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Hi KW,
You think stumbling is falling?
You think falling is failing?
You speak of grace but assign success to men and not God.
Strengthen those weak knees.
Nick,
You should work more at understanding me for your words run are at a tilt from what I actually said.
What I stated was a paraphrase of the words of Hebrews 6:4-6.
If I were sin I hope never to do what that passage speaks for it sounds like it speaks of a sin that leads to death. Instead I hope that I ever commit are due to lack of mature faith.
You are already aware that some stumbles lead to death but not every one does.
kerwin….brother Nick is right in this , ABRAHAMS FAITH did produce works of obediance, he left his homeland by it, he was willing to offered up Issac as a sacrifice by his FAITH IN GOD. But his works were not “RECONED’ to him as rightiousness , but his FAITH WAS, why?, because it was his faith that “caused” the works, it was not the works that caused the faith, it was the faith that did, so FAITH IN GOD was the true rightiousness, “reconed” to him, not that he “himself” was rightious, “THEREFORE by works of law, shall no flesh be justified before GOD”. “We are saved by “grace” through Faith, that not of ourselves, it is a gift of God.
Same thing applies to JESUS , it was his FAITH IN GOD, PRODUCING the works “IN” HIM, that is why he told the one who called him good, “why call me good, there is “only’ one that is good , and that is GOD”.
I do agree our faith should produce good fruit in our lives, remember faith is a veriable, unto whom little is given little is required, unto whom much is given much is required. Jesus even addressed his deciples as having little faith, saying, “O’ you of little faith”.
It truley is about FAITH. I believe you already know this. IMO
peace and love to you and yours. ………gene
Gene,
Your words are contradicting the words of James that faith without works is dead. This is because you are confused by the works of the flesh vs. the works of the Spirit. Paul often the earlier and James is addressing the later though he uses the earlier as an example.
Galatians 5:19-23New English Translation (NET Bible)
19 Now the works of the flesh are obvious: sexual immorality, impurity, depravity, 20 idolatry, sorcery, hostilities, strife, jealousy, outbursts of anger, selfish rivalries, dissensions, factions, 21 envying, murder, drunkenness, carousing, and similar things. I am warning you, as I had warned you before: Those who practice such things will not inherit the kingdom of God!
22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, 23 gentleness, and self-control. Against such things there is no law.
John 16:7New English Translation (NET Bible)
7 But I tell you the truth, it is to your advantage that I am going away. For if I do not go away, the Advocate will not come to you, but if I go, I will send him to you.
To bear the fruits of the Spirit Abraham would have to have the Spirit but he could not have had the Spirit because his mortal life was over before Jesus went away to send the Spirit to those that have faith. God considered this and so credited Abraham for what he would had he had the Spirit to walk by.
Do you believe Jesus words that the Spirit would come until he went away and sent it?
If you do then you also know Abraham could not have received it.
Nick,
That is what I am speaking of because if one does not have the Spirit of Christ in them doing its work then that one does not have Christ in them.
Nick,
So you fail to understand Scripture.
God dwells in believers through his own Spirit and Jesus Christ dwells in believers through his Spirit. It is not two Spirits but rather one with two names. (1 Corinthians 3:16)
It is about being Spiritually unified with Christ.
Hi KW,
The Spirit is one but has two dimensions.
The Spirit of the Son worships and serves the Father.
rom 8.15
It takes time and our cooperation before the Spirit dwelling in believers manifests.
gal 4.19
That’s right Nick,
Kerwin does not yet realize the important roll he plays in the story.
____________________________
Make it known brother
Ed JHi Andrew,
That is NOT what “I” was talking about. I was
talking about the roll we play towards others.Nick understands that now; though I don’t think
he did when I first started posting on this board.____________
God bless
Ed J“And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him,
that we may be also glorified together. For I reckon that the sufferings of this present time are not
worthy to be compared with the glory which shall be revealed in us. For the earnest expectation of
the creature waiteth for the manifestation of the sons of God. For the creature was made subject
to vanity, not willingly, but by reason of him who hath subjected the same in hope, Because the
creature itself also shall be delivered from the bondage of corruption into the glorious liberty
of the children of God. For we know that the whole creation groaneth and travaileth in pain
together until now. And not only they, but ourselves also, which have the firstfruits of the Spirit,
even we ourselves groan within ourselves, waiting for the adoption, to wit, the redemption of our body.”
(Romans 8:17-23)Ok then but the role we play toward others? I only read this last page and it sounds like you and Nick were referring to saving ones self,not others.And can we really save others btw? We can try to lead them and testify but the choice is theirs correct? It sometimes sickens me when I hear people on tv saying they have saved a “million”souls as if they’re presumptuously bragging for the rewards they think they’ll get in an afterlife.And if their boast or main concern is what they think they will get rewarded then it just seems arrogant,selfish and wrong to me.
When I first became a Christian with an innocent and seeking heart I couldn’t help but sense the arrogance that’s involved with it.But now after so many years I accept and know what it’s about and it’s not too heavenly in my estimation.But I still seek and hope for the heavenly bliss.
Nick,
The Spirit of the Son worships and serves the Father.
rom 8.15
That is why we are instructed to walk according to the Spirit.
It takes time and our cooperation before the Spirit dwelling in believers manifests.
gal 4.19
The verse is speaking of children in Christ who are not yet mature.
AndrewAD,
Jesus cannot make anyone come to him so why would we think we can. Those that will be saved through the new covenant will come to him because they hunger and thirst for righteousness while those that love sin will not come to him. The best a believer can do is speak the true message boldly and strive to remove obstacles from the paths of others.
You are correct we were not speaking of evangelism.
AndrewAD,
The Spirit does not give heavenly bliss in this world. It can give joy but I think even that is tinged with sorrow for those that will not inherit the kingdom. In addition the knowledge that all sin is malevolent and that it is common causes a maturing Christ more grief and perhaps anger as one matures. There is also glimpses of paradise.
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