The Light

[Lightenup]

Quote (Gene @ Mar. 01 2009,11:29)

LU……….Does the bible say ADAM Himself sinned or that sin (entered in through) Him, the first place we see sin mentioned was in the case of Cain, and before he sinned God told Him sin was at His Door and He must master it. It would be interesting to get the clarity on this. The question was did Adam Himself sin, seeing the eyes of both Him and Eve were closed to the point they didn't even know they were naked, Even when GOD cursed the Ground , He said it was cursed for their Sake. It appears that made it Harder for the both to live , but that was for thier Good to show them what Evil really consists of, so they could grow to Hate it. But the first to really sin i believe was Cain, who then was marked. Maybe as what identifies what sin is, it works death. (this maybe speculation on my part).  IMO love and peace to you and yours……………………………gene

Hi Gene,
Interesting perspective. Yes Adam sinned. God gave him a direct command and Adam disobeyed=sin.

Gen 2:16-17
16 The LORD God commanded the man, saying, “From any tree of the garden you may eat freely; 17 but from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil you shall not eat, for in the day that you eat from it you will surely die.”
NASU

Perhaps this discussion can be taken to another more appropriate thread…what do you think, Gene?

LU

[Lightenup]

Quote (Not3in1 @ Mar. 01 2009,14:35)

John 1:8 (New International Version) 8He himself was not the light; he came only as a witness to the light. Jesus is the light of the world, but is he THE light?  John seems to think that he is a witness of the light, but he is not the light himself.  Kathi, doesn't this go directly against your theory?  I dunno…..  It's just something I came accross and thought I would add here for what it is worth.  I'm not as invested in the idea, so I'm sure you have already contemplated this scripture.

Mandy,
The one who is not the light is John in this passage as I understand it. John was not the true light. The true light came into the world and the world was made through Him. The true light became flesh. John came as a witness to testify about the light. We see in these verses that the one that John came to testify about was Christ.

John 1:6-8
John. 7 He (John) came as a witness, to testify about the Light (the Son), so that all might believe through him (John). 8 He (John) was not the Light (the Son), but he(John) came to testify about the Light(the Son).
NASU

John 1:15-19
15 John testified about Him (the Son) and cried out, saying, “This was He (the Son) of whom I (John) said, ' He (the Son) who comes after me (John) has a higher rank than I(John), for He (the Son) existed before me (John).'” 16 For of His (the Son) fullness we have all received, and grace upon grace. 17 For the Law was given through Moses; grace and truth were realized through Jesus Christ. 18 No one has seen God at any time; the only begotten God (the Son) who is in the bosom of the Father, He (the Son) has explained Him (the Father).
NASU

Maybe I am wrong but that has always been a clear understanding for me. Maybe you can show me who you are applying the pronouns to if you see it differently. Of course the John that I mention here is John the Baptist.

Kathi

[Lightenup]

Quote (Nick Hassan @ Mar. 01 2009,13:24)

Hi LU, Indeed since the Jordan that light has been in him.

Hi Nick,
I am confused by what you say. No where do I see that light comes “in” Him at the Jordan. He knew God to be His Father as a young boy, doesn't that demonstrate that He had “light” in Him?

Maybe you can show me scripture that says that light came in Him at the Jordan and says it specifically. I can't find anything coming “in” Him at the Jordan.

Thanks,
Kathi

[NickHassan]

Hi LU,
Eph 5
8for you were formerly darkness, but now you are Light in the Lord; walk as children of Light

9(for the fruit of the Light consists in all goodness and righteousness and truth),

10trying to learn what is pleasing to the Lord.

The light is of the SPIRIT of God.

Psalm 43:3
O send out Your light and Your truth, let them lead me;Let them bring me to Your holy hillAnd to Your dwelling places.

Luke 11:36
“If therefore your whole body is full of light, with no dark part in it, it will be wholly illumined, as when the lamp illumines you with its rays.”

1Jn1
5This then is the message which we have heard of him, and declare unto you, that God is light, and in him is no darkness at all.

6If we say that we have fellowship with him, and walk in darkness, we lie, and do not the truth:

7But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin.

[GeneBalthrop]

To All………Light in scripture is symbolic for enlightenment of the Mind. God is the Source of all enlightenment As Said By John the Word is expressed enlightenment and this light in in all man kind. For it enlightens everyone coming into the world. Even if it is some what darkened, Jesus said if that Light in you be darkness how great is that darkness, another word if you understand little how great of is what you don't know. But the fact remains that even if its a little it's still some. No one has (ALL) light except GOD. We see through a darkened glass as scripture says. There is room to grow in enlightenment in all of us. IMO

love and peace to you all………………………gene

[Lightenup]

Hi Nick,

Thanks for those verses. They apply to common man. Does one apply to the Son specifically? Can you show me where the Son ever had darkness in Him? Or how about where He walked in darkness? I'm not tryin to be difficult , really!

LU

[NickHassan]

Hi,
1 Thessalonians 5:5
for you are all sons of light and sons of day We are not of night nor of darkness;

So the light in us should not be darkness.
The mouth shows what the heart is full of.

[Lightenup]

Quote (Lightenup @ Mar. 01 2009,17:11)

Hi Nick, Thanks for those verses.  They apply to common man.  Does one apply to the Son specifically?  Can you show me where the Son ever had darkness in Him? Or how about where He walked in darkness?  I'm not tryin to be difficult , really! LU

Hi Nick,
Thanks but you gave me another verse about common man, can you not find anything that tells us that Jesus had darkness in HIM specifically? I suggest that He always was the light from day one and I do not see any of your verses to say that He wasn't. I really am trying to understand why you use the verses you use.

Please just show me a verse that says when Jesus received the light that you seem to claim He didn't have before the Jordan.

Jesus was not like common man who was in darkness at one time. IMO

Kathi

[NickHassan]

Hi LU,
Jesus overcame.
He inherited our sinful estate
Rom8
3For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:

4That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

We can follow such a man.

[GeneBalthrop]

Nick……..But could Jesus still say if the light in you be darkness who great is that darkness, would that still not apply to you and me. Do you see so clearly that you can say you know it all because you are in full light, I highly doubt it brother, it think we all have a way to go to true enlightenment. In fact i will venture to say that we will never get to the total enlighten state ever, but will continual to grow always. For it has not even entered the mind of Man the things that GOD has plane for him. WE only see in part as Paul said. imo

love and peace………………………………..gene

[NickHassan]

G,
Nobody here seems to be making such claims.
But we all need to listen to what we produce from our mouth.

[Lightenup]

Nick,

Light embodied the likeness of sinful flesh and became a man. He appeared like any other sinner yet had no sin, no darkness within. He took on our sins while on the cross, not before.
1 Peter 2:24
24 and He Himself bore our sins in His body on the cross,
NASU

We can follow Him…absolutely!

Kathi

[GeneBalthrop]

Nick……Right and we all need to try to consider what others are trying to say also, without being so Judgmental of there Person brother.

love and peace to you and yours………………………….gene

[Lightenup]

Gotta run
Kathi

[NickHassan]

Hi LU,
God is light.
Jesus is the light because God is in him
We too can be lights on the hill if God is in us.

[Lightenup]

Quote (Nick Hassan @ Mar. 01 2009,18:21)

Hi LU, God is light. Jesus is the light because God is in him We too can be lights on the hill if God is in us.

Hi Nick,
John the Baptist also had God in him, even from the womb yet he declared he was not the light but came for a witness to bear witness to the true light.  That true Light is the Son of God.  So, I propose that the true Light that Jesus is, is significantly different than the Light that His followers are.

Nick you say:

Quote

This of course refers to John the Baptist. Jn1 6There was a man sent from God, whose name was John. 7The same came for a witness, to bear witness of the Light, that all men through him might believe. 8He was not that Light, but was sent to bear witness of that Light. But the Light that came into the world is surely God visiting His people in the vessel of the Son.

Thanks for your help Nick,
Kathi

[Not3in1]

Quote (Lightenup @ Mar. 02 2009,07:42)

Quote (Not3in1 @ Mar. 01 2009,14:35) John 1:8 (New International Version) 8He himself was not the light; he came only as a witness to the light. Jesus is the light of the world, but is he THE light?  John seems to think that he is a witness of the light, but he is not the light himself.  Kathi, doesn't this go directly against your theory?  I dunno…..  It's just something I came accross and thought I would add here for what it is worth.  I'm not as invested in the idea, so I'm sure you have already contemplated this scripture. Mandy, The one who is not the light is John in this passage as I understand it.  John was not the true light.  The true light came into the world and the world was made through Him.  The true light became flesh.  John came as a witness to testify about the light.  We see in these verses that the one that John came to testify about was Christ. John 1:6-8 John. 7 He (John) came as a witness, to testify about the Light (the Son), so that all might believe through him (John). 8 He (John) was not the Light (the Son), but he(John) came to testify about the Light(the Son). NASU John 1:15-19 15 John testified about Him (the Son) and cried out, saying, “This was He (the Son) of whom I (John) said, ' He (the Son) who comes after me (John) has a higher rank than I(John), for He (the Son) existed before me (John).'” 16 For of His (the Son) fullness we have all received, and grace upon grace. 17 For the Law was given through Moses; grace and truth were realized through Jesus Christ. 18 No one has seen God at any time; the only begotten God (the Son) who is in the bosom of the Father, He (the Son)  has explained Him (the Father).   NASU Maybe I am wrong but that has always been a clear understanding for me.  Maybe you can show me who you are applying the pronouns to if you see it differently.  Of course the John that I mention here is John the Baptist. Kathi

Oh, I'm laughing so hard at myself right now.

Kathi, you are absolutely correct! This passage is speaking of John. It's not the passage that I had intended on posting. I'll have to go back and look at my study this morning to find the right verse. Too funny.

Thanks,
Mandy

[Lightenup]

One of those blonder moments ey Mandy?…I have too many of them myself! It is good to laugh at ourselves.

Kathi

[NickHassan]

Hi LU,
He was filled with the light as no man before os since has been.

Matthew 17:2
And was transfigured before them: and his face did shine as the sun, and his raiment was white as the light.

Yet it says about us too.

Mt6
22The light of the body is the eye: if therefore thine eye be single, thy whole body shall be full of light.

[NickHassan]

Hi LU,
If both God and the Son are the light then which is the light in us?

Only of God is this said
James 1:17
Every good gift and every perfect gift is from above, and cometh down from the Father of lights, with whom is no variableness, neither shadow of turning.

[Author]

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