Moses attains atonement without blood

[bodhitharta]

Quote (SimplyForgiven @ Sep. 26 2010,06:51)

Quote (bodhitharta @ Sep. 26 2010,00:48) Quote (SimplyForgiven @ Sep. 26 2010,06:32) Quote (bodhitharta @ Sep. 26 2010,00:27) Quote Hebrews 11:4 By faith Abel offered unto God a more excellent sacrifice than Cain, by which he obtained witness that he was righteous, God testifying of his gifts: and by it he being dead yet speaketh. You have now proven to yourself my point thakns to the Spirit of God that has helped you. ABEL OBTAINED WITNESS THAT HE WAS RIGHTEOUS BY THE TESTIMONY of GOD OF HIS GIFTS. Do you agree with the testimony of God or not? Oh My Bod, lol Your looking for anyway out arnt you? Why was Abel righteous? what did he do that cain didnt do? What made him righteous? What happened? Was he perfect and without flaws? Quote God testifying of his gifts Do you not believe the testimony of GOD? Do you not believed that he tesitfied about his Gifts? Do you not believe that Job was righteous in his own way? Did these men Die? Yet God said he was righteous, but yet inquity was still found in him. Your ignoring the whole book of Romans brother, I have proved to you my case, You simply do not want to believe that all have come short of the glory of God

God said Ael was righteous and you can not even agree with God that Abel was righteous. God said that Noah was righteous and you can not agree with God that Noah was righteous. God said Job was righteous and as a matter of fact that there was no one like him on earth and you can not agree with God.

Do you even want to believe what God says?

[SimplyForgiven]

Quote (bodhitharta @ Sep. 26 2010,02:02)

Quote (SimplyForgiven @ Sep. 26 2010,06:51) Quote (bodhitharta @ Sep. 26 2010,00:48) Quote (SimplyForgiven @ Sep. 26 2010,06:32) Quote (bodhitharta @ Sep. 26 2010,00:27) Quote Hebrews 11:4 By faith Abel offered unto God a more excellent sacrifice than Cain, by which he obtained witness that he was righteous, God testifying of his gifts: and by it he being dead yet speaketh. You have now proven to yourself my point thakns to the Spirit of God that has helped you. ABEL OBTAINED WITNESS THAT HE WAS RIGHTEOUS BY THE TESTIMONY of GOD OF HIS GIFTS. Do you agree with the testimony of God or not? Oh My Bod, lol Your looking for anyway out arnt you? Why was Abel righteous? what did he do that cain didnt do? What made him righteous? What happened? Was he perfect and without flaws? Quote God testifying of his gifts Do you not believe the testimony of GOD? Do you not believed that he tesitfied about his Gifts? Do you not believe that Job was righteous in his own way? Did these men Die? Yet God said he was righteous, but yet inquity was still found in him. Your ignoring the whole book of Romans brother, I have proved to you my case, You simply do not want to believe that all have come short of the glory of God God said Ael was righteous and you can not even agree with God that Abel was righteous. God said that Noah was righteous and you can not agree with God that Noah was righteous. God said Job was righteous and as a matter of fact that there was no one like him on earth and you can not agree with God. Do you even want to believe what God says?

God Said many people were Righteous, but what does that Mean that they were without flaws?

Hebrews 5:1For every high priest taken from among men is ordained for men in things pertaining to God, that he may offer both gifts and sacrifices for sins:

So what was Abel doing? Wasnt he Attoning? offering scrafices?  The LAMB! that he killed, the best FATTEST one?

Think about it Bod, let it sink it.

Hebrew 12:24 to Jesus the mediator of the new covenant, and to the blood of sprinkling, that speaketh better things than that of Abel.

I DO agree with God, but by FAITH, by KNOWING him we have the result of being the Children of Light, we can have a relationship with God but not becuase we are righteous, not because we have some sort of immunity, we ALL have fallen short, and until you realize that  you CANNOT submit yourself truely to God.

Noah Got Drunk and naked like a fool later on and than even cursed his son for seeing him naked and laughing.

Oh my Bod,
I JUST PROVED TO YOU THAT JOB WAS UNJUST BECAUSE HE DIDNT JUSTIFY GOD BUT JUSTIFIED HIMSELF,

You truely are lost brother,

YOU DO NOT AGREE WITH GOD,

your a liar, Im sorry, a Deceiver,
you twisted truth all over the place,

You dont even know what Righteousness Is,
Your not even being Righteous for trying to be a deciever,

I  wish you werent but its my only conclusion, it either that your ignorant or your a deicver.

I have showed you that biblical support and proof, and i have shown you where Elihu and even God and even JOB himself said that he was unjust and has fallen short.

I have shown you a number of things, but you still believe not.

Your becoming a Vipor,

examine yoursellf, how many scriptures did i correct you on on this thread alone?

How many bod?

you disagree with God, and you PURPOSELY ignore the Facts,
I have already shown them to you and you just ignore and continue on,

How many biblical verses have we talked about?

You know you love to play these games bod, but the truth is that you ignore the truth, and you dont care.

I hope that changes for you,
I truely do, because this doesnt satisfy me in any way nor pleasures me to see you lost,

but Bod you need to accept the Truth,

WE ALL HAVE FALLEN SHORT,

There is not one TURELY Righteous without God or seperate from God!
God is what makes us a children of Light

[bodhitharta]

Quote (SimplyForgiven @ Sep. 26 2010,16:31)

Quote

God Said many people were Righteous, but what does that Mean that they were without flaws?

Yes, God Said but you don't believe God

Quote

So what was Abel doing? Wasnt he Attoning? offering scrafices? The LAMB! that he killed, the best FATTEST one?

The scripture does not say anything about atoning for sin, here let me help you:

Genesis 4:3-4 (King James Version)
3And in process of time it came to pass, that Cain brought of the fruit of the ground an offering unto the LORD.
4And Abel, he also brought of the firstlings of his flock and of the fat thereof. And the LORD had respect unto Abel and to his offering:

Quote

I DO agree with God, but by FAITH, by KNOWING him we have the result of being the Children of Light, we can have a relationship with God but not becuase we are righteous, not because we have some sort of immunity, we ALL have fallen short, and until you realize that you CANNOT submit yourself truely to God.

You keep missing the point

Quote

Noah Got Drunk and naked like a fool later on and than even cursed his son for seeing him naked and laughing.

Show me where God said that Noah sinned drinking alcohol, Jesus drank Alcohol too

Quote

Oh my Bod, I JUST PROVED TO YOU THAT JOB WAS UNJUST BECAUSE HE DIDNT JUSTIFY GOD BUT JUSTIFIED HIMSELF,

God said Job was right, but you don't believe what God said?

Quote

examine yoursellf, how many scriptures did i correct you on on this thread alone? How many bod?

None that I am aware of, you don't believe the direct testimony of God so who can convince you after that?

[Qote]you disagree with God, and you PURPOSELY ignore the Facts,
I have already shown them to you and you just ignore and continue on,[/Quote]

Show me where?

Quote

WE ALL HAVE FALLEN SHORT,

Why did Jesus have to learn?

Quote

There is not one TURELY Righteous without God or seperate from God! God is what makes us a children of Light

I never said that anyone is righteous without God nor is anyone a sinner with God.

God Bless you!

[SimplyForgiven]

Quote (bodhitharta @ Sep. 26 2010,11:58)

Quote (SimplyForgiven @ Sep. 26 2010,16:31) [/quote] Quote God Said many people were Righteous, but what does that Mean that they were without flaws? Yes, God Said but you don't believe God Quote So what was Abel doing? Wasnt he Attoning? offering scrafices?  The LAMB! that he killed, the best FATTEST one? The scripture does not say anything about atoning for sin, here let me help you: Genesis 4:3-4 (King James Version) 3And in process of time it came to pass, that Cain brought of the fruit of the ground an offering unto the LORD. 4And Abel, he also brought of the firstlings of his flock and of the fat thereof. And the LORD had respect unto Abel and to his offering: Quote I DO agree with God, but by FAITH, by KNOWING him we have the result of being the Children of Light, we can have a relationship with God but not becuase we are righteous, not because we have some sort of immunity, we ALL have fallen short, and until you realize that  you CANNOT submit yourself truely to God. You keep missing the point Quote Noah Got Drunk and naked like a fool later on and than even cursed his son for seeing him naked and laughing. Show me where God said that Noah sinned drinking alcohol, Jesus drank Alcohol too Quote Oh my Bod, I JUST PROVED TO YOU THAT JOB WAS UNJUST BECAUSE HE DIDNT JUSTIFY GOD BUT JUSTIFIED HIMSELF, God said Job was right, but you don't believe what God said? Quote examine yoursellf, how many scriptures did i correct you on on this thread alone? How many bod? None that I am aware of, you don't believe the direct testimony of God so who can convince you after that? [Qote]you disagree with God, and you PURPOSELY ignore the Facts, I have already shown them to you and you just ignore and continue on, Show me where? Quote WE ALL HAVE FALLEN SHORT, Why did Jesus have to learn? Quote There is not one TURELY Righteous without God or seperate from God! God is what makes us a children of Light I never said that anyone is righteous without God nor is anyone a sinner with God. God Bless you!

Yes i do believe God,
Its you who is in error,

Actually i just showed you the scripture.

naa you missed the point.

Did i say he sinned? no i said he was imperfect, obviously.

Doenst make him righteous.

God said that Job should know better than to question him.

Actually i already corrected you in several verses.
you just ignore that.

You have dont it serveral times, in fact through out this whole thread.

What does that have to do with what im stating,

WE all have fallen Short! if we ALL fell through the first adam we are saved throught the Second.

Actually you keep on stating that we have a natural love of God and how there are Righteous people who are seperate from Sinners,

The fact is we all have sinned and come short of the glory of God, and by knowing the only True God, and Jesus christ who he has sent, is Eternal life, though we are damned by the law, we are saved through Christ Jesus.

This is what you dont accept.

God bless you too,

[SimplyForgiven]

Genesis 3:21-23
Matthew 10:40-42
Luke 15:11-32
John 9:30-32
Genesis 18:22-24
2 Samuel 22:24-26
Job 1:7-9
Matthew 10:40-42
1 Timothy 1:8-10
James 5:15-17
Mark 4:11-13
Isaiah 6:9-11
Job 34:4-6

now all these verses are in order in how you presented them.
Whats funny that you went from the subject of Adam, to Noah, to Job, to Cain, To Abel,

I mean u went in every direction you could,
How come you cant just believe what Paul said, that NO ONE is Righteous and that we all have come short in the glory of God.

Are you realizing im just repeating what Paul said right?

[bodhitharta]

Quote (SimplyForgiven @ Sep. 26 2010,18:06)

Quote (bodhitharta @ Sep. 26 2010,11:58) Quote (SimplyForgiven @ Sep. 26 2010,16:31) Quote God Said many people were Righteous, but what does that Mean that they were without flaws? Yes, God Said but you don't believe God Quote So what was Abel doing? Wasnt he Attoning? offering scrafices?  The LAMB! that he killed, the best FATTEST one? The scripture does not say anything about atoning for sin, here let me help you: Genesis 4:3-4 (King James Version) 3And in process of time it came to pass, that Cain brought of the fruit of the ground an offering unto the LORD. 4And Abel, he also brought of the firstlings of his flock and of the fat thereof. And the LORD had respect unto Abel and to his offering: Quote I DO agree with God, but by FAITH, by KNOWING him we have the result of being the Children of Light, we can have a relationship with God but not becuase we are righteous, not because we have some sort of immunity, we ALL have fallen short, and until you realize that  you CANNOT submit yourself truely to God. You keep missing the point Quote Noah Got Drunk and naked like a fool later on and than even cursed his son for seeing him naked and laughing. Show me where God said that Noah sinned drinking alcohol, Jesus drank Alcohol too Quote Oh my Bod, I JUST PROVED TO YOU THAT JOB WAS UNJUST BECAUSE HE DIDNT JUSTIFY GOD BUT JUSTIFIED HIMSELF, God said Job was right, but you don't believe what God said? Quote examine yoursellf, how many scriptures did i correct you on on this thread alone? How many bod? None that I am aware of, you don't believe the direct testimony of God so who can convince you after that? [Qote]you disagree with God, and you PURPOSELY ignore the Facts, I have already shown them to you and you just ignore and continue on, Show me where? Quote WE ALL HAVE FALLEN SHORT, Why did Jesus have to learn? Quote There is not one TURELY Righteous without God or seperate from God! God is what makes us a children of Light I never said that anyone is righteous without God nor is anyone a sinner with God. God Bless you![/quote] Yes i do believe  God, Its you who is in error, Actually i just showed you the scripture. naa you missed the point. Did i say he sinned? no i said he was imperfect, obviously. Doenst make him righteous. God said that Job should know better than to question him. Actually i already corrected you in several verses. you just ignore that. You have dont it serveral times, in fact through out this whole thread. What does that have to do with what im stating, WE all have fallen Short! if we ALL fell through the first adam we are saved throught the Second. Actually you keep on stating that we have a natural love of God and how there are Righteous people who are seperate from Sinners, The fact is we all have sinned and come short of the glory of God, and by knowing the only True God, and Jesus christ who he has sent, is Eternal life, though we are damned by the law, we are saved through Christ Jesus. This is what you dont accept. God bless you too,

Jesus said he came for the LOST sheep, he did not ever say that all the sheep were lost, did he?

And Jesus answering said unto them, They that are whole need not a physician; but they that are sick.
Luke 5:30-32

Do you not believe Jesus?

Luke 5:32 (King James Version)
32I came not to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance.

Do you not believe Jesus?

Luke 1:5-6 (King James Version)
5THERE was in the days of Herod, the king of Judaea, a certain priest named Zacharias, of the course of Abia: and his wife was of the daughters of Aaron, and her name was Elisabeth.
6And they were both righteous before God, walking in all the commandments and ordinances of the Lord blameless.

This is the truth that God by The Holy Spirit is delivering to you, will you not believe?

How can you see the verse above any different way? Please don't be prideful simply say yes it does say that they were BLAMELESS and RIGHTEOUS and that means they did not fall short in any way.

Stop Playing you know there is no other way but to accept what I have shown you.

God Bless you!

[Ed J]

Quote (SimplyForgiven @ Sep. 26 2010,18:23)

Genesis 3:21-23 Matthew 10:40-42 Luke 15:11-32 John 9:30-32 Genesis 18:22-24 2 Samuel 22:24-26 Job 1:7-9 Matthew 10:40-42 1 Timothy 1:8-10 James 5:15-17 Mark 4:11-13 Isaiah 6:9-11 Job 34:4-6 now all these verses are in order in how you presented them. Whats funny that you went from the subject of Adam, to Noah, to Job, to Cain, To Abel, I mean u went in every direction you could, How come you cant just believe what Paul said, that NO ONE is Righteous and that we all have come short in the glory of God. Are you realizing im just repeating what Paul said right?

Hi SF,

That's because BD does not believe the writings of The Apostle Paul are canon;
nor does BD believe in the New Testament altogether! (Matt.26:28 / Mark 14:24 / Luke 22:20 / 1Cor.11:25)

God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

[bodhitharta]

Quote (Ed J @ Sep. 26 2010,19:02)

Quote (SimplyForgiven @ Sep. 26 2010,18:23) Genesis 3:21-23 Matthew 10:40-42 Luke 15:11-32 John 9:30-32 Genesis 18:22-24 2 Samuel 22:24-26 Job 1:7-9 Matthew 10:40-42 1 Timothy 1:8-10 James 5:15-17 Mark 4:11-13 Isaiah 6:9-11 Job 34:4-6 now all these verses are in order in how you presented them. Whats funny that you went from the subject of Adam, to Noah, to Job, to Cain, To Abel, I mean u went in every direction you could, How come you cant just believe what Paul said, that NO ONE is Righteous and that we all have come short in the glory of God. Are you realizing im just repeating what Paul said right? Hi SF, That's because BD does not believe the writings of The Apostle Paul are canon; nor does BD believe in the New Testament altogether! (Matt.26:28 / Mark 14:24 / Luke 22:20 / 1Cor.11:25) God bless Ed J (Joshua 22:34) http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

Of course they are canon ED but that has nothing to do with what we are discussing here.

[bodhitharta]

Quote (SimplyForgiven @ Sep. 26 2010,18:23)

Genesis 3:21-23 Matthew 10:40-42 Luke 15:11-32 John 9:30-32 Genesis 18:22-24 2 Samuel 22:24-26 Job 1:7-9 Matthew 10:40-42 1 Timothy 1:8-10 James 5:15-17 Mark 4:11-13 Isaiah 6:9-11 Job 34:4-6 now all these verses are in order in how you presented them. Whats funny that you went from the subject of Adam, to Noah, to Job, to Cain, To Abel, I mean u went in every direction you could, How come you cant just believe what Paul said, that NO ONE is Righteous and that we all have come short in the glory of God. Are you realizing im just repeating what Paul said right?

So when the scripture says “God said” you hold that equal to what “Paul said”?

Paul also said that Jesus was the seed of David according to the flesh, is that correct?

Matthew 22:42-45 (King James Version)
42Saying, What think ye of Christ? whose son is he? They say unto him, The son of David.
43He saith unto them, How then doth David in spirit call him Lord, saying,
44The LORD said unto my Lord, Sit thou on my right hand, till I make thine enemies thy footstool?
45If David then call him Lord, how is he his son?

I have no problem sharing with you but we don't need insults because we should communicate out of Love for God and each other not out of arrogance and anger

God Bless you!

[bodhitharta]

And Jesus answering said unto them, They that are whole need not a physician; but they that are sick.
Luke 5:30-32

Do you not believe Jesus?

Luke 5:32 (King James Version)
32I came not to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance.

Do you not believe Jesus?

Luke 1:5-6 (King James Version)
5THERE was in the days of Herod, the king of Judaea, a certain priest named Zacharias, of the course of Abia: and his wife was of the daughters of Aaron, and her name was Elisabeth.
6And they were both righteous before God, walking in all the commandments and ordinances of the Lord blameless.

This is the truth that God by The Holy Spirit is delivering to you, will you not believe?

How can you see the verse above any different way? Please don't be prideful simply say yes it does say that they were BLAMELESS and RIGHTEOUS and that means they did not fall short in any way.

Stop Playing you know there is no other way but to accept what I have shown you.

God Bless you!

[JustAskin]

Bod,
What do you believe concerning God and Christ?

And of mankind.

God knows the heart of a man and can decide to overlook errancies.

He, and he alone, can decide this. So, although mankind is inherantly sinful, God will overlook a certain amount of sin in one man if the rest of that man is, by His values, rightious. Like David, Like Moses, Like Solomon, like the many of the prophets.
Bod, consider God as the referee in a contest. All judgement is through Him, whether you, the player, thinks it's right or wrong.
Quarrel with the ref and it's You that ends up with the Red Card!

SF is correct in what he says. And also others assessment that you are being devious in deliberately not understanding.

This is quite clear. Please stop the nonesense as everyone can see your tactics.

[bodhitharta]

Quote (JustAskin @ Sep. 27 2010,09:57)

Bod, What do you believe concerning God and Christ? And of mankind. God knows the heart of a man and can decide to overlook errancies. He, and he alone, can decide this. So, although mankind is inherantly sinful, God will overlook a certain amount of sin in one man if the rest of that man is, by His values, rightious. Like David, Like Moses, Like Solomon, like the many of the prophets. Bod, consider God as the referee in a contest. All judgement is through Him, whether you, the player, thinks it's right or wrong. Quarrel with the ref and it's You that ends up with the Red Card! SF is correct in what he says. And also others assessment that you are being devious in deliberately not understanding. This is quite clear. Please stop the nonesense as everyone can see your tactics.

Now that you have made an accusation about me you will have to then show yourself right.

If you say I am being devious then you must show that when the scripture says that Zacharia and his wife were blameless that this scripture is wrong.

You must in-fact invalidate the very testimony of GOD.

JA,

I welcome you to debate whatever you assert about me but after you are proven to be inaccurate please tell me you will then admit your errors.

[SimplyForgiven]

Quote (bodhitharta @ Sep. 26 2010,12:32)

Jesus said he came for the LOST sheep, he did not ever say that all the sheep were lost, did he? And Jesus answering said unto them, They that are whole need not a physician; but they that are sick. Luke 5:30-32 Do you not believe Jesus? Luke 5:32 (King James Version) 32I came not to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance. Do you not believe Jesus? Luke 1:5-6 (King James Version) 5THERE was in the days of Herod, the king of Judaea, a certain priest named Zacharias, of the course of Abia: and his wife was of the daughters of Aaron, and her name was Elisabeth. 6And they were both righteous before God, walking in all the commandments and ordinances of the Lord blameless. This is the truth that God by The Holy Spirit is delivering to you, will you not believe? How can you see the verse above any different way? Please don't be prideful simply say yes it does say that they were BLAMELESS and RIGHTEOUS and that means they did not fall short in any way. Stop Playing you know there is no other way but to accept what I have shown you. God Bless you!

Quote

Jesus said he came for the LOST sheep, he did not ever say that all the sheep were lost, did he? And Jesus answering said unto them, They that are whole need not a physician; but they that are sick. Luke 5:30-32 Do you not believe Jesus?

Do you not believe Jesus? really BOd?
think about what he just said, its the same i been telling you, If your “WHOLE” or think you are “WHOLE” than what need do you have for Jesus?
This is my point that to claim that you are whole or righteous is to say that you do not need Jesus, because to be whole and righteous you MUST know Jesus Christ.

Quote

Luke 5:32 (King James Version) 32I came not to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance. Do you not believe Jesus?

Same thing again Bod,

Quote

Luke 1:5-6 (King James Version) 5THERE was in the days of Herod, the king of Judaea, a certain priest named Zacharias, of the course of Abia: and his wife was of the daughters of Aaron, and her name was Elisabeth. 6And they were both righteous before God, walking in all the commandments and ordinances of the Lord blameless. This is the truth that God by The Holy Spirit is delivering to you, will you not believe?

AND YOUR HOLY ANGEL GABRIEL (the one you cliam that recited to Mohammed) said this to Zachariah later,
luke 1:19And the angel answering said unto him, I am Gabriel, that stand in the presence of God; and am sent to speak unto thee, and to shew thee these glad tidings.
20And, behold, thou shalt be dumb, and not able to speak, until the day that these things shall be performed, because thou believest not my words, which shall be fulfilled in their season.
21And the people waited for Zacharias, and marvelled that he tarried so long in the temple.
22And when he came out, he could not speak unto them: and they perceived that he had seen a vision in the temple: for he beckoned unto them, and remained speechless.
Was He PERFECT? Righteous? did he believe the word of the Lord? no he didnt! Understand that the LAw made nothing perfect! and that we are not consistent. But Zachariah sought the Lord like the Sinner of David did as well, a man who was after the Heart of God. Though they all have fallen short, the difference is that they seek God, because God sought them, and romanced them, not because they stopped sinning (bc they cant) they continued to make mistakes and sinned and screwed up, these are not actions of Love, though the do Love God.

Quote

How can you see the verse above any different way? Please don't be prideful simply say yes it does say that they were BLAMELESS and RIGHTEOUS and that means they did not fall short in any way.

Im not pridefull at All, becuase its obvious they were not perfect, any human being could not be like Adam the way he was before he fell, and like Jesus.
With God we can be righteous, with God, having God, knowing him, we can be children of Light,- this is where i agree, but by ourselves we are SINNERS and ourselves as individuals have fallen short from God, but you say otherwise, your trying to prove that Individuals impressed God.

Job was BLESSED by God, and he was famous for It,
WHO IS JOB WITHOUT GOD?

Quote

Stop Playing you know there is no other way but to accept what I have shown you.

You have just accused me of being Prideful,
but you have judged yourself,
As you wrote did you not feel that once of Pride, the ounce of Victory that you believed you had?

You have condemend yourself, with your own words.
I accuse you of being Prideful

[SimplyForgiven]

Quote (bodhitharta @ Sep. 26 2010,13:22)

Quote (SimplyForgiven @ Sep. 26 2010,18:23) Genesis 3:21-23 Matthew 10:40-42 Luke 15:11-32 John 9:30-32 Genesis 18:22-24 2 Samuel 22:24-26 Job 1:7-9 Matthew 10:40-42 1 Timothy 1:8-10 James 5:15-17 Mark 4:11-13 Isaiah 6:9-11 Job 34:4-6 now all these verses are in order in how you presented them. Whats funny that you went from the subject of Adam, to Noah, to Job, to Cain, To Abel, I mean u went in every direction you could, How come you cant just believe what Paul said, that NO ONE is Righteous and that we all have come short in the glory of God. Are you realizing im just repeating what Paul said right? So when the scripture says “God said” you hold that equal to what “Paul said”? Paul also said that Jesus was the seed of David according to the flesh, is that correct? Matthew 22:42-45 (King James Version) 42Saying, What think ye of Christ? whose son is he? They say unto him, The son of David. 43He saith unto them, How then doth David in spirit call him Lord, saying, 44The LORD said unto my Lord, Sit thou on my right hand, till I make thine enemies thy footstool? 45If David then call him Lord, how is he his son? I have no problem sharing with you but we don't need insults because we should communicate out of Love for God and each other not out of arrogance and anger God Bless you!

Lol No Bod,
Your Confusd this is why you dont understand,
Its either your sickly Confused, or your are purposely a deciever.

I cant tell which sometimes, even though i lean closer to think you are a deciever or just plain ignorant.

And If Jesus is the seed of David so what?

Quote

I have no problem sharing with you but we don't need insults because we should communicate out of Love for God and each other not out of arrogance and anger

No Bod, no,
Out of Love im telling you that your trying to decieve me, or your just blind. There is no way possible that you could have came to those conclusions of yours if you read the context.

for example you used a pharise qoute from the bible and used it as evidence to prove that people who worship God are righteous and not a sinner,

for example this is what you said:

Quote

Now we know that God heareth not sinners: but if any man be a worshipper of God, and doeth his will, him he heareth. John 9:30-32 It doesn't say any Jew or any gentile or any Pharisee or any Muslim or any Catholic it says ANY MAN. So you have simply misunderstood that's all. Do you understand? A worshipper of God is NOT a SINNER

And i told you what bod? do you rememeber? your qouting a pharasie…. really who were trying to accuse Jesus of being a demonic spirit for healing a blind man.

Do you realize this? how did you NOT know this, or you knew this and didnt care.

Here is my point that any CHRISITIAN who is not biblical intimate would believe you, and take in your words as true,

But the Word exposes you, and the Word examines you, and the Word has shown that you have spoken false in many occasions.

I believed you, and because i went to the word myself is the reasons why i dont believe you.

Do you understand this concept?

I do have Anger, of course i do, because out of love i Hate what your doing, and out of Love i hate that your decieved or are proned to deceive.

You must understand and come to terms with this, that a Man without God can NEVER be righteous in the eyes of God.

All the men of the bible that you mention are NOTHING without God.
There Righteousness depends on God.

[bodhitharta]

SF,

Why do you keep saying without God as if we can even live without God? You must not understand what I am saying.

Sin nor righteousness even has a definition without God so what are you really saying?

[JustAskin]

Bod,
You yourself know what your sin is in this issue.

Seek it out and expunge it yourself with God's help.

You are capable of seeing the truth in what is being pointed out to you but your 'playful pride' is holding you to ransom.

This is what the Holy Spirit reveals.

Your posts reveals twisty tangly arguments against SF's posts but you simply refuse to accept the truth of it just to raise up an advesrsarial spirit against SF.

Bod, examine yourself and see if this is untrue. Then come and tell JustAskin that he is wrong.

Truly, Bod, examine first, no kneejerk response.

I await your Holy Spirited response, Bod. Answer by grace from God, not from the deceptive soul of man.

[bodhitharta]

Quote (JustAskin @ Sep. 27 2010,19:47)

Bod, You yourself know what your sin is in this issue. Seek it out and expunge it yourself with God's help. You are capable of seeing the truth in what is being pointed out to you but your 'playful pride' is holding you to ransom. This is what the Holy Spirit reveals. Your posts reveals twisty tangly arguments against SF's posts but you simply refuse to accept the truth of it just to raise up an advesrsarial spirit against SF. Bod, examine yourself and see if this is untrue. Then come and tell JustAskin that he is wrong. Truly, Bod, examine first, no kneejerk response. I await your Holy Spirited response, Bod. Answer by grace from God, not from the deceptive soul of man.

You are misunderstanding what is going on here. SF, does not agree that some are righteous as it is written in scripture and he believes this because of what Paul quoted out of the OT saying “No one is righteous” but the fact is that quote applied to Atheists.

Of course there are people that were raised up from the beginning who loved God and were obedient since the time of Abel and Abel was righteous

By faith Abel offered unto God a more excellent sacrifice than Cain, by which he obtained witness that he was righteous, God testifying of his gifts: and by it he being dead yet speaketh.
Hebrews 11:3-5

Now if God says someone was righteous how can it be argued that God is wrong? There is nothing twisty or tangly about it.

Maybe SF likes to refer to everyone as a sinner so that it makes an excuse for sin you know it's the old “Well, no one's perfect” argument.

Jesus said to be PERFECT do you think he was Joking around?

And you said “this is what The Holy Spirit reveals” so exactly what did The Holy Spirit reveal to you (Exactly)? how was it revealed to you? I.e. a voice, a page fell open, in a dream…How?

[SimplyForgiven]

Quote (bodhitharta @ Sep. 27 2010,12:09)

SF, Why do you keep saying without God as if we can even live without God? You must not understand what I am saying. Sin nor righteousness even has a definition without God so what are you really saying?

Bod,
You can live seperated from God and do everythign that he hates naturally.

Im saying again that without God in our lives, or without having a “relationship” with God, than there is no possibility to be righteous.

whatever we think is good or bad doesnt compare to what God believes is Good or bad.

ITs reallly simple, the Men of God are who they are because they were Chosen by God.

No one has the ability to be righteous without God IN them.
but every is already unrighteous!
Every has sinned! everyone has a flaw!

This is us as humans, we all have sinned at one point of time, and we all have flaws!

Just by the fact that we can Die, and we suffer in this land, and that we must “WORK” are all conditions that relate to the failure of Adams choice.

No matter if God already knew, Adam still made a choice based on what he cared about more and it wasnt God.

[SimplyForgiven]

Bod,

Quote

You are misunderstanding what is going on here. SF, does not agree that some are righteous as it is written in scripture and he believes this because of what Paul quoted out of the OT saying “No one is righteous” but the fact is that quote applied to Atheists.

I love it how instead of answering about what Ja said, you pointed the other finger towards me, is this righteousness?
or DENIAL?
So your stating that there is a remnant thats righteous based only one scripture (that i gave you).  Becasue your down to Abel, i have taken the rest away from you.  Paul actually was writing to the romans Who he proved through out chapter 2 adn 3 that there is no difference between “jew” or “gentile” and there is no differnece between “circumsized” and the “uncircumsized”  that we ALL have fallen short.
You speak of a Remant that are God chosen ones, which are not perfect and have made mistakes.  He was not speaking to Atheists per say, ATHEIST DIDNT EXIST BACK IN THOSE DAYS! EVERY BELIEVED IN MANY GODS! so your statement is already false.  Ch 1 already speaks about the beliefs of the Romans, and how they worship the creature and creation.

Quote

Of course there are people that were raised up from the beginning who loved God and were obedient since the time of Abel and Abel was righteous

No one person was consistently obedient.
David was raised up yet sinned!
Zacarhiah was blamesless, yet did not believe!
Abraham laughed with Sarah!
Moses even did not believe and struck the rock!
Cain (which is obvious) was Evil!

There is no other like Jesus Christ

Quote

Hebrews 11:3-5 Now if God says someone was righteous how can it be argued that God is wrong? There is nothing twisty or tangly about it.

You dont understand what Righteousness is!
Why was Abel making scrafices and gifts to God?
Who showed up that? why do you think he cares to make a scrafise to God?

Quote

Maybe SF likes to refer to everyone as a sinner so that it makes an excuse for sin you know it's the old “Well, no one's perfect” argument.

Actually that has nothing to do with it, WE have the ability to be perfect when we have Christ in Us, so that we may be perfect in One.   No, i refer everyone as a sinner because everyone NEEDS CHRIST!
So obviously what you stated are not Guided by God nor the spirit because these are my true intentions that i presented right now and i have repeated it many times.

Quote

And you said “this is what The Holy Spirit reveals” so exactly what did The Holy Spirit reveal to you (Exactly)? how was it revealed to you? I.e. a voice, a page fell open, in a dream…How?

The Truth shall set you free Bod, its already starting to destroy you.
The Truth is everything you just said is a lie, and false, from what you cliam, to what you “think” my intentions are.

Fact is you were wrong about my intentions, therefore thats not guided by the Holy Spirit,

and second your claims are focused to make a remnant “righeous” so that YOU CAN CLAIM, (as you already have)
that you have LOVED God sinced the beginning and that you grew up obeying him and what not.

Your not willing to call yourself a Sinner, and this is where you are not just.

You admitted that you have sinned at one point in time, so you cuold not call yourself righteous.

The point of this thread is that you said Attonement was not nessary through Christ,

Though you love to change subjects and though you try to have people forget what the topic is really about,

but i do remember,

That you NEED JESUS,  there is no other atonement that will satisfy God.

Only the Blood that Jesus has is enough to save you, You knowing Him, and Him knowing you.

You ask us to pray about this,

Have you Prayed without telling God that we are wrong, and to show us that we are wrong? have you prayed to God telling him your setting everything you believe aside and let him telll you directly the Truth?

Have you really prayed? have you listened? or do you continue to talk and say the things that you “wish” for God to say?

Deny yourself, Deny yourself,

Matthew 11:15
He that hath ears to hear, let him hear.

[bodhitharta]

SF,

One day I hope you really understand but today is not that day and that's okay I didn't learn instantly and so it's pkay if you don't either.

The very first problem you have is continuing to Believe that Jesus is God which would be making “God” asking God to save God
Jesus asked to be saved from the cross.

sin and righteousness are not opposed to each other and that's why you are so confused. Righteousness is the willingness to do what is right and sin is simply when someone misses that goal. Noah was called Righteous if you don't believe me argue with God about it and there are and have always been many, many righteous people I only used Abel as an example so you could focus. Abel was not making a sin offereing or an offering of atonement if that were true it would say so. God said that SACRIFICE was never commanded

For I spake not unto your fathers, nor commanded them in the day that I brought them out of the land of Egypt, concerning burnt offerings or sacrifices:
Jeremiah 7:21-23

Now why would I call myself a sinner when I submit to God willingly?

Nevertheless if thou warn the righteous man, that the righteous sin not, and he doth not sin, he shall surely live, because he is warned; also thou hast delivered thy soul.
Ezekiel 3:20-22

Why is it you wish to remain a slave to sin. You said Christ has set you free and yet you still call yourself a sinner? How terrible!

If the Son therefore shall make you free, ye shall be free indeed.
John 8:35-37

Jesus said this before the “Crucifixion” so why are you still a slave to sin?

Whosoever abideth in him sinneth not: whosoever sinneth hath not seen him, neither known him.
1 John 3:5-7

Right now I keep trying to give you meat but you are only ready for milk and it's okay.

God does not need Sacrifice nor Blood. God wants you to be grateful and yet you still complain about everything.
You even say that you are a sinner after you believe that someone died for your sins so you leave Christ open to shame.

You should repent if you are a sinner and then as Jesus said:

Afterward Jesus findeth him in the temple, and said unto him, Behold, thou art made whole: sin no more, lest a worse thing come unto thee.
John 5:13-15

She said, No man, Lord. And Jesus said unto her, Neither do I condemn thee: go, and sin no more.
John 8:10-12

So why do you still sin SF?

Be perfect and give up the deception that Satan has put upon you.

[Author]

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