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Quote (SEEKING @ Mar. 31 2009,08:19) Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Mar. 30 2009,12:11) Of course isn’t this true concerning anything about God? The Father never does anything without the Son and the Son never does anything without the Father and the Spirit proceeds from both of them. I wonder why?
Blessings WJ
Luk 1:34 And Mary said to the angel, “How will this be, since I am a virgin?”
Luk 1:35 And the angel answered her, “The Holy Spirit will come upon you, and the power of the Most High will overshadow you; therefore the child to be born will be called holy–the Son of God.The Father never does anything without the son? Without the Father there would be no son. As another puts it, that is reality.
Blessings,
Seeking
Hi SEEKINGSo you think that Jesus had nothing to do with his coming in the flesh?
Please explain these scriptures which clearly show that Jesus took part in his coming in the flesh.
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and THE WORD WAS GOD. John 1:1
And THE WORD WAS MADE FLESH, AND DWELT (skēnoō
) among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth. John 1:14The Greek word for “dwelt” is 'skēnoō' which means…
1) to fix one's tabernacle, have one's tabernacle, abide (or live) in a tabernacle (or tent), tabernacle
2) to dwell
Our bodies are temples that we live in with God for our bodies are the Temple of God.
The “Word” came in the flesh in agreement with Phil 2: which states that he, Jesus, being in the form of God, emptied himself and came in the likeness of sinful flesh and was found in fashion as a man.
So we see that the Son had a part in his human birth when he says…
Jesus knew that the Father had put all things under his power, and “THAT HE HAD COME FROM GOD AND WAS RETURNING TO GOD”; John 13:3
”FOR I HAVE COME DOWN FROM HEAVEN” not to do my will but to do the will of him who sent me. John 6:38
Then he clarified his statement by saying…
WHAT IF YOU SEE THE SON OF MAN ASCEND TO WHERE “HE WAS BEFORE”! John 6:62
And then Jesus said…
And now, Father, glorify me in your presence with “THE GLORY I HAD WITH YOU BEFORE THE WORLD BEGAN”. John 17:5
Jesus clearly taught he came from the Father and was returning to the Father where he was before.
He chose to come in the flesh by emptying himself and taking on the likeness of sinful flesh and be found as a man.
This is reality!
Now my statement stands..
Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Mar. 30 2009,12:11) Of course isn’t this true concerning anything about God? The Father never does anything without the Son and the Son never does anything without the Father and the Spirit proceeds from both of them. I wonder why?
Blessings WJ
Now SEEKING, please show us where the Father does anything without the Son.
Blessings WJ
Hi KW,
Who knows?
Ps2
7I will declare the decree: the LORD hath said unto me, Thou art my Son; this day have I begotten thee.Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Mar. 30 2009,18:32) Quote (SEEKING @ Mar. 31 2009,08:19) Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Mar. 30 2009,12:11) Of course isn’t this true concerning anything about God? The Father never does anything without the Son and the Son never does anything without the Father and the Spirit proceeds from both of them. I wonder why?
Blessings WJ
Luk 1:34 And Mary said to the angel, “How will this be, since I am a virgin?”
Luk 1:35 And the angel answered her, “The Holy Spirit will come upon you, and the power of the Most High will overshadow you; therefore the child to be born will be called holy–the Son of God.The Father never does anything without the son? Without the Father there would be no son. As another puts it, that is reality.
Blessings,
Seeking
Hi SEEKINGSo you think that Jesus had nothing to do with his coming in the flesh?
Please explain these scriptures which clearly show that Jesus took part in his coming in the flesh.
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and THE WORD WAS GOD. John 1:1
And THE WORD WAS MADE FLESH, AND DWELT (skēnoō
) among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth. John 1:14The Greek word for “dwelt” is 'skēnoō' which means…
1) to fix one's tabernacle, have one's tabernacle, abide (or live) in a tabernacle (or tent), tabernacle
2) to dwell
Our bodies are temples that we live in with God for our bodies are the Temple of God.
The “Word” came in the flesh in agreement with Phil 2: which states that he, Jesus, being in the form of God, emptied himself and came in the likeness of sinful flesh and was found in fashion as a man.
So we see that the Son had a part in his human birth when he says…
Jesus knew that the Father had put all things under his power, and “THAT HE HAD COME FROM GOD AND WAS RETURNING TO GOD”; John 13:3
”FOR I HAVE COME DOWN FROM HEAVEN” not to do my will but to do the will of him who sent me. John 6:38
Then he clarified his statement by saying…
WHAT IF YOU SEE THE SON OF MAN ASCEND TO WHERE “HE WAS BEFORE”! John 6:62
And then Jesus said…
And now, Father, glorify me in your presence with “THE GLORY I HAD WITH YOU BEFORE THE WORLD BEGAN”. John 17:5
Jesus clearly taught he came from the Father and was returning to the Father where he was before.
He chose to come in the flesh by emptying himself and taking on the likeness of sinful flesh and be found as a man.
This is reality!
Now my statement stands..
Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Mar. 30 2009,12:11) Of course isn’t this true concerning anything about God? The Father never does anything without the Son and the Son never does anything without the Father and the Spirit proceeds from both of them. I wonder why?
Blessings WJ
Now SEEKING, please show us where the Father does anything without the Son.
Blessings WJ
I did! Only your trinitarian assumptions create your erroneous
conclusions.As has been asked of those with trinitarian convictions in the past, show one bible passage – old or new testament – that
SPECIFICALLY talks of a trinity regradless of the trinity version you choose Appoliarian or not.Trinitarians cannot even agree on what they believe.
Blessings,
Seeking
Quote (kerwin @ Mar. 31 2009,03:29) Nick Hassan wrote: Quote Who knows?
How do those that believe in Jesus become God's sons?
Hi,
Maybe the question should be “How do those who believe in Jesus become adopted sons?” The Son of GOD is not an adopted son but inherently had the nature of God from the start. Those who believe in Him are merely partakers of the nature. That nature is a NEW nature to those who believe but for the only begotten Son, it always was His nature as I understand it.LU
Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Mar. 30 2009,21:32) Quote (SEEKING @ Mar. 31 2009,08:19) Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Mar. 30 2009,12:11) Of course isn’t this true concerning anything about God? The Father never does anything without the Son and the Son never does anything without the Father and the Spirit proceeds from both of them. I wonder why?
Blessings WJ
Luk 1:34 And Mary said to the angel, “How will this be, since I am a virgin?”
Luk 1:35 And the angel answered her, “The Holy Spirit will come upon you, and the power of the Most High will overshadow you; therefore the child to be born will be called holy–the Son of God.The Father never does anything without the son? Without the Father there would be no son. As another puts it, that is reality.
Blessings,
Seeking
Hi SEEKINGSo you think that Jesus had nothing to do with his coming in the flesh?
Please explain these scriptures which clearly show that Jesus took part in his coming in the flesh.
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and THE WORD WAS GOD. John 1:1
And THE WORD WAS MADE FLESH, AND DWELT (skēnoō
) among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth. John 1:14The Greek word for “dwelt” is 'skēnoō' which means…
1) to fix one's tabernacle, have one's tabernacle, abide (or live) in a tabernacle (or tent), tabernacle
2) to dwell
Our bodies are temples that we live in with God for our bodies are the Temple of God.
The “Word” came in the flesh in agreement with Phil 2: which states that he, Jesus, being in the form of God, emptied himself and came in the likeness of sinful flesh and was found in fashion as a man.
So we see that the Son had a part in his human birth when he says…
Jesus knew that the Father had put all things under his power, and “THAT HE HAD COME FROM GOD AND WAS RETURNING TO GOD”; John 13:3
”FOR I HAVE COME DOWN FROM HEAVEN” not to do my will but to do the will of him who sent me. John 6:38
Then he clarified his statement by saying…
WHAT IF YOU SEE THE SON OF MAN ASCEND TO WHERE “HE WAS BEFORE”! John 6:62
And then Jesus said…
And now, Father, glorify me in your presence with “THE GLORY I HAD WITH YOU BEFORE THE WORLD BEGAN”. John 17:5
Jesus clearly taught he came from the Father and was returning to the Father where he was before.
He chose to come in the flesh by emptying himself and taking on the likeness of sinful flesh and be found as a man.
This is reality!
Now my statement stands..
Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Mar. 30 2009,12:11) Of course isn’t this true concerning anything about God? The Father never does anything without the Son and the Son never does anything without the Father and the Spirit proceeds from both of them. I wonder why?
Blessings WJ
Now SEEKING, please show us where the Father does anything without the Son.
Blessings WJ
Hi Keith,Heb 10:5
“SACRIFICE AND OFFERING YOU HAVE NOT DESIRED,
BUT A BODY YOU HAVE PREPARED FOR ME;
NASUThe Father prepared the body for the Son, the Son did not prepare His own flesh body. So this is where the Father did something apart from the Son. The passage doesn't say “a body WE have prepared for me.”
Peace,
LUThinker said:
Quote God is a plural one. Psalm 23 says the YHWH is the shepherd. Ezekiel says that there is one shepherd. Jesus said “I am the good shepherd.” Nick replied:
Quote Hi TT,
Can we add our own presumptive ideas and make useful doctrine?Here it is again Nick,
Quote God is a plural one. Psalm 23 says the YHWH is the shepherd. Ezekiel says that there is one shepherd. Jesus said “I am the good shepherd.” If God is not a plural one then Jesus LIED in calling Himself “the good Shepherd.”
thinker
Quote (thethinker @ Mar. 30 2009,16:48) Seeking said: Quote Without the Father there would be no son. As another puts it, that is reality. Seeking's statement above infers that the Holy Spirit is the literal “father” of Jesus. The physical “reality” is that Jesus was conceived by the Holy Spirit and not the Father. So the term “Father” in reference to Christ's relationship to God was a figurative expression. Hebrews 11 says that Isaac was Abraham's only begotten son “figuratively” . So Christ also was God's only begotten Son figuratively.
What Seeking does not, or maybe will refuses to understand is that there is spiritual reality too.
thinker
Thinker,I think that there is yet another side of the coin here. Many on here believe that the spirit of GOD is the spirit of GOD. Huh? I know that sounds obvious and it should be…as obvious as saying the spirit of Thinker is the spirit OF Thinker, the spirit within Thinker. Put it this way, the seed (sperm) of the dad conceives the baby but the baby does not call the part of the father (the seed) that conceived him “father.” So I suggest to you that your own line of reasoning actually shows that the Holy Spirit who conceived Jesus is actually a part of the Father, not part of a triune god but a part of the Father. If the Holy Spirit was a seperate being, equal to the Father your point would have merit but as many believe on here, the Spirit is not a seperate equal being but a personal spirit of and within the Father. He extends that very personal spirit to the Son and through the Son to all believers. The Father directs the Spirit within Him. The Spirit within Him does not operate on its own. Man's spirit does not operate on its own either.
Now, I am not saying that the Holy Spirit is the “seed” of GOD here necessarily but that it is a part of GOD, the Father. It was a part of GOD that was able to cause holy conception in a virgin among many other things.
Have a great day…I think I am done posting for now
LU
Seeking said:
Quote As has been asked of those with trinitarian convictions in the past, show one bible passage – old or new testament – that
SPECIFICALLY talks of a trinity regradless of the trinity version you choose Appoliarian or not.Seeking,
God is a plural unity. Even Gene who is a non-trinitarian agrees though he impersonalizes Elohim. It is by necessary inference that trinitarians determine that the plurality of God is limited to three persons.Seeking said:
Quote Trinitarians cannot even agree on what they believe. First, there are the Jw's who confess Christ's pre-existence but deny His divinity. There are also those who call themselves “Biblical Unitarians” who deny both the pre-existence of Christ and His divinity. So non-trinitarians are divided into “camps” also. In a post on March 16 on the Elohim thread I said:
Quote The variants of non-trinitarian interpretations just keeps mounting up: 1. Gene says that “elohim” means “powers” and not persons.
2. t8 says that “elohim” means men or angels
3. Then t8 said that there are “many” explanations
4. Marty said that God revealed to him personally what “elohim” means.
5. Now you say that “elohim” means “family.”
Non-trinitarians just can't give a uniform explanation.
Take note that t8 admitted that there are MANY explanations. This means that you are the pot calling the kettle “black.”
Furthermore, my Apollinarian trinitarianism is virtually non-existent now and you know this! So for you to bring up ancient Apollinarism and try to prove from it that trinitarians “cannot agree” on what they believe is a gross misrepresentation. I made it clear that I am the dissenter among trinitarianism. The “orthodox” trinitarians speak with ONE voice. Though I dissent from “orthodox” trinitarianism I must defend them. It is totally unfair to charge them as you have because of one dissenter like myself. It is especially unfair seeing that no non-trinitarian here can agree on “elohim.”
thinker
Quote (thethinker @ Mar. 31 2009,08:47) Seeking said: Quote As has been asked of those with trinitarian convictions in the past, show one bible passage – old or new testament – that
SPECIFICALLY talks of a trinity regradless of the trinity version you choose Appoliarian or not.Seeking,
God is a plural unity. Even Gene who is a non-trinitarian agrees though he impersonalizes Elohim. It is by necessary inference that trinitarians determine that the plurality of God is limited to three persons.Seeking said:
Quote Trinitarians cannot even agree on what they believe. First, there are the Jw's who confess Christ's pre-existence but deny His divinity. There are also those who call themselves “Biblical Unitarians” who deny both the pre-existence of Christ and His divinity. So non-trinitarians are divided into “camps” also. In a post on March 16 on the Elohim thread I said:
Quote The variants of non-trinitarian interpretations just keeps mounting up: 1. Gene says that “elohim” means “powers” and not persons.
2. t8 says that “elohim” means men or angels
3. Then t8 said that there are “many” explanations
4. Marty said that God revealed to him personally what “elohim” means.
5. Now you say that “elohim” means “family.”
Non-trinitarians just can't give a uniform explanation.
Take note that t8 admitted that there are MANY explanations. This means that you are the pot calling the kettle “black.”
Furthermore, my Apollinarian trinitarianism is virtually non-existent now and you know this! So for you to bring up ancient Apollinarism and try to prove from it that trinitarians “cannot agree” on what they believe is a gross misrepresentation. I made it clear that I am the dissenter among trinitarianism. The “orthodox” trinitarians speak with ONE voice. Though I dissent from “orthodox” trinitarianism I must defend them. It is totally unfair to charge them as you have because of one dissenter like myself. It is especially unfair seeing that no non-trinitarian here can agree on “elohim.”
thinker
Thinker,I'm sorry, I missed the passages(s)!
As has been asked of those with trinitarian convictions in the past, show one bible passage – old or new testament – that SPECIFICALLY talks of a trinity regradless of the trinity version you choose Appoliarian or not.
Blessings, Seeking
Quote (SEEKING @ April 01 2009,00:35) Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Mar. 30 2009,18:32) Quote (SEEKING @ Mar. 31 2009,08:19) Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Mar. 30 2009,12:11) Of course isn’t this true concerning anything about God? The Father never does anything without the Son and the Son never does anything without the Father and the Spirit proceeds from both of them. I wonder why?
Blessings WJ
Luk 1:34 And Mary said to the angel, “How will this be, since I am a virgin?”
Luk 1:35 And the angel answered her, “The Holy Spirit will come upon you, and the power of the Most High will overshadow you; therefore the child to be born will be called holy–the Son of God.The Father never does anything without the son? Without the Father there would be no son. As another puts it, that is reality.
Blessings,
Seeking
Hi SEEKINGSo you think that Jesus had nothing to do with his coming in the flesh?
Please explain these scriptures which clearly show that Jesus took part in his coming in the flesh.
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and THE WORD WAS GOD. John 1:1
And THE WORD WAS MADE FLESH, AND DWELT (skēnoō
) among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth. John 1:14The Greek word for “dwelt” is 'skēnoō' which means…
1) to fix one's tabernacle, have one's tabernacle, abide (or live) in a tabernacle (or tent), tabernacle
2) to dwell
Our bodies are temples that we live in with God for our bodies are the Temple of God.
The “Word” came in the flesh in agreement with Phil 2: which states that he, Jesus, being in the form of God, emptied himself and came in the likeness of sinful flesh and was found in fashion as a man.
So we see that the Son had a part in his human birth when he says…
Jesus knew that the Father had put all things under his power, and “THAT HE HAD COME FROM GOD AND WAS RETURNING TO GOD”; John 13:3
”FOR I HAVE COME DOWN FROM HEAVEN” not to do my will but to do the will of him who sent me. John 6:38
Then he clarified his statement by saying…
WHAT IF YOU SEE THE SON OF MAN ASCEND TO WHERE “HE WAS BEFORE”! John 6:62
And then Jesus said…
And now, Father, glorify me in your presence with “THE GLORY I HAD WITH YOU BEFORE THE WORLD BEGAN”. John 17:5
Jesus clearly taught he came from the Father and was returning to the Father where he was before.
He chose to come in the flesh by emptying himself and taking on the likeness of sinful flesh and be found as a man.
This is reality!
Now my statement stands..
Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Mar. 30 2009,12:11) Of course isn’t this true concerning anything about God? The Father never does anything without the Son and the Son never does anything without the Father and the Spirit proceeds from both of them. I wonder why?
Blessings WJ
Now SEEKING, please show us where the Father does anything without the Son.
Blessings WJ
I did! Only your trinitarian assumptions create your erroneous
conclusions.As has been asked of those with trinitarian convictions in the past, show one bible passage – old or new testament – that
SPECIFICALLY talks of a trinity regradless of the trinity version you choose Appoliarian or not.Trinitarians cannot even agree on what they believe.
Blessings,
Seeking
Hi SEEKINGIn other words you cannot show me one thing the Father does without the Son.
And you also cannot address the scriptures that I post showing clearly Jesus came from Heaven.
So you just make a statement claiming the Trinity is false without any proof from the scriptures and this makes it so?
Quote (SEEKING @ April 01 2009,00:35) As has been asked of those with trinitarian convictions in the past, show one bible passage – old or new testament – that
SPECIFICALLY talks of a trinity regradless of the trinity version you choose Appoliarian or not.Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in* the name of “THE FATHER” and of “THE SON” and of the “Holy Spirit”. Matt 28:19
[The grace of “the Lord Jesus Christ“, and the “love of God“, and “the communion of the Holy Ghost“, be with you all. Amen
Now show me one scripture that specifically says the three spoken of above does not exist!!! There are many scriptures that speak of the three. Now show me scripturally where they are not God and I can show you scripturally where they are God.
This is not hard to understand. BTW, to say that the word “Trinity” is not found in the scriptures therefore it is false is a straw, for there are many words that are not found in scripture and yet the concept is.
WJ
thethinker,Mar. wrote:[/quote]
Quote Furthermore, my Apollinarian trinitarianism is virtually non-existent now and you know this!
Whenyou grasp at straws you sound ridiculous. No, I DON”T
know anything of the kind. You exist don't you? Why can't there be others?Quote
So for you to bring up ancient Apollinarism and try to prove from it that trinitarians “cannot agree” on what they believe is a gross misrepresentation.Totally inane statement. It is at least one of the things that DOES prove they can't agree.
Quote It is totally unfair to charge them as you have because of one dissenter like myself. You getting even more far fetched! “One dessenter like myself.” So you take sole credit for Appolinarinism, do you? Or have there been and ARE there other dissenters!
Have you found those SPECIFIC passages yet or is “necessary inference” the best thing you have going?
Blessings,
Seeking
Quote (Lightenup @ April 01 2009,03:01) Hi Keith, Heb 10:5
“SACRIFICE AND OFFERING YOU HAVE NOT DESIRED,
BUT A BODY YOU HAVE PREPARED FOR ME;
NASUThe Father prepared the body for the Son, the Son did not prepare His own flesh body. So this is where the Father did something apart from the Son. The passage doesn't say “a body WE have prepared for me.”
Peace,
LU
Hi KathiThe word “prepare” does not mean “Create” or “Born”.
Through him all things were made; “WITHOUT HIM NOTHING WAS MADE THAT HAS BEEN MADE“. John 1:3
Do you think the Father prepared the Body without the Spirit of Jesus giving it life when the “Word” was “Tabernacled” (John 1:14 “Dwelt” among us) by entering into it?
“For as the body without the spirit is dead“, so faith without works is dead also. James 2:26
Or do you believe that the Spirit of Jesus was born at the conception of his body?
Again my statement stands…
Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Mar. 30 2009,12:11) Of course isn’t this true concerning anything about God? THE FATHER NEVER DOES ANYTHING WITHOUT THE SON (including his natural birth) and the Son never does anything without the Father and the Spirit proceeds from both of them.
I wonder why? Jesus took part in his natural birth when he “emptied himself” and came in the likeness of sinful flesh and was found in fashion as a man. Phil 2
Blessings WJ
Hi WJ,
Jn1
6There was a man sent from God, whose name was John.7The same came for a witness, to bear witness of the Light, that all men through him might believe.
8He was not that Light, but was sent to bear witness of that Light.
9That was the true Light, which lighteth every man that cometh into the world.
10He was in the world, and the world was made by him, and the world knew him not.
11He came unto his own, and his own received him not.
Jesus does not give light to all who come into the world.
The Jewish people were God's own people, not those of Jesus.So the LIGHT spoken of here is not the light\lamp of Jesus but the Spirit of God that filled Jesus.
God Himself is the source of LIGHT2 Corinthians 4:6
For God, who said, “Let light shine out of darkness,” made his light shine in our hearts to give us the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Christ.1 John 1:5
This is the message we have heard from him and declare to you: God is light; in him there is no darkness at all.Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Mar. 31 2009,12:04) Quote Now SEEKING, please show us where the Father does anything without the Son. WJ,
Once again I say, “I did! Only your trinitarian assumptions create your erroneous conclusions.”
Here are excerpts from a post to “thinker”
You use a “select” scripture to establish mutual involvement
in the resurrection ignoring the plain statement as to who raised Jesus from the dead.Mat 17:23 and they will kill him, and he will be raised on the third day.” And they were greatly distressed
Rom 6:9 We know that Christ, being raised from the dead, will never die again; death no longer has dominion over him.
“Raised” is written in the “passive” voice. The subject, Jesus,
is acted upon. He does not do the acting.Rom 8:11 If the Spirit of him who raised Jesus from the dead dwells in you, he who raised Christ Jesus from the dead will also give life to your mortal bodies through his Spirit who dwells in you.
Act 2:32 This Jesus God raised up, and of that we all are witnesses.
Act 2:23 this Jesus, delivered up according to the definite plan and foreknowledge of God, you crucified and killed by the hands of lawless men.
Act 2:24 God raised him up, loosing the pangs of death, because it was not possible for him to be held by it.Act 3:15 and you killed the Author of life, whom God raised from the dead. To this we are witnesses.
Act 3:26 God, having raised up his servant, sent him to you first, to bless you by turning every one of you from your wickedness
Act 10:40 but God raised him on the third day and made him to appear,
Rom 10:9 because, if you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved
1Co 6:14 And God raised the Lord and will also raise us up by his power.
2Co 4:14 knowing that he who raised the Lord Jesus will raise us also with Jesus and bring us with you into his presence.
Gal 1:1 Paul, an apostle–not from men nor through man, but through Jesus Christ and God the Father, who raised him from the dead–
Eph 1:20 that he worked in Christ when he raised him from the dead and seated him at his right hand in the heavenly places,
1Th 1:10 and to wait for his Son from heaven, whom he raised from the dead, Jesus who delivers us from the wrath to come.
1Pe 1:21 who through him are believers in God, who raised him from the dead and gave him glory, so that your faith and hope are in God.
Yet ANOTHER thing the Father did alone
Quote So you just make a statement claiming the Trinity is false without any proof from the scriptures and this makes it so? The onus does not lie with the individual to prove what does not exist. Yours is the responsibility to show the scripture(s) that SPECIFICALLY mention the trinity as it is YOUR contention that the non-existent does exist. “Thinker”
admits it is from “necessary inference” which, though a valid
method of interpretation, is the least preferred. Can you at least admit to that since the words, “I don't have scripture”
apparently can no t flow from your lips! Preferred methods of interpretation would be WRITTEN WORD the APPROVED EXAMPLE finally NECESSARY INFERENCE.Quote Now show me one scripture that specifically says the three spoken of above does not exist!!! There are many scriptures that speak of the three. Now show me scripturally where they are not God and I can show you scripturally where they are God. 1) Of course the three exist, SEPERATELY. What kind of request is that?
2) They are not God because that would add up to three
god's. There is only one. Here is just one passage –Eph 4:4-6 There is one body and one Spirit–just as you were called to the one hope that belongs to your call– one Lord, one faith, one baptism, one God and Father of all, who is over all and through all and in all.
Quote BTW, to say that the word “Trinity” is not found in the scriptures therefore it is false is a straw, for there are many words that are not found in scripture and yet the concept is. Please show another word not found in scripture from which
a complete doctrine has been derived.Quote And you also cannot address the scriptures that I post showing clearly Jesus came from Heaven. A pre-existent Jesus does NOT make him God. But that is a whole discussion in itself, is it not. I came FROM my mother,
but please believe me I had NOTHING TO DO WITH MY BIRTH
IN THE FLESH.Blessings,
Seeking
Hi TT,
You say
“God is a plural unity.”But Jesus says
Mark 12:29
“The most important one,” answered Jesus, “is this: 'Hear, O Israel, the Lord our God, the Lord is one.We prefer the words of Jesus as they come from the Spirit of God
Seeking said:
Quote No, I DON”T
know anything of the kind. You exist don't you? Why can't there be others?Seeking,
If you say that you did not know that Apollinarianism is virtually nonexistant I take your word for it. It was more than reasonable for me to assume that you did because you have posted information on Apollinarianism here. I said that Apollinarianism is “virtually nonexistant.” This does not mean that there are no other Apollinarians today. But I don't know of any.But it does not matter for you are still the pot that calls the kettle “black.” For it is well known in christendom that non-trinitarians are divided into camps. And the various views here alone on “elohim” show that you possess alot of gonads to find weakness with trinitarianism on the grounds that they do not all agree.
thinker
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