Preexistence

[Ed J]

Quote (Ed J @ Jan. 28 2012,03:42)

Quote (Frank4YAHWEH @ Jan. 28 2012,01:11) Misleading the Opposition Come, Yahshua Messiah! Note: We have more than 60 papers about the non-pre-existence of Yahshua [FREE]. If interested, PLEASE ASK FOR THEM. Hi Frank,                60 opinions, Mmmm, that should be enough to convince almost anyone. Col 2:8-9 Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ. For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily. God bless Ed J (Joshua 22:34) http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

Hi Frank,

Why don't you post all 60 just to make sure we get it?

God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

[Frank4YAHWEH]

If anyone is interested in the studies that I had previously mentioned, simple ask for the studies compiled by Voy Wilks on the Trinity and Pre-existence doctrines by contacting the Assembly of Yahweh (7th Day) and they will send them to you free. The link to their contact web page is as follows:

The Assembly of Yahweh (7th Day)

[Ed J]

Hi Frank,

Please explain what YOU believe the words  ‘twice dead’  in Jude are referring to; thank you. (Jude 1:12)

God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

[Frank4YAHWEH]

Quote (Ed J @ Jan. 28 2012,13:12)

Hi Frank, Please explain what YOU believe the words  ‘twice dead’  in Jude are referring to; thank you. (Jude 1:12) God bless Ed J (Joshua 22:34) http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

Ed J,

I am no longer having any discussion with you whatsoever!

[Frank4YAHWEH]

So far, it is only Gene that I wish to have fellowship with on this forum. Not saying that there may come others to this forum in the future that I may choose to have fellowship with though. Maybe Gene can inform me of others who visit here that are of like precious belief?

[Ed J]

Quote (Frank4YAHWEH @ Jan. 28 2012,13:30)

Quote (Ed J @ Jan. 28 2012,13:12) Hi Frank, Please explain what YOU believe the words  ‘twice dead’  in Jude are referring to; thank you. (Jude 1:12) God bless Ed J Ed J, I am no longer having any discussion with you whatsoever!

Hi Frank,

This is a serious question, please take it as such: I believe it refers to fallen angels
that are refusing YHVH's salvation (twice dead), born in human form.   …what say you?

God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

[Proclaimer]

Quote (Frank4YAHWEH @ Jan. 28 2012,07:55)

Since most if not all other Scriptures indicate Yahshua did not pre-exist except in Yahweh's plan, * it is my view that the words in Philippians 2:5-11 should be accepted at face value, as words are normally used in a natural sense. However, people love a mystery so much that one is sometimes invented where there is no mystery. Let us compare these opposite views.

That's rich. Face value for Philippians 2:5-11 as well as other scriptures say that he EXISTED in the form of God, became human, and went back to the glory that he had with God before the world began.

Your interpretation is the mysterious one. So mysterious that you have to add in the words plan, thought, and not mention the word exist.

Sad for you Frank that you are brainwashed and likely by that denomination you attend. You prove by your words that you are so entrenched in that doctrine, that no matter what scripture challenges that thought, you find a way to make it fit in your own head.

Just don't expect us to follow this folly Frank. We believe what the scriptures say, that is where our doctrine is from. Not a denomination, not a creed. Scripture Frank.

[Ed J]

Quote (Ed J @ Jan. 28 2012,13:40)

Quote (Frank4YAHWEH @ Jan. 28 2012,13:30) Quote (Ed J @ Jan. 28 2012,13:12) Hi Frank, Please explain what YOU believe the words  ‘twice dead’  in Jude are referring to; thank you. (Jude 1:12) God bless Ed J Ed J, I am no longer having any discussion with you whatsoever! Hi Frank, This is a serious question, please take it as such: I believe it refers to fallen angels that are refusing YHVH's salvation (twice dead), born in human form.   …what say you? God bless Ed J

Hi Frank,

Jude 1:6…12 And the angels which kept not their first estate, but left their own habitation,
he hath reserved in everlasting chains under darkness unto the judgment of the great day.
…clouds they are without water, carried about of winds; trees whose fruit withereth,
without fruit, twice dead, plucked up by the roots;

God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

[Ed J]

Quote (t8 @ Jan. 28 2012,14:54)

Quote (Frank4YAHWEH @ Jan. 28 2012,07:55) Since most if not all other Scriptures indicate Yahshua did not pre-exist except in Yahweh's plan, * it is my view that the words in Philippians 2:5-11 should be accepted at face value, as words are normally used in a natural sense. However, people love a mystery so much that one is sometimes invented where there is no mystery. Let us compare these opposite views. That's rich. Face value for Philippians 2:5-11 as well as other scriptures say that he EXISTED in the form of God, became human, and went back to the glory that he had with God before the world began. Your interpretation is the mysterious one. So mysterious that you have to add in the words plan, thought, and not mention the word exist. Sad for you Frank that you are brainwashed and likely by that denomination you attend. You prove by your words that you are so entrenched in that doctrine, that no matter what scripture challenges that thought, you find a way to make it fit in your own head. Just don't expect us to follow this folly Frank. We believe what the scriptures say, that is where our doctrine is from. Not a denomination, not a creed. Scripture Frank.

Hi T*8,

Funny how Frank calls me childish, but he is the one exhibiting childish behavior!  
…I'm not playing with you, I DON'T LIKE THE WAY YOU PLAY; WAAAA!!!

God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

[Frank4YAHWEH]

To ALL,

Just to make it clear, I am non-denominational. My beliefs are in accordance with what is actually taught in Scripture. I choose to associate with those of like precious beliefs and not with those who come against our Heavenly Father and Creator's word and Name in triviality.

[942767]

Quote (t8 @ Jan. 28 2012,14:54)

Quote (Frank4YAHWEH @ Jan. 28 2012,07:55) Since most if not all other Scriptures indicate Yahshua did not pre-exist except in Yahweh's plan, * it is my view that the words in Philippians 2:5-11 should be accepted at face value, as words are normally used in a natural sense. However, people love a mystery so much that one is sometimes invented where there is no mystery. Let us compare these opposite views. That's rich. Face value for Philippians 2:5-11 as well as other scriptures say that he EXISTED in the form of God, became human, and went back to the glory that he had with God before the world began. Your interpretation is the mysterious one. So mysterious that you have to add in the words plan, thought, and not mention the word exist. Sad for you Frank that you are brainwashed and likely by that denomination you attend. You prove by your words that you are so entrenched in that doctrine, that no matter what scripture challenges that thought, you find a way to make it fit in your own head. Just don't expect us to follow this folly Frank. We believe what the scriptures say, that is where our doctrine is from. Not a denomination, not a creed. Scripture Frank.

No, t8, the scriptures do not say that without a little help from your private interpretation.

Love in Christ,
Marty

[942767]

Quote (Ed J @ Jan. 28 2012,13:12)

Hi Frank, Please explain what YOU believe the words  ‘twice dead’  in Jude are referring to; thank you. (Jude 1:12) God bless Ed J (Joshua 22:34) http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

Hi Ed:

This describes those in the church who profess to be Christians but whose life style reflects otherwise.  Jesus paid the price for all where in darkness because of the first death or spiritual separation from God because of sin, but these will undergo the second death or eternal separation from God.

Here is the scripture from Jude:

Quote

Jud 1:8   Likewise also these [filthy] dreamers defile the flesh, despise dominion, and speak evil of dignities.   Jud 1:9   Yet Michael the archangel, when contending with the devil he disputed about the body of Moses, durst not bring against him a railing accusation, but said, The Lord rebuke thee.   Jud 1:10   But these speak evil of those things which they know not: but what they know naturally, as brute beasts, in those things they corrupt themselves.   Jud 1:11   Woe unto them! for they have gone in the way of Cain, and ran greedily after the error of Balaam for reward, and perished in the gainsaying of Core.   Jud 1:12 ¶ These are spots in your feasts of charity, when they feast with you, feeding themselves without fear: clouds [they are] without water, carried about of winds; trees whose fruit withereth, without fruit, twice dead, plucked up by the roots;   Jud 1:13   Raging waves of the sea, foaming out their own shame; wandering stars, to whom is reserved the blackness of darkness for ever.   Jud 1:14   And Enoch also, the seventh from Adam, prophesied of these, saying, Behold, the Lord cometh with ten thousands of his saints,   Jud 1:15   To execute judgment upon all, and to convince all that are ungodly among them of all their ungodly deeds which they have ungodly committed, and of all their hard [speeches] which ungodly sinners have spoken against him.   Jud 1:16 ¶ These are murmurers, complainers, walking after their own lusts; and their mouth speaketh great swelling [words], having men's persons in admiration because of advantage.   Jud 1:17   But, beloved, remember ye the words which were spoken before of the apostles of our Lord Jesus Christ;   Jud 1:18   How that they told you there should be mockers in the last time, who should walk after their own ungodly lusts.   Jud 1:19   These be they who separate themselves, sensual, having not the Spirit.

Love in Christ,
Marty

[Ed J]

Quote (Frank4YAHWEH @ Jan. 29 2012,11:12)

To ALL, Just to make it clear, I am non-denominational. My beliefs are in accordance with what is actually taught in Scripture. I choose to associate with those of like precious beliefs and not with those who come against our Heavenly Father and Creator's word and Name in triviality.

Hi Frank,

So, to you, everyone that disagrees with you is coming against, not you,
but God's word; is this not a rather arrogant presumption on your part?

Your brother
in Christ, Jesus.
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
holycitybiblecode.org

[Ed J]

Quote (942767 @ Jan. 29 2012,11:38)

Quote (Ed J @ Jan. 28 2012,13:12) Hi Frank, Please explain what YOU believe the words  ‘twice dead’  in Jude are referring to; thank you. (Jude 1:12) God bless Ed J Hi Ed: This describes those in the church who profess to be Christians but whose life style reflects otherwise.  Jesus paid the price for all where in darkness because of the first death or spiritual separation from God because of sin, but these will undergo the second death or eternal separation from God. Love in Christ, Marty

Hi Frank,

wps, I mean Marty; Marty the question I asked was for Frank to answer.

But since Frank doesn't like to give us “HIS” opinion,

Frank, do you agree with Marty here?

God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

[Frank4YAHWEH]

Quote (942767 @ Jan. 29 2012,11:23)

Quote (t8 @ Jan. 28 2012,14:54) Quote (Frank4YAHWEH @ Jan. 28 2012,07:55) Since most if not all other Scriptures indicate Yahshua did not pre-exist except in Yahweh's plan, * it is my view that the words in Philippians 2:5-11 should be accepted at face value, as words are normally used in a natural sense. However, people love a mystery so much that one is sometimes invented where there is no mystery. Let us compare these opposite views. That's rich. Face value for Philippians 2:5-11 as well as other scriptures say that he EXISTED in the form of God, became human, and went back to the glory that he had with God before the world began. Your interpretation is the mysterious one. So mysterious that you have to add in the words plan, thought, and not mention the word exist. Sad for you Frank that you are brainwashed and likely by that denomination you attend. You prove by your words that you are so entrenched in that doctrine, that no matter what scripture challenges that thought, you find a way to make it fit in your own head. Just don't expect us to follow this folly Frank. We believe what the scriptures say, that is where our doctrine is from. Not a denomination, not a creed. Scripture Frank. No, t8, the scriptures do not say that without a little help from your private  interpretation. Love in Christ, Marty

Marty,

Are you of the same belief as I, that Yahshua [“Jesus”] did not pre-exist his birth as an actual being and was not a creator or a co-creator with his and our Father Yahweh [“God”] in the beginning?

I noted that t8 capitalized the word 'EXISTED' in his response. It seems that he wanted me to realize that this is in the past tense. I am not sure. I had already realized this, but I do not believe the past tense of the word 'existed' is in reference to his existing with Father Yahweh in the beginning, but is in reference to his existence here on Earth, since this was written well after Yahshua was here on Earth.

Did Yahshua Create Or Pre-exist His Birth?

“Jesus IS God!”?

[GeneBalthrop]

Frank…….You are right the “EXISTED” there was talking about when Jesus “EXISTED” on EARTH and Has nothing to do with a Pre-earth existence at all.

Frank………..that pdf file you posted me, see if you can get MIKE or T8 to read it , it was quite good and to the point offer it to Mike and T8 and see what they do with It.

peace and love to you and yours………………………….gene

[Ed J]

Quote (Ed J @ Jan. 30 2012,03:17)

Quote (942767 @ Jan. 29 2012,11:38) Quote (Ed J @ Jan. 28 2012,13:12) Hi Frank, Please explain what YOU believe the words  ‘twice dead’  in Jude are referring to; thank you. (Jude 1:12) God bless Ed J Hi Ed: This describes those in the church who profess to be Christians but whose life style reflects otherwise.  Jesus paid the price for all where in darkness because of the first death or spiritual separation from God because of sin, but these will undergo the second death or eternal separation from God. Love in Christ, Marty Hi Frank, wps, I mean Marty; Marty the question I asked was for Frank to answer. But since Frank doesn't like to give us “HIS” opinion, Frank, do you agree with Marty here? God bless Ed J (Joshua 22:34) http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

Frank?

[Frank4YAHWEH]

Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Jan. 30 2012,05:41)

Frank…….You are right the “EXISTED” there was talking about when Jesus “EXISTED” on EARTH and Has nothing to do with a Pre-earth existence at all. Frank………..that pdf file you posted me, see if you can get MIKE or T8 to read it , it was quite good and to the point offer it to Mike and T8 and see what they do with It. peace and love to you and yours………………………….gene

Gene,

I am no longer having any fellowship with Mike, Ed J, or t8 with respects to Scripture, since they seem to be set in THEIR WAYS and not willing for correction and reproof in accordance with Scripture. Certainly you know what Scripture says of those who do not accept correction and reproof in accordance with Father Yahweh's inspired prophetic word, right? Father Yahweh clearly makes it known that they are fools in doing so.

[Ed J]

Quote (Frank4YAHWEH @ Jan. 30 2012,07:02)

Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Jan. 30 2012,05:41) Frank…….You are right the “EXISTED” there was talking about when Jesus “EXISTED” on EARTH and Has nothing to do with a Pre-earth existence at all. Frank………..that pdf file you posted me, see if you can get MIKE or T8 to read it , it was quite good and to the point offer it to Mike and T8 and see what they do with It. peace and love to you and yours………………………….gene Gene, I am no longer having any fellowship with Mike, Ed J, or t8 with respects to Scripture, since they seem to be set in THEIR WAYS and not willing for correction and reproof in accordance with Scripture. Certainly you know what Scripture says of those who do not accept correction and reproof in accordance with Father Yahweh's inspired prophetic word, right? Father Yahweh clearly makes it known that they are fools in doing so.

Hi Frank,

Are YOU now seeing your reflection in myself, T8 & Mike??? (Rev.22:14)

Psalms 18:25-27 With the merciful thou(YHVH) will show thyself merciful;
with an upright man thou(YHVH) will show thyself upright; With the pure
thou(YHVH) will show thyself pure; and with the froward thou(YHVH) will
show thyself froward. For thou will save the afflicted people;
but [thou YHVH] will bring down high looks.

James 1:23-24 For if any be a hearer of the word, and not a doer, he is like
unto a man beholding his natural face in a glass: For he beholdeth himself,
and goeth his way, and straightway forgetteth what manner of man he was.

I guess this verse doesn't mean to much to you then; right Frank4himself.
1 Peter 3:15 But sanctify The LORD GOD in your hearts:
and be ready always to give an answer to every man that asketh you
a reason of the hope that is in you with meekness and fear:

Witnessing to a worldwide audience in behalf of YHVH!
יהוה האלהים (JEHOVAH GOD) YÄ-hä-vā  hä ĔL-ō-Hêêm!
Ed J (Isaiah 49:16 / Isaiah 60:14 / Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org (Ecl.9:12-17)

[Ed J]

Quote (Frank4YAHWEH @ Jan. 30 2012,07:02)

I am no longer having any fellowship with Mike, Ed J, or t8 with respects to Scripture,…

Hi Frank,

How's the weather by you?

God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

[Author]

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