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Hi Mercy,
I have tried to explain that the message we are to teach about salvation is written in the words of Peter in Acts 2 and those who claim other experiences and opinions carry as much weight as the Word of God are teaching popular but false teachings.
Sadly instead of listening and responding to the Spirit in the Word they judge me unsaved because I hold to scripture.It is not that we judge. It is because you haven't understood salvation. It is not just what it says in the Word. It is living the Word. It is experiencing the Word. To just say I read the Word and accept it is one thing. Unless you ask Jesus into your heart, you will not be saved. You must believe with all of your heart. It is not a matter of half heartedness. You have to surrender all of your self will to him Nick. Unless you turn it all over to God, you will not be saved. If you hold on to the world you will not be saved. You must let go of the world. You must surrender completely to Christ. He is at the door of your heart waiting to enter and all you have to do is let him in.
Hi H,
You say
” Unless you ask Jesus into your heart, you will not be saved “
It is not scriptural.
It is your teaching and beyond that of Christ himself.Hi H,
Harrassment of individuals is neither courteous nor even christian.
You have been warned about it before and we would not want further steps taken.Quote (Nick Hassan @ July 31 2006,22:24) Hi H,
Harrassment of individuals is neither courteous nor even christian.
You have been warned about it before and we would not want further steps taken.
Hey Nick,If a person with confesses Jesus with his mouth and ask Jesus in his heart but cannot get to water before he dies is he saved?
Quote (Nick Hassan @ July 31 2006,22:50) Hi kenrch,
I am not an oracle.
What does your bible say?
Round and round you go where Nick stops only the Lord knows!My bible Nick says the same that yours says. That there are people that are ignorant of the righteousness of God.
And that If you confess with your mouth and believe in your heart then you will be saved.
Nick, what are you talking about? The only way I can see if asking you to accept Christ into your heart as harrassment is if you don't know him and don't have him in your heart. That is what it is all about Nick, salvation. I am not doing this to harrass you, I am doing this because I love you and want you to enjoy God's free gift of salvation.
Quote (heiscomingintheclouds @ July 31 2006,23:17) Nick, what are you talking about? The only way I can see if asking you to accept Christ into your heart as harrassment is if you don't know him and don't have him in your heart. That is what it is all about Nick, salvation. I am not doing this to harrass you, I am doing this because I love you and want you to enjoy God's free gift of salvation.
Amen!Not to be arguementative or contentious – however – I believe the scriptures tell us to work out our own salvation with fear and trembling, to judge ourselves and our own standing before God – so that we do not fall short – to give ourselves the word test, and leave others to do the same.
This is not to say that we cannot admonish one another or encourage one another in the way that is right.
Now I know that the statement has been made that we must ask Jesus into our hearts in order to be saved.
The scripture renders it – confess with your lips and believe in your heart…
because with the heart man believes unto righteousness and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.I personally do not believe that any of us can find God, He finds us, we are lost and unable to find Him. No one can come to the Father (God) but by Jesus – and no one can come to Jesus unless God draws him.
So I do not see any asking Jesus to come into your heart, rather a requirement to believe with your heart when Jesus is revealed by God's Spirit to us.
We have to be willing to recieve him (the Word) and this is done by believing in our heart and confession of this (the Word that we have recieved) is made by the lips.
Then the love of God is shed abroad in our hearts by the Holy Spirit which is given to us.
Thats JMTCW
Quote (malcolm ferris @ Aug. 01 2006,10:54) Not to be arguementative or contentious – however – I believe the scriptures tell us to work out our own salvation with fear and trembling, to judge ourselves and our own standing before God – so that we do not fall short – to give ourselves the word test, and leave others to do the same. This is not to say that we cannot admonish one another or encourage one another in the way that is right.
Now I know that the statement has been made that we must ask Jesus into our hearts in order to be saved.
The scripture renders it – confess with your lips and believe in your heart…
because with the heart man believes unto righteousness and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.I personally do not believe that any of us can find God, He finds us, we are lost and unable to find Him. No one can come to the Father (God) but by Jesus – and no one can come to Jesus unless God draws him.
So I do not see any asking Jesus to come into your heart, rather a requirement to believe with your heart when Jesus is revealed by God's Spirit to us.
We have to be willing to recieve him (the Word) and this is done by believing in our heart and confession of this (the Word that we have recieved) is made by the lips.
Then the love of God is shed abroad in our hearts by the Holy Spirit which is given to us. Thats JMTCW
That's a good point, no one comes to Jesus unless the Father draws him. So if one confesses with his mouth and believes in his heart the Father drew him. The Father knows the persons heart. All that being the case can anyone say that the Father will deny him salvation if God's new son could not be baptized?Thanks Malcolm and God bless
Quote (Nick Hassan @ Aug. 01 2006,00:33) Hi H and kenrch,
I think I would prefer the love of a python.
Nick you already have the love of a snake and your words are as vinom. But that's alright I still love you!There is only one name in that which a man can be saved. The Holy Spirit will convict the man to repentance, but if the man does not call upon that name, he will not be saved. And that name is Jesus Christ.
The only thing I will add to this is that I see where both sides are coming from.
One side is stating a conversion experience
The other side is stating the pattern laid out in scripture for the definition of what conversion is
Only the individual and God will know if his experience is in line with scripture (assuming he/she knows scripture)
Romans 14:10
10 You, then, why do you judge your brother or sister? Or why do you treat your brother or sister with contempt? For we will all stand before God's judgment seat. 11 It is written:
” 'As surely as I live,' says the Lord,
'every knee will bow before me;
every tongue will confess to God.' ” [a]12 So then, we will all give an account of ourselves to God.
13 Therefore let us stop passing judgment on one another. Instead, make up your mind not to put any stumbling block or obstacle in the way of a brother or sister.
I realize that this is not talking about salvation and I have taken it out of context. I think the illustration is accurate, however.
Each side can clearly state his / her case but in the end we cannot usurp the throne of Christ and judge our fellow mans conversion.
Matthew 7:1-5
1 “Do not judge, or you too will be judged. 2 For in the same way you judge others, you will be judged, and with the measure you use, it will be measured to you.
3 “Why do you look at the speck of sawdust in someone else's eye and pay no attention to the plank in your own eye? 4 How can you say, 'Let me take the speck out of your eye,' when all the time there is a plank in your own eye? 5 You hypocrite, first take the plank out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to remove the speck from the other person's eye.I do indeed understand where Nick is coming from because I am often saddened by those who think that repeating “the sinner's prayer” is salvation. I think that by itself a sinners prayer is dangerous if a person does not understand that salvation is not a “repeat after me confession”. However, a sinners prayer in combination with faith, repentance, baptism and walking in righteousness as a new creature can be a wonderful way to make that first contact with your father.
My point is that asking Jesus into your heart may not be “the way” (meaning the scriptural outline) but I certainly think that it can and has accompanied the conversion in peoples lives, including my own.
When witnessing to others though I do not bring up that formula of “ask him into your heart”, because I do not want to confuse the person into thinking that salvation is a prayer rather than a whole hearted act of repentance.
People sometimes say the prayer and think that some intellectual knowledge of “the way” and a confession of it's truth is all that is needed for salvation. As if they are saved by a knowledge. Very Gnostic!
James 2:19
19 You believe that there is one God. Good! Even the demons believe that—and shudder.Just my two cents.
I would like to encourage the participants in this topic to:
1 Peter 3:15
15 But in your hearts revere Christ as Lord. Always be prepared to give an answer to everyone who asks you to give the reason for the hope that you have. But do this with gentleness and respect[U]Mercy,
I agree you can confess all you want but if your heart is not right then you have done nothing. The same is true for baptism if your heart is not right then all you do is get wet.
God knowing the heart of a believer who has accepted Jesus and cannot get baptized the Father will NOT deny him salvation. This is the righteousness of God.
AGAIN you will follow scripture and be baptized. But the foundation of the gospel is LOVE. And love is not going to murder anyone because he couldn't get to water.
God is not a murderer and if “anyone” thinks that God will murder His new Child then he is ignorant of the righteousness of the Father.
Rom 10:2 For I bear them witness that they have a zeal for God, but not according to knowledge.
Rom 10:3 For being ignorant of God's righteousness, and seeking to establish their own, they did not subject themselves to the righteousness of God.
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