- This topic is empty.
- Posts
wakeup
If this is so, please state,So I can learn.
you cannot learn from no one ;if you cannot learn in 40 years as you say the basics of scriptures teachings then NO ONE CAN TRULY TEACH YOU,
I TRIED ,AND MANY OTHERS BEFORE ME AND AFTER ME ; if the scriptures that has the spirit of truth in it can not bring your attention to the truth than who can ???? no one except your own heart
Terra.
You are a stumbling block to the true seekers here.
Talking to you is like talking to a brick wall.
Because of your nakedness; you only have stones, instead of just a bit of knowledge.
But the worse part is; you THINK you have it all sewn up.
I have sown some good seed, but have fallen on the pathway, and the birds came and took it away.
The land is desolate, nothing can grow on it. God has not given the rain to fall on it.
Some of the seed has fallen amongst thorns, and have chocked it.
This is the whole situation at the moment; until the Master comes, and prepare the soil.wakeup.
Pierre
Did you need scriptures to claim Israel will be provoked to jealousy? and that salvation goes out to the gentiles First, and Israel last?
You should already know this.Wakeup’s posts are always fully loaded. You should also know this by now.
He gave the scriptures, and then gave the answer in the same post. He just didn’t tell you how he got to that conclusion, and I took it upon myself to fill in those gaps as to how we get to the answer, in reply to your ugly comment, because I knew he would not want to answer you after that.
wakeup
THE JEWS WERE CALLED FIRST ;THEY WILL BE LAST RESURRECTED.(IN THE SECOND RESURRECTION).
THE GENTILES WERE CALLED LAST;THEY WILL BE RESURRECTED FIRST.
THE JEWS MUST GO THROUGH THE 1000YEAR OF LEARNING ;THEN RESURRECTED.
THIS IS WHAT THE KINGDOM IS FOR. (REWARDS GIVEN FOR WORKS DONE, NOT FOR JUST FOR GETTING WET)wakeup
looking for scriptures on this claim of yours ? please
j42
Pierre
Did you need scriptures to claim Israel will be provoked to jealousy? and that salvation goes out to the gentiles First, and Israel last?
You should already know this.Wakeup’s posts are always fully loaded. You should also know this by now.
He gave the scriptures, and then gave the answer in the same post. He just didn’t tell you how he got to that conclusion, and I took it upon myself to fill in those gaps as to how we get to the answer, in reply to your ugly comment, because I knew he would not want to answer you after that.
no not that ,just read my previous quote :Jews must go through 1000 years of study ; any scriptures ?
The statement “THE LAST SHALL BE FIRST, AND THE FIRST LAST” seems to mean that come first in some way will come last in the same way later and those that are last in some way will come first in the same way later”. By itself the statement is vague and I missed how it applied the parable because I had the wrong understanding for it for sometime. The answer is in the parable at verse Matthew 20:12 in the words of the earlier laborers who say “and thou hast made them equal unto us” . When the first become last they do not stop from being the first and when the last become first they do not stop from being last so after it is all done they are equal. They householder did not deny that he made them equal but instead he stated he had the right to do so.
There is nothing about Jews or Gentiles in the passage though it can be that one of the earlier group of laborers were Jews and the latest group was Gentiles. The Jews were not the earliest group of laborers that appeared in Scripture as Jacob aka Israel was first Jew and yet Abraham his father also labored for God. Noah came even earlier as did Adam and Eve.
Looking at the parable each of the laborers receive the same payment and therefore it seems reasonable that each of those that labor in serving God in this world will receive the same payment in the next. The only payment I know about is inheriting the kingdom of God. The thousand years would not come into it as it is the closing era of this world when God’s people yet labor for the day of this world has not yet ended.
Hi Kerwin.
The vineyard they were working on is ONE and the same vineyard.
The early workers on the vineyard are the jews(Israel), the latter are the gentiles.
And the very last, just before closing time are also the gentiles; Christians that are coming in, just before the coming.
Just before closing hour.
They get payed first in the 1st resurrection , and the jews will get payed last, in the 2nd resurrection.
wakeup.
Wakeup,
Assuming you are correct about the labors symbolizing the various groups of workers in the vineyard and I see no evidence Jesus was trying to make that point then there are five groups of laborers not the two you mention.
The division in Scripture is Jew and Gentile not the Jew and Christian division we have today. The only division they had then was the Christian and Jews were different denominations in the same religion. Some among the Jews called it a sect in Acts 24:5
Acts 24:5Authorized (King James) Version (AKJV)
5 For we have found this man a pestilent fellow, and a mover of sedition among all the Jews throughout the world, and a ringleader of the sect of the Nazarenes:
just like Luke called the Sadducee a sect in Acts 5:17
Acts 5:17Authorized (King James) Version (AKJV)
17 Then the high priest rose up, and all they that were with him, (which is the sect of the Sadducees,) and were filled with indignation,
In short they were different opinions in the same religion and sometime the word translated sect is used with a negative coordination as it seems to be close to our word opinion. The AV of the KJV actually translates it to heresy in at least one case.
You have five groups of laborers and one religion that was first known as Judaism and then known as both Judaism and Christianity.
Hi Kerwin.
They are workers of many generations all working for the same boss, and the same vineyard.
Not many different vineyards.wakeup.
hi all
I would like to understand your understanding for it explain many things but what about what Jesus really meant 😕
Mt 20:1 “For the kingdom of heaven is like a landowner who went out early in the morning to hire men to work in his vineyard.
Mt 20:2 He agreed to pay them a denarius for the day and sent them into his vineyard.
Mt 20:3 “About the third hour he went out and saw others standing in the marketplace doing nothing.
Mt 20:4 He told them, ‘You also go and work in my vineyard, and I will pay you whatever is right.’
Mt 20:5 So they went.
“He went out again about the sixth hour and the ninth hour and did the same thing.
Mt 20:6 About the eleventh hour he went out and found still others standing around. He asked them, ‘Why have you been standing here all day long doing nothing?’
Mt 20:7 “ ‘Because no one has hired us,’ they answered.
“He said to them, ‘You also go and work in my vineyard.’
Mt 20:8 “When evening came, the owner of the vineyard said to his foreman, ‘Call the workers and pay them their wages, beginning with the last ones hired and going on to the first.’
Mt 20:9 “The workers who were hired about the eleventh hour came and each received a denarius.
Mt 20:10 So when those came who were hired first, they expected to receive more. But each one of them also received a denarius.
Mt 20:11 When they received it, they began to grumble against the landowner.
Mt 20:12 ‘These men who were hired last worked only one hour,’ they said, ‘and you have made them equal to us who have borne the burden of the work and the heat of the day.’
Mt 20:13 “But he answered one of them, ‘Friend, I am not being unfair to you. Didn’t you agree to work for a denarius?
Mt 20:14 Take your pay and go. I want to give the man who was hired last the same as I gave you.
Mt 20:15 Don’t I have the right to do what I want with my own money? Or are you envious because I am generous?’
Mt 20:16 “So the last will be first, and the first will be last.”WHAT IS PICTURED BY THE “VINEYARD” ?
WHO IS PICTURED AS THE “LANDLORD”? WHO ARE THOSE PICTURED AS “WORKERS” AND WHAT IS PICTURED AS THE “VINEYARD ” ?
AND WHAT IS PICTURED BY : “EARLY IN THE MORNING “?
AND WHAT IS PICTURED IN THE ” HOUR ” 1,2,3,4,5,6..AND SO ON,
WHAT IS PICTURED BY : THE PAY (ONE DENARIUS) ?
AND WHAT IS PICTURED BY “THE END OF THE DAY” ?
THOSE ANSWERS WILL MAKE ALL THINGS TRUE
Wakeup,
They are workers of many generations all working for the same boss, and the same vineyard.
Not many different vineyards.They could well be different generations though the idea I received was not different generations but rather different lengths of service and yet they all received the same reward. There was no difference in the reward between those whose labored all day and those who labored but a short time.
Kerwin.
The jews were working towards God first.. Since 2000bc ??. length of service.
The Christians were working towards God since AD. to today.2000ad.lenght of service.wakeup
Wakeup,
Abraham walked this earth about 2000 BC. The first Jew, Jacob, came three generations later. There were many generations before as well as the Great Deluge. There were many people that labored until then and you Jew/Christian teaching leaves out many of those. It also leaves out the righteous Gentiles that existed at the same time as the Jews.
To me it seems like you are trying to force a square block in a round hole.
Kerwin.
It also leaves out the righteous Gentiles that existed at the same time as the Jews
Those righteous gentiles did not work or serve Christ nor God
Kerwin ;it seems that you are putting on a stiff neck.
Scriptures are not to be used to play a game to fill in spare time.If you truly think you are on the right track; just go for it. You have a free choice.
wakeup.
Wakeup,
Those righteous gentiles did not work or serve Christ nor God
What evidence support your claim?
Jonah was sent to a nation of Gentiles.
Wakeup,
Kerwin ;it seems that you are putting on a stiff neck.
I have no problem with admitting I am wrong as can be seen from my writing. Does your writing say the same about you?
Wakeup,
If you truly think you are on the right track; just go for it. You have a free choice.
I see no reason to do otherwise and assume the same is true of anyone.
Wakeup,
Given that the words sum up the message of the parable the way it sounds is that each will be awarded equally no matter how long the length of their service.
In the parable the first were paid the same as the last and last were paid the same as the first.
If it is not part of the parable then it could well mean those that seek to be first will be last while those that seek to be last will be first and so the meek will inherit the earth.
I have no looked into it enough to be certain of anything as this point.
- You must be logged in to reply to this topic.
