Preexistence

[mikeboll64]

Luke 2
46 After three days they found him in the temple courts, sitting among the teachers, listening to them and asking them questions. 47 Everyone who heard him was amazed at his understanding and his answers.

By what means did this 12 year old boy get this understanding and these answers, David?

Also, do you think it's logical that the one sent to make the paths straight for the Lord would be filled with Holy Spirit from the womb, but not the Lord himself, who was actually FATHERED via the Holy Spirit?  YES or NO?

In other words, do you think Jesus was completely void of Holy Spirit until the Jordan?

[mikeboll64]

Quote (david @ Mar. 25 2012,11:48)

Is this the thread where we were discussing when jesus became the Christ?

Yes. I was merely making a joke about you thinking of the “Pre-existent” thread when you saw that scripture.

[terraricca]

Quote (david @ Mar. 26 2012,11:48)

Hi Mike.  Ya, I assumed it was most likely in here somewhere.  This is a large thread.   Maybe this isn't even the right thread.  It's been a couple days.  Is this the thread where we were discussing when jesus became the Christ? If so, It seems like God didn't “anoint” Jesus with “holy spirit and power” when he was a child.  He was anointed with holy spirit and power when he began to do powerful things. comment?

David

look at what Paul says ;

Col 1:15 He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation.
Col 1:16 For by him all things were created: things in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or powers or rulers or authorities; all things were created by him and for him.
Col 1:17 He is before all things, and in him all things hold together.

CHRIST IS THE FIRSTBORN OVER ALL CREATION FOR HIM BY HIM ALL THINGS WERE CREATED;

SEE NEXT;

Col 1:18 And he is the head of the body, the church; he is the beginning and the firstborn from among the dead, so that in everything he might have the supremacy.
Col 1:19 For God was pleased to have all his fullness dwell in him,
Col 1:20 and through him to reconcile to himself all things, whether things on earth or things in heaven

LOOK IN VERSE 19 FULLNESS ; AND VERSE 20 RECONCILE ALL THINGS,

IN VERSE 18 MIGHT HAVE THE SUPREMACY;

the son of God is first and will staying first in all things in heaven and on earth ,there is no other way

[NickHassan]

Hi T,
Yes
The anointing became Jesus Christ.
Sonship to God is by sharing the anointing from above

[david]

Quote (mikeboll64 @ Mar. 26 2012,04:55)

Luke 2 46 After three days they found him in the temple courts, sitting among the teachers, listening to them and asking them questions. 47 Everyone who heard him was amazed at his understanding and his answers. By what means did this 12 year old boy get this understanding and these answers, David? Also, do you think it's logical that the one sent to make the paths straight for the Lord would be filled with Holy Spirit from the womb, but not the Lord himself, who was actually FATHERED via the Holy Spirit?  YES or NO? In other words, do you think Jesus was completely void of Holy Spirit until the Jordan?

Mike, you seem to keep repeating this and I don't think anyone here believes it.

People had holy spirit before Jesus was baptised. Holy spirit existed in the Hebrew scriptures. prophets, all had holy spirit.

Jesus no doubt prayed for holy spirit, as he would often later pray when performing miracles.

Jesus was certainly a very spiritual child. He was no doubt given this by his parents who were chosen by God for a reason.

I know if I was made to believe I was going to be the Christ growing up, going to be the savior, I would probably become pretty familiar with the scriptures and perhaps read them 15 hours a day.

He was also a little different in that he had no human father, genetically? Holy spirit overshadowed the birth?? and as you may know, some think that Jesus was born without sin, meaning from birth, he wasn't imperfect, carrying the genetic stain of sin, as some say. Jesus was the second Adam, he was what adam could have been, if Adam didn't choose to sin. But none of these things mean he had to been born the Christ.

[terraricca]

Quote (Nick Hassan @ Mar. 26 2012,12:46)

Hi T, Yes The anointing became Jesus Christ. Sonship to God is by sharing the anointing from above

N

Christ is either the son of God as God's first creation in heaven ,

or he is the son of God as a man born on earth that became the son of God at around his 30 th birth day wen he was baptized by John,

so what is it Nick ? number one or two ? it can not be both

[terraricca]

David

Quote

I know if I was made to believe I was going to be the Christ growing up, going to be the savior, I would probably become pretty familiar with the scriptures and perhaps read them 15 hours a day. He was also a little different in that he had no human father, genetically? Holy spirit overshadowed the birth?? and as you may know, some think that Jesus was born without sin, meaning from birth, he wasn't imperfect, carrying the genetic stain of sin, as some say. Jesus was the second Adam, he was what adam could have been, if Adam didn't choose to sin. But none of these things mean he had to been born the Christ.

Jesus was not the second Adam by his birth but by his dead ,

Jesus the son of God was the only possibility to save human kind and to reconcile it with God ,no other way, the first of creation as supremacy and so was the only possible appointing or anointing possible under all of creation,

;redemption,destruction of all opposition to God , Restoration of all things ,all those things belong to Christ the only son of God since the beginning of the ages ,so the baptism of Christ by John was not his appointing of becoming the son of God but the affirmation of it ,
for all those who will believe ,

[mikeboll64]

Quote (david @ Mar. 25 2012,13:11)

But none of these things mean he had to been born the Christ.

Yes.  And being anointed with Holy Spirit without limit doesn't have to mean that's WHEN he became the Christ, either.  Just like Acts 2:36 doesn't have to mean he was made the Christ after he was crucified – even though that's the way it sounds.

I've showed that both David and Saul were anointed with oil BEFORE they were anointed with the Holy Spirit.  In other words, they were christs of God BEFORE they received the Holy Spirit from God.  And I maintain that the anointing is the CHOOSING of them by God for a specific purpose.  The oil is just a declaration of that anointing.  The minute God makes up His mind to set them apart as special is the minute they are a christ, IMO.

But what DOES mean Jesus was born the Christ is that the angel of God, CLEARLY, and WITHOUT MINCING WORDS, said he was born the Christ.

What DOES mean he was born the Christ is that the Holy Spirit guided Simeon to the temple on the day Jesus was to be circumcised for a reason.  That reason was that God promised him he would see the Christ before he died.  He saw that Christ, and then told God he could now die in peace because God had KEPT HIS PROMISE.

David, these are scriptures, in case you didn't know.  Why won't you believe them?  Why would you instead add your own thoughts into them?  Why would you assume the angel meant “he is the soon to be Christ” when that's not what he said?

These things baffle me sometimes.

[NickHassan]

Quote (terraricca @ Mar. 26 2012,06:18)

Quote (Nick Hassan @ Mar. 26 2012,12:46) Hi T, Yes The anointing became Jesus Christ. Sonship to God is by sharing the anointing from above N Christ is either the son of God as God's first creation in heaven , or he is the son of God as a man born on earth that became the son of God at around his 30 th birth day wen he was baptized by John, so what is it Nick ? number one or two ? it can not be both

Hi T,
Why are you confused?

There are sons of God in heaven seen in job and ? ps 89 but they are angelic. They are not God.

The Word of life is not an angel but was God.

The Word of Life that was with God was manifested to us.[1jn1]

The Spirit of life was IN Christ Jesus[Rom8.2]

[Frank4YAHWEH]

Quote (terraricca @ Mar. 26 2012,06:18)

Quote (Nick Hassan @ Mar. 26 2012,12:46) Hi T, Yes The anointing became Jesus Christ. Sonship to God is by sharing the anointing from above N Christ is either the son of God as God's first creation in heaven , or he is the son of God as a man born on earth that became the son of God at around his 30 th birth day wen he was baptized by John, so what is it Nick ? number one or two ? it can not be both

Pierre,

Nowhere in Scripture does it ever teach or say that Yahshua was Yahweh's “first creation in heaven”.

Quote (terraricca @ Mar. 25 2012,04:19)

N Quote Was Jesus not a man because God was his father? how you can even say this ,is be on my understanding ,THIS WOULD MEAN WHAT new creation new dirt ,what was God is father wen was Jesus created wen is the beginning begins ??wen does firstborn over all creation begins??? how can he be the one were through all things are created be born trough a women millions of years later ? Col 1:15 He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation. Col 1:16 For by him all things were created: things in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or powers or rulers or authorities; all things were created by him and for him. Col 1:17 He is before all things, and in him all things hold together. Col 1:18 And he is the head of the body, the church; he is the beginning and the firstborn from among the dead, so that in everything he might have the supremacy. Col 1:19 For God was pleased to have all his fullness dwell in him, Nick,it appears that you do not accept scriptures the way it is written or do you

Pierre,

The answer to you question is right there in front of your eyes in what you have posted and you still can not see!

Quote

THIS WOULD MEAN WHAT new creation

Father Yahweh is still in the creation process:

“Behold, I will create NEW heavens and a NEW earth. The FORMER THINGS will not be remembered, nor will they come to mind” (Isayah 65:16).

Quote

wen does firstborn over all creation begins???

It is AFTER Yahshua's DEATH as is revealed in the following verse that you posted:

Quote

he is the beginning and the firstborn FROM AMONG THE DEAD,

Note that in the above verse that you posted “the beginning and the firstborn” is in reference to the NEW CREATION and not in reference to Father Yahweh creating the heavens and the earth and ALL THINGS IN THEM in the BEGINNING (GENESIS). The word 'Genesis' means 'Beginning' and is in reference to Father Yahweh's beginning the creation of the heavens and the earth and ALL THINGS IN THEM, and not to the NEW creation in later times. Father Yahweh is to later BEGIN a NEW CREATION in which His son Yahshua is the beginning of. See Isayah 65:16 above. It is quite clear that this verse when it says “the beginning and the firstborn” can not be in reference to the creation IN THE BEGINNING (GENESIS), since Yahshua most certainly was not “FROM AMONG THE DEAD in Genesis.

As I have tried to explain MANY times before in this forum (which fell on deaf ears and blind eyes that do not perceive or understand {SEE & HEAR}), Yahshua did NOT create ANYTHING, nor did he EVER proclaim that he did. It was his and our Father Yahweh Who created the heavens and the earth and ALL THINGS IN THEM. It was Yahweh “ALONE”, “BY HIMSELF” with “NO ONE BESIDE HIM”, Who created the heavens and the earth and ALL THINGS IN THEM. This truth as recorded in the so-called “Old Testament” and is revealed in SOME 107 SCRIPTURE VERSES AND PASSAGES that clearly show us that Father Yahweh did not create “THROUGH” His son Yahshua as if he were a pre-existent being BESIDE HIM in the VERY BEGINNING (GENESIS) of His creating.

Did Yahshua Create Or Pre-exist His Birth?

[mikeboll64]

Quote (Frank4YAHWEH @ Mar. 25 2012,14:38)

The answer to you question is right there in front of your eyes in what you have posted and you still can not see! Quote THIS WOULD MEAN WHAT new creation Father Yahweh is still in the creation process: “Behold, I will create NEW heavens and a NEW earth. The FORMER THINGS will not be remembered, nor will they come to mind” (Isayah 65:16).

Frank,

Do you believe like Kerwin that “firstborn of every creature” really means “firstborn of the NEW creation”?

He has made this claim many times, but I can't seem to find the word “new” anywhere in Paul's writing of that scripture.

[Frank4YAHWEH]

Quote (david @ Mar. 26 2012,06:11)

Quote (mikeboll64 @ Mar. 26 2012,04:55) Luke 2 46 After three days they found him in the temple courts, sitting among the teachers, listening to them and asking them questions. 47 Everyone who heard him was amazed at his understanding and his answers. By what means did this 12 year old boy get this understanding and these answers, David? Also, do you think it's logical that the one sent to make the paths straight for the Lord would be filled with Holy Spirit from the womb, but not the Lord himself, who was actually FATHERED via the Holy Spirit?  YES or NO? In other words, do you think Jesus was completely void of Holy Spirit until the Jordan? Mike, you seem to keep repeating this and I don't think anyone here believes it. People had holy spirit before Jesus was baptised.  Holy spirit existed in the Hebrew scriptures.  prophets, all had holy spirit.   Jesus no doubt prayed for holy spirit, as he would often later pray when performing miracles. Jesus was certainly a very spiritual child.  He was no doubt given this by his parents who were chosen by God for a reason.   I know if I was made to believe I was going to be the Christ growing up, going to be the savior, I would probably become pretty familiar with the scriptures and perhaps read them 15 hours a day. He was also a little different in that he had no human father, genetically?  Holy spirit overshadowed the birth?? and as you may know, some think that Jesus was born without sin, meaning from birth, he wasn't imperfect, carrying the genetic stain of sin, as some say.  Jesus was the second Adam, he was what adam could have been, if Adam didn't choose to sin.    But none of these things mean he had to been born the Christ.

David,

I certainly would not believe it, since none of the Scripture references that Mike posted never makes mention that Yahshua was anointed with the set apart [“holy”] spirit and power [authority]. In fact, I would never believe or agree with anything that Mike or t8 posted on this forum.

Yahshua was raised by parents who were Yahdahim [“Jews”] and he most certainly would have been taught from Father Yahweh's inspired prophetic word (the so-called “Old Testament”). This is obviously where Yahshua received his righteous knowledge.

The following passage is from the so-called “New Testament” and is most certainly in reference to the so-called “Old Testament”, since the so-called “New Testament” had not yet been compiled at the point of time this was said. This is obviously from where THE MAN {SON OF MAN} Yahshua received his righteous knowledge:

All Scripture is given by inspiration of Yahweh, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: That THE MAN OF YAHWEH [Yahshua] may be PERFECT, THOROUGHLY FURNISHED unto ALL RIGHTEOUS WORKS (2 Timothy 3:16-17).

When Did Yahshua's Anointing Take Place?

But Shimeon Kepha opened his mouth and he said, “In truth, I understand that Yahweh is no respecter of persons. In EVERY NATION He finds favor with those who REVERE HIM and DOES WHAT IS RIGHT. You know what happened throughout Yahdah, beginning in Galilee, AFTER Yahchanan began proclaiming his message of immersion. Yahweh anointed Yahshua of Nazareth with the Set Apart [“Holy”] Spirit and with power [authority]” (Acts 10:34-38).

When all the people were immersed, Yahshua was also immersed and He began communing [“praying”]. Then the heaven was opened, and the Set Apart [“Holy”] Spirit descended like a dove upon him, and a voice came from heaven, which said, “You are My beloved son” (Lukyah 3:21-22).

He taught regularly in their synagogues and was praised by everyone. When he came to the village of Nazareth, his boyhood home, he went, as his custom was, to the synagogue on THE SABBATH and stood up to read the Scriptures. The scroll of Isayah the prophet was handed to him. He unrolled the scroll and found the place where this was written and began to read: “The Spirit of Yahweh is upon me, because He has anointed me to proclaim the glad tidings to the poor. He has sent me to proclaim freedom for the prisoners and recovery of sight for the blind, to release the oppressed, and to proclaim the acceptable era of Yahweh.” He rolled up the scroll, handed it back to the attendant, and sat down. All eyes in the synagogue looked at him intently. Then he began to speak to them. “The Scripture you've just heard has been fulfilled at this very time” (Lukyah 4:15-21).

BTW, A Greek “kudos” on your post as follows:

“…starting from Gal′i·lee after the baptism that John preached, namely, Jesus who was from Naz′a·reth, how God anointed him with holy spirit and power, and he went through the land doing good and healing all those oppressed by the Devil; because God was with him.” (Acts 10:37,38)

I just fell upon this scripture and thought I would include it.  

It seems like God didn't “anoint” Jesus with “holy spirit and power” when he was a child.  He was anointed with holy spirit and power when he began to do powerful things.

Anyway, just saw this scripture.  Thought of this thread.

Did Yahshua Create Or Pre-exist His Birth?

“Jesus IS God!”?

………….

[Frank4YAHWEH]

Quote (mikeboll64 @ Mar. 26 2012,07:46)

Quote (Frank4YAHWEH @ Mar. 25 2012,14:38) The answer to you question is right there in front of your eyes in what you have posted and you still can not see! Quote THIS WOULD MEAN WHAT new creation Father Yahweh is still in the creation process: “Behold, I will create NEW heavens and a NEW earth. The FORMER THINGS will not be remembered, nor will they come to mind” (Isayah 65:16). Frank, Do you believe like Kerwin that “firstborn of every creature” really means “firstborn of the NEW creation”? He has made this claim many times, but I can't seem to find the word “new” anywhere in Paul's writing of that scripture.

Mike,

So, you actually believe that Yahshua was BORN, BEGOTTEN, or given BIRTH to before the world began. If so, maybe you could explain to me how it was that he was BORN, BEGOTTEN or given BIRTH to before the world began from a Scriptural perspective?

Did Yahshua Create Or Pre-exist His Birth?

“Jesus IS God!”?

[terraricca]

Quote (Frank4YAHWEH @ Mar. 26 2012,14:38)

Quote (terraricca @ Mar. 26 2012,06:18) Quote (Nick Hassan @ Mar. 26 2012,12:46) Hi T, Yes The anointing became Jesus Christ. Sonship to God is by sharing the anointing from above N Christ is either the son of God as God's first creation in heaven , or he is the son of God as a man born on earth that became the son of God at around his 30 th birth day wen he was baptized by John, so what is it Nick ? number one or two ? it can not be both Pierre, Nowhere in Scripture does it ever teach or say that Yahshua was Yahweh's “first creation in heaven”. Quote (terraricca @ Mar. 25 2012,04:19) N Quote Was Jesus not a man because God was his father? how you can even say this ,is be on my understanding ,THIS WOULD MEAN WHAT new creation new dirt ,what was God is father wen was Jesus created wen is the beginning begins ??wen does firstborn over all creation begins??? how can he be the one were through all things are created be born trough a women millions of years later ? Col 1:15 He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation. Col 1:16 For by him all things were created: things in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or powers or rulers or authorities; all things were created by him and for him. Col 1:17 He is before all things, and in him all things hold together. Col 1:18 And he is the head of the body, the church; he is the beginning and the firstborn from among the dead, so that in everything he might have the supremacy. Col 1:19 For God was pleased to have all his fullness dwell in him, Nick,it appears that you do not accept scriptures the way it is written or do you Pierre, The answer to you question is right there in front of your eyes in what you have posted and you still can not see! Quote THIS WOULD MEAN WHAT new creation Father Yahweh is still in the creation process: “Behold, I will create NEW heavens and a NEW earth. The FORMER THINGS will not be remembered, nor will they come to mind” (Isayah 65:16). Quote wen does firstborn over all creation begins??? It is AFTER Yahshua's DEATH as is revealed in the following verse that you posted: Quote he is the beginning and the firstborn FROM AMONG THE DEAD, Note that in the above verse that you posted “the beginning and the firstborn” is in reference to the NEW CREATION and not in reference to Father Yahweh creating the heavens and the earth and ALL THINGS IN THEM in the BEGINNING (GENESIS). The word 'Genesis' means 'Beginning' and is in reference to Father Yahweh's beginning the creation of the heavens and the earth and ALL THINGS IN THEM, and not to the NEW creation in later times. Father Yahweh is to later BEGIN a NEW CREATION in which His son Yahshua is the beginning of. See Isayah 65:16 above. It is quite clear that this verse when it says “the beginning and the firstborn” can not be in reference to the creation IN THE BEGINNING (GENESIS), since Yahshua most certainly was not “FROM AMONG THE DEAD in Genesis. As I have tried to explain MANY times before in this forum (which fell on deaf ears and blind eyes that do not perceive or understand {SEE & HEAR}), Yahshua did NOT create ANYTHING, nor did he EVER proclaim that he did. It was his and our Father Yahweh Who created the heavens and the earth and ALL THINGS IN THEM. It was Yahweh “ALONE”, “BY HIMSELF” with “NO ONE BESIDE HIM”, Who created the heavens and the earth and ALL THINGS IN THEM. This truth as recorded in the so-called “Old Testament” and is revealed in SOME 107 SCRIPTURE VERSES AND PASSAGES that clearly show us that Father Yahweh did not create “THROUGH” His son Yahshua as if he were a pre-existent being BESIDE HIM in the VERY BEGINNING (GENESIS) of His creating. Did Yahshua Create Or Pre-exist His Birth?

F

if you right ,what was Christ old creation ?

we as sinfull men know that we need to be renewed and become a new creation in the image of Christ but why would Christ the ONLY SON of God be renewed

[Ed J]

Quote (Nick Hassan @ Mar. 25 2012,15:49)

Hi Ed, So aligning the verse in Acts 19 with the other seven in Acts what do you think BAPTISM means?

Hi Nick,

To be “submerged” as in to be submerged into the Spirit that was in Christ.

God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

[Ed J]

Quote (Nick Hassan @ Mar. 25 2012,15:59)

Hi Ed. I have a few more. I left out the ones by John as we could assume they are of water. rom 6.4,col 2.12, 1peter 3.21, eph 4.5,  mt 16.16, 1 cor 1.16, 1 cor 1.17,1co 15.29, 1cor 12.13, acts 22.16, 1cor 1.13 etc

Hi Nick, how can you say that baptism is(?) born of water?

Rom.6:4 Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised
up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.

John 3:6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.

God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

[Ed J]

Quote (mikeboll64 @ Mar. 26 2012,02:35)

Quote (Ed J @ Mar. 24 2012,21:35) Quote (mikeboll64 @ Mar. 25 2012,12:18) Quote (Ed J @ Mar. 24 2012,18:29) Quote (mikeboll64 @ Mar. 25 2012,05:39) Trained him via His Holy Spirit, Nick? Hi Mike, You disagree? God bless Ed J No Ed, I agree.  I agree that the Holy Spirit was working in Jesus long before he got baptized. Hi Mike, And after    …?       God filled him with the Holy Spirit without measure at the Jordan.  But he already was God's anointed one and filled with and led by some Holy Spirit long before this time. I also believe that at his baptism, Jesus had his past memories of his pre-existence in heaven restored to him.

Hi Mike,

Thanks for the explanation!

Please don't let those who attack,
stop you from explaining your beliefs!

God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org
Reason for edit: to add in the last line after reading further posts.

[Ed J]

Quote (david @ Mar. 26 2012,04:10)

“…starting from Gal′i·lee after the baptism that John preached, namely, Jesus who was from Naz′a·reth, how God anointed him with holy spirit and power, and he went through the land doing good and healing all those oppressed by the Devil; because God was with him.” (Acts 10:37,38) I just fell upon this scripture and thought I would include it.   It seems like God didn't “anoint” Jesus with “holy spirit and power” when he was a child.  He was anointed with holy spirit and power when he began to do powerful things. Anyway, just saw this scripture.  Thought of this thread.

Hi David,

Where did you get the bible verse with the phonetic spellings in them?

God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

[Ed J]

Quote (david @ Mar. 26 2012,06:11)

Quote (mikeboll64 @ Mar. 26 2012,04:55) Luke 2 46 After three days they found him in the temple courts, sitting among the teachers, listening to them and asking them questions. 47 Everyone who heard him was amazed at his understanding and his answers. By what means did this 12 year old boy get this understanding and these answers, David? Also, do you think it's logical that the one sent to make the paths straight for the Lord would be filled with Holy Spirit from the womb, but not the Lord himself, who was actually FATHERED via the Holy Spirit?  YES or NO? In other words, do you think Jesus was completely void of Holy Spirit until the Jordan? Mike, you seem to keep repeating this and I don't think anyone here believes it. People had holy spirit before Jesus was baptised.  Holy spirit existed in the Hebrew scriptures.  prophets, all had holy spirit.   Jesus no doubt prayed for holy spirit, as he would often later pray when performing miracles. Jesus was certainly a very spiritual child.  He was no doubt given this by his parents who were chosen by God for a reason.   I know if I was made to believe I was going to be the Christ growing up, going to be the savior, I would probably become pretty familiar with the scriptures and perhaps read them 15 hours a day. He was also a little different in that he had no human father, genetically?  Holy spirit overshadowed the birth?? and as you may know, some think that Jesus was born without sin, meaning from birth, he wasn't imperfect, carrying the genetic stain of sin, as some say.  Jesus was the second Adam, he was what adam could have been, if Adam didn't choose to sin.    But none of these things mean he had to been born the Christ.

Hi David,

You are like the trinitarians: in that like they say God's “HolySpirit”
is a different person, you say it's something different than God. (Link)

God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

[Ed J]

Quote (mikeboll64 @ Mar. 26 2012,07:46)

Quote (Frank4YAHWEH @ Mar. 25 2012,14:38) The answer to you question is right there in front of your eyes in what you have posted and you still can not see! Quote THIS WOULD MEAN WHAT new creation Father Yahweh is still in the creation process: “Behold, I will create NEW heavens and a NEW earth. The FORMER THINGS will not be remembered, nor will they come to mind” (Isayah 65:16). Frank, Do you believe like Kerwin that “firstborn of every creature” really means “firstborn of the NEW creation”? He has made this claim many times, but I can't seem to find the word “new” anywhere in Paul's writing of that scripture.

Hi Mike, (see Col.1:18)

Jesus “IS” the first born of the new creation,
but that is not what the verse means.
It means he has preeminence.

God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

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