- This topic has 698 replies, 13 voices, and was last updated 24 years, 5 months ago by
.
- Posts
The definition of ‘deception’ is being led astray without knowing it..!
–
You say you have come out of Babylon, but really you are lost in the labyrinth of your own delusions… to the point where you are now promoting a type of cult Christianity, while at the same time thinking you are proclaiming the truth..!
–
You actually present to us the VERY confusion that you warn us to come out of…!!!david
can you point out some indication in the scriptures that actually talks about the trinity ???
and of cause that lines up with the words of what God says ;THAT HE ALONE IS GOD ,AND THAT THEIR IS NO OTHER GOD LIKE HIM ;
AND THE UNDERSTANDING THAT GOD IS A BEING NOT A COMPOSED BEING ,
@ DavidL.
See how you need extra-biblical support for your doctrine? Whereas, we can give you scripture that cannot be altered by reason of their simplicity and clarity.
You have one so-called proof, your interpretation of John 1:1c. But we have told you before that there are 3 ways that John 1:1c can be read using all the possible legitimate interpretations when the definite article is not there.
1) Imagine it is inferred and treat it like other verses where it is also not there, but is still talking about God;
2) Put in the indefinite article like other verses do such as Jesus calling Judas “a devil”;
3) Interpret it without any article at all as it is written, thus giving it a qualitative view such as we see with Jesus own words, when he said, “ye are gods/theos”. When he said that, he did not mean “Ye are God” and there is no definite article there either.
In order to choose the right one, you only have to choose the one that does not contradict the rest of scripture. It is not hard and we shouldn’t even have to spell that out to you. So let’s take a look at 3 scriptures, 2 from Paul, one from Jesus.
“For us there is one God the Father”
“There is one God and Father of all”
“This is eternal life, that you may know the only true God, and Jesus Christ whom he has sent”.
Anyone who chooses the first option for John 1:1c (such as yourself), ignores the words of Jesus and Paul above and hundreds of other verses that I haven’t quoted in this post but are quoted here, (100 verses are):So why swap the clear words of Jesus for one supposed possible interpretation of what John wrote in the opening line of his book, and even worse, John tells us the conclusion of his book which is to believe who Jesus is, which he says, the son of God, and the messiah. Those who swap the words of Jesus for their own opinion of John 1:1c or any other scripture, are being foolish in the extreme.
But as Jesus said himself, “My sheep hear my voice”, so we would be wise to listen to him on who God is. But I realise that not all will listen and there is nothing I can do about that. I can lead a horse to water, but I cannot force him to drink.
DavidL, your Trinity Doctrine is from Babylon. It is not in scripture, it contradicts hundreds of scriptures that are clear, and it goes against Jesus own teachings. What can I say, will we then become bewitched and return to Babylonian captivity or will we remain free in the truth?
I can tell you here an now, we are not interested in your wares. The bread you are trying to get us to consume is not from Heaven.He simply cannot. He gives John 1:1. Unfortunately for him, it is talking about the Word and God. No Trinity there. But he is happy to quote extra-biblical material.
Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost: – Matthew 28:19
You have brought into question the translation of John 1:1…giving your understanding of Greek and how you imagine it should be interpreted, and I have shared why this Scripture correctly reads, “the Word was God.” …I don’t need this information to support my belief, but I share it so we have something to compare your teaching with…since it is you that must change this verse to support your anti-trinity doctrine.
–
btw I believe “This is eternal life, that you may know the only true God, AND Jesus Christ whom He has sent”. Every Christian believes this, but you use this verse (like all who oppose the trinity) to deny the rightful Deity of Christ..and the reason you do this is because you lean on your own understanding (Proverbs 3:5) to interpret Scripture, and as such you cannot make sense of the trinity….this is the difference between us.But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned. – 1 Corinthians 2:14
–
Oh, the depth of the riches of the wisdom and knowledge of God! How unsearchable His judgments, and His paths beyond tracing out!
– Romans 11:33
–
“Can you solve the mysteries of God? Can you discover everything about the Almighty? – Job 11:7
–
Do you not know? Have you not heard? The LORD is the everlasting God, the Creator of the ends of the earth. He will not grow tired or weary, and his understanding no one can fathom. – Isaiah 40:28
–
these are the things God has revealed to us by His Spirit. The Spirit searches all things, even the deep things of God. – 1 Corinthians 2:10
–
My goal is that they may be encouraged in heart and united in love, so that they may have the full riches of complete understanding, in order that they may know the mystery of God, namely, Christ, in whom are hidden all the treasures of wisdom and knowledge. I tell you this so that no one may deceive you by fine-sounding arguments…See to it that no one takes you captive through hollow and deceptive philosophy, which depends on human tradition and the elemental spiritual forces of this world rather than on Christ. For in Christ all the fullness of the Deity lives in bodily form, and in Christ you have been brought to fullness. He is the head over every power and authority. – Colossians 2
–
The mystery that gives us our reverence for God is acknowledged to be great: He appeared in His human nature, was approved by the Spirit, was seen by angels, was announced throughout the nations, was believed in the world, and was taken to heaven in glory. – 1 Timothy 3:16t8 – you ‘use’ Scripture to support your hollow arguments but like the Pharisees, your dead theology denies the very GOD you profess to serve.
–
you are not fighting me – you are opposing the Holy Spirit.I noticed that you didn’t say I was opposing scripture, but the Holy Spirit. You have this idea that the Holy Spirit interprets scripture differently to how it is written. So “this is eternal life to know the only true God and Jesus Christ whom he has sent”, becomes something different that means that the Father is not the only true God according to Jesus own words. Let’s call it what it is, a direct contradiction of Jesus’s own words.
Jesus said, “my sheep hear my voice” and eternal life was to believe in the only true God the Father and Jesus whom the Father sent.
This much is clear. You publicly oppose this, and condemn me for repeating Jesus own words.david
Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost: – Matthew 28:19
do you know that the Hebrew gospel of Matthew does not have that verse ,??? and do you know that there is no other scripture that support this ritual ???
The Church who calls herself the mother Church also defends the Mysterious Trinity. How interesting to note that she is called a mother and she defends something that is a mystery.
The ancient mystery religion is Mystery Babylon and the Mysterious Trinity is part of this ancient religion. The original Babylon worshipped a Trinity, with Tamuz the son being born on Dec 25. God was so enraged by Babylon that he destroyed that city so that it would never rise again.
But the religion spread especially after Babel. It took on many forms and many names, and so it was that trinities appeared in many cultures. This Mother Church that defends this mysterious Trinity has put to death those who did not concur with her doctrine and foundation. These martyrs were burned at the stake, hung, tortured, starved and imprisoned. Some say it was many millions that were put to death. Her reign was terrible and became known as the Dark Ages. Scripture was removed from everyday people, and no one could stop her. During this darkness when men did not have the Word of God, her false foundation took deep root and with the opposition killed, she sat like a queen. She sat there with a golden cup in her hand and wearing purple and scarlet. And the wine that she gave people to drink was not from the River of Life, but from her golden cup of abominations. And from this she made much of the world drunk.
Even today, drunk people are still trying to shut us up. They can’t kill us because that is unlawful. But who knows what men are capable of when darkness has her hour.The Hebrew gospel of Matthew was written by George Howard in 1995, who took a medieval Jewish rabbinical commentary on Matthew (written in Hebrew) and extracting the text of Matthew, he first published it separately as ‘The Gospel of Matthew according to a primitive Hebrew Text’ (1987)..
–
Most scholars consider that these medieval Hebrew manuscripts are derived by translation from medieval Greek or Latin manuscripts, and therefore that it is extremely unlikely that any of the unique readings found in these medieval Hebrew manuscripts could be ancient..but rather were written for the purpose of Jewish apologetics…Your ideas remind me of groups like Jehovah’s Witnesses and Seventh Day Adventist, who love attacking the Catholic church for it’s false doctrine and past persecution of believers…you talk about mystery Babylon etc, but this fascination you have with the trinity has really perverted your concept of Christianity.. making your view tunnel-visioned to the point where it seems you think the whole Christian world revolves around this one doctrine..
–
I’m not Catholic – never have been, nor for that matter do I belong to any denomination…but I can tell you without a doubt, the threefold unity of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit is the absolute truth of Scripture..!!!
–
The fact that the Godhead is presented to us in the Word as ‘mysterious’ is in no way related to mystery Babylon..it is just showing (quite understandably) that the mind of man is incapable of comprehending Almighty God, the same as when Paul was caught up into Paradise and heard unspeakable words…or Ezekiel saw four faced creatures with wheels full of eyes…
–
That God is both Three and ONE at the same time is something which confounds the intellectual mind, but for those who are born of the Spirit it is no longer a doctrine to work out theologically or historically – you simply know it’s true because you’ve ‘seen’ it..
–
This may sound arrogant to some but really ‘revelation’ is the basis of all true faith – period..! It starts with us seeing our own need for God…and even knowing Jesus died for our sins is itself a revelation…the work of salvation is really the work of the Holy Spirit revealing to us the truth…but like the Galatians who started out right, we all must guard against falling back to relying on our own understanding again…
–
“Are you so foolish? After beginning by means of the Spirit, are you now trying to finish by means of the flesh?” – Galatians 3:3But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in My name, He shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you. – John 14:26
–
“When the Advocate comes, whom I will send to you from the Father–the Spirit of truth who goes out from the Father–He will testify about Me.” – John 15:26
–
“There are different kinds of gifts, but the same Spirit distributes them. There are different kinds of service, but the same Lord. There are different kinds of working, but in all of them and in everyone it is the same God at work.” – 1 Corinthians 12:4-6I see that you identify strongly with Babylon.
And Jesus said that eternal life was to know the only true God (the Father) and to also know him (Jesus) whom the only true God sent.
Does Jesus sound like a JW to you too? He must do.
If I say that the Father is the only true God and that makes me like a JW, then Jesus is like a JW to you too.
The Pharisees claimed to be of God and Abraham. But they were not because the proof was they ignored Jesus words. Why do you do that too?“A little (and incomplete) knowledge of Greek can do more harm than good when people try to apply it beyond their scope of knowledge.” – Corey Keating
DavidL, in Revelation we are told that men did not repent of worhipping and making idols even during the judgements.
But why would they not repent I use to wonder. You have partially given me the answer. It is because they have been deceived into thinking they are right. And they are deceived because they loved not the truth.
Here is a truth that you do not love. “For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten son”. Here is another. “This is eternal life, that you may know the only true God, and Jesus Christ whom he has sent”.
When we do not love the truth, we are then susceptible to the lies, even the great lies and false wonders that will happen and are happening.The Trinity. It started in Babylon spread to Egypt, to Greece, to the Roman Empire, then the Holy Roman Empire, and now the Roman Catholic Church. They all had their beloved Trinity. This mystery religion rode on the back of the whole Beast and yes the Mystery Religion was in these empires, not just the first one. It kept the people drunk and easy to control. A very handy took in the hands of these power mongers.
- You must be logged in to reply to this topic.
