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Thank you KJ.
I want to address two important things here fo Wj, and yes I am smiling.
First I want to remind you that any man testifying against keeping the 7th day who did for years and got nothing Spiritual out of it, was “under the law” in other words he kept the 7th day to please himself and not our Father in heaven, so when he did not get whatever thing he expected to receive, like some kind of reward, he decided it was unnecessary. It absolutely “must” be kept to please Him and not ourself. We deserve nothing!
I'd like to first point out the 7th day Adventist does not keep all the Sabbaths (appointed times) of YHWH, and also that they are trinitarians. My 7th day pastor Jim gave a sermon several months ago and admitted they were Laodecia, and luke warm.
You will know when you have found a church after YHWH's own heart, when you “Continue to grow in the fullness of His Son”, therefore even the Galatians who were chastised for falling backwards into their old pagen laws and traditions, could wind up being an assembly after His heart, IF they return to Him. It is not impossible for a Sunday church to grow in faith, BUT if they are truly growing they will show it, and move to the Sabbath. Otherwise just sit idol, and become stagnent.
That brings me to my second point and since I am again straightening a crooked path that was laid above, I WILL post scripture to light the path to righteousness.
Gal 1:6 I marvel that ye are so soon removed from him that called you into the grace of Christ unto another gospel:
Gal 1:7 Which is not another; but there be some that trouble you, and would pervert the gospel of Christ.
Gal 1:8 But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed.
Gal 1:9 As we said before, so say I now again, If any man preach any other gospel unto you than that ye have received, let him be accursed.
Gal 1:10 For do I now persuade men, or God? or do I seek to please men? for if I yet pleased men, I should not be the servant of Christ.
Gal 1:11 But I certify you, brethren, that the gospel which was preached of me is not after man.
Gal 1:12 For I neither received it of man, neither was I taught it, but by the revelation of Jesus Christ.
Gal 1:13 For ye have heard of my conversation in time past in the Jews' religion, how that beyond measure I persecuted the church of God, and wasted it:First thing I noticed in Pauls letter was that he did not say “to the faithful” as in many other of his letters.
The second thing I notice is that the Galatians did not stay in the Word, they fell from obedience, how else does one show it!
Third thing I noticed is they had “another” gospel and called it the gospel of Y'shua. So already they began twisting the truth. JUST LIKE THOSE SINNING ISRAELITES! SO soon do they fall away from the truth.
Fourthly, HE WARNS THEM 2 times!
Fifth thing, I see the gospel they were preaching glorified themselves!
Lastly, Paul hits them with a confession. He says “At one time I made a name for myself, persecuting the beleivers of YHWH, I worked for a foreign government, it was my job. Y'shua came to me and showed me the “gospel of the kingdom of heaven” which says to believe that Y'shua is the Son of Elohim and the Anointed One, and guard the commands, for judgment is near!
Paul goes on to show them in detail, where they fell off the path, and how to get back on it.
Quote Gal. 4:21-31
Tell me, ye that desire to be under the law, do ye not hear the law? For it is written, that Abraham had two sons, the one by a bondmaid, and the other by a free woman. But he who was of the bondwoman was born after the flesh, but he of the freewoman was by promise. Which things are an allegory: for these are the two covenants; the one from the Mount Sinai, which gendereth to bondage, which is Agar…. But Jerusalem which is above is free which is the mother of us all…. Now we, brethren, as Isaac was, are the children of promise. But as then he that was born after the flesh persecuted him that was born of the Spirit, even so it is now. Nevertheless what saith the scripture? Cast out the bondwoman and her son: for the son of the bondwoman shall not be heir with the son of the freewoman. So then, brethren, we are not children of the bondwoman, but of the freeLets not look at one passage of Paul's writings that are “hard to understand” and come to the conclusion that Paul did not keep the Ten commandments of God.
2Pe 3:16 as he does in all his letters when he speaks in them of these matters. There are some things in them that are hard to understand, which the ignorant and unstable twist to their own destruction, as they do the other Scriptures.
2Pe 3:17 You therefore, beloved, knowing this beforehand, take care that you are not carried away with the error of lawless people and lose your own stability.Rom 7:14 For we know that the law is spiritual, but I am of the flesh, sold under sin.
Paul says that he serves the law of God.
Rom 7:25 Thanks be to God through Jesus Christ our Lord! So then, I myself serve the law of God with my mind, but with my flesh I serve the law of sin.
The following chapter Paul declares that unless walking in the Spirit you “cannot” keep the law of God.
Rom 8:6 For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace.
Rom 8:7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can .I have brought this up time and again. God's law is the law God wrote. Moses' law is the law that God gave Moses to write.
The law God wrote was placed inside the ark. The law that God gave Moses to write was placed on the side of the ark.Time and again Pauls shows that he kept God's commandments.
1Co 7:19 Circumcision is nothing, and uncircumcision is nothing, but the keeping of the commandments of God.
1Co 9:19 For though I am free from all, I have made myself a servant to all, that I might win more of them.
1Co 9:20 To the Jews I became as a Jew, in order to win Jews. To those under the law I became as one under the law (though not being myself under the law) that I might win those under the law.
1Co 9:21 To those outside the law I became as one outside the law (not being outside the law of God but under the law of Christ) that I might win those outside the law.Lets look at Gal. chapter 4.
Gal 4:4 But when the fulness of the time was come, God sent forth his Son, made of a woman, made under the law,
Gal 4:5 To redeem them that were under the law, that we might receive the adoption of sons.
Gal 4:6 And because ye are sons, God hath sent forth the Spirit of his Son into your hearts, crying, Abba, Father.
Gal 4:7 Wherefore thou art no more a servant, but a son; and if a son, then an heir of God through Christ.
Gal 4:8 Howbeit then, when ye knew not God, ye did service unto them which by nature are no gods.
Gal 4:9 But now, after that ye have known God, or rather are known of God, how turn ye again to the weak and beggarly elements, whereunto ye desire again to be in bondage?
Gal 4:10 Ye observe days, and months, and times, and years.This is speaking of Moses' law of the coming Messiah.
“Verse 4 when the fulness of time had come, He sent His Son”
I'm going to ask again WJ Which of the Ten Commandments point to the coming Messiah?
Days, months, and times of years speak of Moses' law and NOT God's law that Paul said he “served”.
Taking all the scriptures that say Keep the commandments of God. The fact that Paul said he served the law of God and was never outside the law of God when teaching those who were. That those who do not walk after the Spirit cannot keep the law of God. The fact that Paul taught ALL Gentiles on the Sabbath and NOT Sunday.
You pull part of scripture out of context to prove that we don't keep the Commandments of God that all scripture says this is the Love of God that we Keep His Commandment that we heard from the beginning and walk in them.1Jo 5:3 For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous.
2Jo 1:6 And this is love, that we walk after his commandments. This is the commandment, That, as ye have heard from the beginning, ye should walk in it.
Rev 12:17 And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.
Rev 14:12 Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.All of us were taught by the RCC and the truth hidden in her till NOW.
Jesus said the only sign He was going to give that HE is the Messiah is that He would be in the heart of the earth three days and three nights.
There is no way anyone can get three days and three nights from Friday night to Sunday morning.
Now who are you going to believe WJ the RCC (Harlot and her daughters) or Jesus the Christ.The RCC has deceived all of us and continues to deceive “many”. The time is NOW saying “come out of her MY people”, Rev 18:4.
God belss all,
Ken
Quote (kejonn @ Oct. 06 2007,00:21) What day did Yeshua get crucified? On the 14th day of Nisan (Abib), which is also the day before the Feast of Unleavened Bread (FoUB). The first day of the FoUB was a sabbath because there was no work to be done on it, just as the last day of the FoUB. We know it is not the weekly Sabbath because of this verse: Joh 19:31 Since it was the day of Preparation, and so that the bodies would not remain on the cross on the Sabbath (for that Sabbath was a high day), the Jews asked Pilate that their legs might be broken and that they might be taken away.
I will provide OT scriptural evidence later that Yeshua observed the First Passover with his disciples the night prior to his death, and that he died on the Second Passover.
Thus it appears that Yeshua died on Wednesday and was laid in the tomb Wednesday evening, before sunset which would start the Jewish 5th day. So he either arose just before sunset on Saturday, placing his resurrection on the weekly Sabbath, or early after sunset on Saturday. Laurel believes the former and it makes sense if you're going on exact times from when he was laid in the tomb (prior to Sunset Wednesday).
kejonnThere seems to be a lot of ambiguity around this. Which makes me wonder about the days and weeks and months and the calendar. After all we dont even know the year our Lord was born.
Friday
Nisan 7
30 or 33 AD
John 12:1 Six days before the Passover Jesus came to Bethany to visit Lazarus, Mary and Martha. A dinner is served in his honor
Jesus' feet anointed with Nard by Mary
Chief priests and Pharisees plotting to arrest JesusSaturday
Nisan 8
30 or 33 AD
John 12:2-5 In Bethany, Jesus ate a supper with Mary, Martha and Lazarus.
John 12:3 Mary ointments Jesus’ feet with Spikenard, Judas objects
Mt 26:6-13, Mark 14:3-9, Luke 7:36-38, John 12:2-11Sunday
Nisan 9
30 or 33 AD
Triumphal Entry
John 12:1-13: Triumphal Entry into Jerusalem and Palm Sunday
Jesus weeps over Jerusalem and curses it and the temple
Chief priests plotting to kill Jesus
Mt 21:7-9, Mark 11:8-10, Luke 19:35-38, John 12:12-16.Monday
Nisan 10
30 or 33 AD
Temple cleansed
Mark 11:12 Next day when they came from Bethany
Mt 21:12: Jesus cleanses temple second time. (Mark records the actual sequence whereas Matthew’s account combines the whole story into one factual account and is not chronological)
Passover lamb selected on Nisan 10: Ex 12:3. It may well be that the act of entering the temple and cleansing it was anti-typical of Ex 12:3. Jesus symbolically presented Himself in the Temple as the Lamb to be slain four days later.
Mk 11:19 Jesus leaves for Bethany again
Matt 21:13, Luke 19:46Tuesday
Nisan 11
30 or 33 AD
Destruction of Jerusalem foretold
Mark 11:20 And in the morning, as they passed by, they saw the fig tree dried up from the roots.
Mark 11:27-13:37 Jesus authority Questioned
Leaders ask many questions but ask no more after being refuted
Widows mite
Matt 24:1 Destruction of Jerusalem in 70 AD foretold
Matt 21:23-23:39; Luke 20:1-21:4.Wednesday
Nisan 12
30 or 33 AD
Sunset, 6 PM Tues – Sunset, 6 PM Wed, Roman (our) time
This was “two days before Passover”, chief priests plot to kill Jesus Mt 26:2-5, Mark 14:1-2, Luke 22:1-2.
Judas bargains with leaders
Jesus retires to the Mount of OlivesThursday
Nisan 13
30 or 33 AD
Sunset, 6 PM Wed – Sunset, 6 PM Thurs Roman (our) time
Disciples sent to prepare upper room for 8 day Passover feast- Mat 26:17-19, Mark 14:12-16, Luke 22:7-13.Friday
Crucifixion
Nisan 14
30 or 33 AD
Passover
And
Preparation Day for Feast of unleavened bread
Friday the 14th of Nisan is the Passover, It started at sundown, what we call today 6 PM Thursday and ended at sundown Friday 6 PM our (Roman) time. Lev 23:5
The week day of the Passover changed from year to year as do our birthdays. In the year 33 AD Passover was on a Friday.
It is also Preparation day for the Feast of unleavened bread. Some are confused by the expression: “day of preparation for the Passover” as used in Jn 19:14; Matt. 27:62
Judas identified as the betrayer- Mat 26:21-25, Mark 14:18-21, Luke 22:21-23, John 13:21-30.
Passover meal and The Lord's Supper- Mat 26:26-29, Mark 14:22-25, Luke 22:14-16.
Around 12 PM Roman time, Jesus retires to Gethsemane and is arrested- Mat 26:30-56, Mark 14:26-52, Luke 22:39-53, John 18:1-12.
12 AM- 6 AM Roman time, (but still Nisan 14) the trials took place in the darkness of the morning.
6 AM Roman time (“sixth hour” Jn 19:14). Jews tell Pilate: “We have no king but Caesar.”
Crucifixion began at about 9 am (the third hour- Mark 15:25). Jesus died at the very moment the Passover lamb was to be slain at the Temple, the ninth hour on the 14th of Nisan (our Friday 3 PM). From the moment Jesus was laid in the tomb, until sunset, the Jews reckoned to be the first day in the grave, even though it was only a few hours. All of this took place on what was the preparation day – not only for the 7th day Sabbath, but also for the upcoming Feast of Unleavened Bread.
From Noon to 3 PM Roman time (6th-9th hour Jewish time) the sky is dark. This may have been a very literal fulfillment of Ex 12:6 where the Passover lamb was to be killed “between the evenings”.
Between 3-5 PM thousands of lambs are being slain for Passover at the same Jesus dies.
John 19:31 Thieves legs broken because it was the preparation day and a Saturday was a “high day”
2 Mary’s watch Joseph and Nicodemus bury JesusSaturday
Nisan 15
30 or 33 AD
Sabbath
Sunset, 6 PM Fri – Sunset, 6 PM Sat, Roman Time
Chief priests and Pharisees ask Pilate to put a guard on tomb about 7 PM (4 hours after Jesus died and one hour into the Sabbath but our Friday night) Matthew 27:62
John 19:31 it was a “high” Seventh day (Saturday) Sabbath because it was ALSO the 15th of Nisan, a feast day: Lev 23:6-7 “On the first day you shall have a holy convocation; you shall not do any laborious work.”
The Messiah rests in the tomb, observing the Sabbath day rest the entire day. This is the second day in the grave.
No Bible verse outright states that Jesus was risen on Saturday.Sunday
Nisan 16
30 or 33 AD
Sunset, 6 PM Sat – Sunset, 6 PM Sun, Roman (our) Time
The resurrection takes place just at day break about 6 AM
The day of first fruits/ wave/ sheaf offering
http://www.bible.ca/d-3-days-and-3-nights.htm#IIBWJ,
It was prophecied that the Messiah would be born the 3rd day or before the year 4,000.Y'eshua was born the year 3999, in the month of Tishri otherwise know as Ethanim or the 7th month, and durring the Feast of Tabernacles. The Word became flech and Tabernacled among us.
Today ends the Feast of Tabernacles, so Happy Birthday Messiah!
Laurel
WJ,
You are on the right track when you say no verse says there were no witnesses to His ressurection. It is only known by those who search Scripture with their whole heart, mind, and soul. It is only by belief in Scripture, or the Word of Elohim, that we can be sure.The guards, “were made to sleep”, while His ressurection took place. Then later they lied and said the Jews stole Y'shua's body. Today many self named Jews believe the body of the Messiah was stolen. They do not believe Y'shua is the Messiah.
Laurel
Quote (Laurel @ Oct. 06 2007,03:44) Blessed is He who came and is coming again in the Name of YHWH!!!
Amen, sister!And Happy birthday Jesus!
Wow, I just have to say, since other's have joined in on this Sabbath thread…….there is so much truth coming out. It's good to have many voices to ponder all of this. I'm enjoying my personal study of this topic, and the thread here is such a nice companion to my study. Thanks all.
WJ…..For that sabbath was a high day is a term used for any HOLY DAY even today by Jews. Lets be honest can you get three days and three nights from Friday to sunday morning. That should be obvious to anyone especially you.
Jesus died wensday after noon at the same time the Jew's were killing the Lambs for the passover meal, and that night started the passover (A SABBATH HIGH DAY) when no work could be done,so they had to get Jesus' body down and in a grave before sundown that day. He died wednsday around three P.M
and rose around the same time saturday.There were three consective Sabbaths
one…..Passover, started sundown wednsday
two….the first day of unleaven bread starting sundown thursday.
three…the regular sabbath, starting sundown friday.It also say's in DAn 9:27…>” and he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week and in the (midest) of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and oblation to cease”. Jesus replaced them and they are no longer needed.
at lest acknowledge this WJ… Peace to all…gene
Not3in1…..Mandy it good to hear your responce, Hope everything is going well with you I am praying for you.
The sabbath (IF) used in a right way can be a special time with God and rest also. It reflects to us the eternal rest we can enter into with our Father as we rely more and more on Him….Bless you and yours….geneHi All!
Heres some more information about Yeshua being crucified on Friday and his Ressurection on Sunday.
Understanding the Jewish time system:
Luke 13:32 ‘Behold, I cast out demons and perform cures today and tomorrow, and the third day I reach My goal.’
Even during the Exodus there is an excellent example of Jewish inclusive time keeping. The Bible says: “The Lord also said to Moses, “Go to the people and consecrate them today and tomorrow, and let them wash their garments; and let them be ready for the third day, for on the third day the Lord will come down on Mount Sinai in the sight of all the people.” Exodus 19:10-11
Intro: The purpose of this section:The term, three days and three nights is: Absolutely equivalent with “after three days”, “on the third day”, three days later”
The term, three days and three nights: Does not require three literal days and three literal nights.
The term, three days and three nights: Does not require 72 literal hours.
That a Friday crucifixion at 3 PM with at Sunday resurrection at 6 AM would have been considered three days and three nights by the Jewish people of the day.From the mouth of Jesus!
Luke 13:32 ‘Behold, I cast out demons and perform cures today and tomorrow, and the third day I reach My goal.’
What this proves is that the expression “the third day” represents a literal duration of Friday – Sunday!!! Jesus spoke Lk 12:32 ON A FRIDAY and he entered Jerusalem on a Sunday exactly one week before he died!
This proves, by Jesus own words, that Friday – Sunday = less than 72 hours and that the expression “3 days and 3 nights” is Friday – Sunday!!!
http://www.bible.ca/d-3-days-and-3-nights.htm#IIBHi All!
The Early Church Fathers has much to say about the ressurection of our lord. I will post some later but thought this was rather interesting and deals with this point now.
“Preparation”, the first century word for Friday!
Charles C. Torrey explains, In Aramaic, “the middle days of the week were designated by numbers, ‘third, fourth, fifth,’ but Friday was always arubta; there was no ‘sixth day’ of the week; . . . Its Greek equivalent, paraskeue-Friday, was likewise adopted, from the first, by the Greek Church.”
The Didache, dated between A.D. 70 to 120, enjoins Christians to fast on “the fourth day and Preparation” (8:1), that is, Wednesday and Friday. It is noteworthy that Friday is designated simply as “Preparation-paraskeuen,” without the article or the noun “day,” thus indicating the technical usage of the term. By the time of Tertullian (c. A.D. 160-225) paraskeue had already become such a fixed name for Friday that he even argues that this had been the name for Friday since creation. This clearly indicate that Christians adopted the Jewish practice of numbering the first five days of the week and of naming the sixth and the seventh as paraskeue and sabbaton—Preparation and Sabbath.
250 AD IGNATIUS: “On the day of the preparation, then, at the third hour, He received the sentence from Pilate, the Father permitting that to happen; at the sixth hour He was crucified; at the ninth hour He gave up the ghost; and before sunset He was buried. During the Sabbath He continued under the earth in the tomb in which Joseph of Arimathaea had laid Him. At the dawning of the Lord's day He arose from the dead, according to what was spoken by Himself, “As Jonah was three days and three nights in the whale's belly, so shall the Son of man also be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.” The day of the preparation, then, comprises the passion; the Sabbath embraces the burial; the Lord's Day contains the resurrection.” The (Epistle of Ignatius to the Trallians, chapter 9)WJ…. those are all trinitarians ways of avoiding the truth to try to match their Idology of Jesus' resurection to be sunday. If Jesus said He would be in the (GRAVE) three (DAY) and three (NIGHTS) why can't you just believe that and take it for what it say's, why do you continuely try to twist scripture to meet your trinitarian teachings. Even a child could figure it out. Why try tp pervert the plain words of Jesus to support your corrupt theologies. Nothing whats said seams to mean what it say's with you, you just refuse to accept straight forward simple texts so you constantly have to go around them some how. Are ypu truly seeking truth or just pushing your trinitarian theology no matter what it takes even if its to misrepersent the simple truths layed out in the bible..If you can't see the obivious error in the sunday reseruction theory then there is not much hope in you seeing any of the other false teachings of the trinity either…..sorry you cant see it……..gene
Hi folks,
So as to keep on the actual topic of the Sabbath, I've started a new thread for the timing of the death and resurrection of Yeshua. Find it here.
Hi All,
Just wanted to give a little update. Molly Sue was born Monday the 24th just before 10AM. She was 6lbs 8oz and 20 in. Thanks so much for all your prayers, my delivery was a wonderful experience for both me and my husband. Molly and I recovered so well we were able to leave the hospital by 10AM the next day! This was really great since my first delivery was by C-section and we had to stay several days in the hospital. I am so thankful I got to experience a natural birth!
As you can imagine I haven't had much time to work on a post, but I have been able to check in from time to time and just take in all that everyone has been writing.
God Bless
Jodi Congratulations on your Baby Girl Molly Sue, what a beutiful Name and I am sure She as well is beautiful. So good to hear that you are both doing so good and Home altready, just don't overdo it.
With all my Love
Peace and Love Irene:D
Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Oct. 06 2007,05:48) WJ…. those are all trinitarians ways of avoiding the truth to try to match their Idology of Jesus' resurection to be sunday. If Jesus said He would be in the (GRAVE) three (DAY) and three (NIGHTS) why can't you just believe that and take it for what it say's, why do you continuely try to twist scripture to meet your trinitarian teachings. Even a child could figure it out. Why try tp pervert the plain words of Jesus to support your corrupt theologies. Nothing whats said seams to mean what it say's with you, you just refuse to accept straight forward simple texts so you constantly have to go around them some how. Are ypu truly seeking truth or just pushing your trinitarian theology no matter what it takes even if its to misrepersent the simple truths layed out in the bible..If you can't see the obivious error in the sunday reseruction theory then there is not much hope in you seeing any of the other false teachings of the trinity either…..sorry you cant see it……..gene
GBYou say…
Quote
WJ…. those are all trinitarians ways of avoiding the truth to try to match their Idology of Jesus' resurection to be sunday.
Yes of course the famous “If they are a Trinitarian then they are liars” therfore you cant believe anything a Trinitarian believes syndrome. I thoght the Idea here is to understand the truth about how Jews believed and the early Christians.
Rather than just claim a twisting of scriptures, why diont you give us some facts that show otherwise?
Besides there is no scripture that says Jesus rose on the Sabbath. There is more evidence Jesus rose on the first day of the week. Why would he wait a day to appear to the desciples?
We are here to learn are we not?
Jodi
Congrats on the new born. I just had a new grandchild a month ago.
May the Lord bless her and keep her all he days.
Blessing Keith
Quote Besides there is no scripture that says Jesus rose on the Sabbath. There is more evidence Jesus rose on the first day of the week. Why would he wait a day to appear to the desciples? 1Pe 3:18 For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the Spirit:
1Pe 3:19 By which also he went and preached unto the spirits in prison;That's what Jesus did until Mary found the tomb Empty!
WJ you need to “forget ” all what the RCC's daughters have taught you and start listening to scripture.
It's all clear and plain IF you forget what the Harlot has taught the world. And continues to decieve the “Many”.
She deceives the “whole world”.
Rev 12:9 And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.
WJ at one time or another everyone who seachers the truth comes to the realization that we have been lied too. And now that the end is near the truth is being reavealed. AND so AGAIN the call goes out “come out of her MY People”.
Search the scriptures search your heart and submit.
God bless,
Ken
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