The Trinity Doctrine

[Worshipping Jesus]

Hi All

I worship the Father, Son and the Holy Spirit for they are God!  

WJ

[Lightenup]

Istari wrote in the post above on this page:

Quote

And what use is a Sacrifice if the Sacrificed person still retained all that he had during the sacrificial period?

He gave up His body, His flesh and blood body was sacrificed. It was His body only that died.
Matt 10:28 “Do not fear those who kill the body but are unable to kill the soul; but rather fear Him who is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.

The body is what the Son added to Himself in order to, in part, then give it up as a sacrifice. Otherwise He could not have shed His own blood since, before the body of flesh and blood, He didn't have blood to shed.

[Istari]

WJ,

You are aware of what you just said!

You are aware of what you have committed yourself to!

You are now held to your words!

But you can still repent – but only in earnest!

WJ, if you believe so fervently in what you said, WHY OH WHY did it take so much effort to get it out of you?? Were you CONSIDERING, were you DOUBTING, were you DECIDING what you should say?

So, seeing that there was no trick, nothing unto-wards, then I ask 'How do you Worship the Holy Spirit'?

Do you pray to the Holy Spirit? Do you ask for grace, mercy, revelation, power, authority, wisdom, … What?, how?

Now, WJ, you are a church leader, so you MUST HAVE TAUGHT YOUR CONGREGATION to Also Pray to the HOLY SPIRIT?

Can you show me a Scripture that says to Worship the Holy Spirit, or where the Holy Spirit is called 'God'?

[Istari]

Then Kathi, Jesus lost NOTHING by his sacrifice!

Kathi, NOBODY's SPIRIT DIES… not Adam, Cain, Abraham, Satan, The Demon Angels, Lazarus, David, Saul, Samuel, Elijah….the Saints, the Apostles… No one!

SO, in that, how is Jesus different? No way at all : Before his Body died he committed it to God (!!!) his Father… And so did Saint STEVEN…

And how many other people DIED IN THE FLESH? Billions!
And how many other people's Spirit go back to God? The exact same number as died in the flesh!

Kathi, how was Jesus different that represents a Sacrifice seeing that – in your description – there was nothing different between Jesus and BILLIONS of others of mankind!

[Worshipping Jesus]

Quote (Istari @ June 01 2011,12:33)

WJ, WJ, if you believe so fervently in what you said, WHY OH WHY did it take so much effort to get it out of you?? Were you CONSIDERING, were you DOUBTING, were you DECIDING what you should say?

JA

Are you old and forgetful or are you on drugs?

Many months ago in this thread I had confessed the same thing.

I know in whom I have believed and I am not ashamed to say I worship the Father, Jesus and the Holy Spirit for they are “One God”.

WJ

[Lightenup]

Istari,
Dying was excruciatingly painful for the Son…He felt every whip lashed, ever nail pounded into his hands and heard every mocking comment, etc. He was the one who the sins of the whole world were put upon. There were several martyrs that died to some degree like that also but didn't bear all the sins of the world like He did. They didn't create the very ones who killed them like the Son did.

[Worshipping Jesus]

He was in the world, and “the world was made by him”, and the world knew him not. John 1:10

How true it is. So many do not even know their Creator!

WJ

[terraricca]

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ June 02 2011,08:27)

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ May 31 2011,17:23) Hi All I know in whom I have believed and am persuaded he is able to keep that which I have committed unto him against that day. I am saved, and filled with the Holy Ghost and Fire and the Spirit bears witness with my spirit that Jesus is my Great God and Savour.   WJ Hi All So why am I being attacked for quoting scriptures and confessing that I know in whom I believe? Why am I being attacked for confessing Jesus as my Great God and Savour? That is a scriptural confession isn't it? Doesn't the scriptures tell us Jesus is “God with us?” It is very telling and reminds me of what t8 just posted about men wanting to kill Jesus followers. WJ

WJ

Mt 22:37 Jesus replied: “ ‘Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.’
Mt 22:38 This is the first and greatest commandment.
Mt 22:39 And the second is like it: ‘Love your neighbor as yourself.’
Mt 22:40 All the Law and the Prophets hang on these two commandments.”

when you love God with all your heart and all your soul and mind ,what is there left to be worshiped

Pierre

[Worshipping Jesus]

Quote (terraricca @ June 01 2011,14:55)

Mt 22:40 All the Law and the Prophets hang on these two commandments.” when you love God with all your heart and all your soul and mind ,[b]what is there left to be worshiped

Peirre

Good point! Do you love Jesus with all your heart, soul, mind and strength?

If not why not?

WJ

[terraricca]

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ June 02 2011,14:35)

Quote (terraricca @ June 01 2011,14:55) Mt 22:40 All the Law and the Prophets hang on these two commandments.” when you love God with all your heart and all your soul and mind ,[b]what is there left to be worshiped Peirre Good point! Do you love Jesus with all your heart, soul, mind and strength? If not why not? WJ

WJ

there is only room in my heart and soul and mind for all the things God as made his doing and will do ,and worship only him for all those things he alone as made possible,even Christ is subdue to his God ,and he never claim to be worthy for being worshiped instead of his father.
yes we have to honor him ,

Pierre

[Worshipping Jesus]

Peirre

So I take that as a “No” you do not love Jesus with your whole heart, soul, mind, and strength?

WJ

[Istari]

Kathi and Keith,

I don't think you know what you are talking about concerning the death of Christ.
First you say he only died in the flesh because his Spirit didn't die (When no one said anything about the Spirit dying!) then you say that he died in excruciating pain … Tell me: was Jesus the ONLY PERSON beaten with those cruel tortour whips? Were they created just for Jesus? Or were they a normal tool of torture used on MANY CRIMINALS …!

AND the Nails … Didn't all those who were crucified also similarly nailed so?

Wasn't the REAL PAIN AND SUFFERING because Jesus was COMPLETELY INNOCENT OF ANY CRIME?

Why did Jesus sweat blood if his only sacrifice was death in 'sleep' of the body.
Did the thief on the cross sweat blood over his death?
Do those in battle sweat blood before the battle?

No, so what was Jesus' sacrifice? An unsinful man cannot die for his body is as perfect as can be made human and sustained by the Holy Spirit of God the father.
In order to die the Holy Spirit must first be removed.
This is why Jesus called out to his father: 'Father, why have you foresaken me?'. This is the point where Jesus' body took on the Sins of mankind and he was then subject to death in the flesh.

Jesus DID NOT KNOW IF HE COULD BE RAISED UP AGAIN.
If he could not be raised up again then he would be PERMANENTLY DEAD.

Jesus TRUSTED that his father COULD RAISE HIM UP AGAIN…

So here lies the Sacrifice: That he would die for Mankind… Take away the Dins of Mankind – the Perfect UNBLEMISHED SACRIFICIAL LAMB – one life of a pure Man for the sinful life of another ('For by one man sin came, and by another perfect one sin was expunged')

If Jesus was God – What Sacrifice did he give – none!!!

Else what are all those verses written for saying 'For if Christ did not die and was raised again then there is no sacrifice – and if no sacrifice then we are all still in sin'
And 'If you call Jesus a liar (that he did not die and was raised again) then you crucify him again'

K and K, that is what you have both just done: you have both just claimed that Jesus DID NOT DIE – but went to heaven in the Spirit (Only his body died – which is inconsequential!!)
This is calling Scriptures lies!!!

All this because you KNOW THAT A GOD CANNOT DIE – so you MUST SAY THAT JESUS DIDN'T DIE!!
Yet Scriptures clearly says he did – AND – if you say otherwise you make the The Apostles, Jesus and God, liars (Ooh look, a Trinity with ONE NAME(s): Witnesses and liars)

It was to give his life

[Proclaimer]

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ June 02 2011,04:01)

Hi All I worship the Father, Son and the Holy Spirit for they are God!   WJ

Good to see you using the word “they”.
Don't forget to use the word “them” too.

Just don't use “Him” or “his”. That would be deceptive.

We use those words who believe that the Father is the one true God.

Thanks WJ.

[terraricca]

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ June 02 2011,16:33)

Peirre So I take that as a “No” you do not love Jesus with your whole heart, soul, mind, and strength? WJ

WJ

you now see how your conclusions are wrong and not guided by the holy spirit of truth ,

it is not no it is yes but in the arrangement of God ,not like you as a preference against Gods own command.

Pierre

[Worshipping Jesus]

Quote (t8 @ June 01 2011,18:12)

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ June 02 2011,04:01) Hi All I worship the Father, Son and the Holy Spirit for they are God!   WJ Good to see you using the word “they”. Don't forget to use the word “them” too. Just don't use “Him” or “his”. That would be deceptive. We use those words who believe that the Father is the one true God. Thanks WJ.

t8

Make sure you when you speak of God doing or saying anything in your life that you say “They Spoke to you” or “I believe in them as my Savour and Lord and King”.

This is so silly this straw man argument you have built.  

God is they and them to us because you cannot have God without “them” or “they” can you t8?

Blessings!

WJ

[Worshipping Jesus]

Quote (terraricca @ June 01 2011,18:59)

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ June 02 2011,16:33) Peirre So I take that as a “No” you do not love Jesus with your whole heart, soul, mind, and strength? WJ WJ you now see how your conclusions are wrong and not guided by the holy spirit of truth , it is not no it is yes but in the arrangement of God ,not like you as a preference against Gods own command. Pierre

Pierre

All you had to do was say “Yes” I do love Jesus with my whole heart, soul, mind and strength.

Instead you beat around the bush.

Now since you confess that you give all your being to Jesus then how is that different than giving all you being to God?

They are One Peirre and you can't have one without the other.

BTW, Do you pray to Jesus and have fellowship with him?

WJ

[Worshipping Jesus]

Quote (Istari @ June 01 2011,18:01)

All this because you KNOW THAT A GOD CANNOT DIE – so you MUST SAY THAT JESUS DIDN'T DIE!!

God is Spirit and the Spirit of Jesus did not die because he was the “Eternal life” that was with the Father in the beginning of all things. 1 John 1:1-3

Eternal life cannot die!

Jesus said he was the Life! John 14:6

Jesus said he was the resurrection and the life. John 11:25

His soul was not left in hell and his flesh did not see corruption. Acts 2:31

Jesus said destroy this temple (his body) and I will raise it again in three days. John 2:19

Jesus also said no man takes his life from him but that he had the power to lay down his life and he had the power to take it up again. John 10:18

Jesus said he would be in the heart (center of the earth) for three days and three nights as Jonah was alive in the belly of the fish. Matt 12:40

Jesus said whosoever lives and believes in me will never die. Matt 12:40 (it is obvious Jesus is not speaking of physical death here)

Jesus also said “fear not them that are able to kill the body but are not able to kill the soul”. Matt 10:28
(obviously death here is not what you say it is)

Jesus also said the rich man was in hell in torments and pleading for water. Luke 16:20-28
(Jesus is not telling a story based on untruths but in fact Jesus mentions the name Lazarus and in all other parables he never mentions names. This is further proof that his story is real and not a fantasy based on false premises.)

I could go on but the question is “how do you define death?”, because if death means to cease to exist then all the scriptures above and many more are useless.

Did God destroy Jesus Spirit/soul when he gave up the ghost or did Jesus leave his body and descend into hell for 3 days as the scriptures proclaim?

So once again, since Jesus Spirit is the Spirit of God, the Spirit of Christ. then God, the Word that was with God and was God, did not die.

He was put to death in the flesh but not in the Spirit. His Spirit/soul lived on because he was/is the Eternal Life.

WJ

[SimplyForgiven]

Good post WJ!
Your one bright old man, with a bright futureeee…..ehh well whatever years you got left

[Worshipping Jesus]

Quote (SimplyForgiven @ June 02 2011,14:38)

Good post WJ! Your one bright old man, with a bright futureeee…..ehh well whatever years you got left

Thanks Dennison. I will take that as a compliment “green horn”.

WJ

[Istari]

Yes, SF, a VERY BRIGHT FUTURE – in fact SO BRIGHT he will disappear into OBLIVION.

It is clear that he made up EVERY LAST BIT OF HIS POST from desperation of knowing he is wrong in his assessment.

We have clashed swords before and he, WJ, has been on the losing side everytime – he is only trying his luck again – he's a sure one for cruising for a bruising!

He has not posted for a time because he spent that time trying to figure out HOW HE WAS GOING TO RESPOND… you notice he ignores anything that he CANNOT ANSWER and only picks the bits that he THINKS he can get away with.

Can you believe this guy has been posting ONLY CONCERNING TRINITY for OVER TWELVE YEARS and these are the best lame inaccurate outlandish twisted and distorted ideas he can muster – AND HE TEACHES these things to others in his Church – wow – poor parishioners!!!0

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