2007,19:17) Quote (kejonn @ Oct. 23 2007,12:12) Quote (Morningstar @ Oct. 22 2007,19:05) Quote (kejonn @ Oct. 23 2007,12:02) Quote (Morningstar @ Oct. 19 2007,02:26) Satan as a Morning Star, not just a morning star “A Fallen Morning Star”
Isaiah 14:12
12 How you have fallen from heaven,
O morning star, son of the dawn!
You have been cast down to the earth,
you who once laid low the nations!
Not Satan but the king of Babylon (Is 14:4), aka, Nebuchadnezzar. Satan is not a singular being in the Tanach, nor is “he” even mentioned here.
your right it might not be satan.but it is deffinately a son of god, angel, elohim
you are thinking of the prince of tyre.
all human rulers had heavenly rulers over them, principalities.
king of tyre = principality and power
prince of tyre = human ruler
No, it says “king of Babylon” in v4. Last I looked, Nebuchadnezzar was not a “principality and power”. Nice try though.
you seem a learned individual. may i ask what method you use for research?because i know the majority of non-religious scholars agree with me.
it makes me suspect that you are learning from a religious organization, because their really is a lot of information you can learn from higher criticism scholars.
why because they dont have a faith to defend in their studies.
how many verses must i show you. do i need to start listing of scholars here?
the nations were divided up amongst the sons of God.
these are the prinicpalities and powers paul spoke of.
My method of research is contextual study (that is, don't just rip verses out of their surrounding passages to support a theology) and prayer. And every once in awhile, a commentary.Don't be so quick to jump on the “non-religious scholars” bandwagon. They often have their own agenda: to make religious people look like fools.
that is true.but, i can accept that.
BTW, don't Mormons support the idea that they will become “gods”?
Here's a question. If Christians are to become “gods” and rule, and non-christians are tossed in the lake of fire, who will we rule?
Quote (kejonn @ Oct. 23 2007,12:23) BTW, don't Mormons support the idea that they will become “gods”? Here's a question. If Christians are to become “gods” and rule, and non-christians are tossed in the lake of fire, who will we rule?
yes mormons do. I am not mormon. they mean god very differently.I simply mean elohim. Regents of God. Ruling Nations.
Nations populated by those who survived the return of Christ.
The earth will keep on trucking under new leadership for (literally i don't know) a thousand years.
the nations literally will be rule by christians and christ. plus i think their are far less christians in the world than statistics claim.
after this all things are made new and the Father will dwell among us when the son turns everything back over to him.
MS,
If the idea that you will be elohim excites you, good for you. Me, I'd rather live with a good ol' dose of humility and know who my God is.
Quote (kejonn @ Oct. 23 2007,12:35) MS, If the idea that you will be elohim excites you, good for you. Me, I'd rather live with a good ol' dose of humility and know who my God is.
does it excite me? yes. as any honest person would admit.I have always thought this stuff was stupid new age balogny too.
I considered it blasphemy.
Until, i could not deny the evidence of scripture.
I am not some new age quack on a power trip.
I am a Christian who was greatly surprised for things God has in store for us, that I have discovered in scripture.
Now this next part everyone hates, because built into it is the concept that I am somehow more learned or spiritual.
I do not think that is true. Knowledge of the mind will not impress God. Condition of the heart (spirit) is what will.
Anyway, I am just trying to say that everyone who thinks I have escaped from the insane asylum: I understand. I would have completely thought the same thing.
I just ask that you truly weigh the scriptures I give without making judgement prior. I know all of us make judgements but you know what I mean.
Be honest, have any of you truly weighed the evidence. Or have you hopped on your keyboard, preparing to convince me how perposterous what I am saying is?
Quote (Morningstar @ Oct. 23 2007,12:01) Quote (942767 @ Oct. 23 2007,11:32) Hi Morning Star: What about the following verse relative to your thesis?
Quote Hebrews 2:5-9
5 For unto the angels hath he not put in subjection the world to come, whereof we speak. 6 But one in a certain place testified, saying, What is man, that thou art mindful of him? or the son of man, that thou visitest him? 7 Thou madest him a little lower F6 than the angels; thou crownedst him with glory and honour, and didst set him over the works of thy hands: 8 Thou hast put all things in subjection under his feet. For in that he put all in subjection under him, he left nothing that is not put under him. But now we see not yet all things put under him. 9 But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honour; that he by the grace of God should taste death for every man.God Bless
exactly angels will no longer be in charge of the nations. we will be as the new spirit filled sons of god. Thanks for reminding me of this proof text.hebrews 2
17For this reason he had to be made like his brothers in every way, in order that he might become a merciful and faithful high priest in service to God, and that he might make atonement for[f]the sins of the people
you also reminded me of this verse. Where Jesus had to take on our form rather than his previous angelic form in order to help us. because since he doesnt help the angels he cant remain in his angelic form.
No MS: My point is that Jesus is not an angelic being, and he never was. An angel (messenger) yes, but not an angelic being.God Bless
Quote (942767 @ Oct. 23 2007,13:09) Quote (Morningstar @ Oct. 23 2007,12:01) Quote (942767 @ Oct. 23 2007,11:32) Hi Morning Star: What about the following verse relative to your thesis?
Quote Hebrews 2:5-9
5 For unto the angels hath he not put in subjection the world to come, whereof we speak. 6 But one in a certain place testified, saying, What is man, that thou art mindful of him? or the son of man, that thou visitest him? 7 Thou madest him a little lower F6 than the angels; thou crownedst him with glory and honour, and didst set him over the works of thy hands: 8 Thou hast put all things in subjection under his feet. For in that he put all in subjection under him, he left nothing that is not put under him. But now we see not yet all things put under him. 9 But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honour; that he by the grace of God should taste death for every man.God Bless
exactly angels will no longer be in charge of the nations. we will be as the new spirit filled sons of god. Thanks for reminding me of this proof text.hebrews 2
17For this reason he had to be made like his brothers in every way, in order that he might become a merciful and faithful high priest in service to God, and that he might make atonement for[f]the sins of the people
you also reminded me of this verse. Where Jesus had to take on our form rather than his previous angelic form in order to help us. because since he doesnt help the angels he cant remain in his angelic form.
No MS: My point is that Jesus is not an angelic being, and he never was. An angel (messenger) yes, but not an angelic being.God Bless
Yeah,I got your point and then proceeded to make mine.
Quote (Morningstar @ Oct. 23 2007,13:13) Quote (942767 @ Oct. 23 2007,13:09) Quote (Morningstar @ Oct. 23 2007,12:01) Quote (942767 @ Oct. 23 2007,11:32) Hi Morning Star: What about the following verse relative to your thesis?
Quote Hebrews 2:5-9
5 For unto the angels hath he not put in subjection the world to come, whereof we speak. 6 But one in a certain place testified, saying, What is man, that thou art mindful of him? or the son of man, that thou visitest him? 7 Thou madest him a little lower F6 than the angels; thou crownedst him with glory and honour, and didst set him over the works of thy hands: 8 Thou hast put all things in subjection under his feet. For in that he put all in subjection under him, he left nothing that is not put under him. But now we see not yet all things put under him. 9 But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honour; that he by the grace of God should taste death for every man.God Bless
exactly angels will no longer be in charge of the nations. we will be as the new spirit filled sons of god. Thanks for reminding me of this proof text.hebrews 2
17For this reason he had to be made like his brothers in every way, in order that he might become a merciful and faithful high priest in service to God, and that he might make atonement for[f]the sins of the people
you also reminded me of this verse. Where Jesus had to take on our form rather than his previous angelic form in order to help us. because since he doesnt help the angels he cant remain in his angelic form.
No MS: My point is that Jesus is not an angelic being, and he never was. An angel (messenger) yes, but not an angelic being.God Bless
Yeah,I got your point and then proceeded to make mine.
And what about the following scripture:Quote Heb 1:5
For unto which of the angels said he at any time, Thou art my Son, this day have I begotten thee? And again, I will be to him a Father, and he shall be to me a Son?Heb 5:5
So also Christ glorified not himself to be made an high priest; but he that said unto him, Thou art my Son, to day have I begotten thee.God Bless
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