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Quote (Not3in1 @ Dec. 11 2008,19:21) Quote (Lightenup @ Dec. 05 2008,16:05) Hi Mandy,
Sorry things are rough going right now for you. I am concerned for you being so open to other teachings as “God's word”. I don't believe other “religious books” teach that Jesus is the way, the truth, and the life and that there is no other way to the Father but through Him. I may be mistaken but one would have to deny that “teaching” to accept other religious “scriptures” and their teachings as God's word also.Love, Kathi
Hi Kathi,Thanks for your concern and prayers, I appreciate them both!
I no longer believe that Jesus is the only way. Jesus has been the way for me, but not for everyone that I know. Certainly not for most of the world. Yet, most of the world believes in God.
Who are we to judge? Ironically, the bible seems to give us some power to judge in these matters. But I doubt these words came from God – they are of men – along with the errors contained in the same book.
I do not attribute the errors in the bible to God, and that goes double for most of the nonesense written therein as well. Nonesense like that of Jesus being the only way to God. When you have a gazillion different peoples from all different nations and tribes, it would seem ridiculous to appoint ONE way to a “narrow” path that few would/could find.
Only God knows our hearts. All will be revealed someday.
Hope all is well with you,
Mandy
Hi Mandy,
I hope that you find the peace in your spiritual journey.You realize that Jesus can't be just one of the ways to God. That would make Him a liar or a lunatic because He claims that He is the way, the truth, and the life and that no one comes to the Father but through Him.
John 14:6
6 Jesus answered, “I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me.
(from New International Version)Also, if someone could come to God apart from His Son, that would make the God of the Bible, a liar.
1 John 5:9-13
9 We accept man's testimony, but God's testimony is greater because it is the testimony of God, which he has given about his Son. 10 Anyone who believes in the Son of God has this testimony in his heart. Anyone who does not believe God has made him out to be a LIAR, because he has not believed the testimony God has given about his Son. 11 And this is the testimony: God has given us eternal life, and this life is in his Son. 12 He who has the Son has life; HE WHO DOES NOT HAVE THE SON OF GOD DOES NOT HAVE THE LIFE. 13 I write these things to you who believe in the name of the Son of God so that you may know that you have eternal life.
(from New International Version)Mandy, do all these other people that you speak of have the Son of God. If not, they do not have eternal life. Otherwise the Bible is worthless except for maybe having some interesting ideas.
If your stance is that there are many paths to God and not just through Christ, you are denying the God of the Bible and His Son. You can't have it both ways, no fence riding. Do you see that??
Sweetheart, you can't believe Christ is true and that there are many ways to God at the same time. He is either Lord, liar, or lunatic. If He is Lord then He is the ONLY way. If He was not the only way, why would you even follow Him since He would have to be a liar or lunatic?
All the other paths in the end WILL lead to Christ because every knee will bow to Him one day and every tongue will confess that Jesus Christ is Lord but by not following Him and believing His words now, you live for yourself like a street person without a home. You ought to be honest with yourself. According to the Bible, you go to the Father through the Son…no one else, or you deny the Bible.
From your post, you are denying the God of the Bible. Reread the verses I have pasted here. It is clear what the Bible teaches.
Lord, liar or lunatic…there is a book by that title by Josh McDowell. What do you believe He is? If He is Lord then follow Him ALONE, not your friends, they certainly aren't going to give you the peace you long for. In Christ alone!
I love you Mandy and so does Jesus. He gave Himself up for YOU and your friends EVEN THOUGH THE DENY Him as Lord!
Love and prayers,
KathiI love you, too, Kathi. Thanks for your concern, thoughts and prayers!
I respect your belief system. I do not share it, however.
Press on towards the goal!
Love,
MandyQuote (Not3in1 @ Dec. 13 2008,19:43) I love you, too, Kathi. Thanks for your concern, thoughts and prayers! I respect your belief system. I do not share it, however.
Press on towards the goal!
Love,
Mandy
Mandy! I do agree with Kathi and hope and pray that you will find the way back to Christ. I have wondered for some time now what exactly why you deny Christ. You say that Christ does not line up with the Messiah of the Old Testament. (remember something like that) But then you gave me no Scriptures of the Old Testament to prove so, just don't remember none. I would really like to help if I could.
Love IreneQuote (Lightenup @ Dec. 13 2008,01:13) Quote (Not3in1 @ Dec. 11 2008,19:21) Quote (Lightenup @ Dec. 05 2008,16:05) Hi Mandy,
Sorry things are rough going right now for you. I am concerned for you being so open to other teachings as “God's word”. I don't believe other “religious books” teach that Jesus is the way, the truth, and the life and that there is no other way to the Father but through Him. I may be mistaken but one would have to deny that “teaching” to accept other religious “scriptures” and their teachings as God's word also.Love, Kathi
Hi Kathi,Thanks for your concern and prayers, I appreciate them both!
I no longer believe that Jesus is the only way. Jesus has been the way for me, but not for everyone that I know. Certainly not for most of the world. Yet, most of the world believes in God.
Who are we to judge? Ironically, the bible seems to give us some power to judge in these matters. But I doubt these words came from God – they are of men – along with the errors contained in the same book.
I do not attribute the errors in the bible to God, and that goes double for most of the nonesense written therein as well. Nonesense like that of Jesus being the only way to God. When you have a gazillion different peoples from all different nations and tribes, it would seem ridiculous to appoint ONE way to a “narrow” path that few would/could find.
Only God knows our hearts. All will be revealed someday.
Hope all is well with you,
Mandy
Hi Mandy,
I hope that you find the peace in your spiritual journey.You realize that Jesus can't be just one of the ways to God. That would make Him a liar or a lunatic because He claims that He is the way, the truth, and the life and that no one comes to the Father but through Him.
John 14:6
6 Jesus answered, “I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me.
(from New International Version)Also, if someone could come to God apart from His Son, that would make the God of the Bible, a liar.
1 John 5:9-13
9 We accept man's testimony, but God's testimony is greater because it is the testimony of God, which he has given about his Son. 10 Anyone who believes in the Son of God has this testimony in his heart. Anyone who does not believe God has made him out to be a LIAR, because he has not believed the testimony God has given about his Son. 11 And this is the testimony: God has given us eternal life, and this life is in his Son. 12 He who has the Son has life; HE WHO DOES NOT HAVE THE SON OF GOD DOES NOT HAVE THE LIFE. 13 I write these things to you who believe in the name of the Son of God so that you may know that you have eternal life.
(from New International Version)Mandy, do all these other people that you speak of have the Son of God. If not, they do not have eternal life. Otherwise the Bible is worthless except for maybe having some interesting ideas.
If your stance is that there are many paths to God and not just through Christ, you are denying the God of the Bible and His Son. You can't have it both ways, no fence riding. Do you see that??
Sweetheart, you can't believe Christ is true and that there are many ways to God at the same time. He is either Lord, liar, or lunatic. If He is Lord then He is the ONLY way. If He was not the only way, why would you even follow Him since He would have to be a liar or lunatic?
All the other paths in the end WILL lead to Christ because every knee will bow to Him one day and every tongue will confess that Jesus Christ is Lord but by not following Him and believing His words now, you live for yourself like a street person without a home. You ought to be honest with yourself. According to the Bible, you go to the Father through the Son…no one else, or you deny the Bible.
From your post, you are denying the God of the Bible. Reread the verses I have pasted here. It is clear what the Bible teaches.
Lord, liar or lunatic…there is a book by that title by Josh McDowell. What do you believe He is? If He is Lord then follow Him ALONE, not your friends, they certainly aren't going to give you the peace you long for. In Christ alone!
I love you Mandy and so does Jesus. He gave Himself up for YOU and your friends EVEN THOUGH THE DENY Him as Lord!
Love and prayers,
Kathi
Mandy,
Would you mind telling me what you disagree with in particular with my post and how you understand those verses that I quoted about Jesus being the only way to the Father and he who does not have the Son of God does not have eternal life.I really would care to hear.
Love,
KathiHi Kathi,
Quote You realize that Jesus can't be just one of the ways to God. That would make Him a liar or a lunatic because He claims that He is the way, the truth, and the life and that no one comes to the Father but through Him.
Well it certainly would call into question whoever wrote down Jesus' words, I'll grant you that.Quote Also, if someone could come to God apart from His Son, that would make the God of the Bible, a liar.
Ya, chat with Nick about this idea. He seems to think that after the first resurrection, the door to life through Jesus is closed. So tell me, how do the rest find God? That is, if Jesus is the only way and that way is closed? Sounds like nonsense to me.Quote 12 He who has the Son has life; HE WHO DOES NOT HAVE THE SON OF GOD DOES NOT HAVE THE LIFE. 13 I write these things to you who believe in the name of the Son of God so that you may know that you have eternal life.
So I guess according to those who believe the door is shut to the bridegroom after the rapture….. those who remain after the rapture cannot find God at all. Because the door to Jesus is shut. And according to scripture, HE WHO DOES NOT HAVE THE SON OF GOD DOES NOT HAVE LIFE…..Also, those who never had an opportunity to meet Jesus in this lifetime are also turned away and not granted life. Nonsense.
Quote If your stance is that there are many paths to God and not just through Christ, you are denying the God of the Bible and His Son. You can't have it both ways, no fence riding. Do you see that??
Yes, you are correct according to your belief system and interpretation of the bible.
I'm curious, so denying the bible is denying God now? Wow.Quote All the other paths in the end WILL lead to Christ because every knee will bow to Him one day and every tongue will confess that Jesus Christ is Lord but by not following Him and believing His words now, you live for yourself like a street person without a home. You ought to be honest with yourself. According to the Bible, you go to the Father through the Son…no one else, or you deny the Bible.
I agree with you that all other paths will lead to God. Remember that Jesus is the w a y, he is not the destination.
I assure you, my home is with my Creator (although you are correct, I have no home here on earth….I await my citizenship in the Kingdom of Heaven! Praise God).Quote Lord, liar or lunatic…there is a book by that title by Josh McDowell. What do you believe He is? If He is Lord then follow Him ALONE, not your friends, they certainly aren't going to give you the peace you long for. In Christ alone!
I've read a lot of Josh McDowell and, quite frankly, I think he's full of crap. Sorry.
I believe Jesus is Lord.
I don't follow my friends.
I have peace in God.Quote He gave Himself up for YOU and your friends EVEN THOUGH THE DENY Him as Lord!
I'm not sure who these “friends” of mine are that you are ref'ing?
I've never denied Jesus as Lord, have I?Kathi, no one knows the heart of another man. You have a book by which you feel the power to pass judgement onto me (after all it's useful for teaching and rebukes – I know). But the heart of Jesus was “no judgement”. He did not come into the world to judge the world. He admonishes his followers to check the mirror for logs first, then if there is no log, he may safely try to remove the spec in his brother's eye. In other words…..be careful how you judge the children of God.
If I am born again, which I feel that I am, then no one can pluck me out of his hand. I'm safe there – along with you – in His care.
We just have different ideas. Ideas that we both get from reading the SAME BOOK. Go figure.Love,
MandyMandy! One thing that I am very glad of that you are born again. Whatever your concen about the rest of things, will fall into place IMO I do believe that you think that Jesus is the Son of God the Almighty Father. Georg and I have believed for some time that everybody will have a chance to be in the Kingdom of God. I do not believe that God would kill all those children that died before they got to know Him. For that matter with all the confusion now how can anybody see the truth. In the Millinium the truth will cover the earth like water covers the sea. In Georg's Book “Understanding Truth God's Word”s is Truth” He explains a lot of this. It is avaible at Xibris Corporation 1-888-795-4274
Peace and Love IreneQuote (Not3in1 @ Dec. 14 2008,02:21) Hi Kathi, Quote You realize that Jesus can't be just one of the ways to God. That would make Him a liar or a lunatic because He claims that He is the way, the truth, and the life and that no one comes to the Father but through Him.
Well it certainly would call into question whoever wrote down Jesus' words, I'll grant you that.Quote Also, if someone could come to God apart from His Son, that would make the God of the Bible, a liar.
Ya, chat with Nick about this idea. He seems to think that after the first resurrection, the door to life through Jesus is closed. So tell me, how do the rest find God? That is, if Jesus is the only way and that way is closed? Sounds like nonsense to me.Quote 12 He who has the Son has life; HE WHO DOES NOT HAVE THE SON OF GOD DOES NOT HAVE THE LIFE. 13 I write these things to you who believe in the name of the Son of God so that you may know that you have eternal life.
So I guess according to those who believe the door is shut to the bridegroom after the rapture….. those who remain after the rapture cannot find God at all. Because the door to Jesus is shut. And according to scripture, HE WHO DOES NOT HAVE THE SON OF GOD DOES NOT HAVE LIFE…..Also, those who never had an opportunity to meet Jesus in this lifetime are also turned away and not granted life. Nonsense.
Quote If your stance is that there are many paths to God and not just through Christ, you are denying the God of the Bible and His Son. You can't have it both ways, no fence riding. Do you see that??
Yes, you are correct according to your belief system and interpretation of the bible.
I'm curious, so denying the bible is denying God now? Wow.Quote All the other paths in the end WILL lead to Christ because every knee will bow to Him one day and every tongue will confess that Jesus Christ is Lord but by not following Him and believing His words now, you live for yourself like a street person without a home. You ought to be honest with yourself. According to the Bible, you go to the Father through the Son…no one else, or you deny the Bible.
I agree with you that all other paths will lead to God. Remember that Jesus is the w a y, he is not the destination.
I assure you, my home is with my Creator (although you are correct, I have no home here on earth….I await my citizenship in the Kingdom of Heaven! Praise God).Quote Lord, liar or lunatic…there is a book by that title by Josh McDowell. What do you believe He is? If He is Lord then follow Him ALONE, not your friends, they certainly aren't going to give you the peace you long for. In Christ alone!
I've read a lot of Josh McDowell and, quite frankly, I think he's full of crap. Sorry.
I believe Jesus is Lord.
I don't follow my friends.
I have peace in God.Quote He gave Himself up for YOU and your friends EVEN THOUGH THE DENY Him as Lord!
I'm not sure who these “friends” of mine are that you are ref'ing?
I've never denied Jesus as Lord, have I?Kathi, no one knows the heart of another man. You have a book by which you feel the power to pass judgement onto me (after all it's useful for teaching and rebukes – I know). But the heart of Jesus was “no judgement”. He did not come into the world to judge the world. He admonishes his followers to check the mirror for logs first, then if there is no log, he may safely try to remove the spec in his brother's eye. In other words…..be careful how you judge the children of God.
If I am born again, which I feel that I am, then no one can pluck me out of his hand. I'm safe there – along with you – in His care.
We just have different ideas. Ideas that we both get from reading the SAME BOOK. Go figure.Love,
Mandy
Mandy,
I have pasted several translations of John 14:6 for you to see that the translators are consistent and agree with one another.John 14:6
Context
NET © Jesus replied, 1 “I am the way, and the truth, and the life. 2 No one comes to the Father except through me.NIV ©
biblegateway Joh 14:6
Jesus answered, “I am the way and the truth and the life. No-one comes to the Father except through me.NASB ©
biblegateway Joh 14:6
Jesus *said to him, “I am the way, and the truth, and the life; no one comes to the Father but through Me.NLT ©
biblegateway Joh 14:6
Jesus told him, “I am the way, the truth, and the life. No one can come to the Father except through me.MSG ©
biblegateway Joh 14:6
Jesus said, “I am the Road, also the Truth, also the Life. No one gets to the Father apart from me.BBE ©
SABDAweb Joh 14:6
Jesus said to him, I am the true and living way: no one comes to the Father but by me.NRSV ©
bibleoremusJoh 14:6
Jesus said to him, “I am the way, and the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me.NKJV ©
biblegateway Joh 14:6
Jesus said to him, “I am the way, the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through Me.So, do I understand you correctly that you think this verse was made up by the man who wrote this down and isn't true? You don't think that Jesus actually said that? If so, what is your defense?
Hi Kathi,
Thanks for all your effort here, but I own a gazillion different versions of the bible. I understand that many of them are consistent with one another.
My belief is that the bible (as a whole) is in question on many levels. The versions that you quoted above, and even much earlier versions are still all based on a few manuscripts that were used as sources. A basic study of these manuscripts and their history is enough to make anyone doubt the consequent translations of them. That is, if they are not operating on blind faith. I don't have a lot against blind faith – I think it serves some very well – I just don't happen to be one of them (anymore).
Have a good week,
MandyYou own a gazillion Bible, which ones. I only have 4 that I do not consider a gazillion. What are they, would you care to tell me, Mandy
IreneWhen I have all of them out – my dining room table that seats 8 – cannot contain them!!
I went a bit nuts and began a bible collection (of sorts). I drew the line at one copy of antiquity for $12,000!!
Hi not3,
We should become a bible.
Soaking in scripture is meant to enable us to take from our store new and old things to share.Jesus, Peter and Paul did not carry a copy of any book
Quote (Nick Hassan @ Dec. 16 2008,08:36) Hi not3,
We should become a bible.
Soaking in scripture is meant to enable us to take from our store new and old things to share.Jesus, Peter and Paul did not carry a copy of any book
I agree to a certain degree.I believe that God's holy Spirit teaches us all things (as well as the bible). So we are able to bring forth those things that we are taught *along with* those things from the bible.
Quote (Nick Hassan @ Dec. 16 2008,08:36) Hi not3,
We should become a bible.
Soaking in scripture is meant to enable us to take from our store new and old things to share.Jesus, Peter and Paul did not carry a copy of any book
There was no Book that was into a Bible, back then, only the Letters of the Apostles. It was much later when a Catholic Monks took all little pieces of the letters and put them together and made a Book out of them. So it is understandable that some have errors in it. But God lets us see of His Words what He wants us to see. It is the Faith in Christ Jesus that saves us, it is a free gift from God, so no one can boast. We are after all under grace. At Baptism we do receive the Holy Spirit and we do understand the things of God.
Peace and Love IreneQuote (Lightenup @ Dec. 16 2008,07:56) Mandy,
I wish you well on your search for truth. God bless you and your family.
Kathi
Thanks, Kathi.I wish you well, too.
Love,
MandyThe sun is shining so very beautiful here in Cincinnati, Ohio. It also has been 2 weeks since anyone has posted here. Is it a good sign, that nobody is sick? Well unfortunately this body of mine is breaking down and getting old. Have been experiencing some extreme pain in my feet, to the point that it is hard to walk. I did go seen my Doctor yesterday. He gave me 3 Prescription. I have Neuropathy which is very painful in my case. Georg just left to get my med. hopefully it will help. In the mean time I would appreciate some prayers.
Peace and Love IreneQuote (Tiffany @ Dec. 31 2008,02:35) The sun is shining so very beautiful here in Cincinnati, Ohio. It also has been 2 weeks since anyone has posted here. Is it a good sign, that nobody is sick? Well unfortunately this body of mine is breaking down and getting old. Have been experiencing some extreme pain in my feet, to the point that it is hard to walk. I did go seen my Doctor yesterday. He gave me 3 Prescription. I have Neuropathy which is very painful in my case. Georg just left to get my med. hopefully it will help. In the mean time I would appreciate some prayers.
Peace and Love Irene
Hi Mrs:I am praying that God will see you through these trials, and encourage you saying, that in the world to come there will be no more sickness, pain and suffering, and that at the right hand of God will be eternal joy and pleasures forever more.
God Bless
Irene,
Hi Sweetie! I will pray for your feet and that the meds will help you. Have a Happy New Year celebration tomorrow.
Love, Kathi
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