Quran vs the bible

[SimplyForgiven]

Quote (bodhitharta @ June 11 2010,13:34)

Quote (SimplyForgiven @ June 09 2010,19:37) Quote (Ed J @ June 09 2010,16:40) Quote (SimplyForgiven @ June 09 2010,16:28) bod, Omgosh. Really so corrupted text validates the uncorrupted text? It cannot work like that.  The Testimony of Jesus is for those who witness this.   The testimony of the Quran is not valid, why because they guy wasnt there. The testimony of the bible is more valid than anything because the individuals who wrote it were present. i disagree with the two independent testimonies of Christ.   ED J: I want you to see the fallacy, that he does try to show awefuly hard to discredit the bible, make it seem corrupted, but the thing is if he does, it ruins the quran, IF the Bible falls, the Quran falls/ if the Quran falls, the Bible prevails. In order to be part of islam one has to believe both the BIble and the Quran, but the believer has a mental block, a cognitive block believeing the bible is “corrupted”. Do you understand my arguements? Hi SF, I understand the points you make fully, but BD will argue with you endlessly over your points! BD get's his information from a 'counterfeit' Bible; the 'book of fraud', with a 'counterfeit' god. God bless Ed J http://www.holycitybiblecode.org yet i feel some of my points are ignored. So idk if either they are ignored or they were held. There needs to be a formal debate center or something so that one can see whats been refuted or not been refuted yet. I think its more than that he gets info from the Quran.  Because the thing is that the Quran cannot validate it self seperate from the bible.  That means on its own, it is faulty. I never knew until now, that the Quran was so clingy on the bible.  without the bible the Quran is nothing. without the quran, the bible continues and prevails. Thats what i see. what do you think kj? what is the best way to approach to understand what is validated and what is not. How can one validate the Quran without the bible? The Quran validates itself just as the books of the NT validate themselves and yet you will find that the OT to Chistians are necessary. now Jews pay no heed at all to the NT and call Paul and Jesus False prophets just like you do with Islam. The Christians went so far as to actually BIND the NT scriptures to the scriptures of the Jews. What do you say about this very important point. You see the Bible as a single book but the fact is it is a collection and compilation of books half of which the Jews would consider garbage(The entire NT) Can you tell me why the Jews are wrong for their view of the NT?

Hi Bod,

An Observation about you,

I have realized that Ed J does not at times directly answer questions.  But you in the other hand, for every point that we make, you ask a question abut the point or change the subject,

lets say You and I are debating about the Skys color, i say its muliple colors, you say its only one color, but a variations of it, i say your wrong for this reason, you say that jew over there doesnt believe me either, therefore you are right.

This an error.  
This is the second time you have done this, first you make a diversion from the orginal question by stating something else that has nothing to do with the conversation.

For example, i say i dont believe in allah, you mention the christians who call God allah due to language as a point, which is invalid.

We say that the Quran cannot be validated without the bible, you say the Jews dont believe in the NT.

This is a horrible defense once everyone see's it for what it is, a diversion, a plot to stir away from the point.

this is the basis, I say your wrong, you say im wrong, we both disagree, i bring up a point, either refute to disagree or dont if you agree.  dont bring up something that has nothing to do with the current point and make a circle of questions and points that are full of nonsense.  this is a fallacy, or a great error within discussions.

With much respect,

if we are to discuss, discuss.

Lets say the bible didnt exist, could the Quran uphold on its own?

The bible cannot exist without the OT,
I do agree its a collection of books, of those who have testimony about the current event.

[Ed J]

Quote (bodhitharta @ June 11 2010,19:34)

Quote (Ed J @ June 11 2010,17:33) Quote (bodhitharta @ June 11 2010,16:20) Quote (Ed J @ June 11 2010,16:11) Quote (bodhitharta @ June 11 2010,15:53) Quote (Ed J @ June 11 2010,14:35) Quote (bodhitharta @ June 11 2010,13:34) Can you tell me why the Jews are wrong for their view of the NT? Hi BD, The real question is: Why don't you believe in the New “Testament”=117? There are plenty of Jews who believe in [יהשוע המשיח] YÄ-shü-ă  hä-Mäh-shē-äkh!                             “YHVH is GOD”=117 PSALM 117 is [The Bible's Center Chapter], the [smallest chapter] of the [LARGEST BOOK]! Witnessing to the world in behalf of YHVH (Psalm 45:17) 117=יהוה האלהים(JEHOVAH GOD) YÄ-hä-vā  hä ĔL-ō-Hêêm! Ed J (AKJV Joshua 22:34 / Isaiah 60:13-15) http://www.holycitybiblecode.org Why is it you won't answer? Is it because you know that you can not answer without proving me right? OF COURSE and no you are wrong there is not ONE orthodox Jew that believes in the NT and you are wrong because I do, I just understand what was concealed and is now revealed just like you feel about the NT HI BD, Your asking me to guess why some Jews might not believe in the New Testament? A question like that would be thrown out in a court of law in the U.S.A. The real question is: Do you believe in the “New Testament”? ED J No, the real question is the one I asked and it would not be thrown out in court since you defend your religion with a religion that completely rejects your claim just as you are doing regarding Islam Hi BD, You really don't believe in the “New Testament”; do you? Witnessing to the world in behalf of YHVH (Psalm 45:17) 117=יהוה האלהים(JEHOVAH GOD) YÄ-hä-vā  hä ĔL-ō-Hêêm! Ed J (AKJV Joshua 22:34 / Isaiah 60:13-15) http://www.holycitybiblecode.org ED, Why can't you answer?

Hi BD,

You want me to guess why some Jews might not believe in the New Testament?
I don't 'know' any of these people; except of course you (You don't believe in the New Testament)
because if you did you wouldn't be 'peddling' the garbage from the 'book of fraud' (no takers at h-net)!

.

[Ed J]

Quote (SimplyForgiven @ June 11 2010,21:10)

Hi Bod, An Observation about you, I have realized that Ed J does not at times directly answer questions.  But you in the other hand, for every point that we make, you ask a question abut the point or change the subject, lets say You and I are debating about the Skys color, i say its muliple colors, you say its only one color, but a variations of it, i say your wrong for this reason, you say that jew over there doesnt believe me either, therefore you are right. This an error.   This is the second time you have done this, first you make a diversion from the orginal question by stating something else that has nothing to do with the conversation. For example, i say i dont believe in allah, you mention the christians who call God allah due to language as a point, which is invalid. We say that the Quran cannot be validated without the bible, you say the Jews dont believe in the NT. This is a horrible defense once everyone see's it for what it is, a diversion, a plot to stir away from the point. this is the basis, I say your wrong, you say im wrong, we both disagree, i bring up a point, either refute to disagree or dont if you agree.  dont bring up something that has nothing to do with the current point and make a circle of questions and points that are full of nonsense.  this is a fallacy, or a great error within discussions. With much respect, if we are to discuss, discuss. Lets say the bible didnt exist, could the Quran uphold on its own? The bible cannot exist without the OT, I do agree its a collection of books, of those who have testimony about the current event.

Hi SF,

Deception comes from the disputer of this world (red dragon: Rev12:3)
and his is a distraction in Awareness (antichrist: Rev.13:1-4)
resulting in confusion of Truth (false prophet: Rev.13:11-12)!

God bless
Ed J (AKJV 1Cor.1:18-20)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

[bodhitharta]

Quote (SimplyForgiven @ June 11 2010,21:10)

Quote

Hi Bod, An Observation about you, I have realized that Ed J does not at times directly answer questions. But you in the other hand, for every point that we make, you ask a question abut the point or change the subject,

If the point made is valid then the question asked by me would be equally as valid if it follows the same line of reasoning

Quote

lets say You and I are debating about the Skys color, i say its muliple colors, you say its only one color, but a variations of it, i say your wrong for this reason, you say that jew over there doesnt believe me either, therefore you are right.

This example is tainted by inserting a religious connotation to it

Quote

This an error. This is the second time you have done this, first you make a diversion from the orginal question by stating something else that has nothing to do with the conversation.

There was no diversion from the original question at all in-fact the original question was expanded to clarify that the Bible is not a Completely Christian work at all

Quote

For example, i say i dont believe in allah, you mention the christians who call God allah due to language as a point, which is invalid.

Of course the point is valid if ALLAH is the name of God in their Christian Arab and Jewish Arab Bibles, it is not right to invalidate a people based on their language and I am sure you will agree. If you do agree then you do believe in ALLAH and would have to believe in ALLAH is Elohim/YHVH you would have to at least admit and believe this to be true according to the usage by such Arab Christians and Arab Jews, either that or you attempt to invalidate or belittle those brothers and sisters.

Quote

We say that the Quran cannot be validated without the bible, you say the Jews dont believe in the NT.

What I said and was guided to say by The Holy Spirit was you do to the Muslim what the Jew does to the Christian. Christianity has validated itself by binding its text and bibliography to the text and bibliography to what they call the “Old Testament” which Jews do not call the OLD TESTAMENT at all in doing this Christianity has had to suggest that Judaism should have passed into Christianity becoming “NEW” and since this is the case it is also true that the Quran seals the two together and clarifies the misconceptions in both binding them all together like a 3 fold chord

Ecclesiastes 4:12 (King James Version)

12And if one prevail against him, two shall withstand him; and a threefold cord is not quickly broken.

Quote

This is a horrible defense once everyone see's it for what it is, a diversion, a plot to stir away from the point.

I have only continuously clarified the point I was making that there is ONE GOD and from Genesis to the Quran it is one progressive revelation

Quote

this is the basis, I say your wrong, you say im wrong, we both disagree, i bring up a point, either refute to disagree or dont if you agree. dont bring up something that has nothing to do with the current point and make a circle of questions and points that are full of nonsense. this is a fallacy, or a great error within discussions.

If I am getting the impression that you don't understand the point I'm making, questions can resolve and clarify what I understand about how you are considering my view and because of that I can adjust the information I am giving you more to suit your understanding.

Quote

With much respect, if we are to discuss, discuss. Lets say the bible didnt exist, could the Quran uphold on its own?

Yes, because it is complete information in a SINGLE book of the entire History of God and man there is no other SINGLE book like it

Quote

The bible cannot exist without the OT, I do agree its a collection of books, of those who have testimony about the current event.

Exactly there is no other SINGLE book beside the Quran

where a person can learn in detail about Adam, Abraham, Moses, John the Baptist, Mary and Jesus

There is no single book that discusses Judaism, Christianity including trinity and Oneness doctrine, Mary worship, Pre Judaism and the fact that Abraham, Noah, Adam and others were not Jews at all

This one Single Book that speaks of Gabriel and Michael

The One single book that shows both the wrath of God and the great Mercuy of God

One single book that speaks about the beginning as much as the end.

Now I'm not talking about 66 or 73 books, I'm talking about ONE SINGLE BOOK of 114 chapters. There is nothing like it in the entire World and that is because it is from GOD ALMIGHTY, your GOD and my GOD

[Ed J]

Quote (bodhitharta @ June 12 2010,05:37)

Quote For example, i say i dont believe in allah, you mention the christians who call God allah due to language as a point, which is invalid. Of course the point is valid if ALLAH is the name of God in their Christian Arab and Jewish Arab Bibles, …

Hi BD,

We have been through this time and time again: 'allah'(=66 in Arabic) is merely a 'title'=66; not a name!
'The problem'=114 is your use of this 'title', trying desperately to validate the 'book of fraud'=114!
2Cor.4:3-4 But if our gospel be hid, it is hid to them that are lost: In whom 'the god'(satan)
of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the
glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.

Ed J

[bodhitharta]

Quote (Ed J @ June 12 2010,06:03)

I am glad you are posting because your intolerant and inaccurate writings will assist others in finding the truth by seeing your false notions for what they really are

Let's recap what you believe

ED believes that Satan is the God of the world

ED believes that Satan is the one who says “I am”

ED believes that Satan is or was part of the Godhead

ED believes that Jesus came to earth to remove Satan out of the Godhead or to purge himself of Satan

[Ed J]

This is basically what BD has said…

Quote

Let's recap what you believe 1) ED believes that Satan is the God of the world 2) ED believes that Satan is the one who says “I am” 3) ED believes that Satan was part of the Godhead 4) ED believes that Jesus came to earth to remove Satan out of the Godhead

Hi BD,

1) 2Cor.4:3-4 But if our gospel be hid, it is hid to them that are lost: In whom 'the god'
of this (current) world (system) hath blinded the minds of them which believe not,
lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.
2Peter 3:10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night (to the uninformed); in which
the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements(meaning satan's military command)
shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.
Rev.11:15 And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms
of this world are become the kingdoms of our LORD, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever.

.

[Ed J]

This is basically what BD has said…

Quote

Let's recap what you believe 1) ED believes that Satan is the God of the world 2) ED believes that Satan is the one who says “I am” 3) ED believes that Satan was part of the Godhead 4) ED believes that Jesus came to earth to remove Satan out of the Godhead

Hi BD,

2) 1Tm.1:15 This is a faithful saying, and worthy of all acceptation,
that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners; of whom 'i am' chief.
Job 40:2 Shall he that contendeth with the Almighty instruct him?  
he that reproveth God, let him answer it.Then Job answered the LORD, and said,
Behold, I am vile(vile means evil); what shall I answer thee?  I will lay mine hand upon my mouth.

.

[Ed J]

This is basically what BD has said…

Quote

Let's recap what you believe 1) ED believes that Satan is the God of the world 2) ED believes that Satan is the one who says “I am” 3) ED believes that Satan was part of the Godhead 4) ED believes that Jesus came to earth to remove Satan out of the Godhead

Hi BD,

3) Col.2:9: For in him(Christ=77) dwelleth all the fulness of “the Godhead”=77 bodily.
Isaiah 14:12 How art thou fallen from heaven, O 'Lucifer'=74(satan's=74 name), son of the morning!  
how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations! For thou hast said in thine heart,
I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount
of the congregation, in the sides of the north: I will ascend above the heights of the clouds;
I will be like the most High. Yet thou shalt be brought down to hell, to the sides of the pit.
They that see thee shall narrowly look upon thee, and consider thee, saying,
Is this the man that made the earth to tremble, that did shake kingdoms;
That made the world as a wilderness, and destroyed the cities thereof;
that opened not the house of his prisoners? All the kings of the nations,
even all of them, lie in glory, every one in his own house. But thou art
cast out of thy grave like an abominable branch, and as the raiment
of those that are slain, thrust through with a sword, that go down to
the stones of the pit; as a carcase trodden under feet. Thou shalt not
be joined with them in burial, because thou hast destroyed thy land,
and slain thy people: the seed of evildoers shall never be renowned.
Prepare slaughter for his children for the iniquity of their fathers;
that they do not rise, nor possess the land, nor fill the face of the world with cities.
For I will rise up against them, saith the “LORD of Hosts”=151, and cut off from Babylon the name,
and remnant, and son, and nephew, saith [The LORD JEHOVAH=151]. I will also make it a possession
for the bittern, and pools of water: and I will sweep it with the besom of destruction, saith the LORD of hosts.
The LORD of hosts hath sworn, saying, Surely as I have thought, so shall it come to pass; and as I have purposed,
so shall it stand: That I will break the Assyrian (Isaiah 10:13) in my land, and upon my mountains tread him under foot:
then shall his yoke depart from off them, and his burden depart from off their shoulders. This is the purpose
that is purposed upon the whole earth: and this is the hand that is stretched out upon all the nations. For the
LORD of hosts hath purposed, and who shall disannul it?  and his hand is stretched out, and who shall turn it back?

.

[Ed J]

This is basically what BD has said…

Quote

Let's recap what you believe 1) ED believes that Satan is the God of the world 2) ED believes that Satan is the one who says “I am” 3) ED believes that Satan was part of the Godhead 4) ED believes that Jesus came to earth to remove Satan out of the Godhead

Hi BD,

4) Gal.2:20 'i am' crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life
which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me.

.

[Ed J]

This is basically what BD has said…

Quote

Let's recap what you believe 1) ED believes that Satan is the God of the world 2) ED believes that Satan is the one who says “I am” 3) ED believes that Satan was part of the Godhead 4) ED believes that Jesus came to earth to remove Satan out of the Godhead

Hi BD,

Note: Isaiah 10:12 Wherefore it shall come to pass, that when the Lord hath performed his whole work
upon mount Zion and on Jerusalem, I will punish the fruit of the stout heart of the king of Assyria,
and the glory of his high looks. For he saith, By the strength of my hand I have done it,
and by my wisdom; for I am prudent: and I have removed the bounds of the people,
and have robbed their treasures, and I have put down the inhabitants like a valiant man:
And my hand hath found as a nest the riches of the people: and as one gathereth eggs that are left,
have I gathered all the earth; and there was none that moved the wing, or opened the mouth, or peeped.
Shall the axe boast itself against him that heweth therewith?  or shall the saw magnify itself against him
that shaketh it?  as if the rod should shake itself against them that lift it up, or as if the staff should lift up itself,
as if it were no wood. Therefore shall , the Lord of hosts, send among his fat ones leanness;
and under his glory he shall kindle a burning like the burning of a fire. And the light of Israel shall be for a fire,
and his Holy One for a flame: and it shall burn and devour his thorns and his briers in one day;

                            “YHVH is GOD”=117
PSALM 117 is [The Bible's Center Chapter], the [smallest chapter] of the [LARGEST BOOK]!

Witnessing to the world in behalf of YHVH (Psalm 45:17)
117=יהוה האלהים(JEHOVAH GOD) YÄ-hä-vā  hä ĔL-ō-Hêêm!
Ed J (AKJV Joshua 22:34 / Isaiah 60:13-15)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

[bodhitharta]

Quote (Ed J @ June 12 2010,07:42)

This is basically what BD has said… Quote Let's recap what you believe 1) ED believes that Satan is the God of the world 2) ED believes that Satan is the one who says “I am” 3) ED believes that Satan was part of the Godhead 4) ED believes that Jesus came to earth to remove Satan out of the Godhead Hi BD, 1) 2Cor.4:3-4 But if our gospel be hid, it is hid to them that are lost: In whom 'the god' of this (current) world (system) hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them. 2Peter 3:10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night (to the uninformed); in which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements(meaning satan's military command) shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up. Rev.11:15 And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our LORD, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever. .

I see now ED where your corruption comes from

Isaiah 14:12 (King James Version)

12How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations!

Isaiah 14:12 (New International Version)

12 How you have fallen from heaven,
O morning star, son of the dawn!
You have been cast down to the earth,
you who once laid low the nations!

Who is this morning star that was cast down?

NIV: Revelation 22:16,
“I, Jesus, have sent my angel to give you [1] this testimony for the churches. I am the Root and the Offspring of David, and the bright Morning Star.”

NIV: 2 Peter 1:19,
And we have the word of the prophets made more certain, and you will do well to pay attention to it, as to a light shining in a dark place, until the day dawns and the morning star rises in your hearts.

NIV: Revelation 2:28–
I will also give him the morning star.

These verses call Lucifer “Jesus” is that what you really believe?

[bodhitharta]

Let's recap further

1) ED believes that Lucifer is Jesus and was thrown down to earth to purge his evil

2) ED believes that Satan is the one who says “I am”

3) ED believes that Jesus came to earth to remove Satan out of the Godhead through cricifixion

[bodhitharta]

Let's recap further

1) ED believes that Lucifer is Jesus and was thrown down to earth to purge his evil

2) ED believes that Satan is the one who says “I am”

3) ED believes that Jesus came to earth to remove Satan out of the Godhead through cricifixion

King James Version

“Then said they all, Art thou then the Son of God? And he said unto them, Ye say that I am.”

[Ed J]

Quote (bodhitharta @ June 12 2010,07:48)

Quote (Ed J @ June 12 2010,07:42) This is basically what BD has said… Quote Let's recap what you believe 1) ED believes that Satan is the God of the world 2) ED believes that Satan is the one who says “I am” 3) ED believes that Satan was part of the Godhead 4) ED believes that Jesus came to earth to remove Satan out of the Godhead Hi BD, 1) 2Cor.4:3-4 But if our gospel be hid, it is hid to them that are lost: In whom 'the god' of this (current) world (system) hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them. 2Peter 3:10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night (to the uninformed); in which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements(meaning satan's military command) shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up. Rev.11:15 And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our LORD, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever. . I see now ED where your corruption comes from

Your seeing 'your' own reflection again!

Psalm 18:25-27 With the merciful thou(YHVH) will show thyself merciful;
with an upright man thou will show thyself upright; With the pure thou(YHVH)
will show thyself pure; and with the froward thou(YHVH) will show thyself froward.
For thou will save the afflicted people; but will bring down high looks. Your high looks BD!

.

[Ed J]

Quote (bodhitharta @ June 12 2010,07:56)

Let's recap further 1) ED believes that Lucifer is Jesus and was thrown down to earth to purge his evil

You have some serious 'confusion' brother!

'quran'='babylon'=71; and Babylon means 'confusion'!

.

[Ed J]

Quote (bodhitharta @ June 12 2010,08:00)

Let's recap further King James Version “Then said they all, Art thou then the Son of God? And he said unto them, Ye say that I am.”

Hi BD,

John 18:37 Pilate therefore said unto him, Art thou a king then? Jesus answered, Thou sayest that I am a king.
To this end was I born, and for this cause came I into the world, that I should bear witness unto the truth.
Every one that is of the truth heareth my voice.

.

[bodhitharta]

Quote (Ed J @ June 12 2010,08:32)

Quote (bodhitharta @ June 12 2010,07:56) Let's recap further 1) ED believes that Lucifer is Jesus and was thrown down to earth to purge his evil You have some serious 'confusion' brother! 'quran'='babylon'=71; and Babylon means 'confusion'! .

How are Lucifer and Jesus connected ED?

[Ed J]

Quote (bodhitharta @ June 12 2010,08:34)

Quote (Ed J @ June 12 2010,08:32) You have some serious 'confusion' brother! 'quran'='babylon'=71; and Babylon means 'confusion'! . How are Lucifer and Jesus connected ED?

Hi BD, (Matt.7:7 / 2Tm.2:13)

In death…
Job 40:4 Behold, 'i am' vile…
Nahum 1:14 And the LORD hath given a commandment concerning thee, that no more of thy name be sown: out of the
house of thy gods will I cut off the graven image and the molten image: I will make thy grave; for thou (i am) art vile.
Isaiah 14:19 But thou art cast out of thy grave like an abominable branch, and as the raiment of those that are slain,
thrust through with a sword, that go down to the stones of the pit; as a carcase trodden under feet.
Gal.2:20 'i am' crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live… Deut 32:39 See now that I, even I, he, and there is no god
with me: I kill, and I make alive; I wound, and I heal: neither is there any that can deliver out of my hand. For I lift
up my hand to heaven, and say, I live for ever. If I whet my glittering sword, and mine hand take hold
on judgment; I will render vengeance to mine enemies, and will reward them that hate me.

.

[bodhitharta]

Quote (Ed J @ June 12 2010,09:13)

Quote (bodhitharta @ June 12 2010,08:34) Quote (Ed J @ June 12 2010,08:32) You have some serious 'confusion' brother! 'quran'='babylon'=71; and Babylon means 'confusion'! . How are Lucifer and Jesus connected ED? Hi BD, (Matt.7:7 / 2Tm.2:13) In death… Job 40:4 Behold, 'i am' vile… Nahum 1:14 And the LORD hath given a commandment concerning thee, that no more of thy name be sown: out of the house of thy gods will I cut off the graven image and the molten image: I will make thy grave; for thou (i am) art vile. Isaiah 14:19 But thou art cast out of thy grave like an abominable branch, and as the raiment of those that are slain, thrust through with a sword, that go down to the stones of the pit; as a carcase trodden under feet. Gal.2:20 'i am' crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live… Deut 32:39 See now that I, even I, he, and there is no god with me: I kill, and I make alive; I wound, and I heal: neither is there any that can deliver out of my hand. For I lift up my hand to heaven, and say, I live for ever. If I whet my glittering sword, and mine hand take hold on judgment; I will render vengeance to mine enemies, and will reward them that hate me. .

before death how were Lucifer and Jesus connected?

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