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Hi CB,
You say
“Did you catch that? That's one “holy” for each person of the Godhead!”
Now I am convinced!Quote (Tim2 @ April 20 2007,19:11) Adam, That's right. I don't know Hebrew. Do you? Was Moses called something other than El or Elohim? Please tell me. Because the judges of men were called Elohim (Psalm 82, and many think, in Exodus 21:6 and 22:9). …
Tim
so Tim, are you saying you stand corrected?
That Moses is indeed actually called elohim in scripture, and not el?
(which btw is what I said to begin with!)
Moses is called twice, elohimTim2
To do the quote thing. If you want to respond to someones post or even add to your own, just left click on the “QUOTE” button in the top right corner of the post and then type in the white box your response.
I have a habit of clicking on preview post since I dont have editing rights, I am not sure why.
Hope this helps. Its sometimes difficult to seperate the post from the response if you dont.
Blessings!
Hi CB,
Do you hold that Is 6 speaks of Jesus on his private throne as many here do following the wrong translation of the NIV? Comparison with the similar view in Rev4 and Dan7 suggests it is in fact the Father seen in the vision.If so why would the angels attending one “Deity” be praising three “deities”?
Quote (Tim2 @ April 21 2007,06:11) Adam, That's right. I don't know Hebrew. Do you? Was Moses called something other than El or Elohim? Please tell me. Because the judges of men were called Elohim (Psalm 82, and many think, in Exodus 21:6 and 22:9). In any event, I don't see how Moses being made “as” God in relation to Pharaoh somehow suggests that in the beginning, the Word was not God.
Ken,
The Father and the Holy Spirit are not the same. The voice during Jesus' baptism came from heaven, not the dove. And Jesus distinguished the Holy Spirit from the Father in John 14:16 and 15:26.
Tim
The Holy Spirit is not a person but a dove! OH!!Quote (Tim2 @ April 21 2007,06:11) Adam, That's right. I don't know Hebrew. Do you?
This is something I would like to know too Adam Pastor. I recall you making derogatory remarks of this nature to me too in the past. So, Adam, exactly how well do you know the Hebrew language?Quote (WorshippingJesus @ April 21 2007,08:12) Tim2 To do the quote thing. If you want to respond to someones post or even add to your own, just left click on the “QUOTE” button in the top right corner of the post and then type in the white box your response.
I have a habit of clicking on preview post since I dont have editing rights, I am not sure why.
Hope this helps. Its sometimes difficult to seperate the post from the response if you dont.
Blessings!
RIGHT ON! Thanks WJ, I've been wondering how to use this quote thing, too.
Adam,
1. I don't see what your point is that Elohim was used in reference to Moses. Elohim is used with reference to the judges of Israel. What does that have to do with Jesus? Is He just a judge of Israel, or only equal to Moses? If you have special insight into Hebrew, please let us know.
2. Elohim is used referring to Moses in Exodus 4:16 and 7:1. In 4:1, the Septuagint says:
και αυτος σοι προσλαλησει προς τον λαον και αυτος εσται
σου στομα συ δε αυτω εση τα προς τον θεονAccording to Trenchard's dictionary of New Testament Greek, προς in the genitive means, “in the interest of.” In the dative it means “close to” a place. In the accusative it means “on behalf of.” So Moses acts in the interest of or on behalf of God. Hence, C.L. Brenton in 1850 translated it: thou shalt be for him in things pertaining to God.
In Exodus 7:1, the Septuagint reads:
και ειπεν κυριος προς Μωυσην λεγων ιδου δεδωκα σε θεον
Φαραω και Ααρων ο αδελφος σου εσται σου προφητηςδεδωκα means, “to give, bestow, produce, make, cause, or entrust.” So Moses was, as usually translated made theon to Pharaoh. Brenton translates it, “I have made thee a god to Pharaoh.” Again, when does the New Testament say Jesus was “made” a god?
Tim
Hi ,
Tim2 has made this startling admission about the basis of the trinity PROPOSITION” it is the only possible inference from Scripture, because the Scripture testifies that three persons are God. “
The whole basis of this so called Foundational DOCTRINE is not scripture but INFERENCE.
Thus he shows that it is a false doctrine.
Quote (Tim2 @ April 21 2007,05:09) Adam, 1. I don't see what your point is that Elohim was used in reference to Moses.
My point simply was that …
You said Moses is actually called el
And I was simply pointed out not so!
He is called elohim not elThat's the only point I was making.
BTW thanks for the infokenrch
Quote The apostles baptized in Jesus' name only. Why? Col 2:9 For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.
Quote (Cult Buster @ April 22 2007,00:49) kenrch Quote The apostles baptized in Jesus' name only. Why? Col 2:9 For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.
I agree CB, If you baptize in Jesus name then you have baptized in the Father's name also and the Holy Spirit who has the same name as Jehovah.Jesus and the Father are one in Spirit, the Holy Spirit of God.
God bless,
IHN&L,
Ken
Quote (Not3in1 @ April 21 2007,10:45) Quote (WorshippingJesus @ April 21 2007,08:12) Tim2 To do the quote thing. If you want to respond to someones post or even add to your own, just left click on the “QUOTE” button in the top right corner of the post and then type in the white box your response.
I have a habit of clicking on preview post since I dont have editing rights, I am not sure why.
Hope this helps. Its sometimes difficult to seperate the post from the response if you dont.
Blessings!
RIGHT ON! Thanks WJ, I've been wondering how to use this quote thing, too.
Not3Your welcome!!!
Quote (Cult Buster @ April 22 2007,00:49) kenrch Quote The apostles baptized in Jesus' name only. Why? Col 2:9 For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.
Hi CB,
Did “the trinity”
or
God
dwell in Christ?Hi,
The simple fact of the matter is that God never, ever, revealed Himself as a trinity.
Men surmised these things by failing to understand who is the Son God sent.
Trinity god is a foreign god, foreign to scripture, foreign to the Jews
and foreign to Jesus and the apostles and prophets.
We do not worship and serve foreign gods.Quote David thats very enlightening. Especially since it is written by Non-Trinitarians.
How surprising!
Heres some more news…
Wikopedia JWs
WJ, the fact that you have to resort to this…. showing what the “critics” think of JW's in a trinity thread, in an attempt to fallaciously prove that the trinity is correct or something….ridiculous.
Have you ever heard of the word “fallacy”? We all use them, often not realizing it. You use them quite frequently however.
Taken from wikipedia under: “nontrinitariansim:”
Ontological Differences Between “God” and Jesus
Jesus prays to God. (John 17:1-3)
Jesus has faith in God. (Hebrews 2:17,18 Hebrews 3:2)
Jesus is a servant of God. (Acts 3:13)
Jesus does not know things God knows. (Mark 13:32 Revelation 1:1)
Jesus worships God. (John 4:22)
Jesus has one who is God to him. (Revelation 3:12)
Jesus is in subjection to God. (1 Corinthians 15:28)
Jesus’ head is God. (1 Corinthians 11:1)
Jesus has reverent submission, fear, of God. ( Hebrews 5:7)
Jesus is given lordship by God. (Acts 2:36)
Jesus is exalted by God. (Acts 5:31)
Jesus is made high priest by God.. (Hebrews 5:10)
Jesus is given authority by God. (Philippians 2:9)
Jesus is given kingship by God. (Luke 1:32,33
Jesus is given judgment by God. (Acts 10:42)
“God rasied [Jesus] from the dead.” (Acts 2:24, Romans 10.9, 1 Cor 15:15)
Jesus is at the right hand of God. (Mark 16:19, Luke 22:69, Acts 2:33, Romans 8:34)
Jesus is the one human mediator between the one God and man. (1 Tim 2:5)
God put everything, except Himself, under Jesus. (1 Cor 15:24-28)
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