The bible

[Towshab]

Quote (Son of Light @ Jan. 09 2008,13:43)

Tow, Look at it like this.  You are a deist who sees within the OT the only possible revealing of God.  You then erase from the record as being accurate the weak and human nature of this God as described by men. This is the God described by Jesus.  God is not a despot like Zeus.  Jesus agreed.  He followed your same religion and attributed the evil to fallen angels.  Which the essenes believed became men. Other than the eclectic life style of Jesus it seems you share a faith with him. You don't have to tear down the teacher even if the catholics lied about him.

Do you think he was the coming King Messiah? Its not whether I agree with what he taught ir not, I disagree with people worshiping him, through him, and closing out their prayers in his name. He was a man and no man deserves all of that.

[Towshab]

Quote (Towshab @ Jan. 09 2008,11:40)

SOL, What do you think of these verses? Mat 22:44  “'The Lord said to my Lord, Sit at my right hand, until I put your enemies under your feet'? Act 2:34  For David did not ascend into the heavens, but he himself says, “'The Lord said to my Lord, Sit at my right hand, Act 2:35  until I make your enemies your footstool.' Heb 1:13  And to which of the angels has he ever said, “Sit at my right hand until I make your enemies a footstool for your feet”?

Still wondering what you think about these SOL.

[Stu]

Quote (Son of Light @ Jan. 10 2008,06:43)

God is not a despot like Zeus.

Hi Son of Light

Just a very low-grade question here. Notwithstanding the fact that you have to bend the OT out of shape completely or ignore it altogether to get “god is not a despot” (surely he is portrayed as an unpredictable dictator quick to smite!) but you compare him directly to Zeus. Am I misunderstanding or are you comparing a god you think exists with a god you think doesn't? If so, I am keen to find out why you are a Zeus-atheist but not a YHWH / Allah / Jehova / the LORD / whatever the name(s) of your god-atheist.

Stuart

[Towshab]

Quote (Nick Hassan @ Jan. 09 2008,13:58)

Hi Tow, Where does scripture say Jesus was famous?

Mat 4:24 So his fame spread throughout all Syria, and they brought him all the sick, those afflicted with various diseases and pains, those oppressed by demons, epileptics, and paralytics, and he healed them.

Mat 9:31 But they went away and spread his fame through all that district.

Mat 14:1 At that time Herod the tetrarch heard about the fame of Jesus,

Mar 1:28 And at once his fame spread everywhere throughout all the surrounding region of Galilee.
========================================

Fame – To make renowned or famous.

[Towshab]

Quote (Stu @ Jan. 09 2008,18:05)

Quote (Son of Light @ Jan. 10 2008,06:43) God is not a despot like Zeus. Hi Son of Light Just a very low-grade question here. Notwithstanding the fact that you have to bend the OT out of shape completely or ignore it altogether to get “god is not a despot” (surely he is portrayed as an unpredictable dictator quick to smite!) but you compare him directly to Zeus. Am I misunderstanding or are you comparing a god you think exists with a god you think doesn't? If so, I am keen to find out why you are a Zeus-atheist but not a YHWH / Allah / Jehova / the LORD / whatever the name(s) of your god-atheist. Stuart

His god has no name, just “Most High”. Yahweh/Jehovah/Allah/YHVH/Adonai is an evil angel to him.

[NickHassan]

Hi Tow,
Quite so.
So he was famous in the Galilee region of Israel.
I do not think that would have made the local Jerusalem rag

[Towshab]

Quote (Nick Hassan @ Jan. 09 2008,18:43)

Hi Tow, Quite so. So he was famous in the Galilee region of Israel. I do not think that would have made the local Jerusalem rag

Mat 3:5 Then Jerusalem and all Judea and all the region about the Jordan were going out to him,

Mat 4:25 And great crowds followed him from Galilee and the Decapolis, and from Jerusalem and Judea, and from beyond the Jordan.

Luk 5:17 On one of those days, as he was teaching, Pharisees and teachers of the law were sitting there, who had come from every village of Galilee and Judea and from Jerusalem. And the power of the Lord was with him to heal.

Luk 6:17 And he came down with them and stood on a level place, with a great crowd of his disciples and a great multitude of people from all Judea and Jerusalem and the seacoast of Tyre and Sidon,

Joh 2:23 Now when he was in Jerusalem at the Passover Feast, many believed in his name when they saw the signs that he was doing.

Joh 4:45 So when he came to Galilee, the Galileans welcomed him, having seen all that he had done in Jerusalem at the feast. For they too had gone to the feast. [/quote]
=====================================

Seems you don't read the book you defend much.

[NickHassan]

Hi Tow,
Good point.
Thanks

[Stu]

Quote (Towshab @ Jan. 10 2008,11:42)

Quote (Stu @ Jan. 09 2008,18:05) Quote (Son of Light @ Jan. 10 2008,06:43) God is not a despot like Zeus.   Hi Son of Light Just a very low-grade question here.  Notwithstanding the fact that you have to bend the OT out of shape completely or ignore it altogether to get “god is not a despot” (surely he is portrayed as an unpredictable dictator quick to smite!) but you compare him directly to Zeus.  Am I misunderstanding or are you comparing a god you think exists with a god you think doesn't?  If so, I am keen to find out why you are a Zeus-atheist but not a YHWH / Allah / Jehova / the LORD / whatever the name(s) of your god-atheist. Stuart His god has no name, just “Most High”. Yahweh/Jehovah/Allah/YHVH/Adonai is an evil angel to him.

See! It's so unfair. Why did Son of Light ask you about deism and me about the mindfield of names, or non-names for things that I can't be bothered counting as they dance on the proverbial pinhead? I get it now though. The 'scholars' who have studied this stuff are experts on cultural assimilation and hot air.

Stuart

[acertainchap]

Quote (Son of Light @ Jan. 10 2008,05:53)

I serve a God of Love as revealed by Jesus.

You are on the right track.

[Son of Light]

Quote (Stu @ Jan. 10 2008,11:05)

Quote (Son of Light @ Jan. 10 2008,06:43) God is not a despot like Zeus.   Hi Son of Light Just a very low-grade question here.  Notwithstanding the fact that you have to bend the OT out of shape completely or ignore it altogether to get “god is not a despot” (surely he is portrayed as an unpredictable dictator quick to smite!) but you compare him directly to Zeus.  Am I misunderstanding or are you comparing a god you think exists with a god you think doesn't?  If so, I am keen to find out why you are a Zeus-atheist but not a YHWH / Allah / Jehova / the LORD / whatever the name(s) of your god-atheist. Stuart

I am not a zeus athiest. Tow pretty much has it right. The gods of the nations are representive of fallen angels.

[acertainchap]

What is your Biblical proof of your statement that the gods of the nations are representative of fallen angels?

[Son of Light]

Quote (acertainchap @ Jan. 10 2008,12:39)

Quote (Son of Light @ Jan. 10 2008,12:35) Stuart The gods of the nations are representive of fallen angels.[/quote] What is your Biblical proof for this statement?

Deuteronomy 32

8When the Most High(Q) gave to the nations their inheritance,
when he divided mankind,
he fixed the borders[a] of the peoples
according to the number of the sons of God.
9But the LORD’s portion is his people,
Jacob his allotted heritage.

Deuteronomy 32:17

They made offerings to evil spirits which were not God, to gods who were strange to them, which had newly come up, not feared by your fathers.

1 Corinthians10

19So what am I saying? That meat sacrificed to idols is anything? Or that an idol is anything?
20 No, I mean that what they sacrifice, (they sacrifice) to demons, 8 not to God, and I do not want you to become participants with demons.
21 You cannot drink the cup of the Lord and also the cup of demons.

colossians 2

14having canceled the written code, with its regulations, that was against us and that stood opposed to us; he took it away, nailing it to the cross. 15And having disarmed the powers and authorities, he made a public spectacle of them, triumphing over them by the cross.
18Do not let anyone who delights in false humility and the worship of angels disqualify you for the prize.

psalm 82

1 God presides in the great assembly;
he gives judgment among the “gods”:
2 “How long will you [a] defend the unjust
and show partiality to the wicked?
Selah

3 Defend the cause of the weak and fatherless;
maintain the rights of the poor and oppressed.

4 Rescue the weak and needy;
deliver them from the hand of the wicked.

5 “They know nothing, they understand nothing.
They walk about in darkness;
all the foundations of the earth are shaken.

6 “I said, 'You are “gods”;
you are all sons of the Most High.'

7 But you will die like mere men;
you will fall like every other ruler.”

8 Rise up, O God, judge the earth,
for all the nations are your inheritance.

[Stu]

Quote (Son of Light @ Jan. 10 2008,12:35)

Quote (Stu @ Jan. 10 2008,11:05) Quote (Son of Light @ Jan. 10 2008,06:43) God is not a despot like Zeus.   Hi Son of Light Just a very low-grade question here.  Notwithstanding the fact that you have to bend the OT out of shape completely or ignore it altogether to get “god is not a despot” (surely he is portrayed as an unpredictable dictator quick to smite!) but you compare him directly to Zeus.  Am I misunderstanding or are you comparing a god you think exists with a god you think doesn't?  If so, I am keen to find out why you are a Zeus-atheist but not a YHWH / Allah / Jehova / the LORD / whatever the name(s) of your god-atheist. Stuart I am not a zeus athiest.  Tow pretty much has it right.  The gods of the nations are representive of fallen angels.

This is fantastic! if I invent a god, will you believe it to be a fallen angel too?

Stuart

[acertainchap]

There is no need to invent a pagan god when we have a real God.

[acertainchap]

Quote (Son of Light @ Jan. 10 2008,12:50)

Deuteronomy 32 8When the Most High(Q) gave to the nations their inheritance,   when he® divided mankind, he fixed the borders[a] of the peoples   according to the number of the sons of God. 9But the LORD’s portion is his people,   Jacob his allotted heritage. Deuteronomy 32:17 They made offerings to evil spirits which were not God, to gods who were strange to them, which had newly come up, not feared by your fathers. 1 Corinthians10 19So what am I saying? That meat sacrificed to idols is anything? Or that an idol is anything? 20 No, I mean that what they sacrifice, (they sacrifice) to demons, 8 not to God, and I do not want you to become participants with demons. 21 You cannot drink the cup of the Lord and also the cup of demons. colossians 2 14having canceled the written code, with its regulations, that was against us and that stood opposed to us; he took it away, nailing it to the cross. 15And having disarmed the powers and authorities, he made a public spectacle of them, triumphing over them by the cross. 18Do not let anyone who delights in false humility and the worship of angels disqualify you for the prize. psalm 82 1 God presides in the great assembly;       he gives judgment among the “gods”: 2 “How long will you [a] defend the unjust       and show partiality to the wicked?       Selah 3 Defend the cause of the weak and fatherless;       maintain the rights of the poor and oppressed. 4 Rescue the weak and needy;       deliver them from the hand of the wicked. 5 “They know nothing, they understand nothing.       They walk about in darkness;       all the foundations of the earth are shaken. 6 “I said, 'You are “gods”;       you are all sons of the Most High.' 7 But you will die like mere men;       you will fall like every other ruler.” 8 Rise up, O God, judge the earth,       for all the nations are your inheritance.

Yes, this could very well be so, then.

[Son of Light]

Quote (Stu @ Jan. 10 2008,12:57)

Quote (Son of Light @ Jan. 10 2008,12:35) Quote (Stu @ Jan. 10 2008,11:05) Quote (Son of Light @ Jan. 10 2008,06:43) God is not a despot like Zeus.   Hi Son of Light Just a very low-grade question here.  Notwithstanding the fact that you have to bend the OT out of shape completely or ignore it altogether to get “god is not a despot” (surely he is portrayed as an unpredictable dictator quick to smite!) but you compare him directly to Zeus.  Am I misunderstanding or are you comparing a god you think exists with a god you think doesn't?  If so, I am keen to find out why you are a Zeus-atheist but not a YHWH / Allah / Jehova / the LORD / whatever the name(s) of your god-atheist. Stuart I am not a zeus athiest.  Tow pretty much has it right.  The gods of the nations are representive of fallen angels. This is fantastic!  if I invent a god, will you believe it to be a fallen angel too? Stuart

If your movement because successful then an entity might come along to step into that role and help move things along.

[Towshab]

Hey SOL, what about those verses?

[Son of Light]

Quote (Towshab @ Jan. 10 2008,04:40)

SOL, What do you think of these verses? Mat 22:44  “'The Lord said to my Lord, Sit at my right hand, until I put your enemies under your feet'? Act 2:34  For David did not ascend into the heavens, but he himself says, “'The Lord said to my Lord, Sit at my right hand, Act 2:35  until I make your enemies your footstool.' Heb 1:13  And to which of the angels has he ever said, “Sit at my right hand until I make your enemies a footstool for your feet”?

Pharisee

YHVH promised a war messiah to put the gentile nations under the regency of Israel.

Essene

The Most High promised a peacefule messiah would enlightment the sons of light (known from the foundation of the world) that they can overcome the principalities of the world. God then removes his spirit from the fallen “gods” so that the angels spiral into matter and die like mere men as the sons of light rise above them in spirit, thus having their enemies put beneath their feet.

[Stu]

Quote (Son of Light @ Jan. 10 2008,13:12)

Quote (Stu @ Jan. 10 2008,12:57) Quote (Son of Light @ Jan. 10 2008,12:35) Quote (Stu @ Jan. 10 2008,11:05) Quote (Son of Light @ Jan. 10 2008,06:43) God is not a despot like Zeus.   Hi Son of Light Just a very low-grade question here.  Notwithstanding the fact that you have to bend the OT out of shape completely or ignore it altogether to get “god is not a despot” (surely he is portrayed as an unpredictable dictator quick to smite!) but you compare him directly to Zeus.  Am I misunderstanding or are you comparing a god you think exists with a god you think doesn't?  If so, I am keen to find out why you are a Zeus-atheist but not a YHWH / Allah / Jehova / the LORD / whatever the name(s) of your god-atheist. Stuart I am not a zeus athiest.  Tow pretty much has it right.  The gods of the nations are representive of fallen angels. This is fantastic!  if I invent a god, will you believe it to be a fallen angel too? Stuart If your movement because successful then an entity might come along to step into that role and help move things along.

So you're saying my new religion could advertise for a deity, and if sufficiently attractive, one of the lesser 'gods' might step in as Chairman? What do you have to pay to get Most High to head up your fantasy corporation?

Stuart

[Author]

Posts