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I have given more than enough of the scientific explanation for your origins and mine. If you were interested in what is thought to be the explanations for these things you could easily read it for yourself. As you appear to have a negative view of science perhaps there is no point casting those pearls in any case. What does vanity have to do with it?
You are asserting there is evidence for a creator, so what is it?
Stuart
Quote (Stu @ Dec. 06 2010,15:29) I have given more than enough of the scientific explanation for your origins and mine. If you were interested in what is thought to be the explanations for these things you could easily read it for yourself. As you appear to have a negative view of science perhaps there is no point casting those pearls in any case. What does vanity have to do with it? You are asserting there is evidence for a creator, so what is it?
Stuart
Greetings Stu….Life as we know it and all the components that add to it….This is the evidence I present….When I speak of vanity,I speak of mans inability to accept that there is a creator and it was not him,so as a result man marvels over the creation but denies the creator ….that is vanity..Quote (theodorej @ Dec. 07 2010,02:18) Quote (Stu @ Dec. 06 2010,15:29) I have given more than enough of the scientific explanation for your origins and mine. If you were interested in what is thought to be the explanations for these things you could easily read it for yourself. As you appear to have a negative view of science perhaps there is no point casting those pearls in any case. What does vanity have to do with it? You are asserting there is evidence for a creator, so what is it?
Stuart
Greetings Stu….Life as we know it and all the components that add to it….This is the evidence I present….When I speak of vanity,I speak of mans inability to accept that there is a creator and it was not him,so as a result man marvels over the creation but denies the creator ….that is vanity..
You still have not given this evidence you asserted exists for your god. What is it?Who cares about vanity? Aren't you interested in what can be said to be true?
Stuart
Quote (Stu @ Dec. 07 2010,20:12) Quote (theodorej @ Dec. 07 2010,02:18) Quote (Stu @ Dec. 06 2010,15:29) I have given more than enough of the scientific explanation for your origins and mine. If you were interested in what is thought to be the explanations for these things you could easily read it for yourself. As you appear to have a negative view of science perhaps there is no point casting those pearls in any case. What does vanity have to do with it? You are asserting there is evidence for a creator, so what is it?
Stuart
Greetings Stu….Life as we know it and all the components that add to it….This is the evidence I present….When I speak of vanity,I speak of mans inability to accept that there is a creator and it was not him,so as a result man marvels over the creation but denies the creator ….that is vanity..
You still have not given this evidence you asserted exists for your god. What is it?Who cares about vanity? Aren't you interested in what can be said to be true?
Stuart
Greetings Stu…. This is a tedeous discussion simply because what I recognize as proof that there is a creator you attribute to either a massive explosion or some amebic ball of slim emerging from the water or the most grandious of all… our decent from primates….As I have stated before there is no order in an explosion,science itself has disproved the amebic theory and replaced it with the primate theory,and to this date they have not been able to produce a transitional speci…Quote (theodorej @ Dec. 08 2010,01:40) Quote (Stu @ Dec. 07 2010,20:12) Quote (theodorej @ Dec. 07 2010,02:18) Quote (Stu @ Dec. 06 2010,15:29) I have given more than enough of the scientific explanation for your origins and mine. If you were interested in what is thought to be the explanations for these things you could easily read it for yourself. As you appear to have a negative view of science perhaps there is no point casting those pearls in any case. What does vanity have to do with it? You are asserting there is evidence for a creator, so what is it?
Stuart
Greetings Stu….Life as we know it and all the components that add to it….This is the evidence I present….When I speak of vanity,I speak of mans inability to accept that there is a creator and it was not him,so as a result man marvels over the creation but denies the creator ….that is vanity..
You still have not given this evidence you asserted exists for your god. What is it?Who cares about vanity? Aren't you interested in what can be said to be true?
Stuart
Greetings Stu…. This is a tedeous discussion simply because what I recognize as proof that there is a creator you attribute to either a massive explosion or some amebic ball of slim emerging from the water or the most grandious of all… our decent from primates….As I have stated before there is no order in an explosion,science itself has disproved the amebic theory and replaced it with the primate theory,and to this date they have not been able to produce a transitional speci…
You appear to be profoundly ignorant about this. You have always struck me as a considerate and thinking kind of person. Is this one area of understanding that you have never taken onboard in any serious capacity?I cannot see any proof of anything whatever in your posts. Complete the following statement. I will be happy enough with unambiguous evidence, I do not require “proof”, which is essentially a mathematical notion anyway:
“The Judeo-christian god I worship must really exist because…”
Stuart
Quote (Stu @ Dec. 08 2010,02:57) Quote (theodorej @ Dec. 08 2010,01:40) Quote (Stu @ Dec. 07 2010,20:12) Quote (theodorej @ Dec. 07 2010,02:18) Quote (Stu @ Dec. 06 2010,15:29) I have given more than enough of the scientific explanation for your origins and mine. If you were interested in what is thought to be the explanations for these things you could easily read it for yourself. As you appear to have a negative view of science perhaps there is no point casting those pearls in any case. What does vanity have to do with it? You are asserting there is evidence for a creator, so what is it?
Stuart
Greetings Stu….Life as we know it and all the components that add to it….This is the evidence I present….When I speak of vanity,I speak of mans inability to accept that there is a creator and it was not him,so as a result man marvels over the creation but denies the creator ….that is vanity..
You still have not given this evidence you asserted exists for your god. What is it?Who cares about vanity? Aren't you interested in what can be said to be true?
Stuart
Greetings Stu…. This is a tedeous discussion simply because what I recognize as proof that there is a creator you attribute to either a massive explosion or some amebic ball of slim emerging from the water or the most grandious of all… our decent from primates….As I have stated before there is no order in an explosion,science itself has disproved the amebic theory and replaced it with the primate theory,and to this date they have not been able to produce a transitional speci…
You appear to be profoundly ignorant about this. You have always struck me as a considerate and thinking kind of person. Is this one area of understanding that you have never taken onboard in any serious capacity?I cannot see any proof of anything whatever in your posts. Complete the following statement. I will be happy enough with unambiguous evidence, I do not require “proof”, which is essentially a mathematical notion anyway:
“The Judeo-christian god I worship must really exist because…”
Stuart
Greetings Stu….Perhaps what I consider proof is inadequate and does not meet the criterior needed to convince either yourself and those who share your beliefs,however,since I have a sense that you are a fair man you will appreciate the fact that you have been unable to prove the contrary….Lets leave it at Ignorance Is Bliss and for that reason I am content with what I hold to be true…That would fall far short of the rigour I would expect in regards to anything I was to take on as a belief, but as it always will be, each to their own. As long as I am not expected to assent to creationist canards that don't really even have a place in a Nineteenth Century discourse on the subject!
Stuart
Although i'm not an atheist or agostic, I found the fairies analogy spot on and humorous. One thing for certain though, you either worship the creation or worship the creator you can't do both.
Romans 1:18-23 reads
18 For God’s wrath is being revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men who are suppressing the truth in an unrighteous way, 19 because what may be known about God is manifest among them, for God made it manifest to them. 20 For his invisible [qualities] are clearly seen from the world’s creation onward, because they are perceived by the things made, even his eternal power and Godship, so that they are inexcusable; 21 because, although they knew God, they did not glorify him as God nor did they thank him, but they became empty-headed in their reasonings and their unintelligent heart became darkened. 22 Although asserting they were wise, they became foolish 23 and turned the glory of the incorruptible God into something like the image of corruptible man and of birds and four-footed creatures and creeping things.
Quote (betweenchristendomandjws @ Dec. 13 2010,10:57) Although i'm not an atheist or agostic, I found the fairies analogy spot on and humorous. One thing for certain though, you either worship the creation or worship the creator you can't do both.
I do neither.Stuart
Quote (Stu @ Dec. 13 2010,15:33) Quote (betweenchristendomandjws @ Dec. 13 2010,10:57) Although i'm not an atheist or agostic, I found the fairies analogy spot on and humorous. One thing for certain though, you either worship the creation or worship the creator you can't do both.
I do neither.Stuart
Yes, you worship “consent” as the means of determining right or wrong. By the way can beastiality also be consentual STU?Quote (bodhitharta @ Dec. 20 2010,09:55) Quote (Stu @ Dec. 13 2010,15:33) Quote (betweenchristendomandjws @ Dec. 13 2010,10:57) Although i'm not an atheist or agostic, I found the fairies analogy spot on and humorous. One thing for certain though, you either worship the creation or worship the creator you can't do both.
I do neither.Stuart
Yes, you worship “consent” as the means of determining right or wrong. By the way can beastiality also be consentual STU?
What do you mean by “consent”? Consentual sex
Quote (betweenchristendomandjws @ Dec. 20 2010,13:04) Quote (bodhitharta @ Dec. 20 2010,09:55) Quote (Stu @ Dec. 13 2010,15:33) Quote (betweenchristendomandjws @ Dec. 13 2010,10:57) Although i'm not an atheist or agostic, I found the fairies analogy spot on and humorous. One thing for certain though, you either worship the creation or worship the creator you can't do both.
I do neither.Stuart
Yes, you worship “consent” as the means of determining right or wrong. By the way can beastiality also be consentual STU?
What do you mean by “consent”? Consentual sex
Stu decides morality by whatever is consentual between individuals or societies. To Stu there is no standard of Morality that comes from GodQuote (bodhitharta @ Dec. 21 2010,11:48) Quote (betweenchristendomandjws @ Dec. 20 2010,13:04) Quote (bodhitharta @ Dec. 20 2010,09:55) Quote (Stu @ Dec. 13 2010,15:33) Quote (betweenchristendomandjws @ Dec. 13 2010,10:57) Although i'm not an atheist or agostic, I found the fairies analogy spot on and humorous. One thing for certain though, you either worship the creation or worship the creator you can't do both.
I do neither.Stuart
Yes, you worship “consent” as the means of determining right or wrong. By the way can beastiality also be consentual STU?
What do you mean by “consent”? Consentual sex
Stu decides morality by whatever is consentual between individuals or societies. To Stu there is no standard of Morality that comes from God
Thanks to you, I know what atheists worship, i've talked to a few ex JW's and atheists over the internet but I could never put them in a box UNTIL NOW
.Quote (bodhitharta @ Dec. 21 2010,11:48) Quote (betweenchristendomandjws @ Dec. 20 2010,13:04) Quote (bodhitharta @ Dec. 20 2010,09:55) Quote (Stu @ Dec. 13 2010,15:33) Quote (betweenchristendomandjws @ Dec. 13 2010,10:57) Although i'm not an atheist or agostic, I found the fairies analogy spot on and humorous. One thing for certain though, you either worship the creation or worship the creator you can't do both.
I do neither.Stuart
Yes, you worship “consent” as the means of determining right or wrong. By the way can beastiality also be consentual STU?
What do you mean by “consent”? Consentual sex
Stu decides morality by whatever is consentual between individuals or societies. To Stu there is no standard of Morality that comes from God
Once again you have me wrong.But as the world knows (see the Debating Bodhitharta thread), you are dishonest in your strawman building, and you appear to attract admirers as limited as you are.
Stuart
Quote (Stu @ Dec. 22 2010,14:51) Quote (bodhitharta @ Dec. 21 2010,11:48) Quote (betweenchristendomandjws @ Dec. 20 2010,13:04) Quote (bodhitharta @ Dec. 20 2010,09:55) Quote (Stu @ Dec. 13 2010,15:33) Quote (betweenchristendomandjws @ Dec. 13 2010,10:57) Although i'm not an atheist or agostic, I found the fairies analogy spot on and humorous. One thing for certain though, you either worship the creation or worship the creator you can't do both.
I do neither.Stuart
Yes, you worship “consent” as the means of determining right or wrong. By the way can beastiality also be consentual STU?
What do you mean by “consent”? Consentual sex
Stu decides morality by whatever is consentual between individuals or societies. To Stu there is no standard of Morality that comes from God
Once again you have me wrong.But as the world knows (see the Debating Bodhitharta thread), you are dishonest in your strawman building, and you appear to attract admirers as limited as you are.
Stuart
STU,You did say that societies agree on what is moral and that there is no Absolute standard of Morality, you claimed morality evolved through mutual cooperation, I may not have stated your belief directly but isn't the essense of what I am saying about you true?
Maybe you're changing because before you claimed that consentual adults should have the right to do anything but then you said that statement was slander.
This is the problem you morals will always be changing because they have no foundation, morality is whatever feels right that day just like a leaf in the wind it has no certain direction.
Stu is Adultery right or wrong?
Quote (bodhitharta @ Dec. 24 2010,03:40) Quote (Stu @ Dec. 22 2010,14:51) Quote (bodhitharta @ Dec. 21 2010,11:48) Quote (betweenchristendomandjws @ Dec. 20 2010,13:04) Quote (bodhitharta @ Dec. 20 2010,09:55) Quote (Stu @ Dec. 13 2010,15:33) Quote (betweenchristendomandjws @ Dec. 13 2010,10:57) Although i'm not an atheist or agostic, I found the fairies analogy spot on and humorous. One thing for certain though, you either worship the creation or worship the creator you can't do both.
I do neither.Stuart
Yes, you worship “consent” as the means of determining right or wrong. By the way can beastiality also be consentual STU?
What do you mean by “consent”? Consentual sex
Stu decides morality by whatever is consentual between individuals or societies. To Stu there is no standard of Morality that comes from God
Once again you have me wrong.But as the world knows (see the Debating Bodhitharta thread), you are dishonest in your strawman building, and you appear to attract admirers as limited as you are.
Stuart
STU,You did say that societies agree on what is moral and that there is no Absolute standard of Morality, you claimed morality evolved through mutual cooperation, I may not have stated your belief directly but isn't the essense of what I am saying about you true?
Maybe you're changing because before you claimed that consentual adults should have the right to do anything but then you said that statement was slander.
This is the problem you morals will always be changing because they have no foundation, morality is whatever feels right that day just like a leaf in the wind it has no certain direction.
Stu is Adultery right or wrong?
Oh ok, so it is her belief on morality, she is part of the cain family tree for now
I refuse to acknowledge that Nimrod is my brother even though he comes from the darkskinned race.BD
Quote You did say that societies agree on what is moral and that there is no Absolute standard of Morality, you claimed morality evolved through mutual cooperation, I may not have stated your belief directly but isn't the essense of what I am saying about you true?
No. Morals are the result of that which is inate in us, left there by natural selection as the set of behaviours that have been advantageous to our continued survival, plus that which we develop through ethical thinking together as a group. If you claim an ethical point to be absolute for you then it is absolute. Murder, theft and lying are fundamental ethics shared by all groups regardless of what religions they have encountered. When people universally claim something immoral then why not call it an absolute standard, if that is what people think? No need for an Imaginary Friend in order to have “absolute morals”.Quote Maybe you're changing because before you claimed that consentual adults should have the right to do anything but then you said that statement was slander.
No, again you change the statement. I object to your statement that I quoted repeatedly aback to you, and which you have withdrawn, as slanderous. This is a new statement. Consenting adults should have the right to do what they wish in private, subject to the pragmatic limitations such as those of the problems that arise from incest that produces offspring. Incest must be immoral if it has the real potential to produce genetically damaged offspring. Bestiality must be immoral because an animal cannot give informed consent. I will not be relitigating this point with you again, as I feel I have explained myself well enough in the past.Quote This is the problem you morals will always be changing because they have no foundation, morality is whatever feels right that day just like a leaf in the wind it has no certain direction.
Is slavery right? Like the bible, the koran specifies how you may treat slaves, but does not command you to free them (it gives isolated cases but does not state it as a principle). Pedophilia? You yourself have said that the standard was different in Mo’s time. So whose worldview blows like a leaf in the wind?Quote Stu is Adultery right or wrong?
What I think is wrong is lying, which is the usual problem with adultery. It is the deception, not the act itself. If both partners in a failing marriage have each consummated a new relationship, and all parties are happy that the original marriage should eventually just be dissolved, then who should call that situation immoral?Stuart
Quote (Stu @ Dec. 24 2010,20:28) BD Quote You did say that societies agree on what is moral and that there is no Absolute standard of Morality, you claimed morality evolved through mutual cooperation, I may not have stated your belief directly but isn't the essense of what I am saying about you true?
No. Morals are the result of that which is inate in us, left there by natural selection as the set of behaviours that have been advantageous to our continued survival, plus that which we develop through ethical thinking together as a group. If you claim an ethical point to be absolute for you then it is absolute. Murder, theft and lying are fundamental ethics shared by all groups regardless of what religions they have encountered. When people universally claim something immoral then why not call it an absolute standard, if that is what people think? No need for an Imaginary Friend in order to have “absolute morals”.Quote Maybe you're changing because before you claimed that consentual adults should have the right to do anything but then you said that statement was slander.
No, again you change the statement. I object to your statement that I quoted repeatedly aback to you, and which you have withdrawn, as slanderous. This is a new statement. Consenting adults should have the right to do what they wish in private, subject to the pragmatic limitations such as those of the problems that arise from incest that produces offspring. Incest must be immoral if it has the real potential to produce genetically damaged offspring. Bestiality must be immoral because an animal cannot give informed consent. I will not be relitigating this point with you again, as I feel I have explained myself well enough in the past.Quote This is the problem you morals will always be changing because they have no foundation, morality is whatever feels right that day just like a leaf in the wind it has no certain direction.
Is slavery right? Like the bible, the koran specifies how you may treat slaves, but does not command you to free them (it gives isolated cases but does not state it as a principle). Pedophilia? You yourself have said that the standard was different in Mo’s time. So whose worldview blows like a leaf in the wind?Quote Stu is Adultery right or wrong?
What I think is wrong is lying, which is the usual problem with adultery. It is the deception, not the act itself. If both partners in a failing marriage have each consummated a new relationship, and all parties are happy that the original marriage should eventually just be dissolved, then who should call that situation immoral?Stuart
You have shown your viewpoints to be rather religious and I like that but it's interesting that you masquerade the religious sentiments as somehow not religious.If a person chose to have sex with an animal how is it you say that an animal cannot give consent? If the animal is sexually excited and is certainly looking for satisfaction what more consent would a person need? Do you think animals comsent with one another? If so or if Not how would the consent between humans and animals be any different?
You said Adultery was wrong because lying was immoral, Why is lying immoral, what is wrong with sneaking behind someones back to have sex with their neighbors willing wife?
Quote Consenting adults should have the right to do what they wish in private, subject to the pragmatic limitations such as those of the problems that arise from incest that produces offspring. So here we are again, You are saying that A Father and Son of consenting age have the right to have sexual intercourse or a grandmother in menopause has a right to have sexual intercourse with her adult son or daughter.
Quote Pedophilia? You yourself have said that the standard was different in Mo’s time. So whose worldview blows like a leaf in the wind? I never said that MARRIAGE at any age is immoral or incorrect and no where in either of the Holy Books I study forbids such MARRIAGES, The word pedophelia is then equal to the word gerophelia and has no meaning as Marriage is Marriage:
If the Parents of a child agree to any Marriage it is permissable and if the Child is an orphan it is also permissable. Marriage is a lifelong commitment so age is only relative throughout that relationship, Do you see it wrong for an 80 year old man to marry a 60 year old woman? Do you find it wrong for a 70 year old woman to marry a 40 year old man?
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