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To All,
On the “Monotheism is Scripture's theme” thread page 7 Paladin said:Paladin said:Quote Adonay is one of the names of God. “Ad-down” is a whole different thing.
To All,
I want to publically thank Paladin!!! He said that Adonay is one of the names of God.ACCORDING TO PSALM 110:5 ADONAY IS THE NAME OF THE ONE WHO SITS AT YHWH'S RIGHT HAND! THEREFORE, IT IS GOD WHO SITS AT YHWH'S RIGHT HAND!
Quote Verse 1: YHWH said to my Sovereign, “Sit thou at My right hand until I make Your enemies Your footstool….Verse 5: Adonay is at your right hand (Psalm 110:1,5) At first Paladin told me to “rethink” this. Then he turns around and says exactly what I have been saying. He said, “Adonay is a name for God.” Paladin now concedes this. According to Psalm 110:5 it is Adonay (God) who sits at YHWH'S right hand.
Whew! Now I can take a day off.
thinker
Quote (thethinker @ June 24 2009,08:33) To All,
On the “Monotheism is Scripture's theme” thread page 7 Paladin said:Paladin said:Quote Adonay is one of the names of God. “Ad-down” is a whole different thing.
To All,
I want to publically thank Paladin!!! He said that Adonay is one of the names of God.ACCORDING TO PSALM 110:5 ADONAY IS THE NAME OF THE ONE WHO SITS AT YHWH'S RIGHT HAND! THEREFORE, IT IS GOD WHO SITS AT YHWH'S RIGHT HAND!
Quote Verse 1: YHWH said to my Sovereign, “Sit thou at My right hand until I make Your enemies Your footstool….Verse 5: Adonay is at your right hand (Psalm 110:1,5) At first Paladin told me to “rethink” this. Then he turns around and says exactly what I have been saying. He said, “Adonay is a name for God.” Paladin now concedes this. According to Psalm 110:5 it is Adonay (God) who sits at YHWH'S right hand.
Whew! Now I can take a day off.
thinker
How can even YOU say “Paladin now condedes” what Paladin has always said?Wishful thinking will not win you any points.
If you will quit mixing “Adonay” and “Ad-down” you may begin to comprehend what I have been telling you.
Quote (Paladin @ June 23 2009,18:31) Quote (thethinker @ June 24 2009,08:33) To All,
On the “Monotheism is Scripture's theme” thread page 7 Paladin said:Paladin said:Quote Adonay is one of the names of God. “Ad-down” is a whole different thing.
To All,
I want to publically thank Paladin!!! He said that Adonay is one of the names of God.ACCORDING TO PSALM 110:5 ADONAY IS THE NAME OF THE ONE WHO SITS AT YHWH'S RIGHT HAND! THEREFORE, IT IS GOD WHO SITS AT YHWH'S RIGHT HAND!
Quote Verse 1: YHWH said to my Sovereign, “Sit thou at My right hand until I make Your enemies Your footstool….Verse 5: Adonay is at your right hand (Psalm 110:1,5) At first Paladin told me to “rethink” this. Then he turns around and says exactly what I have been saying. He said, “Adonay is a name for God.” Paladin now concedes this. According to Psalm 110:5 it is Adonay (God) who sits at YHWH'S right hand.
Whew! Now I can take a day off.
thinker
How can even YOU say “Paladin now condedes” what Paladin has always said?Wishful thinking will not win you any points.
If you will quit mixing “Adonay” and “Ad-down” you may begin to comprehend what I have been telling you.
Hi PDWhat did they switch seats when it came time for judgment?
WJ
Hi WJ,
The Judgement which God committed to His Son?
The Son of God is also son of Man but God is not a son of man.Paladin said:
Quote How can even YOU say “Paladin now condedes” what Paladin has always said? Wishful thinking will not win you any points.
I meant that you concede unintentionally as indicated in the title of this thread.
Paladin said:
Quote If you will quit mixing “Adonay” and “Ad-down” you may begin to comprehend what I have been telling you. I have never mixed “Adonay” with “Ad-down.” I said that verse 5 says “Adonay” which you say is “one of the names for God.” Prior to your saying this I repeatedly said that “Adonay was the proper name for God” and I gave Strong's #136 as my source.
The One who sits at YHWH's right hand is identified as a “priest forever after the order of Melchizedek” (vs. 4). This is Christ without a doubt. Then in verse 5 He is identified as “Adonay.” Since this is “one of the names for God” (your own words), then Christ is God. Therefore, GOD sits at YHWH's right hand.
You bored us to tears with your lengthy treatise on “Ad-down” on another thread when all along I had been talking about “Adonay” in Psalm 110:5. Your admission that “Adonay” is “one of the names for God” is an unwitting concession whether you like to admit or not. But, hey, I'll take it anyway I can get it bro.
It is Adonay who is seated at YHWH's right hand whom you infer is God.
thinker
Quote (Nick Hassan @ June 23 2009,19:45) Hi TT,
God sits at God's right hand?
Hi NHWho was the Word that was with God and was God?
WJ
Quote (thethinker @ June 24 2009,11:13) Paladin said: Quote How can even YOU say “Paladin now condedes” what Paladin has always said? Wishful thinking will not win you any points.
I meant that you concede unintentionally as indicated in the title of this thread.
Paladin said:
Quote If you will quit mixing “Adonay” and “Ad-down” you may begin to comprehend what I have been telling you. I have never mixed “Adonay” with “Ad-down.” I said that verse 5 says “Adonay” which you say is “one of the names for God.” Prior to your saying this I repeatedly said that “Adonay was the proper name for God” and I gave Strong's #136 as my source.
The One who sits at YHWH's right hand is identified as a “priest forever after the order of Melchizedek” (vs. 4). This is Christ without a doubt. Then in verse 5 He is identified as “Adonay.” Since this is “one of the names for God” (your own words), then Christ is God. Therefore, GOD sits at YHWH's right hand.
You bored us to tears with your lengthy treatise on “Ad-down” on another thread when all along I had been talking about “Adonay” in Psalm 110:5. Your admission that “Adonay” is “one of the names for God” is an unwitting concession whether you like to admit or not. But, hey, I'll take it anyway I can get it bro.
It is Adonay who is seated at YHWH's right hand whom you infer is God.
thinker
Adonai
Main article: A-D-N
Jews also call God Adonai, Hebrew for “Lord” (Hebrew: אֲדֹנָי). Formally, this is plural (“my Lords”), but the plural is usually construed as a respectful, and not a syntactic plural. (The singular form is Adoni, “my lord”. This was used by the Phoenicians for the god Tammuz and is the origin of the Greek name Adonis. Jews only use the singular to refer to a distinguished person: in the plural, “rabotai”, lit. “my masters”, is used in both Mishnaic and modern Hebrew.)Since pronouncing YHWH is avoided out of reverence for the holiness of the name, Jews use Adonai instead in prayers, and colloquially would use Hashem (“the Name”). When the Masoretes added vowel pointings to the text of the Hebrew Bible around the eighth century CE, they gave the word YHWH the vowels of Adonai, to remind the reader to say Adonai instead. Later Biblical scholars mistook this vowel substitution for the actual spelling of YHWH and interpreted the name of God as Jehovah.
Quote (thethinker @ June 24 2009,11:13) Paladin said: Quote How can even YOU say “Paladin now condedes” what Paladin has always said? Wishful thinking will not win you any points.
I meant that you concede unintentionally as indicated in the title of this thread.
Paladin said:
Quote If you will quit mixing “Adonay” and “Ad-down” you may begin to comprehend what I have been telling you. I have never mixed “Adonay” with “Ad-down.” I said that verse 5 says “Adonay” which you say is “one of the names for God.” Prior to your saying this I repeatedly said that “Adonay was the proper name for God” and I gave Strong's #136 as my source.
The One who sits at YHWH's right hand is identified as a “priest forever after the order of Melchizedek” (vs. 4). This is Christ without a doubt. Then in verse 5 He is identified as “Adonay.” Since this is “one of the names for God” (your own words), then Christ is God. Therefore, GOD sits at YHWH's right hand.
You bored us to tears with your lengthy treatise on “Ad-down” on another thread when all along I had been talking about “Adonay” in Psalm 110:5. Your admission that “Adonay” is “one of the names for God” is an unwitting concession whether you like to admit or not. But, hey, I'll take it anyway I can get it bro.
It is Adonay who is seated at YHWH's right hand whom you infer is God.
thinker
When two sit facing one another, they are BOTH at the other's right hand.Jehovah Adonay is at the right hand of resurrected Messiah, after the same fashion as the logos was “face to face” “with” God.
I am glad to see you publickly concede the issue.
Paladin said:
Quote When two sit facing one another, they are BOTH at the other's right hand. Jehovah Adonay is at the right hand of resurrected Messiah, after the same fashion as the logos was “face to face” “with” God.
I am glad to see you publickly concede the issue.
Paladin,
I am trying to picture what you are saying but I find it difficult. You say that the right hand means face to face. Wouldn't “face to face” imply that they are in front of the other? And wouldn't “face to face” also imply a relationship that is equal? Besides, verses 6-7 clearly say that Adonay will judge the nations. We know that it is the Messiah who does the judging.Let's not forget the account of Isaiah's vision of Adonay's glory (chap 6),
Quote In the year that king Uzziah died, I saw Adonay sitting on a throne, high and lifted up, and the train of His robe filled the temple. Above it stood the seraphim; each one had six wings; with two he covered his face, with two he covered his feet, and with two he flew. And one cried to another and said: “Holy, holy, holy is the LORD of Hosts; the whole land is filled with His glory (Isaiah 6:1-3)
You can take the Apostle John's word for it that Isaiah had seen the glory of Jesus,
Quote Though He had done so many signs before them, they did not believe in Him, that the word of Isaiah the prophet might be fulfilled which he spoke: “Lord, who has believed our report? And to whom has the arm of the Lord been revealed.”
Therefore, they could not believe, because Isaiah said again:
“He has blinded their minds and hardened their hearts, lest they should see with their eyes, lest they should understand with their hearts and turn, so that I should heal them….” These things Isaiah said when he saw His (Christ's) glory and spoke of Him (Jesus) John 12:37-41.
John clearly said that Isaiah had seen the glory of Jesus whom he called “Adonay.”
Have you heard the saying “There is virtue in brevity?” Please keep your reply brief. There is no need for a lengthy dissertation.
thanks,
thinkerQuote (thethinker @ June 25 2009,03:19) Paladin said: Quote When two sit facing one another, they are BOTH at the other's right hand. Jehovah Adonay is at the right hand of resurrected Messiah, after the same fashion as the logos was “face to face” “with” God.
I am glad to see you publickly concede the issue.
Paladin,
I am trying to picture what you are saying but I find it difficult. You say that the right hand means face to face. Wouldn't “face to face” imply that they are in front of the other? And wouldn't “face to face” also imply a relationship that is equal? Besides, verses 6-7 clearly say that Adonay will judge the nations. We know that it is the Messiah who does the judging.Let's not forget the account of Isaiah's vision of Adonay's glory (chap 6),
Quote In the year that king Uzziah died, I was Adonay sitting on a throne, high andlifted up, and the train of His robe filled the temple. Above it stood the seraphim; each one had six wings; with two he covered his face, with two he covered his feet, and with two he flew. And one cried to another and said: “Holy, holy, holy is the LORD of Hosts; the whole land is filled with His glory (Isaiah 6:1-3)
You can take the Apostle John's word for it that Isaiah had seen the glory of Jesus,
Quote Though He had done so many signs before them, they did not believe in Him, that the word of Isaiah the prophet might be fulfilled which he spoke: “Lord, who has believed our report? And to whom has the arm of the Lord been revealed.”
Therefore, they could not believe, because Isaiah said again:
“He has blinded their minds and hardened their hearts, lest they should see with their eyes, lest they should understand with their hearts and turn, so that I should heal them….” These things Isaiah said when he saw His (Christ's) glory and spoke of Him (Jesus) John 12:37-41.
John clearly said that Isaiah had seen the glory of Jesus whom he called “Adonay.”
Have you heard the saying “There is virtue in brevity?” Please keep your reply brief. There is no need for a lengthy dissertation.
thanks,
thinker
Why is it that you keep insisting that Adonai means anything other than lord which is a title of respect and not one of Absolute authority. You will never find one scripture that calls Jesus “The Most High”bodhitharta said:
Quote Why is it that you keep insisting that Adonai means anything other than lord which is a title of respect and not one of Absolute authority. You will never find one scripture that calls Jesus “The Most High” bd,
What are you talking about? Paladin has also said that Adonay is the proper name for God. The word you are referring to is “Ad-down.” Isaiah said that he saw Adonay sitting on a throne high and lifted up,Quote …I saw Adonay sitting on a throne, high and lifted up, and the train of His robe filled the temple. Above it stood the seraphim; each one had six wings; with two he covered his face, with two he covered his feet, and with two he flew. And one cried to another and said: “Holy, holy, holy is the LORD of Hosts; the whole land is filled with His glory (Isaiah 6:1-3)…
There it is! Adonay is the Lord of Hosts. According to John Isaiah saw the glory of Jesus in this vision (John 12:37-41).
You are in total denial!
thinker
Hi TT,
So it is the glory of God.
NIV adds the word JESUS but compare Rev 4 and you will see it is God.
Jesus does not have a private throne or he would be another god and you do not believe in polytheism surely..Quote (thethinker @ June 25 2009,03:19) Paladin said: Quote When two sit facing one another, they are BOTH at the other's right hand. Jehovah Adonay is at the right hand of resurrected Messiah, after the same fashion as the logos was “face to face” “with” God.
I am glad to see you publickly concede the issue.
Paladin,
I am trying to picture what you are saying but I find it difficult. You say that the right hand means face to face. Wouldn't “face to face” imply that they are in front of the other? And wouldn't “face to face” also imply a relationship that is equal? Besides, verses 6-7 clearly say that Adonay will judge the nations. We know that it is the Messiah who does the judging.Let's not forget the account of Isaiah's vision of Adonay's glory (chap 6),
Quote In the year that king Uzziah died, I saw Adonay sitting on a throne, high and lifted up, and the train of His robe filled the temple. Above it stood the seraphim; each one had six wings; with two he covered his face, with two he covered his feet, and with two he flew. And one cried to another and said: “Holy, holy, holy is the LORD of Hosts; the whole land is filled with His glory (Isaiah 6:1-3)
You can take the Apostle John's word for it that Isaiah had seen the glory of Jesus,
Quote Though He had done so many signs before them, they did not believe in Him, that the word of Isaiah the prophet might be fulfilled which he spoke: “Lord, who has believed our report? And to whom has the arm of the Lord been revealed.”
Therefore, they could not believe, because Isaiah said again:
“He has blinded their minds and hardened their hearts, lest they should see with their eyes, lest they should understand with their hearts and turn, so that I should heal them….” These things Isaiah said when he saw His (Christ's) glory and spoke of Him (Jesus) John 12:37-41.
John clearly said that Isaiah had seen the glory of Jesus whom he called “Adonay.”
Have you heard the saying “There is virtue in brevity?” Please keep your reply brief. There is no need for a lengthy dissertation.
thanks,
thinkerQuote
John clearly said that Isaiah had seen the glory of Jesus whom he called “Adonay.”What John said
“John 12:37 But though he had done so many miracles before them, yet they believed not on him: 38 That the saying of Esaias the prophet might be fulfilled which he spake, Lord, who hath believed our report? and to whom hath the arm of the Lord been revealed? 39 Therefore they could not believe, because that Esaias said again, 40 He hath blinded their eyes, and hardened their heart; that they should not see with their eyes, nor understand with their heart, and be converted, and I should heal them. 41 These things said Esaias, when he saw his glory, and spake of him.”First; I do not see “Adonay” anywhere in John's record.
Second, “Isaiah saw,” is a reference to what Isaiah FORESAW as a prophet. And what did Isaiah foresee?
Phil 2:9 Wherefore God also hath highly exalted him, and given him a name which is above every name: 10 That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth; 11 And that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.
Isa 52:13 Behold, my servant shall deal prudently, HE SHALL BE EXALTED AND EXTOLLED AND BE VERY HIGH.
Third: God is not, repeat NOT God's servant. God's servant is a man who suffers AS A MAN, dies AS A MAN, and is raised AS A MAN.
El Jehovah [Isa 42:5] God testified –
that one maiden of Israel was to bear a child, and that the child's name is to be called Immanuel; which means El is with us. So Immanuel is a son of el named Jehovah.BUT, Jehovah tells us that none of the sons of ANY El, is equal with the El named Jehovah;
“For who in the heaven can be compared unto Jehovah (the LORD)? who among the sons of El'm (the mighty) can be likened unto Jehovah (the LORD)?” [Psa 89:6]Isa 40:25 “To whom then will ye liken me, or shall I be equal? saith the Holy One.”
and
46:5 “To whom will ye liken me, and make me equal, and compare me, that we may be like?”
both indicate God's opinion as to the “equality with God” issue.
Prophecy testified –
Messiah Jesus is the seed of the woman of [Gen 3:15];
seed of Abraham[Gen 12:1-3][Gal 3:16]:
seed of Isaac[Gen 26:4];
seed of Jacob[Gen 28:14];
seed of Jesse[Isa 11:10][Rom 15:12];
seed of David[Psa 132:11][Jer 23:5-6];
seed of Mary[Gen 3:15].Zechariah testified –
“…Behold THE MAN whose name is the Branch…” [Zech 6:12]“Awake o sword against my shepherd, and against the MAN that is my fellow…”[Zech 13:7]
David testified –
Messiah was prophecied to be a MAN at God's right hand; “Let thy hand be upon THE MAN of thy right hand, upon the son of man whom thou madest strong for thyself.” [Psa 80:17]“Yea, mine own familiar friend, in whom I trusted, which did eat of my bread, hath lifted up his heel against me.” [Psa 41:9]
AND “A MAN MINE EQUAL;” “For it was not an enemy that reproached me; then I could have borne it: neither was it he that hated me that did magnify himself against me; then I would have hid myself from him: 13 But it was thou, A MAN MINE EQUAL, my guide, and mine acquaintance. 14 We took sweet counsel together, and walked unto the house of God in company.” [Psa 55:12-14]
Isaiah testified –
“He is despised and rejected of men; A MAN of sorrows, and acquainted with grief:…” [Isaiah 53:3]Jesus testified –
“But now ye seek to kill me, A MAN what hath told you the truth…”[John 8:40]Moses testified –
“The Lord God will raise up unto thee a prophet from the midst of thee, of thy brethren…”[Deu 18:15]“I will raise them up a prophet FROM AMONG THEIR BRETHREN” [Deu 18:18]
Paul testified –
“…(God) said, I have found David the son of Jesse, a man after my own heart, which shall fulfill all my will. Of THIS MAN'S SEED hath God according to his promise raised unto Isreael a saviour, Jesus. [Acts 13:22-23]“For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, THE MAN [anthrwpos] Christ Jesus;” ; which tells us that Jesus is functioning AS A MAN and MEDIATOR.
Luke testified –
“Ye men of Israel, hear these words; Jesus of Nazareth, A MAN approved of God among you by miracles and wonders and signs, which God did by him in the midst of you, as ye yourselves also know:” [Acts 2:22]Man cannot kill God!
“Him, being delivered by the determinate counsel and foreknowledge of God, ye have taken, and by wicked hands have crucified and SLAIN: 24 Whom God hath raised up,” [Acts 2:23-24]Quote (Paladin @ June 25 2009,08:17) Quote (thethinker @ June 25 2009,03:19) Paladin said: Quote When two sit facing one another, they are BOTH at the other's right hand. Jehovah Adonay is at the right hand of resurrected Messiah, after the same fashion as the logos was “face to face” “with” God.
I am glad to see you publickly concede the issue.
Paladin,
I am trying to picture what you are saying but I find it difficult. You say that the right hand means face to face. Wouldn't “face to face” imply that they are in front of the other? And wouldn't “face to face” also imply a relationship that is equal? Besides, verses 6-7 clearly say that Adonay will judge the nations. We know that it is the Messiah who does the judging.Let's not forget the account of Isaiah's vision of Adonay's glory (chap 6),
Quote In the year that king Uzziah died, I saw Adonay sitting on a throne, high and lifted up, and the train of His robe filled the temple. Above it stood the seraphim; each one had six wings; with two he covered his face, with two he covered his feet, and with two he flew. And one cried to another and said: “Holy, holy, holy is the LORD of Hosts; the whole land is filled with His glory (Isaiah 6:1-3)
You can take the Apostle John's word for it that Isaiah had seen the glory of Jesus,
Quote Though He had done so many signs before them, they did not believe in Him, that the word of Isaiah the prophet might be fulfilled which he spoke: “Lord, who has believed our report? And to whom has the arm of the Lord been revealed.”
Therefore, they could not believe, because Isaiah said again:
“He has blinded their minds and hardened their hearts, lest they should see with their eyes, lest they should understand with their hearts and turn, so that I should heal them….” These things Isaiah said when he saw His (Christ's) glory and spoke of Him (Jesus) John 12:37-41.
John clearly said that Isaiah had seen the glory of Jesus whom he called “Adonay.”
Have you heard the saying “There is virtue in brevity?” Please keep your reply brief. There is no need for a lengthy dissertation.
thanks,
thinkerQuote
John clearly said that Isaiah had seen the glory of Jesus whom he called “Adonay.”What John said
“John 12:37 But though he had done so many miracles before them, yet they believed not on him: 38 That the saying of Esaias the prophet might be fulfilled which he spake, Lord, who hath believed our report? and to whom hath the arm of the Lord been revealed? 39 Therefore they could not believe, because that Esaias said again, 40 He hath blinded their eyes, and hardened their heart; that they should not see with their eyes, nor understand with their heart, and be converted, and I should heal them. 41 These things said Esaias, when he saw his glory, and spake of him.”First; I do not see “Adonay” anywhere in John's record.
Second, “Isaiah saw,” is a reference to what Isaiah FORESAW as a prophet. And what did Isaiah foresee?
Phil 2:9 Wherefore God also hath highly exalted him, and given him a name which is above every name: 10 That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth; 11 And that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.
Isa 52:13 Behold, my servant shall deal prudently, HE SHALL BE EXALTED AND EXTOLLED AND BE VERY HIGH.
Third: God is not, repeat NOT God's servant. God's servant is a man who suffers AS A MAN, dies AS A MAN, and is raised AS A MAN.
El Jehovah [Isa 42:5] God testified –
that one maiden of Israel was to bear a child, and that the child's name is to be called Immanuel; which means El is with us. So Immanuel is a son of el named Jehovah.BUT, Jehovah tells us that none of the sons of ANY El, is equal with the El named Jehovah;
“For who in the heaven can be compared unto Jehovah (the LORD)? who among the sons of El'm (the mighty) can be likened unto Jehovah (the LORD)?” [Psa 89:6]Isa 40:25 “To whom then will ye liken me, or shall I be equal? saith the Holy One.”
and
46:5 “To whom will ye liken me, and make me equal, and compare me, that we may be like?”
both indicate God's opinion as to the “equality with God” issue.
Prophecy testified –
Messiah Jesus is the seed of the woman of [Gen 3:15];
seed of Abraham[Gen 12:1-3][Gal 3:16]:
seed of Isaac[Gen 26:4];
seed of Jacob[Gen 28:14];
seed of Jesse[Isa 11:10][Rom 15:12];
seed of David[Psa 132:11][Jer 23:5-6];
seed of Mary[Gen 3:15].Zechariah testified –
“…Behold THE MAN whose name is the Branch…” [Zech 6:12]“Awake o sword against my shepherd, and against the MAN that is my fellow…”[Zech 13:7]
David testified –
Messiah was prophecied to be a MAN at God's right hand; “Let thy hand be upon THE MAN of thy right hand, upon the son of man whom thou madest strong for thyself.” [Psa 80:17]“Yea, mine own familiar friend, in whom I trusted, which did eat of my bread, hath lifted up his heel against me.” [Psa 41:9]
AND “A MAN MINE EQUAL;” “For it was not an enemy that reproached me; then I could have borne it: neither was it he that hated me that did magnify himself against me; then I would have hid myself from him: 13 But it was thou, A MAN MINE EQUAL, my guide, and mine acquaintance. 14 We took sweet counsel together, and walked unto the house of God in company.” [Psa 55:12-14]
Isaiah testified –
“He is despised and rejected of men; A MAN of sorrows, and acquainted with grief:…” [Isaiah 53:3]Jesus testified –
“But now ye seek to kill me, A MAN what hath told you the truth…”[John 8:40]Moses testified –
“The Lord God will raise up unto thee a prophet from the midst of thee, of thy brethren…”[Deu 18:15]“I will raise them up a prophet FROM AMONG THEIR BRETHREN” [Deu 18:18]
Paul testified –
“…(God) said, I have found David the son of Jesse, a man after my own heart, which shall fulfill all my will. Of THIS MAN'S SEED hath God according to his promise raised unto Isreael a saviour, Jesus. [Acts 13:22-23]“For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, THE MAN [anthrwpos] Christ Jesus;” ; which tells us that Jesus is functioning AS A MAN and MEDIATOR.
Luke testified –
“Ye men of Israel, hear these words; Jesus of Nazareth, A MAN approved of God among you by miracles and wonders and signs, which God did by him in the midst of you, as ye yourselves also know:” [Acts 2:22]Man cannot kill God!
“Him, being delivered by the determinate counsel
and foreknowledge of God, ye have taken, and by wicked hands have crucified and SLAIN: 24 Whom God hath raised up,” [Acts 2:23-24]
ADDENDUM
Jesus was a MAN in prophecy
Jesus was a MAN with a mission
Jesus is a MAN at God's right hand.
“Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever.” [Heb 13:8]Paladin said:
Quote What John said
“John 12:37 But though he had done so many miracles before them, yet they believed not on him: 38 That the saying of Esaias the prophet might be fulfilled which he spake, Lord, who hath believed our report? and to whom hath the arm of the Lord been revealed? 39 Therefore they could not believe, because that Esaias said again, 40 He hath blinded their eyes, and hardened their heart; that they should not see with their eyes, nor understand with their heart, and be converted, and I should heal them. 41 These things said Esaias, when he saw his glory, and spake of him.”First; I do not see “Adonay” anywhere in John's record.
Paladin,
You altogether ignored John's statement in verse 41,Quote These things Isaiah said when he saw HIS glory and spoke of HIM Isaiah saw Adonay's glory. John applied it to Jesus saying that Isaiah saw HIS glory and spoke of HIM.
Quote The whole discourse has respect to the Lord Jesus, and the natural construction of the passage requires us to refer it to Him. John affirms that it was the glory of the Messiah which Isaiah saw, and yet Isaiah affirms that it was Jehovah; and from this the inference is irrestible that John regarded Jesus as the Jehovah which Isaiah saw. (Barne's Notes p. 314)
Maybe you don't see for the same reasons the Jews did not see. God had judicially blinded them so that they could not see. I hope that you are not under such judgment and that you will come to see.Paladin said:
Quote Man cannot kill God!
“Him, being delivered by the determinate counsel and foreknowledge of God, ye have taken, and by wicked hands have crucified and SLAIN: 24 Whom God hath raised up,”Your view is thoroughly Gnostic and anti-Christian.
Quote Feed the church of God which He has purchased with His own blood (Acts 20:28) The text clearly says that God shed His OWN blood.
thinker
Paladin said:
Quote ADDENDUM
Jesus was a MAN in prophecy
Jesus was a MAN with a mission
Jesus is a MAN at God's right hand.
“Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever.” [Heb 13:8]Jesus was all these things and MUCH MORE. Hebrews 13:8 says that Jesus is unchangeable which is an attribute of God.
thinker
Quote (Paladin @ June 25 2009,08:28) Quote (Paladin @ June 25 2009,08:17) Quote (thethinker @ June 25 2009,03:19) Paladin said: Quote When two sit facing one another, they are BOTH at the other's right hand. Jehovah Adonay is at the right hand of resurrected Messiah, after the same fashion as the logos was “face to face” “with” God.
I am glad to see you publickly concede the issue.
Paladin,
I am trying to picture what you are saying but I find it difficult. You say that the right hand means face to face. Wouldn't “face to face” imply that they are in front of the other? And wouldn't “face to face” also imply a relationship that is equal? Besides, verses 6-7 clearly say that Adonay will judge the nations. We know that it is the Messiah who does the judging.Let's not forget the account of Isaiah's vision of Adonay's glory (chap 6),
Quote In the year that king Uzziah died, I saw Adonay sitting on a throne, high and lifted up, and the train of His robe filled the temple. Above it stood the seraphim; each one had six wings; with two he covered his face, with two he covered his feet, and with two he flew. And one cried to another and said: “Holy, holy, holy is the LORD of Hosts; the whole land is filled with His glory (Isaiah 6:1-3)
You can take the Apostle John's word for it that Isaiah had seen the glory of Jesus,
Quote Though He had done so many signs before them, they did not believe in Him, that the word of Isaiah the prophet might be fulfilled which he spoke: “Lord, who has believed our report? And to whom has the arm of the Lord been revealed.”
Therefore, they could not believe, because Isaiah said again:
“He has blinded their minds and hardened their hearts, lest they should see with their eyes, lest they should understand with their hearts and turn, so that I should heal them….” These things Isaiah said when he saw His (Christ's) glory and spoke of Him (Jesus) John 12:37-41.
John clearly said that Isaiah had seen the glory of Jesus whom he called “Adonay.”
Have you heard the saying “There is virtue in brevity?” Please keep your reply brief. There is no need for a lengthy dissertation.
thanks,
thinkerQuote
John clearly said that Isaiah had seen the glory of Jesus whom he called “Adonay.”What John said
“John 12:37 But though he had done so many miracles before them, yet they believed not on him: 38 That the saying of Esaias the prophet might be fulfilled which he spake, Lord, who hath believed our report? and to whom hath the arm of the Lord been revealed? 39 Therefore they could not believe, because that Esaias said again, 40 He hath blinded their eyes, and hardened their heart; that they should not see with their eyes, nor understand with their heart, and be converted, and I should heal them. 41 These things said Esaias, when he saw his glory, and spake of him.”First; I do not see “Adonay” anywhere in John's record.
Second, “Isaiah saw,” is a reference to what Isaiah FORESAW as a prophet. And what did Isaiah foresee?
Phil 2:9 Wherefore God also hath highly exalted him, and given him a name which is above every name: 10 That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth; 11 And that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.
Isa 52:13 Behold, my servant shall deal prudently, HE SHALL BE EXALTED AND EXTOLLED AND BE VERY HIGH.
Third: God is not, repeat NOT God's servant. God's servant is a man who suffers AS A MAN, dies AS A MAN, and is raised AS A MAN.
El Jehovah [Isa 42:5] God testified –
that one maiden of Israel was to bear a child, and that the child's name is to be called Immanuel; which means El is with us. So Immanuel is a son of el named Jehovah.BUT, Jehovah tells us that none of the sons of ANY El, is equal with the El named Jehovah;
“For who in the heaven can be compared unto Jehovah (the LORD)? who among the sons of El'm (the mighty) can be likened unto Jehovah (the LORD)?” [Psa 89:6]Isa 40:25 “To whom then will ye liken me, or shall I be equal? saith the Holy One.”
and
46:5 “To whom will ye liken me, and make me equal, and compare me, that we may be like?”
both indicate God's opinion as to the “equality with God” issue.
Prophecy testified –
Messiah Jesus is the seed of the woman of [Gen 3:15];
seed of Abraham[Gen 12:1-3][Gal 3:16]:
seed of Isaac[Gen 26:4];
seed of Jacob[Gen 28:14];
seed of Jesse[Isa 11:10][Rom 15:12];
seed of David[Psa 132:11][Jer 23:5-6];
seed of Mary[Gen 3:15].Zechariah testified –
“…Behold THE MAN whose name is the Branch…” [Zech 6:12]“Awake o sword against my shepherd, and against the MAN that is my fellow…”[Zech 13:7]
David testified –
Messiah was prophecied to be a MAN at God's right hand; “Let thy hand be upon THE MAN of thy right hand, upon the son of man whom thou madest strong for thyself.” [Psa 80:17]“Yea, mine own familiar friend, in whom I trusted, which did eat of my bread, hath lifted up his heel against me.” [Psa 41:9]
AND “A MAN MINE EQUAL;” “For it was not an enemy that reproached me; then I could have borne it: neither was it he that hated me that did magnify himself against me; then I would have hid myself from him: 13 But it was thou, A MAN MINE EQUAL, my guide, and mine acquaintance. 14 We took sweet counsel together, and walked unto the house of God in company.” [Psa 55:12-14]
Isaiah testified –
“He is despised and rejected of men; A MAN of sorrows, and acquainted with grief:…” [Isaiah 53:3]Jesus testified –
“But now ye seek to kill me, A MAN what hath told you the truth…”[John 8:40]Moses testified –
“The Lord God will raise up unto thee a prophet from the midst of thee, of thy brethren…”[Deu 18:15]“I will raise them up a prophet FROM AMONG THEIR BRETHREN” [Deu 18:18]
Paul testified –
“…(God) said, I have found David the son of Jesse, a man after my own heart, which shall fulfill all my will. Of THIS MAN'S SEED hath God according to his promise raised unto Isreael a saviour, Jesus. [Acts 13:22-23]“For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, THE MAN [anthrwpos] Christ Jesus;” ; which tells us that Jesus is functioning AS A MAN and MEDIATOR.
Luke testified –
“Ye men of Israel, hear these words; Jesus of Nazareth, A MAN approved
of God among you by miracles and wonders and signs, which God did by him in the midst of you, as ye yourselves also know:” [Acts 2:22]Man cannot kill God!
“Him, being delivered by the determinate counsel and foreknowledge of God, ye have taken, and by wicked hands have crucified and SLAIN: 24 Whom God hath raised up,” [Acts 2:23-24]
ADDENDUM
Jesus was a MAN in prophecy
Jesus was a MAN with a mission
Jesus is a MAN at God's right hand.
“Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever.” [Heb 13:8]
Jesus is a man sitting next to God the Father on His Throne?
I do not think so.
John 17:5 tells us:” And now O Father glorify Me together with Yourself with the glory I had with You before the World was.”
What do you think that glory was? He was a Spirit being. That is what He was before He came to earth to save us from eternal death. Hod be with you.
Peace and Love Irene
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