Quran vs the bible

Participant

Hi All,

Which holds to be true, the Quran or the Bible.
Here are some notes it took on another post.
Note the Oberservations, no other claim will even scratch the suface of Islam because of these reasons.

Problem:
1) Muslims believe the bible is corrupted, there is no point to mention scripture.
2) Nothing else will make sense unless clear distinctions are made between the Quran and the Bible
3) The Muslims will use bible against you, even though that makes no sense, and they can freely pick and choose verses to attack, and in the end claim no responsibiltiy because in the end the bible is corrputed to them.
4) Psychological Defense: No matter what you say, they will not believe what you say is valid, because its based on the corrupted text.

Solutions:
1) The Quran cannot survive without the Bible.
2) To distinguish the fallacys of the Quran one must seperate them both, but not by a corrupted since, but by seperating them showing clearly two different Gods and two different stories…Proirty!!
3) There is only one writer of the Quran.
4) His writings are based on the Bible.
5) Common foundation, different Gods.
6) God identity. Defining who God is portrayed in the Bible vs the Quran, is important.
7) Showing the differnse between Love vs Submitting.
8) Showing the differense of how we are all sinners vs those who submit to God.
9) The Perfection of God.
10) Jesus being the key to all these arguements can now be presented.

Note: Doesnt mean anyone will believe. Everyone has a right not to believe.

Paul Washer-“To make all contradicting statements True is the death of Truth”
Observations:
1.) Uncorrupted Quran cannot be validated by the Bible because its corrupted according to Qurans Text.
2.) Uncorrupted Quran cannot be validated by the Bible because its not corrupted when the Quran says it is.
3.) Uncorrupted Quran can be validated by the bible because it completes the bible which is corrupted, so the uncorrupted and the corrupt come togthor in adultry.
4.) Uncorrupted Quran validates the Bible that is corrupted, Yet to uphold Truth, Quran says to study both books as Allah provides Truth to the disputer. To study both books, what was sent before and the guardian of it.
Bod Said:

Quote

Your observation is correct

(Note: Bod agrees with option four.)
Bod, by picking option 4.
Is just rewording everything i said before into one point.
Therefore your clearly believe in a contradiction.
No offense,
Its just the way i see it.
Here is Food, and Here is Rotten Food. now the Food is to eat welll, and Rotten food is waste. corrupted food.
This is option Four,
The uncorrupted Food (validates) the corrupted Food, yet to uphold sanitation (truth) The Food has to be used with Rotten Food as Allah provides nutrition facts to the disputer . To use both, the Old Rotten Food, and its soulmate uncorrutped Food.

This is a flaw, a imperfection to Gods word.
This shows nothing perfect,
Of coures your not going to believe me, its not you, its your mind, your heart that will not believe.
because to deny allah is to die, or deny your life, and everything about you.

yet speaking as one who as takin that step,
To deny everything to you are,

For God,
Is the only way,
My words me nothing,
Let God show you.
Only God can convince you.
As God can only convince me.
This is my conclusion.

June 5, 2010 at 9:12 pm#194332

Participant

Which Bible Canon? Catholic or Protestant?

June 6, 2010 at 1:59 am#194368

Participant

Quote (bodhitharta @ June 06 2010,08:12)

Which Bible Canon? Catholic or Protestant?

Hi BD,

If (YHVH=63)God's word is “progressive” as you suggest, wouldn't that mean
“The Bible”=63 that has the 66 books is the “correct choice” to use? (2Tm.3:16)

Oh yea that's right your intent is to discredit “The Bible”
only using it to substantiate the (quran)'book of fraud'; right?

Quote (Ed J @ June 05 2010,08:02)

Hi BD,

So when you Posted this, 'you lied'?

Quote (bodhitharta @ June 03 2010,03:28)

Jesus

Rejected/”killed“

Lying to 'infidels' is what the hadith says to do; right?
Oh yea, that's right you will lie about that as well!

June 6, 2010 at 4:42 am#194392

Participant

Quote (Ed J @ June 06 2010,12:59)

Quote (bodhitharta @ June 06 2010,08:12)

Which Bible Canon? Catholic or Protestant?

Hi BD,

If (YHVH=63)God's word is “progressive” as you suggest, wouldn't that mean
“The Bible”=63 that has the 66 books is the “correct choice” to use? (2Tm.3:16)

Oh yea that's right your intent is to discredit “The Bible”
only using it to substantiate the (quran)'book of fraud'; right?

Quote (Ed J @ June 05 2010,08:02)

Hi BD,

So when you Posted this, 'you lied'?

Quote (bodhitharta @ June 03 2010,03:28)

Jesus

Rejected/”killed“

Lying to 'infidels' is what the hadith says to do; right?
Oh yea, that's right you will lie about that as well!

Okay so you pick the protestant canon.

Mark 16:9-20 is not in all protestant versions and at one point was removed and added back

is that true?

June 6, 2010 at 4:54 am#194398

Participant

Quote (bodhitharta @ June 06 2010,15:42)

Quote (Ed J @ June 06 2010,12:59)

Quote (bodhitharta @ June 06 2010,08:12)

Which Bible Canon? Catholic or Protestant?

Hi BD,

If (YHVH=63)God's word is “progressive” as you suggest, wouldn't that mean
“The Bible”=63 that has the 66 books is the “correct choice” to use? (2Tm.3:16)

Oh yea that's right your intent is to discredit “The Bible”
only using it to substantiate the (quran)'book of fraud'; right?

Quote (Ed J @ June 05 2010,08:02)

Hi BD,

So when you Posted this, 'you lied'?

Quote (bodhitharta @ June 03 2010,03:28)

Jesus

Rejected/”killed“

Lying to 'infidels' is what the hadith says to do; right?
Oh yea, that's right you will lie about that as well!

Okay so you pick the protestant canon.

Mark 16:9-20 is not in all protestant versions and at one point was removed and added back

is that true?

Hi BD,

Your the one telling the story?
Mark 16:9-20 was in “The Bible” last time I checked.

Ed J

June 6, 2010 at 6:48 am#194410

Participant

Quote (Ed J @ June 06 2010,15:54)

Quote (bodhitharta @ June 06 2010,15:42)

Quote (Ed J @ June 06 2010,12:59)

Quote (bodhitharta @ June 06 2010,08:12)

Which Bible Canon? Catholic or Protestant?

Hi BD,

If (YHVH=63)God's word is “progressive” as you suggest, wouldn't that mean
“The Bible”=63 that has the 66 books is the “correct choice” to use? (2Tm.3:16)

Oh yea that's right your intent is to discredit “The Bible”
only using it to substantiate the (quran)'book of fraud'; right?

Quote (Ed J @ June 05 2010,08:02)

Hi BD,

So when you Posted this, 'you lied'?

Quote (bodhitharta @ June 03 2010,03:28)

Jesus

Rejected/”killed“

Lying to 'infidels' is what the hadith says to do; right?
Oh yea, that's right you will lie about that as well!

Okay so you pick the protestant canon.

Mark 16:9-20 is not in all protestant versions and at one point was removed and added back

is that true?

Hi BD,

Your the one telling the story?
Mark 16:9-20 was in “The Bible” last time I checked.

Ed J

Mark 16:9-20 (New King James Version)

Footnotes:
a.Mark 16:18 NU-Text reads and in their hands they will.
b.Mark 16:20 Verses 9Â–20 are bracketed in NU-Text as not original. They are lacking in Codex Sinaiticus and Codex Vaticanus, although nearly all other manuscripts of Mark contain them

Mark 16:9-20 (New American Standard Bible)

Footnotes:
a.Mark 16:9 Later mss add vv 9-20
b.Mark 16:20 A few late mss and versions contain this paragraph, usually after v 8; a few have it at the end of ch

June 8, 2010 at 8:27 pm#194703

Participant

I think the Quran is like the counterfeit of the bible.

Its like real money and counterfeit money.

The bible does not need to be validated.
Its the Quran that needs to be validated.

June 8, 2010 at 8:29 pm#194705

Participant

Observation:
5) Bible whether corrupted or not, cannot validate the Quran. witch means that the Quran needs to validate itself.

June 9, 2010 at 2:03 am#194777

Participant

Quote (SimplyForgiven @ June 09 2010,07:29)

Observation:
5) Bible whether corrupted or not, cannot validate the Quran. witch means that the Quran needs to validate itself.

The bible does validate the Quran and The Quran validates the Bible.

Think about it, if we were in front of a Jew and the Jew said Christ is a fairy tale there was no one named Jesus
well if it is simply you and him his case would be just as strong as your but when you insert the Muslim and he says yes, I know me and the Christian might not agree on everything we certainly agree that Jesus existed, was born of a Virgin and the Children of Israel plotted to kill him even though he was the Christ they were waiting for.

This my friend is validation especially since you know that the Christian and the Muslim is not plotting together to fool the Jew they are telling two independent testimonies of Chrsit Jesus

June 9, 2010 at 4:47 am#194800

Participant

Hi BD,

Why do you work so hard to discredit The Bible?

Ed J

June 9, 2010 at 5:28 am#194813

Participant

bod,
Omgosh.
Really so corrupted text validates the uncorrupted text?

It cannot work like that. The Testimony of Jesus is for those who witness this.

The testimony of the Quran is not valid, why because they guy wasnt there.
The testimony of the bible is more valid than anything because the individuals who wrote it were present.

i disagree with the two independent testimonies of Christ.

ED J:

I want you to see the fallacy, that he does try to show awefuly hard to discredit the bible, make it seem corrupted, but the thing is if he does, it ruins the quran,
IF the Bible falls, the Quran falls/ if the Quran falls, the Bible prevails.

In order to be part of islam one has to believe both the BIble and the Quran, but the believer has a mental block, a cognitive block believeing the bible is “corrupted”.

Do you understand my arguements?

June 9, 2010 at 5:40 am#194814

Participant

Quote (SimplyForgiven @ June 09 2010,16:28)

bod,
Omgosh.
Really so corrupted text validates the uncorrupted text?

It cannot work like that. The Testimony of Jesus is for those who witness this.

The testimony of the Quran is not valid, why because they guy wasnt there.
The testimony of the bible is more valid than anything because the individuals who wrote it were present.

i disagree with the two independent testimonies of Christ.

ED J:

In order to be part of islam one has to believe both the BIble and the Quran, but the believer has a mental block, a cognitive block believeing the bible is “corrupted”.

Do you understand my arguements?

Hi SF,

I understand the points you make fully, but BD will argue with you endlessly over your points!
BD get's his information from a 'counterfeit' Bible; the 'book of fraud', with a 'counterfeit' god.

God bless
Ed J
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

June 9, 2010 at 8:37 am#194837

Participant

Quote (Ed J @ June 09 2010,16:40)

Quote (SimplyForgiven @ June 09 2010,16:28)

bod,
Omgosh.
Really so corrupted text validates the uncorrupted text?

It cannot work like that. The Testimony of Jesus is for those who witness this.

The testimony of the Quran is not valid, why because they guy wasnt there.
The testimony of the bible is more valid than anything because the individuals who wrote it were present.

i disagree with the two independent testimonies of Christ.

ED J:

In order to be part of islam one has to believe both the BIble and the Quran, but the believer has a mental block, a cognitive block believeing the bible is “corrupted”.

Do you understand my arguements?

Hi SF,

I understand the points you make fully, but BD will argue with you endlessly over your points!
BD get's his information from a 'counterfeit' Bible; the 'book of fraud', with a 'counterfeit' god.

God bless
Ed J
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

yet i feel some of my points are ignored.

So idk if either they are ignored or they were held.

There needs to be a formal debate center or something so that one can see whats been refuted or not been refuted yet.

I think its more than that he gets info from the Quran. Because the thing is that the Quran cannot validate it self seperate from the bible. That means on its own, it is faulty.

I never knew until now, that the Quran was so clingy on the bible. without the bible the Quran is nothing.

without the quran, the bible continues and prevails.

Thats what i see. what do you think kj?

what is the best way to approach to understand what is validated and what is not.

How can one validate the Quran without the bible?

June 11, 2010 at 2:34 am#195091

Participant

Quote (SimplyForgiven @ June 09 2010,19:37)

Quote (Ed J @ June 09 2010,16:40)

Quote (SimplyForgiven @ June 09 2010,16:28)

bod,
Omgosh.
Really so corrupted text validates the uncorrupted text?

It cannot work like that. The Testimony of Jesus is for those who witness this.

The testimony of the Quran is not valid, why because they guy wasnt there.
The testimony of the bible is more valid than anything because the individuals who wrote it were present.

i disagree with the two independent testimonies of Christ.

ED J:

In order to be part of islam one has to believe both the BIble and the Quran, but the believer has a mental block, a cognitive block believeing the bible is “corrupted”.

Do you understand my arguements?

Hi SF,

I understand the points you make fully, but BD will argue with you endlessly over your points!
BD get's his information from a 'counterfeit' Bible; the 'book of fraud', with a 'counterfeit' god.

God bless
Ed J
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

yet i feel some of my points are ignored.

So idk if either they are ignored or they were held.

There needs to be a formal debate center or something so that one can see whats been refuted or not been refuted yet.

I think its more than that he gets info from the Quran. Because the thing is that the Quran cannot validate it self seperate from the bible. That means on its own, it is faulty.

I never knew until now, that the Quran was so clingy on the bible. without the bible the Quran is nothing.

without the quran, the bible continues and prevails.

Thats what i see. what do you think kj?

what is the best way to approach to understand what is validated and what is not.

How can one validate the Quran without the bible?

The Quran validates itself just as the books of the NT validate themselves and yet you will find that the OT to Chistians are necessary. now Jews pay no heed at all to the NT and call Paul and Jesus False prophets just like you do with Islam.

The Christians went so far as to actually BIND the NT scriptures to the scriptures of the Jews.

What do you say about this very important point.

You see the Bible as a single book but the fact is it is a collection and compilation of books half of which the Jews would consider garbage(The entire NT)

Can you tell me why the Jews are wrong for their view of the NT?

June 11, 2010 at 3:35 am#195099

Participant

Quote (bodhitharta @ June 11 2010,13:34)

Can you tell me why the Jews are wrong for their view of the NT?

Hi BD,

The real question is: Why don't you believe in the New “Testament”=117?
There are plenty of Jews who believe in [יהשוע המשיח] YÄ-shü-ă hä-Mäh-shē-äkh!

“YHVH is GOD”=117
PSALM 117 is [The Bible's Center Chapter], the [smallest chapter] of the [LARGEST BOOK]!

Witnessing to the world in behalf of YHVH (Psalm 45:17)
117=יהוה האלהים(JEHOVAH GOD) YÄ-hä-vā hä ĔL-ō-Hêêm!
Ed J (AKJV Joshua 22:34 / Isaiah 60:13-15)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

June 11, 2010 at 4:53 am#195113

Participant

Quote (Ed J @ June 11 2010,14:35)

Quote (bodhitharta @ June 11 2010,13:34)

Can you tell me why the Jews are wrong for their view of the NT?

Hi BD,

The real question is: Why don't you believe in the New “Testament”=117?
There are plenty of Jews who believe in [יהשוע המשיח] YÄ-shü-ă hä-Mäh-shē-äkh!

“YHVH is GOD”=117
PSALM 117 is [The Bible's Center Chapter], the [smallest chapter] of the [LARGEST BOOK]!

Why is it you won't answer? Is it because you know that you can not answer without proving me right?

OF COURSE and no you are wrong there is not ONE orthodox Jew that believes in the NT and you are wrong because I do, I just understand what was concealed and is now revealed just like you feel about the NT

June 11, 2010 at 5:11 am#195118

Participant

Quote (bodhitharta @ June 11 2010,15:53)

Quote (Ed J @ June 11 2010,14:35)

Quote (bodhitharta @ June 11 2010,13:34)

Can you tell me why the Jews are wrong for their view of the NT?

Hi BD,

The real question is: Why don't you believe in the New “Testament”=117?
There are plenty of Jews who believe in [יהשוע המשיח] YÄ-shü-ă hä-Mäh-shē-äkh!

“YHVH is GOD”=117
PSALM 117 is [The Bible's Center Chapter], the [smallest chapter] of the [LARGEST BOOK]!

Why is it you won't answer? Is it because you know that you can not answer without proving me right?

HI BD,

Your asking me to guess why some Jews might not believe in the New Testament?
A question like that would be thrown out in a court of law in the U.S.A.
The real question is: Do you believe in the “New Testament”?

ED J

June 11, 2010 at 5:20 am#195122

Participant

Quote (Ed J @ June 11 2010,16:11)

Quote (bodhitharta @ June 11 2010,15:53)

Quote (Ed J @ June 11 2010,14:35)

Quote (bodhitharta @ June 11 2010,13:34)

Can you tell me why the Jews are wrong for their view of the NT?

Hi BD,

The real question is: Why don't you believe in the New “Testament”=117?
There are plenty of Jews who believe in [יהשוע המשיח] YÄ-shü-ă hä-Mäh-shē-äkh!

“YHVH is GOD”=117
PSALM 117 is [The Bible's Center Chapter], the [smallest chapter] of the [LARGEST BOOK]!

Why is it you won't answer? Is it because you know that you can not answer without proving me right?

HI BD,

ED J

No, the real question is the one I asked and it would not be thrown out in court since you defend your religion with a religion that completely rejects your claim just as you are doing regarding Islam

June 11, 2010 at 6:33 am#195132

Participant

Quote (bodhitharta @ June 11 2010,16:20)

Quote (Ed J @ June 11 2010,16:11)

Quote (bodhitharta @ June 11 2010,15:53)

Quote (Ed J @ June 11 2010,14:35)

Quote (bodhitharta @ June 11 2010,13:34)

Can you tell me why the Jews are wrong for their view of the NT?

Hi BD,

The real question is: Why don't you believe in the New “Testament”=117?
There are plenty of Jews who believe in [יהשוע המשיח] YÄ-shü-ă hä-Mäh-shē-äkh!

“YHVH is GOD”=117
PSALM 117 is [The Bible's Center Chapter], the [smallest chapter] of the [LARGEST BOOK]!

Why is it you won't answer? Is it because you know that you can not answer without proving me right?

HI BD,

ED J

Hi BD,

You really don't believe in the “New Testament”; do you?

June 11, 2010 at 8:34 am#195134