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The soul that sins will die.
Absolutely, G-d said so; but, what must one do to live? (Ezek 18)
Therefore, death is the price of sin and it is a required payment.
When did G-d say death is the “required payment” for sin?
God is also merciful.
Absolutely!! He tells us HE is AND freely forgives those who come to HIM with a repentant heart.
He sent his son into the world to pay the price for our sin.
I’ve asked where G-d said HE was sending HIS son into the world to “pay the price for our sin.” This would be an explicit requirement of the Messiah.
The sacrificial lamb being the forerunner for the ultimate plan that the enemy had no idea about. For if they knew, they wouldn’t have crucified the Son of God.
A “lamb” wasn’t the only animal used for atonement in the sacrificial system; in fact, flour and charity where also acceptable for atonement. If you say the “sacrificial lamb” is the Passover lamb would be false, the Passover lamb was NEVER a sin sacrifice and it was eaten.
To continue to believe the lie of Paul “if they knew, they wouldn’t have crucified the Son of God” is to call G-d weak. The creator of the universe could be out smarted by HIS creation?!?!
Isa 14:27 For the Lord of hosts has purposed, and who will annul it? His hand is stretched out, and who will turn it back?
Isa 43:13 Also henceforth I am he; there is none who can deliver from my hand; I work, and who can turn it back?”
Isa 46:10 Declaring the end from the beginning and from ancient times things not yet done, saying, ‘My counsel shall stand, and I will accomplish all my purpose,’
Isa 55:11 So shall my word be that goes out from my mouth; it shall not return to me empty, but it shall accomplish that which I purpose, and shall succeed in the thing for which I sent it.
Job 42:2 I know that you can do all things, and that no purpose of yours can be thwarted.
Ps 33:11 The counsel of the Lord stands forever, the plans of his heart to all generations.
Prov 19:21 Many are the plans in the mind of a man, but it is the purpose of the Lord that will stand.
Dan 4:35 All the inhabitants of the earth are accounted as nothing, and he does according to his will among the host of heaven and among the inhabitants of the earth; and none can stay his hand or say to him, “What have you done?”
After reading these passages how can you continue to believe the “words” (lies) of Paul that man could possibly “out smart” and thwart the plans of G-d? When will you begin to verify what you are told is “truth”? Do you verify with the Tanakh when the NT says “as it is written”? If not, WHY NOT!!
Another great attribute of what Gods kingdom rule will accomplish for mankind= No resident will ever say–i am sick -Isaiah 33:24)
Please read the passage in the context it was written…eyes roll…and stop cherry picking phrases you like. Who will never say I am sick; what residents are spoken of here; who does this passage apply to? Who was Isaiah a prophet for?
Enoch and Elijah were sinners.
Those all died back in Jesus’ day– My post is truth on that.
The resurrected will be tested when satan is loosed after given the opportunity to learn and apply Gods will.
Jesus only covers repented sin=Few on earth do that. False teachers say confessing is enough-they are wrong-Acts 3:19-Repent and turn around( stop doing the sin) to get sins blotted out.
Only one in darkness would call Paul a liar. Jesus commissioned him to preach truth=Gods truth. Thus its God you are calling a liar.
Yes once dead one cannot be rejudged for past sin in the resurrection. Death is the full payment( wages) of sin. Every mortal who has lived paid in full by their death the wages of sin. Some claim Jesus death covers all sin= false. Even the righteous have died and paid their own wages.
Hi Keith. Of course repentance is required. But it is true that Jesus died for all and his sacrifice is enough to cover all sin. This is why scripture states that salvation is a free gift of God and that God is not WILLING for anyone to perish.
But all gifts require acceptance in order to possess the gift. And if the gift has a requirement such as repentance, then that seems fair to me. The thing is, God never forces people to choose him or his gifts and blessings because he actually respects our free will. He did not create a race of robots, but of people made in his image who can choose to do his will and who have the potential to be sons.
Best believe Jesus= FEW will find the road that leads off into life( be saved, get grace, get salvation)–the rest are mislead to walk the broad and spacious path that leads to destruction. So their sin is NOT covered.
I think you miss the point here. Of course it is true that not all will have their sins forgiven, but scripture is clear about the atonement for all sin: past, present, and future. This is based on passages such as:
John 1:29: “Behold, the Lamb of God, who takes away the sin of the world!”
1 John 2:2: “He is the atoning sacrifice for our sins, and not only for ours but also for the sins of the whole world.”
As you can see, there is not only enough grace to cover the sins of some, but the whole world.
Salvation by Grace Through Faith is the motto: While Jesus’ sacrifice is sufficient for all sin, individuals must accept this gift through faith to benefit from its effects, see Ephesians 2:8-9.
The unforgivable sin is also a factor, but that is a different subject for now.
Enoch and Elijah were sinners.
Apparently not to bad a “sinner” since G-d whisked them away and they NEVER saw death. You’re going to have a hard time squaring that one up for me; the Jesus died, and they didn’t and as you say, they were “sinners.”
Those all died back in Jesus’ day– My post is truth on that.
Don’t think I disagreed with you on the point of them dying; the contention has to do with the words of the Jesus telling them they wouldn’t see death before he “returned”, yet everyone died and the Jesus never returned.
The resurrected will be tested when satan is loosed after given the opportunity to learn and apply Gods will.
Passage please that supports your claim; if none exists, then it’s a teaching from man and not G-d.
Jesus only covers repented sin
Please produce the passage that states the innocent can take on the punishment of the guilty.
Repent and turn around( stop doing the sin) to get sins blotted out.
Your statement couldn’t speak more truth; however, we will differ on how and who blots this sin out. Christianity says it’s only accomplished thru the Jesus, the Tanakh says it is G-d who will remember it no more…why do I need the Jesus? Do I believe what the NT teaches or what G-d said?
Only one in darkness would call Paul a liar. Jesus commissioned him to preach truth=Gods truth. Thus its God you are calling a liar.
“Only one in darkness would call Paul a liar”, thank goodness I didn’t have a drink in hand when reading that as I would have to buy a new monitor. Thank you for the good laugh! How about this, I challenge you to start verifying every passage Paul “quotes” from the Tanakh to see if it aligns with the original context it was written. For example I Cor 15:3-4 “Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures, 4 and that he was buried, and that he was raised up on the third day according to the scriptures” Please provided the passages where G-d said the true Messiah was to die for the sins of mankind and then be buried and raised up on the third day.
Or take a look at Rom 3:10-18, Paul takes seven passages from the Tanakh and combines them into one and all are taken out of context of there original intent to create Pauline truth. I can speak on the lies of Paul if you can handle them, but like every “christian” they will deny Paul is a liar even when the evidence is presented. The list of Paul’s deception is lengthy! When people argue what the NT states, explain how it can be the “inspired word of God.”
All living on earth in Gods kingdom it applies to.
You obviously didn’t read Isa 33; if you had you wouldn’t have responded with “all living on earth.” When read in context it’s speaking of those in Jerusalem or Zion and has nothing to due with all those “living on earth.” Do any of those who call themselves “christian” have the ability to comprehend the words written or is cherry picking what one does to satisfies their belief system?
Best believe Jesus
Is G-d irrelevant? Does G-d no longer matter when compared to the Jesus? Is the Jesus your G-d?
FEW will find the road that leads off into life( be saved, get grace, get salvation)–the rest are mislead to walk the broad and spacious path that leads to destruction. So their sin is NOT covered.
If one repents and turn from their sin explain how their sin isn’t remembered anymore as G-d says?
Yes once dead one cannot be rejudged for past sin in the resurrection.
So what is the second death for?
Romans 6:23] For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.
This death that Paul speaks of corresponds to the second death that John speaks of in Revelation 20:11-15
I understand it well. All could be forgiven if they would repent and turn around, but Jesus assures-FEW will find the road that leads off into life. Most are being mislead to walk the broad and spacious path that leads to destruction–like this( 2Cor 11:12-15)= billions of them are told and think they are serving God.
Deuteronomy 30:19-God made an oath–LIFE or DEATH. By our actions we make the choice, both will be everlasting. The second death is everlasting.
It’s about free will which allows love to be real.
But there is a risk with free will that you choose outside of God’s perfect plan.
If you love God, then you will live obey him because He has the perfect plan.
But if you do not love God, then you might do and say all the right things in a heavenly setting, but you heart may not be in it. So the tempter comes one last time to harvest the seed that he sowed, the tares.
After that, there is only perfection because the field only contains wheat.
And if you do not love God then why would you want to live with him for all eternity anyway?
So only those that love God will want to live with him for eternity and this is what will happen.
Yes God gave all free will. The wise that love God learn every utterance and live by them to the best of their abilities. By exercising their free will and choosing to live by every utterance and knowing 100% Gods advice is perfect and what he asks of us is for our benefit. Few on earth do.
All can look at their teachers right now, because its a guaranteed fact that the ones that have Jesus teach every utterance=OT-NT to the flock without fail.
Does anyone comprehend what they read or do we live in a world of ear tickling sound bites? How can one quote Duet 30:19 and say it means the following?!?!?!?
God made an oath–LIFE or DEATH. By our actions we make the choice, both will be everlasting. The second death is everlasting.
This is comical! CONTEXT IS KING!! G-d isn’t speaking here, so no “oath” made by G-d; Moses is speaking to the Israelite’s before he passes – begin reading in verse 11. He is speaking about following G-d’s commands and in doing so, they will have life and prosperity; if not, death and disaster is what will befall them. In verse 16 it says, “love Yahweh your God by going in his ways and by keeping his commandments and his statutes and his regulations, and then you will live, and you will become numerous, and Yahweh your God will bless you in the land where you are going.” One is to “love” G-d through the act of following HIS commands (doesn’t Paul teach G-d’s commands are dead because they where nailed to the cross??). Nowhere is a “second death” mentioned, you made that up and distort the true words of G-d.
Paul
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1 Cor. 7:19] Circumcision is nothing, and uncircumcision is nothing, but the keeping of the commandments of God.Rom.2:25
For circumcision verily profiteth, if thou keep the law: but if thou be a breaker of the law, thy circumcision is made uncircumcision.Other bible verses
1 John 5:3
For the love of God consists in keeping his commandments. And his commandments are not burdensomeRev.22:14
Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter through the gates into the cityPaul was speaking of the ceremonial law of offerings and sacrifices, which has become USELESS SINCE THE DEATH AND RESURRECTION OF CHRIST.
On the other hand, the moral law of the 10 commandments remains forever.
Daniel 9:27. And he will confirm the covenant with many for one week; and in the midst of the week 👉he will cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease…..👈
Col.2:11] In whom also you were circumcised with a circumcision made without hand, in putting off the body of the flesh by the circumcision of Christ.
[12] Buried with him in baptism, in which also you are raised with him through the faith of the power of God, who raised him from the dead.
[13] And you, being dead in trespasses and the uncircumcision of your flesh, he has made alive together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses;
[14l] 👉He has blotted out the handwriting containing the ordinances that were against us and has abolished it by nailing it to the cross. 👈
[15] He has disarmed principalities and powers and has made a public spectacle of them, triumphing over them in the cross.Berean, have you read any of the 613 commands given by G-d thru Moses to the nation of Israel? Can you explain why Moses tells the nation in Deut 30:11-20 G-d’s commands given are NOT hard to follow and why following them brings life and properity and not following them bring death and destruction? Can you explain Deut 5:29 when G-d says, “Oh that they had such a heart in them, that they would fear Me and keep all My commandments always, that it may be well with them and with their sons forever!” What does the “always” and “forever” in this passage mean to you?
Explain why the Jesus said, “17 “Do not think that I came to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I did not come to abolish but to fulfill. 18 “For truly I say to you, until heaven and earth pass away, not the smallest letter or stroke shall pass from the Law until all is accomplished. 19 “Whoever then annuls one of the least of these commandments, and teaches others to do the same, shall be called least in the kingdom of heaven; but whoever keeps and teaches them, he shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.” According to the Jesus heaven and earth will pass away before the law does; AND the icing on the cake is those who teach against the law will be called least (Paul taught against the “law” and G-d said to keep ALL HIS commands, not just the “moral law.”) The Jesus goes on and says those who keep them will be called great. Are you getting it yet?
Let’s not forget the “beloved apostle” John when he states “3 For this is the love of God: that we keep his commandments. And his commandments are not burdensome,” sounds slightly contradictory to the liar Paul when he calls them a burden and a curse.
You quote Col 2:14, the most damning passage that proves the christian church follows Paul verses the Jesus. The Jesus confirms the words of G-d and the law will exist forever; Paul teaches against G-d and says they were nailed to the cross. Going so far as to say G-d’s commands are contrary and hostile to those he is speaking; Paul is a false apostle, a liar, a deceiver, manipulator, and a hater of G-d; and you follow him. How much more evidence do you require before you open your eyes to Paul’s deceit? I keep saying to check what Paul quotes from the Tanakh to confirm what he is saying aligns with it and it apparently falls on deaf ears. Until you do you will remain lost in your religious dogma.
If you are going to quote Daniel, recommend you take some time to study the entire chapter before you begin quoting a single phrase of a verse and claim it points to (curious eyes)…what exactly, you never explained. It’s like you threw in a random thought and proved nothing.
I persist in saying that it is the law of offerings and sacrifices that was abolished at the cross and not the MORAL law written by the finger of God and deposited in the ark of the covenant.
What Moses wrote for the people of Israel flows from this and the moral law which is the basis for all humanity.
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