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He merely emptied His God abilities and jumped into Mary to come out through her birth canal as Jesus.
I agree with Not3in1. That is not a birth. It is more like what the creature did in the alien movie.
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Tim, you made me laugh this morning
Thank you!
Thanks for putting it into perspective.Nick wrote:
Jesus was conceived in Mary
**********************************Nick, I'd like to stop you right here, if I could, and ask you what “was conceived” means to you?
Quote (TimothyVI @ April 19 2007,22:34) Quote (Is 1:18 @ April 19 2007,17:21) Not3, wouldn't re-incarnation require a death first? The Logos did not die at the incarnation – Ha! I've been waiting for an opportunity to use a “Ha!”….
If He didn't die, what did He do?
He disappeared from the presence of God or why would He
ask to be taken back in His previous glory? If that is what Jn 17:5 is saying.I am trying to understand the logic of a pre-existing Jesus as well. The way you guys are describing it, Jesus was not born, He merely emptied His God abilities and jumped into Mary to come out through her birth canal as Jesus.
I agree with Not3in1. That is not a birth. It is more like what the creature did in the alien movie.
Tim
Hey TimI think Hebrews 10:5-10 shows that Yeshua basically took on human form Phil 2 and John 1:14, and being found in fashion as a man he humbled himself and obeyed as a man the Father even to the death of the cross.
Heb 10:
5 So that when he (Yeshua, the Word) comes into the world, he says, You had no desire for offerings, but you made a body ready for me;
6 You had no joy in burned offerings or in offerings for sin.
7 Then I said, See, I have come to do your pleasure, O God (as it is said of me in the roll of the book).
8 After saying, You had no desire for offerings, for burned offerings or offerings for sin (which are made by the law) and you had no pleasure in them,
9 Then he said, See, I have come to do your pleasure. He took away the old order, so that he might put the new order in its place.
10 By that pleasure we have been made holy, by the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once and for ever.This is why he is called the second Adam, the Lord from heaven.
No man could pay this price. Scriptures teach that God only is our savior.
Blessings!
No man could pay this price.
******************************This is a popular Trinitarian come-back. Can anyone explain to me why God's Son couldn't pay the price?
When the religious leaders accused Jesus of making himself out to be equal with God, Jesus told him he was God's Son. Meaning, something different than God. He later said that he could do nothing except that the Father impowered him to do. Can this Jesus (who is the man from Nazareth) not save us? Why?
Quote (Not3in1 @ April 20 2007,04:39) No man could pay this price.
******************************This is a popular Trinitarian come-back. Can anyone explain to me why God's Son couldn't pay the price?
When the religious leaders accused Jesus of making himself out to be equal with God, Jesus told him he was God's Son. Meaning, something different than God. He later said that he could do nothing except that the Father impowered him to do. Can this Jesus (who is the man from Nazareth) not save us? Why?
not3You totally misrepresent my statement.
Let me clarify!
No Mere or normal man born in sin could save us.
Only God in the flesh could do this. 1 Tim 3:16
Do you believe God changes his mind?
Do you believe Old Testament scriptures?
Isa 43:11
I, even I, am the LORD; and beside me *there is no saviour*.Isa 45:21
Tell ye, and bring them near; yea, let them take counsel together: who hath declared this from ancient time? who hath told it from that time? have not I the LORD? and there is no God else beside me; a just God and a Saviour; there is *none beside me*.Hsa 13:4
Yet I am the LORD thy God from the land of Egypt, and thou shalt know no god but me: for there is *no saviour* beside me.Again.
Heb 10:5
So that when he (Yeshua, the Word) *comes into the world*, he says, You had no desire for offerings, but you made a body ready for me;Heb 10:10
By that pleasure we have been made holy, by the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once and for ever.I suppose you have a different interpretation of these scriptures also?
He is and was the Lord from heaven.
Hi W,
Not for Tim2-he does not accept Jesus is Lord.
But then there is a code among you to never correct each other is there not?Nick,
Well I just proposed on another thread that we stop misquoting each other, ok?
I believe Jesus is Lord. This is because I believe that Jesus is YHWH. Jesus = YHWH = Lord.
Tim
Do you believe God changes his mind?
Do you believe Old Testament scriptures?
******************************************Yes. And yes. I fail to see what your OT scriptures are trying to say.
GOD DID NOT PAY THE PRICE FOR OUR SINS. Jesus did.
1 John 4:9
This is how God showed his love among us: He sent his one and only Son into the world that we might live through him.He sent his SON. The scriptures do not say he came himself.
And Who is the Son?
The Lord of Glory. 1 Corinthians 2:8
The Author of Life. Acts 3:15.
The First and the Last. Revelation 1:17.
God. John 1:1. John 1:18. John 20:28. Hebrews 1:8.Tim
Quote (Not3in1 @ April 20 2007,07:53) Do you believe God changes his mind? Do you believe Old Testament scriptures?
******************************************Yes. And yes. I fail to see what your OT scriptures are trying to say.
GOD DID NOT PAY THE PRICE FOR OUR SINS. Jesus did.
1 John 4:9
This is how God showed his love among us: He sent his one and only Son into the world that we might live through him.He sent his SON. The scriptures do not say he came himself.
NotActs 20:28
Give attention to yourselves, and to all the flock which the Holy Spirit has given into your care, to give food to the church of God, for which he gave his blood.[/B]You dont believe God is our Saviour?
You dont believe God is our Saviour?
****************I never said that. I said God did not die for me. Jesus died and shed his blood for me.
Even my NIV (which is a really Trinitarian bias translation), says in it's notes regarding the Acts verse: “His own blood, the blood of his own one, a term of endearment……referring to his own Son.”
Quote (Tim2 @ April 20 2007,08:05) And Who is the Son? The Lord of Glory. 1 Corinthians 2:8
The Author of Life. Acts 3:15.
The First and the Last. Revelation 1:17.
God. John 1:1. John 1:18. John 20:28. Hebrews 1:8.Tim
Hi Tim2,
You say he is God.
So God is also the son of God?Nick,
The Bible says He is God. You don't believe the Bible? You're going to apply your false logic to make the Bible contradict itself?
Tim
Hi Nick,
1. Stop pretending that God is one person, and the confusion goes away.
2. Remember that a son always has the same nature as the father. (e.g. The Son of Man is man.)
3. Remember that God is not divided nor multiplied.
4. Remember that the Bible says that three persons are God.
5. Then it makes sense. The one God exists eternally in three persons. He is not divided among them nor multiplied into 3, but remains one God.Tim
Hi Tim2
You say
“. Remember that the Bible says that three persons are God.”Where is this statement?
Surely you would not take three statements and make one composite one out of them and expect it to compare with even ONE VERSE from the mouth of God?
Get serious.Quote (Not3in1 @ April 20 2007,08:38) You dont believe God is our Saviour?
****************I never said that. I said God did not die for me. Jesus died and shed his blood for me.
Even my NIV (which is a really Trinitarian bias translation), says in it's notes regarding the Acts verse: “His own blood, the blood of his own one, a term of endearment……referring to his own Son.”
notThen you have a contradiction in scripture which plainly says God is our saviour and there is no other!
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