The soul

[terraricca]

David

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It's talking about being fearful of God, who can not only destroy the life (present life) but can destroy all future prospects of future life, in Gehenna. (Or, “hell” as this bible translates it)

I think you misunderstand what Christ says ;this live i mean this live in this age is cursed and all will die because of our sins,

and so we will be resurrected but witch resurrection will we be in the first or the second ?

and we know that the soul (spirit ) can not live or act in live so only God can take that away from us ,in one way if we do not receive a body from God we are dead or inactive and useless ,

in the second resurrection when the judgement is done a body is given back to all the souls so that true judgement can take place because it is what we do or not do and should that we will judge on,

this is my view

Pierre

[kerwin]

To all

We Have soul (Nephesh) which is defined in the following ways.

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1.soul, self, life, creature, person, appetite, mind, living being, desire, emotion, passion a.that which breathes, the breathing substance or being, soul, the inner being of man b.living being c.living being (with life in the blood) d.the man himself, self, person or individual e.seat of the appetites f.seat of emotions and passions g.activity of mind 1.dubious h.activity of the will 1.dubious i.activity of the character 1.dubious

We also have breath(neshamah) that is defined by Stong’s in following ways.

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1.breath, spirit a.breath (of God) b.breath (of man) c.every breathing thing d.spirit (of man)

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Ps 18:15 Then the channels of waters were seen, and the foundations of the world were discovered at thy rebuke,O LORD, at the blast of the breath of thy nostrils.

In this verse ”neshamah” is translated to ‘blast’ and not to ‘breath’ which makes it sound like the force of the wind instead of the wind itself.  The word translated to “breath” is “ruwach” which also means “wind” and “spirit”.  In this verse “ruwach” and ”neshamah” are two characteristics of God’s breath.

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Pr 20:27 The spirit of man is the candle of the LORD, searching all the inward parts of the belly.

In this scripture ”neshamah” is translated spirit.

The same ability attributed to ”neshamah” in Proverbs 20:27 is also attributed to the common Greek word Pneuma translated to “spirit” in 1 Corinthians 2:11.

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1Co 2:11 For what man knoweth the things of a man, save the spirit of man which is in him? even so the things of God knoweth no man, but the Spirit of God.

Note 1: I was unable to write the special symbol over the “e” in ”neshamah”.

Note 2:All scriptures from the KJV.

Note 3:All definitions from Strong's.

[GeneBalthrop]

Kerwin……….Brother , but non of that can act without a BODY to ACT (IN)> A spirit is useless without a Body to LIVE IN ,it can do Nothing of Itself, God created BODIES i.e. Souls to INDWELL and without a body a soul does not and can not EXIST. IMO

peace and love to you and yours……………………………………….gene

[mikeboll64]

Quote (Gene Balthrop @ July 10 2011,10:56)

A spirit is useless without a Body to LIVE IN ,it can do Nothing of Itself

Then how do the evil spirits go into arid places before coming back with more powerful spirits? Once they leave the body, how is it that THEY go to arid places if they are “useless without a body to LIVE IN”?

[kerwin]

Quote (Gene Balthrop @ July 10 2011,22:56)

Kerwin……….Brother , but non of that can act without a BODY to ACT (IN)> A spirit is useless without a Body to LIVE IN ,it can do Nothing of Itself, God created BODIES i.e. Souls to INDWELL and without a body a soul does not and can not EXIST. IMO peace and love to you and yours……………………………………….gene

Gene,

Be careful not to limit yourself as God is spirit and is the one who created all bodies as well as establishing the laws of creation.

[GeneBalthrop]

MIke…………Think of this , why do you think Jesus said you must be born of Water (AND) Spirit, The water is the vessel through which the Spirit works it a type of body and is present in all bodies that has life in them, nothing exist as a live substance with out water (IN) it an a spirit can not animate it either, all organic matter has spirit (IN) it while all inorganic matter has no spirit working in it, And a Spirit in a state of animation is useless , it could not effect the man in which it came out off again unless it goes back (INTO) him ,nor could it effect any person it was not in. Because it has nothing to animate, You keep looking at spirit like you look at a human being . Spirit is not a body it can only operate with (IN) a Body of some kind. The term “Arid Places” is like saying it is just drifting around in endless waste but can't find rest unless it is (IN) a Body. That includes all Spirits of all types. God lives vicariously (IN) His creation His creation IS his Body. Do you see what i am saying Mike?

peace and love……………………………………….gene

[terraricca]

Quote (Gene Balthrop @ July 11 2011,18:44)

MIke…………Think of this , why do you think Jesus said you must be born of Water (AND) Spirit, The water is the vessel through which the Spirit works it a type of body and is present in all bodies that has life in them, nothing exist as a live substance with out water (IN) it an a spirit can not animate it either, all organic matter has spirit (IN) it while all inorganic matter has no spirit working in it, And  a Spirit in a state of animation is useless , it could not effect the man in which it came out off again unless it goes back (INTO) him ,nor could it effect any person it was not in. Because it has nothing to animate, You keep looking at spirit like you look at a human being . Spirit is not a body it can only operate with (IN) a Body of some kind. The term “Arid Places” is like saying it is just drifting around in endless waste but can't find rest unless it is (IN) a Body. That includes all Spirits of all types. God lives vicariously (IN) His creation His creation IS his Body. Do you see what i am saying Mike? peace and love……………………………………….gene

gene

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why do you think Jesus said you must be born of Water (AND) Spirit

water stands for knowledge and so spirit stands for what is from above ;this is my understanding

so to make it sound well;

WE HAVE TO ABSORB THE KNOWLEDGE FROM GOD TO BECOME HOLY
you see all the things we have learn are from men not from God.so we have to start over but from God

Pierre

[GeneBalthrop]

Quote (kerwin @ July 11 2011,08:01)

Quote (Gene Balthrop @ July 10 2011,22:56) Kerwin……….Brother , but non of that can act without a BODY to ACT (IN)> A spirit is useless without a Body to LIVE IN ,it can do Nothing of Itself, God created BODIES i.e. Souls to INDWELL and without a body a soul does not and can not EXIST. IMO peace and love to you and yours……………………………………….gene Gene, Be careful not to limit yourself as God is spirit and is the one who created all bodies as well as establishing the laws of creation.

Kerwin………..I do limit myself i believe when i die I am in a Perished State with No remaining Life or thoughts I am gone for ever and unless GOD the Father recreates for me a new Body I will never live again. My only hope is in Him to resurrect a Body for me as He did for Jesus and add spirit back into it, and then i will become a LIVING SOUL AGAIN. IMO

God the FATHER is our (ONLY) Hope and He was Jesus (ONLY) HOPE also after he died. Its like this, consider the little baby birds in a nest , look how intently they look at there Mother for life nourishing food as if their whole existence depend only on their mother feeding them and it does. Even so it is with us it's God the Father who holds our very life in his Hands to give us life or to destory us.  We all need to look and Pray Intently to our God and Father, just as Jesus did. IMO

peace and love to you Kerwin and yours brother………………….gene

[kerwin]

Quote (Gene Balthrop @ July 11 2011,06:59)

Quote (kerwin @ July 11 2011,08:01) Quote (Gene Balthrop @ July 10 2011,22:56) Kerwin……….Brother , but non of that can act without a BODY to ACT (IN)> A spirit is useless without a Body to LIVE IN ,it can do Nothing of Itself, God created BODIES i.e. Souls to INDWELL and without a body a soul does not and can not EXIST. IMO peace and love to you and yours……………………………………….gene Gene, Be careful not to limit yourself as God is spirit and is the one who created all bodies as well as establishing the laws of creation. Kerwin………..I do limit myself i believe when i die I am in a Perished State with No remaining Life or thoughts I am gone for ever and unless GOD the Father recreates for me a new Body I will never live again. My only hope is in Him  to resurrect a Body for me as He did for Jesus and add spirit back into it, and then i will become a LIVING SOUL AGAIN. IMO God the FATHER is our (ONLY) Hope and He was Jesus (ONLY) HOPE also after he died. Its like this, consider the little baby birds in a nest , look how intently they look at there Mother for life nourishing food as if their whole existence depend only on their mother feeding them and it does. Even so it is with us it's God the Father who holds our very life in his Hands to give us life or to destory us.  We all need to look and Pray Intently to our God and Father, just as Jesus did.  IMO peace and love to you Kerwin and yours brother………………….gene

Gene,

A living creature has both a spirit side and a flesh side.

[kerwin]

To all,

We can see from Genesis 2:7, Genesis 6:17 and Genesis 7:15 that Ruwach and N@shamah are synonyms when used in the clause breathe of life.

Ruwach translated to breath.

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Ge 6:17 And, behold, I, even I, do bring a flood of waters upon the earth, to destroy all flesh, wherein is the breath of life, from under heaven; and every thing that is in the earth shall die.

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Ge 7:15 And they went in unto Noah into the ark, two and two of all flesh, wherein is the breath of life.

In Psalms 31:13, Psalms 38:12 and 1 Kings 15:29 we can see that one without either Nephesh or N@shamah is dead.  So either they are the same thing or both are required for a human body to live.

Nephesh translated to life.

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Ps 31:13 ForI have heard the slander of many: fear was on every side: while they took counsel together against me, they devised to take away my life.

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Ps 38:12 They also that seek after my life lay snares for me: and they that seek my hurt speak mischievous things, and imagine deceits all the day long.

N@shamah translated to that breathed.

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1Ki 15:29 And it came to pass, when he reigned, that he smote all the house of Jeroboam; he left not to Jeroboam any that breathed, until he had destroyed him, according unto the saying of the LORD, which he spake by his servant Ahijah the Shilonite:

Strong’s definitions for soul (Nephesh) meanings are as follows.

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1.soul, self, life, creature, person, appetite, mind, living being, desire, emotion, passion a.that which breathes, the breathing substance or being, soul, the inner being of man b.living being c.living being (with life in the blood) d.the man himself, self, person or individual e.seat of the appetites f.seat of emotions and passions g.activity of mind 1.dubious h.activity of the will 1.dubious i.activity of the character 1.dubious

Definitions for breath (neshamah) from Strong’s entry 5397 are as follows.

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1.breath, spirit a.breath (of God) b.breath (of man) c.every breathing thing d.spirit (of man)

Strong’s definitions of spirit (Ruwach) are as follows.

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wind, breath, mind, spirit breath wind of heaven quarter (of wind), side breath of air air, gas vain, empty thing spirit (as that which breathes quickly in animation or agitation) spirit, animation, vivacity, vigour courage temper, anger impatience, patience spirit, disposition (as troubled, bitter, discontented) disposition (of various kinds), unaccountable or uncontrollable impulse prophetic spirit spirit (of the living, breathing being in man and animals) as gift, preserved by God, God's spirit, departing at death, disembodied being spirit (as seat of emotion) desire sorrow, trouble spirit as seat or organ of mental acts rarely of the will as seat especially of moral character Spirit of God, the third person of the triune God, the Holy Spirit, coequal, coeternal with the Father and the Son as inspiring ecstatic state of prophecy as impelling prophet to utter instruction or warning imparting warlike energy and executive and administrative power as endowing men with various gifts as energy of life as manifest in the Shekinah glory never referred to as a depersonalised force

In examination of the above definitions for soul (Nephesh), breath (neshamah), and spirit (Ruwach) it is observed they have a similar meaning in common.  That meaning is phrased “that which breathes, the breathing substance or being, soul, the inner being of man” or “spirit (of the living, breathing being in man and animals) or spirit (of man).

[terraricca]

Kerwin

and so ?

[kerwin]

Quote (terraricca @ July 14 2011,03:58)

Kerwin and so ?

Pierre,

I just followed a path through scripture to demonstrate that in at least one context the spirit, breath, and soul are all synonyms of the inner being or at least aspects of the inner being.

Spirit is also defined as the root of moral character; for example the spirit of holiness or the spirit of unrighteousness.

[terraricca]

Quote (kerwin @ July 14 2011,22:08)

Quote (terraricca @ July 14 2011,03:58) Kerwin and so ? Pierre, I just followed a path through scripture to demonstrate that in at least one context the spirit, breath, and soul are all synonyms of the inner being or at least aspects of the inner being. Spirit is also defined as the root of moral character; for example the spirit of holiness or the spirit of unrighteousness.

Kerwin

did you find out who is you the body of flesh and blood or the inner part is you ?

if we remove the flesh what is left is it you if yes then this would be your soul

if we remove the inside and keep your body of flesh and blood would this live and move and talk or is it only a tool to that the inside soul can use to do all of that ?

Pierre

[kerwin]

Quote (terraricca @ July 14 2011,10:47)

Quote (kerwin @ July 14 2011,22:08) Quote (terraricca @ July 14 2011,03:58) Kerwin and so ? Pierre, I just followed a path through scripture to demonstrate that in at least one context the spirit, breath, and soul are all synonyms of the inner being or at least aspects of the inner being. Spirit is also defined as the root of moral character; for example the spirit of holiness or the spirit of unrighteousness. Kerwin did you find out who is you the body of flesh and blood or the inner part is you ? if we remove the flesh what is left is it you if yes then this would be your soul if we remove the inside and keep your body of flesh and blood would this live and move and talk or is it only a tool to that the inside soul can use to do all of that ? Pierre

I have been brought up to believe the inner part is but I am currently not positive it is all of me.

[terraricca]

Quote (kerwin @ July 15 2011,22:55)

Quote (terraricca @ July 14 2011,10:47) Quote (kerwin @ July 14 2011,22:08) Quote (terraricca @ July 14 2011,03:58) Kerwin and so ? Pierre, I just followed a path through scripture to demonstrate that in at least one context the spirit, breath, and soul are all synonyms of the inner being or at least aspects of the inner being. Spirit is also defined as the root of moral character; for example the spirit of holiness or the spirit of unrighteousness. Kerwin did you find out who is you the body of flesh and blood or the inner part is you ? if we remove the flesh what is left is it you if yes then this would be your soul if we remove the inside and keep your body of flesh and blood would this live and move and talk or is it only a tool to that the inside soul can use to do all of that ? Pierre I have been brought up to believe the inner part is but I am currently not positive it is all of me.

kerwin

the scriptures do not promise to save your flesh,it is ask you to give it up ,the flesh is not you it your tool

the soul is you and that was protected since the beginning by God,this is why Christ says not to be afraid of those who only can kill the flesh

Pierre

[kerwin]

Quote (terraricca @ July 15 2011,11:07)

kerwin the scriptures do not promise to save your flesh,it is ask you to give it up ,the flesh is not you it your tool the soul is you and that was protected since the beginning by God,this is why Christ says not to be afraid of those who only can kill the flesh Pierre

Pierre,

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New International Version (NIV) 31 But about the resurrection of the dead—have you not read what God said to you, 32 ‘I am the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob’? He is not the God of the dead but of the living.”

What part of Abraham, Jacob, and Isaac was alive at the time of Mosses?

Did they already undergo the final resurrection of was it yet to come?

Since one part of them yet lived then what part would be resurrected?

[terraricca]

kerwin

.

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What part of Abraham, Jacob, and Isaac was alive at the time of Mosses? Did they already undergo the final resurrection of was it yet to come? Since one part of them yet lived then what part would be resurrected?

1Co 15:23 But each in his own turn: Christ, the firstfruits; then, when he comes, those who belong to him

1Co 15:24 Then the end will come, when he hands over the kingdom to God the Father after he has destroyed all dominion, authority and power.
1Co 15:25 For he must reign until he has put all his enemies under his feet.
1Co 15:26 The last enemy to be destroyed is death.

1Co 15:35 But someone may ask, “How are the dead raised? With what kind of body will they come?”
1Co 15:36 How foolish! What you sow does not come to life unless it dies.

1Co 15:44 it is sown a natural body, it is raised a spiritual body.
If there is a natural body, there is also a spiritual body.

1Co 15:57 But thanks be to God! He gives us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ.
1Co 15:58 Therefore, my dear brothers, stand firm. Let nothing move you. Always give yourselves fully to the work of the Lord, because you know that your labor in the Lord is not in vain.

Ro 4:1 What then shall we say that Abraham, our forefather, discovered in this matter?
Ro 4:2 If, in fact, Abraham was justified by works, he had something to boast about—but not before God.
Ro 4:3 What does the Scripture say? “Abraham believed God, and it was credited to him as righteousness.”

Ro 4:13 It was not through law that Abraham and his offspring received the promise that he would be heir of the world, but through the righteousness that comes by faith.

Rev 14:13 Then I heard a voice from heaven say, “Write: Blessed are the dead who die in the Lord from now on.”
“Yes,” says the Spirit, “they will rest from their labor, for their deeds will follow them.”

Mt 8:11 I say to you that many will come from the east and the west, and will take their places at the feast with Abraham, Isaac and Jacob in the kingdom of heaven.

Lk 13:28 “There will be weeping there, and gnashing of teeth, when you see Abraham, Isaac and Jacob and all the prophets in the kingdom of God, but you yourselves thrown out.

Jn 8:56 Your father Abraham rejoiced at the thought of seeing my day; he saw it and was glad.”

you see Kerwin when we die our body rottens but our soul goes back to God and the form that it has is not a body because it is not active ,the soul ,any soul to be active it needs a body of a sort ,flesh or spiritual,or other.

so Abraham died just like all of us ,but he was declared righteous by God and scriptures says that the righteous do not die but are resting and wait for the times to come to there end so that the resurrection of all the righteous comes trough,

Pierre

[kerwin]

Pierre,

Below is my question and the way I understand your answer

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I asked What part of Abraham, Jacob, and Isaac was alive at the time of Mosses?

So you believe the inner human being lives after the flesh made of the earth perishes.

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I asked Did they already undergo the final resurrection of was it yet to come?

So You believe there is yet to be a resurrection.

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I asked Since one part of them yet lived then what part would be resurrected?

So you believe they will be resurrected in flesh and blood made of spirit.

[terraricca]

Kerwin

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So you believe they will be resurrected in flesh and blood made of spirit

ans;Mt 8:11 I say to you that many will come from the east and the west, and will take their places at the feast with Abraham, Isaac and Jacob in the kingdom of heaven

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So you believe the inner human being lives after the flesh made of the earth perishes

ans;Ecc 12:7 and the dust returns to the ground it came from,
and the spirit returns to God who gave it.

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So You believe there is yet to be a resurrection

ans;
Lk 14:14 and you will be blessed. Although they cannot repay you, you will be repaid at the resurrection of the righteous.”

Lk 20:35 But those who are considered worthy of taking part in that age and in the resurrection from the dead will neither marry nor be given in marriage

Jn 11:25 Jesus said to her, “I am the resurrection and the life. He who believes in me will live, even though he dies;

Ac 24:15 and I have the same hope in God as these men, that there will be a resurrection of both the righteous and the wicked.
Rev 20:5 (The rest of the dead did not come to life until the thousand years were ended.) This is the first resurrection.
Rev 20:6 Blessed and holy are those who have part in the first resurrection. The second death has no power over them, but they will be priests of God and of Christ and will reign with him for a thousand years

this help to confirm my answers

Pierre

[terraricca]

all

this can answer many things;1Pe 1:9 for you are receiving the goal of your faith, the salvation of your souls.

Pierre

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