Moses attains atonement without blood

Participant

Quote (SimplyForgiven @ Oct. 05 2010,01:57)

Quote

Hi SF,

Why can't you tell me?

When you wanted me to explain what you didn't understand,
I didn't respond “pray about it”; why are you dogging me?

Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

There, there Ed J,

I said it has something to do with spiritual deceit right?
well I cant really explain it, because if you cant understand the “Spiritual” than it cant be explained in the wisdom of man.
So when you pray and you get connected to God, than you can understand the Spiritual.
So dont take it as “brush off” but the wisest counsel you can seek is always in God, espeacially about the spiritual.

1 Corinthians 2:10 But God hath revealed them unto us by his Spirit: for the Spirit searcheth all things, yea, the deep things of God.
11For what man knoweth the things of a man, save the spirit of man which is in him? even so the things of God knoweth no man, but the Spirit of God.
12Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the spirit which is of God; that we might know the things that are freely given to us of God.
13Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual.
14But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

Hi SF,

I was referring to how BD does not believe the Apostle Paul's words are Canon,
yet he at the same time agrees that they are; is that not deceitful?

Then you said …

Quote

And thats all you saw? The Deceit is in the spirit

I then asked you to explain what you meant by this comment,
are you saying you cannot? Are you trying to judge me as being not spiritual?
You know your going to have to give an account for everything you did and said in this life.

Again I ask you: Please explain what you mean? Quit dogging me!
Your doing far worse than just brushing me off! You are treating me differently than I treated you!

Matt.7:2 For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged:
and with what measure ye(Ed J) mete, it shall be measured to you(Ed J) again.

How can you claim that you are spiritually enlightened by God AND NOT DO THE THINGS JESUS SAID?
John 14:15 If ye(SimplyForgiven) love me(Jesus), keep my commandments. Do you really love Jesus?

Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

October 5, 2010 at 1:09 am#218730

Participant

Quote (Ed J @ Oct. 05 2010,01:14)

Quote (SimplyForgiven @ Oct. 05 2010,01:57)

Quote

Hi SF,

Why can't you tell me?

When you wanted me to explain what you didn't understand,
I didn't respond “pray about it”; why are you dogging me?

Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

There, there Ed J,

Hi SF,

I was referring to how BD does not believe the Apostle Paul's words are Canon,
yet he at the same time agrees that they are; is that not deceitful?

Then you said …

Quote

And thats all you saw? The Deceit is in the spirit

Again I ask you: Please explain what you mean? Quit dogging me!
Your doing far worse than just brushing me off! You are treating me differently than I treated you!

Matt.7:2 For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged:
and with what measure ye(Ed J) mete, it shall be measured to you(Ed J) again.

How can you claim that you are spiritually enlightened by God AND NOT DO THE THINGS JESUS SAID?
John 14:15 If ye(SimplyForgiven) love me(Jesus), keep my commandments. Do you really love Jesus?

Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

actually your getting to sensitive over what I said,
I never made the claim that you werent spiritual.
im at work ill say more later

October 5, 2010 at 9:30 am#218818

Participant

Hi SF,

I see you're back.
Still waiting for your explanation.

God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

October 5, 2010 at 9:36 am#218822

Participant

Quote (Ed J @ Oct. 05 2010,14:30)

Hi SF,

I see you're back.
Still waiting for your explanation.

God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

Again Ed J,
Your getting to defensive, i never said your were not spiritual.

Your getting to sensitive over a simple comment i made,
it you didnt get it, than you didnt get it.

October 5, 2010 at 10:03 am#218827

Participant

Hi SF,

Were you lying when you said this?

'im at work ill say more later'.

Exodus 20:16 Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbor.

Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

October 5, 2010 at 10:06 am#218828

Participant

Quote (Ed J @ Oct. 05 2010,15:03)

Hi SF,

Were you lying when you said this?

'im at work ill say more later'.

Exodus 20:16 Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbor.

Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

Oh so your calling me a liar?
…………hmmm what happen about the judging thing you mention to JA?

your becoming quite defensive and Judgemental, dont fall into what Terrarica and Irene aleardy have fallen into.

October 5, 2010 at 1:29 pm#218837

Participant

Quote (SimplyForgiven @ Oct. 05 2010,21:06)

Quote (Ed J @ Oct. 05 2010,15:03)

Hi SF,

Were you lying when you said this?

'im at work ill say more later'.

Exodus 20:16 Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbor.

Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

Oh so your calling me a liar?
…………hmmm what happen about the judging thing you mention to JA?

your becoming quite defensive and Judgemental, dont fall into what Terrarica and Irene aleardy have fallen into.

Hi SF,

Why are you accusing me of accusing you?
Especially after you answered my question sufficiently by PM?
What if you wouldn't of said more later, what would you call it? Telling the truth?

God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

October 5, 2010 at 1:39 pm#218838

Participant

Quote (Ed J @ Oct. 06 2010,00:29)

Quote (SimplyForgiven @ Oct. 05 2010,21:06)

Quote (Ed J @ Oct. 05 2010,15:03)

Hi SF,

Were you lying when you said this?

'im at work ill say more later'.

Exodus 20:16 Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbor.

Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

Oh so your calling me a liar?
…………hmmm what happen about the judging thing you mention to JA?

your becoming quite defensive and Judgemental, dont fall into what Terrarica and Irene aleardy have fallen into.

Hi SF,

Why are you accusing me of accusing you?
Especially after you answered my question sufficiently by PM?
What if you wouldn't of said more later, what would you call it? Telling the truth?

God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

Hi SF,

After you caused me to believe you were going to answer my question later after work,
what would you call only saying more excuses later? Honesty? Truthfulness?
OK; now we can drop it for Good! …No harm, no foul my friend!

God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

October 5, 2010 at 6:18 pm#218869

Participant

“Let the wicked forsake his way and the unrighteous man his thoughts: and let him return unto the Lord, and he will have mercy upon him; and to our God, for he will abundantly pardon” (Isa. lv. 7).

You ae very passionate but that doesn't make you right but it is simply how “you” understand GOD/ALLAH and yes they are One and the Same.

You said that Jesus is Judge and it does say that in the scriptures but Jesus also says:

Ye judge after the flesh; I judge no man.
John 8:14-16

There is a progression of understanding and you simply are at one point and I'm at another. If what I am saying here is untrue then why do you suppose Paul said:

I have fed you with milk, and not with meat: for hitherto ye were not able to bear it, neither yet now are ye able.
1 Corinthians 3:1-3

So you are not ready yet

For when for the time ye ought to be teachers, ye have need that one teach you again which be the first principles of the oracles of God; and are become such as have need of milk, and not of strong meat.
Hebrews 5:11-13

Do you know what Paul is saying when he says “the first principles of the oracles of God” means?

Now, you have this tendency to call people liars when you don't understand them and you were reprved for it by being called a liar yourself of course not by me because I already understand that you are at a certain point and I am not trying to condemn where you are but only sharing with you as much as you can stomach because it's strong meat.

The title of this topic and its original post stated that there is atonement without blood and that was proven and don't you agree with that if you say God loved us first? You said that “This Cup” was the wrath of God and I said that Jesus asked to be saved from the cross, you said no he was asking to be saved from the wrath of God?

Whatever the cup was Jesus asked that it be taken from him and I'm saying that God did what Jesus asked.

You assume that what I'm saying is incorrect and that's okay I didn't always understand it this way either

As Far as Paul is concerned he did a wonderful thing converting people by all means

To the weak became I as weak, that I might gain the weak: I am made all things to all men, that I might by all means save some.
1 Corinthians 9:21-23

and this was “his” understanding of God but you can't see all of this now

For if the truth of God hath more abounded through my lie unto his glory; why yet am I also judged as a sinner?
Romans 3:6-8

What was Paul lying about or why did he use guile? I won't be hard on you nor expect you to understand all that I am saying
you can assume what you want about Islam but I know it's because you are simply not there yet.

And in them is fulfilled the prophecy of Esaias, which saith, By hearing ye shall hear, and shall not understand; and seeing ye shall see, and shall not perceive:
Matthew 13:13-15

why is this same quote also in Acts after Christ was “killed and ressurrected”?

Saying, Go unto this people, and say, Hearing ye shall hear, and shall not understand; and seeing ye shall see, and not perceive:
Acts 28:25-27

so keep studying

As newborn babes, desire the sincere milk of the word, that ye may grow thereby:
1 Peter 2:1-3

If there is no progression in what way would you grow in understanding? right now you seem to be saying that you understand how God operates

For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways, and my thoughts than your thoughts.
Isaiah 55:8-10

for instance you made mention about me not being concerned with the lifestyle of Muhammad but you did so because you assume that
God wouldn't approve of it. You ignore the lifestyle of Moses because they were very similar both brought law, had more than one wife and killed
men. You don't approve, but you are not God. You still believe that the ten commandments and the laws of the Jews were meant for all of mankind but they never were they were for the community of the children of Israel and hence “thou shall not kill” is written at the same time much killing and bloodshed is being done but you never understood that when God ordered the Killing of those against the Israelites “Thou shall not kill” did not apply it was a community command.

When you think on one level sometimes other levels don't make sense just like in math but the basics will do fine Love God, Love your neighbor and your neighbor can be a Muslim just ask Jesus:

Luke 10:29-37 (King James Version)

29But he, willing to justify himself, said unto Jesus, And who is my neighbour?

30And Jesus answering said, A certain man went down from Jerusalem to Jericho, and fell among thieves, which stripped him of his raiment, and wounded him, and departed, leaving him half dead.

31And by chance there came down a certain priest that way: and when he saw him, he passed by on the other side.

32And likewise a Levite, when he was at the place, came and looked on him, and passed by on the other side.

33But a certain Samaritan, as he journeyed, came where he was: and when he saw him, he had compassion on him,

34And went to him, and bound up his wounds, pouring in oil and wine, and set him on his own beast, and brought him to an inn, and took care of him.

35And on the morrow when he departed, he took out two pence, and gave them to the host, and said unto him, Take care of him; and whatsoever thou spendest more, when I come again, I will repay thee.

36Which now of these three, thinkest thou, was neighbour unto him that fell among the thieves?

37And he said, He that shewed mercy on him. Then said Jesus unto him, Go, and do thou likewise.

You see, your ego is trying to justify your understanding of God so much so that you will judge what you need not judge.

I have said to you over and over that God has made man upright and you keep condemning man because you feel condemned (but redeemed)
I keep saying that God is merciful and Compassionate with or without Jesus and you keep saying that God can only be Merciful and Compassionate through Jesus.
I keep saying that God has ALWAYS been Merciful and Compassionate

Let the wicked forsake his way, and the unrighteous man his thoughts: and let him return unto the LORD, and he will have mercy upon him; and to our God, for he will abundantly pardon.
Isaiah 55:6-8

This is what you do not get, Man does in-fact have the ability to be upright and always has and you do believe in some things that are non-biblical such as “evil genetics” calling seths line superior to cain's but how could that even be when you stated “all have fallen short” seth and cain still came out of Adam but you need to “Invent” to account for some things

Lo, this only have I found, that God hath made man upright; but they have sought out many inventions.
Ecclesiastes 7:28-29

But how have you treated me?

I am as one mocked of his neighbour, who calleth upon God, and he answereth him: the just upright man is laughed to scorn.
Job 12:3-5

I understand you think your approach to me is the right one but it is underdeveloped so to chastise you might be pointless. I am on vacation right now but I decided to check in and I'm glad I did, it was good to communicate with you again after today I will most likely(God willing) be posting when I get back home on Friday afternoon/night

October 5, 2010 at 6:30 pm#218870

Participant

Quote (Ed J @ Oct. 06 2010,00:29)

Quote (SimplyForgiven @ Oct. 05 2010,21:06)

Quote (Ed J @ Oct. 05 2010,15:03)

Hi SF,

Were you lying when you said this?

'im at work ill say more later'.

Exodus 20:16 Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbor.

Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

Oh so your calling me a liar?
…………hmmm what happen about the judging thing you mention to JA?

your becoming quite defensive and Judgemental, dont fall into what Terrarica and Irene aleardy have fallen into.

Hi SF,

Why are you accusing me of accusing you?
Especially after you answered my question sufficiently by PM?
What if you wouldn't of said more later, what would you call it? Telling the truth?

God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

And I heard a loud voice saying in heaven, Now is come salvation, and strength, and the kingdom of our God, and the power of his Christ: for the accuser of our brethren is cast down, which accused them before our God day and night.
Revelation 12:9-11

October 5, 2010 at 7:03 pm#218872

Participant

Quote (SimplyForgiven @ Oct. 03 2010,19:10)

Quote (shimmer @ Sep. 30 2010,14:32)

Hi SF, is bod behaving down here ? I hope so,

This has nothing to do with behaving but with Truth and Revelation, and as the Light shines, the darkness will fade away.
The LIES end Here

You are right the LIES should end here but who is lying?

You said ALL glory to GOD but then you denied GOD's SAVING POWER attaching salvation only through Christ.

ALL GLORY to GOD! Christ is not GOD but you give him equal Glory in-fact you give Christ greater glory than God saying that GOD CANNOT SAVE anyone without Christ.

THIS iS A LIE, for Christ came so that you might believe in the ONE THAT SENT him.

Behold, the LORD's hand is not shortened, that it cannot save; neither his ear heavy, that it cannot hear:
Isaiah 59:1-3

Jesus answered them, and said, My doctrine is not mine, but his that sent me.
John 7:15-17

I have many things to say and to judge of you: but he that sent me is true; and I speak to the world those things which I have heard of him.
John 8:25-27

Jesus cried and said, He that believeth on me, believeth not on me, but on him that sent me.
John 12:43-45

And this was not exclusive to Jesus, how can you say such a thing? Those who believed in Moses believed in God because God sent him. Those who believed that Elijah was sent from God and believed in Elijah believed in God. You seem to understand this to only be the case with Jesus and you are mistaken.

Once again you call Muhammad a false prophet because of what reason?

Because what's in the Quran pertaining to Christ was not revealed until 600 years later?

Now to him that is of power to stablish you according to my gospel, and the preaching of Jesus Christ, according to the revelation of the mystery, which was kept secret since the world began,
Romans 16:24-26

But 600 years is too long?

Ephesians 3:2-6 (King James Version)

2If ye have heard of the dispensation of the grace of God which is given me to you-ward:

3How that by revelation he made known unto me the mystery; (as I wrote afore in few words,

4Whereby, when ye read, ye may understand my knowledge in the mystery of Christ)

5Which in other ages was not made known unto the sons of men, as it is now revealed unto his holy apostles and prophets by the Spirit;

6That the Gentiles should be fellowheirs, and of the same body, and partakers of his promise in Christ by the gospel:

But you say there can be no other Mystery revealed?

But in the days of the voice of the seventh angel, when he shall begin to sound, the mystery of God should be finished, as he hath declared to his servants the prophets.
Revelation 10:6-8

Yet, you say you know but the truth is you do not. So what gives you the courage to call someone a liar?

Here is a mental and spiritual exercise for you:

One of themselves, even a prophet of their own, said, the Cretians are alway liars, evil beasts, slow bellies.
Titus 1:11-13

The next sentence says “This witness is true” but if that witness is true and a prophet of theirs(A fellow cretian) told the truth then the statement itself is false because All cretians would not be liars unless he would be lying about them always being liars which would also make it false that they are always liars.

I would love to hear your response to that paradox it may teach you alot about yourself.

October 5, 2010 at 7:56 pm#218882

Participant

Quote (Ed J @ Oct. 05 2010,18:29)

Quote (SimplyForgiven @ Oct. 05 2010,21:06)

Quote (Ed J @ Oct. 05 2010,15:03)

Hi SF,

Were you lying when you said this?

'im at work ill say more later'.

Exodus 20:16 Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbor.

Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

Oh so your calling me a liar?
…………hmmm what happen about the judging thing you mention to JA?

your becoming quite defensive and Judgemental, dont fall into what Terrarica and Irene aleardy have fallen into.

Hi SF,

Why are you accusing me of accusing you?
Especially after you answered my question sufficiently by PM?
What if you wouldn't of said more later, what would you call it? Telling the truth?

God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

Dude, you posted a scripture saying i should bear false witness?

what am I suppose to think?

now that we cleared up the misunderstanding Drop IT

October 5, 2010 at 7:57 pm#218883

Participant

Quote (Ed J @ Oct. 05 2010,18:39)

Quote (Ed J @ Oct. 06 2010,00:29)

Quote (SimplyForgiven @ Oct. 05 2010,21:06)

Quote (Ed J @ Oct. 05 2010,15:03)

Hi SF,

Were you lying when you said this?

'im at work ill say more later'.

Exodus 20:16 Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbor.

Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

Oh so your calling me a liar?
…………hmmm what happen about the judging thing you mention to JA?

your becoming quite defensive and Judgemental, dont fall into what Terrarica and Irene aleardy have fallen into.

Hi SF,

Why are you accusing me of accusing you?
Especially after you answered my question sufficiently by PM?
What if you wouldn't of said more later, what would you call it? Telling the truth?

God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

Hi SF,

God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

I never said i was going to make your questions my proirty for the day,

in other words i was going to eventually answer it when i got the time.

not directly when i clocked out of work.

but later in what time I see fit.

And by the way if you see the believers section was very very busy. and the two new threads i posted took me hours to fix.

October 5, 2010 at 7:59 pm#218885

Participant

Ok Bod,
Which post is in response to the last Post i made to you?
1 or 2nd?

October 5, 2010 at 9:48 pm#218912

Participant

and by the way Bod,
Just consider that it took me 3 hours to write that super long post to you,
and i dont think its fair that you responded with an un-organized posts that are without my quotes.

so if you have the option to edit, and respond accordingly
or just copy and paste and add my quotes and to what your responding too.

Thank you,

October 6, 2010 at 6:11 pm#218983

Participant

Quote (SimplyForgiven @ Oct. 06 2010,08:48)

and by the way Bod,
Just consider that it took me 3 hours to write that super long post to you,
and i dont think its fair that you responded with an un-organized posts that are without my quotes.

so if you have the option to edit, and respond accordingly
or just copy and paste and add my quotes and to what your responding too.

Thank you,

Why did you write a super long post I think we should be much more clear and distinct as much gets lost in the lengthy tit for tat and it's mostly unneccesary.

You spend way too much time trying to defend instead of paying attention to what's actually being said. We both have made the statement that ALL Glory is due to GOD/ALLAH and yet you keep insisting that we disagree on that point.

The only point we actually diagree on is. I believe that ALL glory is due to GOD and that GOD can save or not save whomever HE wants and you believe that God can only save those who believe in Christ as their saviour.

In other words I give ALL GLORY to GOD and you give partial GLORY to GOD or at least that is what I am understanding you to be saying.

Now, do you believe that Jesus is GOD? Yes or No

October 7, 2010 at 4:51 am#219013

Participant

Quote (bodhitharta @ Oct. 06 2010,23:11)

Quote (SimplyForgiven @ Oct. 06 2010,08:48)

and by the way Bod,
Just consider that it took me 3 hours to write that super long post to you,
and i dont think its fair that you responded with an un-organized posts that are without my quotes.

so if you have the option to edit, and respond accordingly
or just copy and paste and add my quotes and to what your responding too.

Thank you,

Why did you write a super long post I think we should be much more clear and distinct as much gets lost in the lengthy tit for tat and it's mostly unneccesary.

In other words I give ALL GLORY to GOD and you give partial GLORY to GOD or at least that is what I am understanding you to be saying.

Now, do you believe that Jesus is GOD? Yes or No

You see bod….. this is always what happens with you when your against the ropes.

I made a post in reponse to every single cliam you made.
this would be the Third time that you do this to me.

You make points and than abandon them.

No i spend way to much attacking your faulty ideas.

You clearly dont understand what is being said, Beileving is not the subject, its Christ knowing you, which is the big difference.

Whether Jesus is God or not is off topic!

either answer my post that i worked hard on or just drop it.

This is very cowardly of you

October 7, 2010 at 4:38 pm#219038

Participant

Quote (SimplyForgiven @ Oct. 07 2010,15:51)

Quote (bodhitharta @ Oct. 06 2010,23:11)

Quote (SimplyForgiven @ Oct. 06 2010,08:48)

and by the way Bod,
Just consider that it took me 3 hours to write that super long post to you,
and i dont think its fair that you responded with an un-organized posts that are without my quotes.

so if you have the option to edit, and respond accordingly
or just copy and paste and add my quotes and to what your responding too.

Thank you,

Why did you write a super long post I think we should be much more clear and distinct as much gets lost in the lengthy tit for tat and it's mostly unneccesary.

In other words I give ALL GLORY to GOD and you give partial GLORY to GOD or at least that is what I am understanding you to be saying.

Now, do you believe that Jesus is GOD? Yes or No

You see bod….. this is always what happens with you when your against the ropes.

I made a post in reponse to every single cliam you made.
this would be the Third time that you do this to me.

You make points and than abandon them.

No i spend way to much attacking your faulty ideas.

You clearly dont understand what is being said, Beileving is not the subject, its Christ knowing you, which is the big difference.

Whether Jesus is God or not is off topic!

either answer my post that i worked hard on or just drop it.

This is very cowardly of you

Quote

You see bod….. this is always what happens with you when your against the ropes.

Against the ropes? You are the one who decided that clarity was not in your best interest

Quote

I made a post in reponse to every single cliam you made.
this would be the Third time that you do this to me.

you were muddying up the waters too much so my point was to get you back on a clear subject

Quote

You make points and than abandon them.

No, I make points and you disregard them assuming yourself to be correct without even understanding my point

Quote

No i spend way to much attacking your faulty ideas.

Why would you attack a faulty idea? If an idea is faulty all you have to do is show its flaw by asserting the truth, there is no need to attack at all.

Let there be no compulsion in religion: truth stands out clear from error: whoever rejects evil and believes in Allah hath grasped the most trustworthy hand-hold, that never breaks. And Allah heareth and knoweth all things.
( سورة البقرة , Al-Baqara, Chapter #2, Verse #256)

Such is Allah, your real Cherisher and Sustainer: apart from truth, what (remains) but error? How then are ye turned away?
( سورة يونس , Yunus, Chapter #10, Verse #32)

Quote

You clearly dont understand what is being said, Beileving is not the subject, its Christ knowing you, which is the big difference.

Keep in mind that I started this thread so that would make me the author of the subject which is how God does not need anyones blood for atonement(that includes the blood of Jesus Christ)

Quote

Whether Jesus is God or not is off topic!

Actually it is not off topic since you direct and assign glory to Christ in such a way that if you do not see him as God then you are not putting God first and if you see him as God you are not putting God first.

Quote

either answer my post that i worked hard on or just drop it.

I will answer your post because you really worked hard on it and you are a babe in Christ

Quote

This is very cowardly of you

God Bless you

October 7, 2010 at 6:24 pm#219039

Participant

Quote (SimplyForgiven @ Oct. 03 2010,18:48)

The time is 9:42 am October 7th in my part of the world

Quote

You can claim confidence, but that not truely where your heart lies because if so, than you would understand.

I still remain confident

Quote

Christ is Perfect, the Second Adam, the King of Kings, the Lord of Lords, he is THE Son of God, and He has a name above every name. Blameless, Sinless, Clean, and was willing to be randsom so that many maybe saved.
This isnt just someone better, but someone that even David himself calls “his Lord”

This argument is not about whom God chose to be HIS Christ but with all that you said above it just shows that you prefer one person over another in regard to who God chooses but God is not a respector of persons and Christ said that we should all be one in purpose and belief.

If Allah helps you, none can overcome you: If He forsakes you, who is there, after that, that can help you? in Allah, then, Let believers put their trust.
( سورة آل عمران , Aal-e-Imran, Chapter #3, Verse #160)

Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
Matthew 7:20-22

For whosoever shall do the will of my Father which is in heaven, the same is my brother, and sister, and mother.
Matthew 12:49-50

So Jesus is not your God and you should worship God as Jesus does and attribute all saving power and grace to God Almighty

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I did correct you, You want to make him(David) seem blameless in righteousness, when the truth is there is nothing righteous outside the will of God.

Jesus once said “Not my will but yours” so are you saying that Jesus was being unrighteous asking that “let this cup be taken away from me”? I say one strives to be in the will of God as Jesus did:

Though he were a Son, yet learned he obedience by the things which he suffered;
Hebrews 5:7-9

Who in the days of his flesh, when he had offered up prayers and supplications with strong crying and tears unto him that was able to save him from death, and was heard in that he feared;
Hebrews 5:6-8

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So the fact that your imperfect and flawed makes us unclean, and that no matter how much we try within our own Strength we can never work towards perfection and please God.

By faith Enoch was translated that he should not see death; and was not found, because God had translated him: for before his translation he had this testimony, that he pleased God.
Hebrews 11:4-6

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Our BEST works are filthy rags for God, so only through him can we please him. And the only way TOO him, is THROUGH Jesus. Yes God has his mercy for whom he wills.

I just showed you that it is Faith that pleases God. and it is said:

But without faith it is impossible to please him: for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him.
Hebrews 11:5-7

Did you see anything about Jesus in the above verse? DILIGENTLY SEEK “HIM”

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Therefore, David is one of us, we are nothign more, or less. We are all on the same boat, because God is not the God focused on a group or nation, but his focus is in the soul of the individual “Adam” Man.

Isn't Jesus one of us as well?

Hebrews 2:17-18 (King James Version)

17Wherefore in all things it behoved him to be made like unto his brethren, that he might be a merciful and faithful high priest in things pertaining to God, to make reconciliation for the sins of the people.

18For in that he himself hath suffered being tempted, he is able to succour them that are tempted.

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Actually he will Inherit alot more than that Collossians 1:19 expresses that it pleased the Father that ALL fullness dwells in Him. He is the Son of God, he will have Kingdom of Heaven, he Is the one who all life sustains it self by, and HE is the one, the only way, the only Truth, and the only Light for man to reach God.

Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is.
1 John 3:1-3

It is God that sustains life as I said but you keep acting as though Jesus did not receive whatever he will receive from God he had no power to get it himself.

Then said Jesus unto them, When ye have lifted up the Son of man, then shall ye know that I am he, and that I do nothing of myself; but as my Father hath taught me, I speak these things.
John 8:27-29

Regarding the light of God:

Allah is the Light of the heavens and the earth. The Parable of His Light is as if there were a niche and within it a Lamp: the Lamp enclosed in Glass: the glass as it were a brilliant star: Lit from a blessed Tree, an Olive, neither of the east nor of the west, whose oil is well-nigh luminous, though fire scarce touched it: Light upon Light! Allah doth guide whom He will to His Light: Allah doth set forth Parables for men: and Allah doth know all things.
( سورة النور , An-Noor, Chapter #24, Verse #35)

Do you understand? Light upon Light! Amen!

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The fact is that You dont Get it Bod, GOD LOVES US IMMENSELY TO SEND HIS ONLY BEGOTTEN SON SO WHOMEVER BELIEVES IN HIM DOES NOT PERISH BUT HAS EVERLASTING LIFE!

That's wonderful! That's not the issue though you want to believe that God cannot deliver people in any way he sees fit, through Jesus through Moses, through Muhammad…or even through any person of any faith DILIGENTLY SEEKING HIM. If none of the prophets or Christ ever existed and someone DILIGENTLY SEEKED GOD what would happen?

Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you:
Matthew 7:6-8

Luke 11:7-10 (King James Version)

7And he from within shall answer and say, Trouble me not: the door is now shut, and my children are with me in bed; I cannot ri
se and give thee.

8I say unto you, Though he will not rise and give him, because he is his friend, yet because of his importunity he will rise and give him as many as he needeth.

9And I say unto you, Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you.

10For every one that asketh receiveth; and he that seeketh findeth; and to him that knocketh it shall be opened.

So this is how you see it, that somehow the Kingdom of Heaven can be shut up or given to only those you deem worthy but it is always open to the DILIGENT SEEKER of GOD and has always been available.

But woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye shut up the kingdom of heaven against men: for ye neither go in yourselves, neither suffer ye them that are entering to go in.
Matthew 23:12-14

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Bod, notice this is a time without the Gospel of Jesus, If David who is ONE Man, ONLY ONE, out of how many in that time? Him and the Prophet, think about two people out of HOW MANY? Do you think God was satisfied that only TWO people were In love, and after the very heart of God?
of course not!
This is why he paved a rode that once was impossible for any man to cross.

The Road is Jesus.

You have never shown me where it was not possible but I have already shown you that there have always been DILIGENT SEEKERS of GOD and they were REWARDED by GOD.

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More lies,
John 14:6Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.
This is a general statment, even though it directed towards Thomas, the Statment is clear that NO man can approach the Father without Jesus.
This has nothing to do with Moses, the only time he was ever mediator was for a moment in the moutain when Gods presence came down where EVEN MOSES could not see the face of God.

And the LORD spake unto Moses face to face, as a man speaketh unto his friend. And he turned again into the camp: but his servant Joshua, the son of Nun, a young man, departed not out of the tabernacle.
Exodus 33:10-12

And you seem to keep disregarding Moses feeling the need to lessen him

With him will I speak mouth to mouth, even apparently, and not in dark speeches; and the similitude of the LORD shall he behold: wherefore then were ye not afraid to speak against my servant Moses?
Numbers 12:7-9

Say: “We believe in Allah, and in what has been revealed to us and what was revealed to Abraham, Isma'il, Isaac, Jacob, and the Tribes, and in (the Books) given to Moses, Jesus, and the prophets, from their Lord: We make no distinction between one and another among them, and to Allah do we bow our will (in Islam).”
( سورة آل عمران , Aal-e-Imran, Chapter #3, Verse #84)

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But Jesus is the one who DWELLS in God.
1 Timothy 6:16Who only hath immortality, dwelling in the light which no man can approach unto; whom no man hath seen, nor can see: to whom be honour and power everlasting. Amen.

So did Moses see God face to face like the scriptures say? or did moses not see God face to face as the scriptures say? Let's find out

Those apostles We endowed with gifts, some above others: To one of them Allah spoke; others He raised to degrees (of honour); to Jesus the son of Mary We gave clear (Signs), and strengthened him with the holy spirit. If Allah had so willed, succeeding generations would not have fought among each other, after clear (Signs) had come to them, but they (chose) to wrangle, some believing and others rejecting. If Allah had so willed, they would not have fought each other; but Allah Fulfilleth His plan.
( سورة البقرة , Al-Baqara, Chapter #2, Verse #253)

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ALL Man has no access to Know God, but only through Jesus we Can.

Then what was the purpose of all the other prophets?

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Actually I do, This is not bearing false witness, this is the Truth, and a Truth that i know hurts you because it destroys your image, who you are, and everything that involves your lifestyle and those you love.
This is a Fact that Mohammed is a flase prophet, he lied to you and many people.
If YOU believe In Mohammed who made cliams 600 years after the Ressurection of Christ, than you have been fooled.

You still have not shown that Muhammad is a false prophet and you will not be able to.

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Here is where your clearly Wrong, I know God, and because I know Him, I regonize whats not from Him.
You said that You didnt care about Mohammed lifestyle, which proves alot about his character.

Gods ways are higher than yours and your thoughts are not HIS thoughts. I said Muhammads lifestyle doesn't concern me nor does the lifestyle of Moses or Jesus they were chosen by God who am I to judge their lifestyle? And you have not shown me anything about the lifestyle of Muhammad that would prove anything anyway. Your own opinions are not what right and wrong are based on.

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He made a counterfeit book, that required you to read the orginal so that you can gain the interpretation of God, this is a great Deceiver.

??? Out of this entire post I would like you to clarify that one thing, would you do that please?

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Ask God about Mohammed, and if your ready to listen, he will Convict you, and it will destroy your life because your imprisoned, and your a captive, your a slave of the deciever.

They say: “O thou to whom the Message is being revealed! truly thou art mad (or possessed)!
( سورة الحجر , Al-Hijr, Chapter #15, Verse #6)

but what does the scripture say?

Sura #68

1 Nun. By the Pen and the (Record) which (men) write,-
2 Thou art not, by the Grace of thy Lord, mad or possessed.
3 Nay, verily for thee is a Reward unfailing:
4 And thou (standest) on an exalted standard of character.
5 Soon wilt thou see, and they will see,
6 Which of you is afflicted with madness.
7 Verily it is thy Lord that knoweth best, whic
h (among men) hath strayed from His Path: and He knoweth best those who receive (true) Guidance.
8 So hearken not to those who deny (the Truth).

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But there is One that will set you Free, and its not the Jesus of the Quran, its the Jesus who Died and Ressurected that can set you Free,
John 8:32
And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.

There is only one Jesus who is Christ

christ disdaineth nor to serve and worship Allah, nor do the angels, those nearest (to Allah.: those who disdain His worship and are arrogant,-He will gather them all together unto Himself to (answer).
( سورة النساء , An-Nisa, Chapter #4, Verse #172)

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Again than your a Fool to believe that.
How do you know that Muhammed didnt make it up?
So Jesus LIED? when he said he was going to be ressurected, so than all the people who saw him Die and all the people who SAW him ressurect Lied?
So what did the Disciples do after his Death and ressurection?
there message was simple THE MAN THAT YOU HEARD ABOUT, THIS JESUS, HE DIED, AND HE WAS THE SON OF GOD, YOU CRUCFIED HIM, BUT NOW HE IS ALIVE AGAIN, REPENT, REPENT,
ARE YOU TELLING ME, that all these people who changed their lives, Who DIED and were matryed for the GOSPEl DIED IN VAIN?
Your telling me when PETER and all the Disciples died, they died in vain? in a lie?

Why would they have died in vain if they preached the Gospel and they to whom they preached it to believed in God?

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If you believe Muhammed than you are calling all these people a liar.
Muhammed who 600 years later decided to tell everyone that it was ALL a lie, and that in fact he never died?
This is a fools joke.

they wouldn't be lying if that is the way they saw it to be

That they said (in boast), “we killed Christ Jesus the son of Mary, the Messenger of Allah.;- but they killed him not, nor crucified him, but so it was made to appear to them, and those who differ therein are full of doubts, with no (certain) knowledge, but only conjecture to follow, for of a surety they killed him not:-
( سورة النساء , An-Nisa, Chapter #4, Verse #157)

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You say if the Quran fails, the bible fails, and you now you also say if Muhammed fails than Paul fails. but notice how you never say these things directly, but always eluding and being sneaky about it.

Actually I'm trying to demonstrate to you how you unevenly apply your principles.

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But you know what Bod, The Bible continues to be Victor, because the Word of God is Living, and the Quran can Fail but the Word of God can never vanish away.

The Bible and The Quran were both sent down from ONE GOD

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The Same with the Testimony of Paul, though he is only a Servant of God, he is not Tied nor connected in anyway with the servant of the deciever Muhammed.

Then if any man shall say unto you, Lo, here is Christ, or there; believe it not.
Matthew 24:22-24

But you did believe and hence today you are confused

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Context Bod, Did Paul ever cliam to be Christ?

“if any man shall say unto you, Lo, here is Christ, or there; believe it not.”

Did Paul claim to have SEEN/met Christ on the road to damascus? Did you believe him?

Mark 13:22 (King James Version)

22For false Christs and false prophets shall rise, and shall shew signs and wonders, to seduce, if it were possible, even the elect.

You said Muhammad was a false prophet does the above describe Muhammad? you even bragged about how Muhammad did no miracles

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So your proof is what is not Stated in Scripture?
You didnt get the point of the story, The people viewed him as a nobody, as a Criminal, a murderer and than they minds changed believing that he was some kind of deity amoung them.

“false prophets shall rise, and shall shew signs and wonders, to seduce”

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Either way, YOU Cannot believe In Paul and belive in the Mummahed becuase Paul preached one thing and Muhammed the oppisite. you cant believe in both, Pick one.

Actually, I can choose both in the correct perspective but you don't understand that yet.

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Cain=evil,
Seth= good

Who taught you that?

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NEW POINT! these are the generations of NOAH, Its not that he was JUST and that he was PERFECT MAN,
Its talking about is PURE descent!
he is PURE descendant, and not from the family of Cains line of EVIL Descendants!

All come from ADAM so who taught you that?

Mankind was one single nation, and Allah sent Messengers with glad tidings and warnings; and with them He sent the Book in truth, to judge between people in matters wherein they differed; but the People of the Book, after the clear Signs came to them, did not differ among themselves, except through selfish contumacy. Allah by His Grace Guided the believers to the Truth, concerning that wherein they differed. For Allah guided whom He will to a path that is straight.
( سورة البقرة , Al-Baqara, Chapter #2, Verse #213)

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These are your ways! this is what you been doing!
You lie, and than you make Diversions, you never fess up, you ignore what you cannot answer and you make personal hit and runs to divert the exposure of your true image as a deciever or the Deceived.

God Bless You!

October 12, 2010 at 8:15 pm#219661